Topic: Castlevania 64 and Legacy of Darkness are the greatest in series

[X]

Why not just take these games, Redo the models and textures, add a free camera, and make alot of money on a 3DS release?

...oh yeah, forgot, Konami.

*sigh...* Yup. Dido 

It is unfortunate too because with the right touches CV64/LoD could be phenomenal. Personally to me, as SCV4 was the epitome of the old school vanias, CV64/LoD seems to be the epitome of the 3D vanias. There hasn't been a 3D vania that has brought out the type of feel I experienced in the 64 titles. Almost like a one-hit wonder.

[Zargon]

Funny, I just bought Castlevania 64 for the first time, after years of renting and borrowing it, and only ever owning Legacy of Darkness. I wanted to compare the two, since there are significant differences between them. And I am happy to say that both games still hold up, and it did end up being a good decision to buy the original separately!

I'll post some responses and musings as things go along here.

First off, I don't think its lack of popularity has anything to do with being on the Nintendo 64... on the contrary, I think that probably helped it (and could have helped it more). The game was well regarded enough when it was released, becoming a poster child for "bad early 3D games cameras" only after the fact. On that subject, it's maybe a dated way of handling things, sure, and the initial decision of having the three camera modes was probably confusing to a lot of people (obvious why that changed to two modes in Legacy of Darkness), but being the aforementioned poster child for bad camera is really not something either game deserves (certainly not Legacy of Darkness). I think the reason we never saw "Son of Castlevania 64", so to speak, is that Symphony of the Night was just such a resounding success. That combined with the rise of portable gaming made it the obvious choice for the best way to continue the franchise for the time being. And when they decided they wanted a new 3D game, Iga was in control of the series, and... with all due respect and love to the man... he is simply not that good at making 3D games the way he makes 2D games. Lament of Innocence put me to actual sleep with its repetitive tunnel stages... how many derelict church rooms can you fit in one vampire lord's castle? One thing you can't fault the 64 games for is boring level design (boring textures early on, maybe, but nothing repetitive).

I'm kind of baffled that they allowed the "high" setting with the expansion pack on LoD... it looks really nice, but it runs so terribly. I think even back in the day when I didn't know any better, I figured it out and switched it to low. This is something a friend of mine responded to with "people often whine about consoles not working like PCs with graphics settings.... well, this is why". I'd like to do a test with low settings vs no expansion pack at all, and see how much of a difference that really made (if any), though I forget if the original insert was actually required to run the system (and I don't know where mine is). Never the less, it is a marked improvement over Castlevania 64... though I think even there the game basically ran fine, certainly better than "high" settings on LoD. There was slowdown in CV64 when there were a bunch of enemies around, but if you're using Carrie, this isn't really a problem since you can just homing missile through all of them.

I think CV64 also controls fine, for the most part. The one thing that is odd to me is not being able to do anything but jump and attack when locked on... and this was fixed by LoD, of course. People move slowly, but this is counteracted (in a funky way) by how fast you move when you jump.

As much as I like him, I think AVGN's take on the game is all wrong. Usually, his stuff isn't meant to be taken super seriously, but his Castlevania reviews all came in part from personal experience and feelings as a child. Stating that the game "has no music" is obviously blatantly untrue, in anything but the first stage. I had actually forgotten that it literally had no music, since I was so used to the version of it in LoD (which is entirely different save for the general look and feel of it). I also disagree with Kurt's original take on the music, particularly the part about there barely being any classic caslevania tunes in the background... we all know now that there are three tracks from Dracula X (including arguably the best version of Dancing in Phantasmic Hell), and a nod to bloody tears. In regards to the Dracula X tracks, they just weren't something most of us were familiar with at the time (if you played Dracula X SNES when it came out, let me know). Besides, I think it's pretty well known that this is a series that has something of an over reliance on classic tunes (much as we love them). The tracks in this game aren't just "ambience", as Kurt put it, they are dark and brooding pieces that absolutely fit the atmosphere of this game (one that has never been matched or even tried again). And they don't just "fit", they are actually quite good, and I think a large problem with the games reception in general was "it's not what I'm used to, therefore it sucks". I had only played CV IV before playing CV 64... so I guess I was a little more open minded? And as others have put it, these games actually do have a lot more of the classic series feel in mind than most of Iga's work, at least in terms of gameplay.

Going back to AVGN, his frustrations with the Nitro section are pretty clearly based on a lack of understanding, but sum up how a lot of people apparently felt. I've just never felt it was all that big a deal, and as Jorge put it earlier, there are only a few areas that are really all that dangerous. They clear out the ones that would have been a big problem, including the room where you later fight Rosa/Camilla Fernandez. I almost made it through first try last night, actually, I just "zigged when I should have zagged" at the part with the biker skeleton. The only time when this section gave me trouble was when I was young, and I don't think I actually understood the path you were supposed to take. I remember being very, very relieved when I found that Cornell did not have to go to the Castle Center, which is silly to me now in retrospect.

Couple final thoughts, for the moment. I always liked the original outfits better (vs the Legacy of Darkness ones), Carries's especially... and Reinhardt's is just Henry minus his helmet (clever re use of assets, sure, but still kinda lame). I am currently playing a Carrie run and a Cornell run back to back, level to level (where appropriate, of course) to compare them. I would have liked to have done Carrie to Carrie, but I had deleted my original Cornell file, and thus was unable to start a new Carrie file. Not a big deal, as it has been ages since I had done Cornell's quest anyway, and I can just do another Carrie run later on hard mode, with the Maria outfit (after I do a Reinhardt comparison). I also don't remember ever having to fight Vincent, strangely enough, and I certainly never fought Renon. As I am now figuring out that for him, you need to actively work to get and spend enough money to be able to fight him. Also, it amazes me that these games were released not even a year apart, cementing the fact that they really had developed Cornell's content already but weren't able to finish it. Even considering that, I think it's rather amazing that they were able to change as much as they did for the existing content within that short amount of time.

[yamabigdog]

I rented them at the time they were out on N64, and found them lacking.  Unfortunately I can not agree with the sentiments shared in this thread.  While the PS2 games were fairly solid, these games were not.  I would go as far as saying the LoS series was better, but I'd never do that (especially LoS2)!

Maybe it's because I grew up with the originals, I dunno. Maybe you guys were closer in age to N64 being your "IT" system (mine was SNES).  By the time the N64 was in it's heyday, I was into other things more so than games at that juncture ( basketball, women, etc).  I did enjoy Turok, and Goldeneye, even some MarioKart and F-Zero.  I shortly thereafter bought a PC and got into FPS's pretty heavily.

I do remember renting these though, and felt like "this isn't CastleVania".  Now when playing these on emulators, my eyes bleed from the textures.  Perhaps this thread's perspective will get me to fire one up this weekend.  I will report back my findings if I do. 

[Zargon]

I rented them at the time they were out on N64, and found them lacking.  Unfortunately I can not agree with the sentiments shared in this thread.  While the PS2 games were fairly solid, these games were not.  I would go as far as saying the LoS series was better, but I'd never do that (especially LoS2)!

Maybe it's because I grew up with the originals, I dunno. Maybe you guys were closer in age to N64 being your "IT" system (mine was SNES).  By the time the N64 was in it's heyday, I was into other things more so than games at that juncture ( basketball, women, etc).  I did enjoy Turok, and Goldeneye, even some MarioKart and F-Zero.  I shortly thereafter bought a PC and got into FPS's pretty heavily.

I do remember renting these though, and felt like "this isn't CastleVania".  Now when playing these on emulators, my eyes bleed from the textures.  Perhaps this thread's perspective will get me to fire one up this weekend.  I will report back my findings if I do.

Not to discount your feelings or say that playing the games on an N64 will magically fix things, but N64 emulation is still pretty shaky these days. One of those things that was just never perfected, for one reason or another. As others have said though, it is best to play them on a CRT anyway, as they look worse on modern screens.

I grew up with the SNES and N64, and was still in middle school during the latter console's twilight years, so there may be a difference there.

I should clarify that I do not think these are perfect games... just that their problems have been overblown, and they have a reputation that they don't really deserve. I do think, though, that while the PS2 games are pretty much just action games... these are an interesting mix of action, platforming, adventure, and even elements of survival horror. You could say that it was trying to do too much, but I personally think all of those aspects were satisfying in these games, in one way or another. I think the end result is something that is, if nothing else, more interesting than either the ps2 games or Lords of Shadow. It would have been interesting to see this built upon, and I think they are games that every Castlevania fan owes it to themselves to play through completely, at least once. If you must play one, play Legacy of Darkness (and make sure it's on low settings). There are some things you miss out on, but it is a better game overall.

One bit of advice for anyone interested in playing this. Use the "interact" button (right c button) on lots of different, interesting things (especially in the Villa and the Castle Center). Treat it like an adventure game, with lots of hidden secrets to find.

[Dracula9]

I find this statement pretentious.

It's not a console problem, Zelda had the same basic controls which suited the Z-lock on system and configuration of the N64 pad. Castlevania 64's controls just weren't as refined.

A mere admission of opinion to clarify the importance of this context isn't pretentious. He's allowed to disagree or think whatever he wants about those opinions. At least he's not being an ass about it--that seems to be my derpartment.

I actually would argue heavily against N64 Zelda (mostly Ocarina as that's the "big" one) being refined in its combat mechanics, but this isn't the place for it. Arin's Sequelitis on Zelda covers pretty much all of my issues with it though, for reference's sake.

All that being said though, while I never finished either 64 title (as far as I remember, anyway...I recall getting really far in 1, but don't remember if I beat it), I enjoyed the hell out of a lot of it.

The way they handle atmosphere is fantastic.

Biggest gripes with them are predominantly due to the universal "how well has it aged" factor--I don't think either has aged particularly well. Controls are clunky, things are present that make no sense (I think Skelebikes are awesome as shit too, but they take me out of it just like the robots in OoE do), etc.

I think of all the titles in the franchise, the CV64 would probably benefit the most from a remake/reboot. There was a lot of potential in there and it's disappointing that what was explored therein never really got touched on again in future iterations.

[X]

Maybe it's because I grew up with the originals, I dunno. Maybe you guys were closer in age to N64 being your "IT" system (mine was SNES).

I grew up starting with the NES and working my way up from there. It took quite a while for me to warm up the the N64 titles as I was blown away by SotN as well. However I did give the games a chance despite how they are now in terms of graphics and play control, and I did find them very enjoyable despite the flaws. The atmosphere is stunning and the music ambience -either quiet or upbeat- works well to fit the environments. The story aspects are also very touching (especially Carrie's ending where she pays her respects to her murdered step mother.) On the whole I feel that CV64/LoD is a good entry to the series.

[zangetsu468]

A mere admission of opinion to clarify the importance of this context isn't pretentious. He's allowed to disagree or think whatever he wants about those opinions. At least he's not being an ass about it--that seems to be my derpartment.

I admit it's my opinion, if someone had said "Although I disagree with most opinions in this thread.." rather than objectively labelling all others to theirs as "terrible", I wouldn't have said a peep. There's an inherent difference, one illustrates that their are differences in our opinions, the other assumes the majority of the thread opinions are "bad/ unfavourable". This was why I said it, to put it simply that if someone can rate my opinion as less valid than their own, I will call that statement to light. Precisely why I mentioned finding the statement pretentious and not the overall post/ poster.

Nah dude, I don't think it's your department tbh. I see you telling it like it is, and you often lay the smack down, (hard yet effective) someone's gotta do it.

I actually would argue heavily against N64 Zelda (mostly Ocarina as that's the "big" one) being refined in its combat mechanics, but this isn't the place for it. Arin's Sequelitis on Zelda covers pretty much all of my issues with it though, for reference's sake.

Just for clarity:
- Refined by N64 days, not by what we consider refined today.
- Refined compared to Castlevania 64's controls which were more "clunky" by nature.

Zelda had the control scheme down for n64 days.

All that being said though, while I never finished either 64 title (as far as I remember, anyway...I recall getting really far in 1, but don't remember if I beat it), I enjoyed the hell out of a lot of it.

The way they handle atmosphere is fantastic.

Atmosphere = unparalleled

[RichterB]

The crazy thing is that these games, which were originally supposed to be one game, were originally supposed to have even MORE content. I compiled some of the history here several years back: http://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/index.php?topic=4917.0

There is no doubt in my mind that these are the best 3D Castlevania games to date. The first one is actually a more cohesive "game" experience in my mind, while the second one, with its refinements and additions, feels more like DLC overall. Despite each having flaws, the trajectory for this development team was looking really good, and both entries are memorable. I grew up around the NES Castlevania games, especially Simon's Quest and Dracula's Curse, and played a lot of SCVIV and IIRC a little of Dracula X SNES before playing Castlevania 64 and LoD, and I found that they were a logical 3D evolution to the series. They kept the player-controlled action-platforming and enemy placement that basically every other 3D Castlevania dropped--which is the CORE of Castlevania--while still including some of the questing and RPG elements from Simon's Quest and SotN; and on top of all that, they cleverly added their own twist of survival horror elements.

These games weren't really reviewed poorly back in the day, either. I just assumed the series would continue to build off of these games. By Curse of Darkness, though, it was clear to me that these games and their design elements had been buried by Konami. They've gained an unfair reputation over the years.

Here is my basic list of CV64/LoD accomplishments that made it into the final cuts of the games, which lays out how much they got right. (And keep in mind this was sort of a "first foray" into 3D with tons of limitations and a high learning curve; in the years since, the ambition and accomplishments seen below have actually, astonishingly, become less achieved by other 3D Castlevania):

*Multiple unique characters (up to four in LoD, two in CV64) with alternate levels/bosses (some even optional)
*Full 3D gameplay (ala Mario 64, so it's not "on-rails")
*Multiple endings based on performance
*Level design features spatial depth (vertical and horizontal--not flat hallways)
*Day-and-night cycles with time-sensitive events (like Simon's Quest)
*Weather effects (rain, lightning, moving clouds, and "fog"--the last one likely being a graphical shortcoming that actually helped)
*Dynamic, real-time lighting (next to candles, for instance)
*Spot-on creepy atmosphere
*Death-defying platforming of all sorts (including ledge grabbing).
*Environmental/enemy hazards (medusa heads, spikes, guillotines, buzz-saws, cannons).
*Innovative survival-horror/suspense elements
*Vampires that pretend to be human and vampires as regular enemies besides bosses
*Status changes, including poison and vampirism
*Manageable questing with inventory items (meat, keys, cards, cure ampules, etc)
*Interesting, involving plot (characters like Rosa, Vincent, Renon, Malice, Henry, etc)
*3D in-game cinemas
*Some voicing
*Unlockable alternate costumes
*Long and short-ranged attacks (IE: whip + sword), plus classic sub-weapons
*Upgradable sub-weapons (in LoD)
*There is a useful slide and duck/crawl play mechanic (that can also be mixed into custom attack combos)
*Diverse mix of old and new enemies in 3D

[Zargon]

(click to show/hide)

The crazy thing is that these games, which were originally supposed to be one game, were originally supposed to have even MORE content. I compiled some of the history here several years back: http://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/index.php?topic=4917.0

There is no doubt in my mind that these are the best 3D Castlevania games to date. The first one is actually a more cohesive "game" experience in my mind, while the second one, with its refinements and additions, feels more like DLC overall. Despite each having flaws, the trajectory for this development team was looking really good, and both entries are memorable. I grew up around the NES Castlevania games, especially Simon's Quest and Dracula's Curse, and played a lot of SCVIV and IIRC a little of Dracula X SNES before playing Castlevania 64 and LoD, and I found that they were a logical 3D evolution to the series. They kept the player-controlled action-platforming and enemy placement that basically every other 3D Castlevania dropped--which is the CORE of Castlevania--while still including some of the questing and RPG elements from Simon's Quest and SotN; and on top of all that, they cleverly added their own twist of survival horror elements.

These games weren't really reviewed poorly back in the day, either. I just assumed the series would continue to build off of these games. By Curse of Darkness, though, it was clear to me that these games and their design elements had been buried by Konami. They've gained an unfair reputation over the years.

Here is my basic list of CV64/LoD accomplishments that made it into the final cuts of the games, which lays out how much they got right. (And keep in mind this was sort of a "first foray" into 3D with tons of limitations and a high learning curve; in the years since, the ambition and accomplishments seen below have actually, astonishingly, become less achieved by other 3D Castlevania):

*Multiple unique characters (up to four in LoD, two in CV64) with alternate levels/bosses (some even optional)
*Full 3D gameplay (ala Mario 64, so it's not "on-rails")
*Multiple endings based on performance
*Level design features spatial depth (vertical and horizontal--not flat hallways)
*Day-and-night cycles with time-sensitive events (like Simon's Quest)
*Weather effects (rain, lightning, moving clouds, and "fog"--the last one likely being a graphical shortcoming that actually helped)
*Dynamic, real-time lighting (next to candles, for instance)
*Spot-on creepy atmosphere
*Death-defying platforming of all sorts (including ledge grabbing).
*Environmental/enemy hazards (medusa heads, spikes, guillotines, buzz-saws, cannons).
*Innovative survival-horror/suspense elements
*Vampires that pretend to be human and vampires as regular enemies besides bosses
*Status changes, including poison and vampirism
*Manageable questing with inventory items (meat, keys, cards, cure ampules, etc)
*Interesting, involving plot (characters like Rosa, Vincent, Renon, Malice, Henry, etc)
*3D in-game cinemas
*Some voicing
*Unlockable alternate costumes
*Long and short-ranged attacks (IE: whip + sword), plus classic sub-weapons
*Upgradable sub-weapons (in LoD)
*There is a useful slide and duck/crawl play mechanic (that can also be mixed into custom attack combos)
*Diverse mix of old and new enemies in 3D

Thank you for all the info, lots of stuff I didn't know, and a good amount that I did. I too had heard that Cornell and Koller were supposed to be prisoners you could save, but I couldn't tell you where. I had just read something about the engagement ring mentioned in that Unseen 64 article, in an old gamefaqs guide from 2001. Very obviously related to Malus's proposal to Carrie in her bad ending. Based on the description, it almost sounds like it was an item they intended for you to have in a new game plus file with her (though of course it could have have been part of the main story, then quite different than it ended up).

Couple cute illustrations I had never seen before, in the vg museum link you posted:





First one with mummy girl, I kind of wonder if she is an earlier design for Koller 2 (the girl with short pink hair), Koller's planned rival/nemesis. With him being kind of like Frankenstein's Monster (and essentially ending up as such, with the gardener), it would make sense that she would have elements of the Bride of Frankenstein (bandages). Carrie obsessing over food is cute, and basically just makes me wonder if they were planning on having a larger variety of food available at one point. I do want to make note that it's not unusual for there to be a lot of scrapped ideas for games, we're just able to see a lot of it for these games. However, based on how far a long a lot of it seemed to be, and based on the fact that Legacy of Darkness exists, it is more likely than in most cases that we actually "coulda got this".

It is worth noting that I think a good amount of Konami's output on the N64 was like this... lots of good ideas but ultimately rushed. Deadly Arts (aka G.A.S.P. Fighters NEXTreme) had wonderfully detailed and interactable stages for the time, and actually had something where you could create your own fighter and give them moves from the other characters movesets by way of training with them. Its downfall is ultimately that it is just really damned hard to pull off practically anything on anyone's movelist, even though they don't seem all that hard to do (though this may be due to an uneven framerate caused by the aforementioned stages). Hybrid Heaven I have not played (would like to), but I know it has a lot of really interesting, unique ideas that end up feeling like they were never fully realized. The two N64 Goemon Games feel the least like they have unrealized potential, Goemon's Great Adventure in particular, though there could be stuff about them that we just don't know (because the Goemon series was treated as a Japan only affair for most of its life). Hell, Mystical Ninja Starring Goemon, as much as I love it to death, has a very odd pacing to it. It feels like it's lacking at least one Impact Boss (and maybe a normal boss as well), and the fetch quest with Kihachi the Kappa near the end feels like it is the sort of thing that was inserted in place of a dungeon that was ultimately cut due to time constraints. This wouldn't make total sense, considering each of the four characters gets a dungeon where they are allowed to shine above the others, but the feeling that something may have been left out is hard to shake.

The reason for all this is up to debate, though it is possible that while Konami had struck a deal with Nintendo to produce for the system, they had less faith in it than the Playstation. This is especially possible with their great successes on that system, such as Metal Gear Solid and SotN, though they produced a ton of sports titles for the N64 (as they always did with everything). Even with all this in mind, I think the Castlevania 64 games came out pretty satisfying, especially considering Legacy of Darkness. They're no Goemon's Great Adventure, but one might argue that they are at least as good as Mystical Ninja Starring Goemon. Flawed, but absolutely priceless in terms of overall value and uniqueness.

To leave off, I am beginning to think that fighting Renon is one of those things that nobody actually found on their own, and we would not have known back in the day without strategy guides and Nintendo Power. Seriously, you either have to grind for it, or find ALL the secret gold in the game.

[RichterB]

Zargon: Excellent observations on Coller 2. I've done a lot of speculation on the lost material over the years with board member Sumac, and we had some similar thoughts. I think she may have been the Rosa of Coller's quest, and that the scientist-looking guy was the Death for Coller's quest. I suggest this because it seems there is a lot of mirroring of various characters' quests; like, at the end of the Castle Center, there are four towers (and there were supposed to be four playable characters). If you think about the gameplay in each, taking into account the Beta stuff and LoD, Tower of Science was probably meant for Coller, Tower of Sorcery for Carrie, Dual Tower for Cornell, and Tower of Execution for Reinhardt.

While I was looking into Coller 2 again to reply to your post, I just came across this site that claims info from a Japanese magazine (and, as I've found out, an official strategy guide, as well) that fills in some blanks I have not heretofore read about alongside stuff I have read about from older original English-language articles: https://www.giantbomb.com/castlevania/3030-22950/ (If this can be trusted, in it, your mummy girl mystery is explained...)

As an aside, I do wonder if Capcom's Darkstalkers fighting game series had an influence on the world of CV64. There is a martial-arts werewolf character in that and a Frankenstein character with a female counterpart who was, in this case, the prototype. It could all be coincidental, though.

I only got to rent and play a little of Mystical Ninja Staring Goemon back in the day. I found it interesting. But I have played all of Hybrid Heaven, and it is indeed another of those rough-around-the-edges gems. To this day, it's not known if it was intended to be a Metal Gear spinoff or an original IP right off the bat. Regardless, the final build of the game, while it does have some Metal Gear-like elements and storytelling, is very much its own thing. There isn't another game like it, really. It is fun and memorable, though, once you get over the learning curve.

World/story-wise, it is a mixture of stuff like The X-Files and Men in Black (the plot is actually quite clever). Gameplay-wise, it's divided between two styles: 1.) 3D platformer with some set-piece events and mild stealth elements where you run, jump, climb, and crawl through obstacles, find special items, take out security systems with a special pistol that only affects electronics, and/or run from danger. 2.) Fully interactive turn-based RPG battles against humanoid opponents whereby you can move freely during the battle, but when you find your moment and angle of attack, you go into a pop-up menu that freezes the action and gives you various physical attack options that correspond to different body parts. The more you use different parts of your body in battle, the more those parts of the body level up, so you have to be thoughtful about how you develop your character, because the villains in the game require different strategies. Also, you can steal special moves from the enemies by having them perform them on you during battle. Eventually, you can put your learned moves into custom combos; but through all of this, you have to be aware of your stamina gauge. It's really weird, but genius and fun once you get into it. Oh, and there are a few weapons and power-ups you can use during battles if you're in a pinch, like a flame gun or an ice gun, but they are in short supply, adding a bit of survival-horror to the whole thing. If you have an open mind, enjoy sci-fi, and find the experimental nature of the N64 era appealing, Hybrid Heaven is just plain cool. Really interesting character designs, too, but the graphics kind of limit things. I have never read any interviews about the mindset behind developing this game.

Yeah, I'm not sure about what was going on with Konami during the N64, but it was fascinating. They had another unique, big-concept game in the works that got completely cancelled called "Survivor: Day One." https://www.unseen64.net/2008/04/04/survivor-day-one-n64-cancelled/

Whatever the fallout was with the N64 games, it must not have been great, because the cancelled Dreamcast game, Castlevania Resurrection, was said to be a lot more straightforward in 3D design. I think there was a rumor, or maybe a Resurrection developer statement out there that said the basic gameplay ideas from there were looked at when Lament of Innocence was decided upon and Resurrection was scrapped. Or at least, the in-progress material of Resurrection was handed off to Japan. If you're not familiar with Resurrection in general: https://www.unseen64.net/2008/04/10/castlevania-resurrection-dc-cancelled/

[Zargon]

Richter B: Once again, thank you for all the info! Some great finds, very interesting about Mummy-chan. I recognized "Nerichagi" as something Kim Kaphwan in Fatal Fury/King of Fighters does (and says), it looks like it is of course a type of kick in Taekwando: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xx_-9EMdgdA

So while she's pretty clearly not Coller 2, this was interesting none the less. It would have been interesting to see her as the boss of maybe the Tower of Ruins, as I am coming off of that and the Tower of Art feeling like they needed a boss, a cutscene, or something. Tower of Ruins stood well enough on its own I think with its focus on puzzles and exploration, though Tower of Art, pretty and an interesting idea idea as it is (and I love Sinking Old Sanctuary, despite how much you hear it in Circle of the Moon), came off as feeling more gimmicky this time than the last time I played this.

I agree with your observations about Coller's stuff, including the scientist vampire from the concept art. I always wondered what his deal was, and that's a pretty good explanation, though I still question how good he would have looked in this game, with how serious it is (biker skeletons aside), and with the N64s rendering capabilities. I also very much agree with the Towers, which would make it more impressive that they were able to develop two brand new tower levels (Art and Ruins) in that amount of time along with everything else they did, that they wouldn't have had before the release of Castlevania 64 (as i originally had suspected). Tower of Science most certainly fits with Coller, I think, not just because it's sciencey, but because of it's extra gritty nature.

Speaking of Tower of Science, I just got through it with both Carrie (in Castlevania 64) and Cornell, and boy what an experience that was. I'm not actually certain I went through it with Carrie in Castlevania 64 before, as I'm not even sure I got all that far with her or even played her quest in it (I played her Legacy of Darkness quest for sure). First things first, those electric beams at the start of the level were kind of the worst, as it is not only hard to tell when they are actually firing with how they flicker, they also appear to have a random pattern that goes between two sets, depending on the RNG when the level loaded, I suppose. Either they can be on for three seconds, and be off for a decent amount of time, or be on for like FIVE seconds and barely be off for long at all! This is a problem because of the setups, and how you're supposed to tackle certain jumps, and mistiming things will result in an instant death by falling. This is very obviously fixed in the LoD version of that section, where not only do they look different, they are much clearer about when they are on and when they aren't, and the firing rate problem seems to be gone. Also, the spiked blocks (very gritty, much science, wow!) are destructable in LoD, at least for Cornell. Beyond that, the rest of the tower is one hundred percent different (worth noting, for those unaware, that the versions of the levels used in Carrie and Reinhardt's quests in LoD are the same as those in Cornell and Henry's, so the old versions of their levels aren't present at all in LoD).

The next part for Carrie is made fairly worse than it would be normally, because the slowdown in the room full of turrets and sciency things in giant vats of green liquid is really intense. Normally it's just something I've been able to shrug off pretty well, but it is really quite annoying here. The is a section with lots of jumps you need to time well too, although the funny thing is, there is an odd section of platforms with some overhead turrets pointed directly at you. They try to fire at you, and anywhere else in the room, they would have been able to hit you, but for some magic reason, their bullets stop short here. It essentially seems as though the developers knew they had made something pretty rough and annoying, so they took pity on the poor player here. In Cornell's section, of course, this part does not exist. While it's pretty obvious why, I would be curios to see how LoD's engine would have handled it, being that they largely fixed the slowdown and framerate (on the low setting, anyway).... though there was a bit of slowdown later on for him, so perhaps best not to push it there. Of note, there is a neat section with a bunch of wall turrets that you can make use of your slide and look cool sliding under all those bullets. Lastly, there is actually a boss in the LoD version! Not a very hard one, but it's appreciated all the same, as it had been two stages without any sort of boss or cutscene for Cornell. Again, while it's all (mostly) still quite fun, the section from Tower of Art to tower of Execution feels very dry in terms of stuff actually going on, due to lack of bosses and cutscenes. Oh well, this was developed in less than a year, after all. I'm not honestly sure I prefer one version over the other either, despite my complaints about the CV64 version, because while it does work in the context of Cornell's quest, it does feel like it's over pretty quickly for Carrie's.

I very much intend to check out Hybrid Heaven, and have taken note of how cheap it is cart only on ebay. I may even pop for a box and manual, as it actually does look nice (got the manual for Castlevania 64, but early CGI Reinhardt does not excite so much. I don't typically collect N64 boxes anyway). And I had noted Survivor: Day One when reviewing what N64 games konami released (or was planning to release) for my previous post, so it is nice to get some more info on it. It definitely seems like the N64 had become a pariah to them at that point, a mentality which continued on with Castlevania Resurrection. Interesting that it may have ended up influencing Lament of Innocence, I think Iga definitely should have given the N64 games a look instead (rather than just retconning them and pretending they never happened until Castlevania Judgment). While as a whole, the God of War series is sort of looked back upon as a big glurg of saminess, the original God of War ended up doing what Lament of Innocence wanted to do with combat, but better. This is something that was apparently brought up in an interview with Iga, and it embarrassed him. =P

[Abnormal Freak]

I think I'm gonna e-marry affinity, even if she ends up being a grizzled man.

The N64 games hold a special place in my heart. They have their problems, sure, but they're games with vision. The atmosphere is some of the best in the series, helped by the low-key ambient music—which gets a lot of flak, but I think it's brilliant. I figure I'll always enjoy going back to both games every few years, and I'd love to get a Virtual Console release for at least Legacy of Darkness.



Right-click > Save as > SpankBank\mummybabe.jpg

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

^LOL, this guy.

I think I will start a playthrough of these games again on my N64 but on my big TV (I have a hardware scaler), just for the lulz.
I wish I had streaming equipment, I'd do this just to showcase the game.  I can actually play through the entire game with minimal gameovers, but I'm so spoiled by SaveStates that if I got a GameOver I'd be mad over just losing my SubWeapon, hahaah.

[X]

Oh yes. Save states. I do this with LoD because of the Tower of Ruins pillar segments. I can never tell which pillars to climb and which ones to avoid. I suppose if I kept a slip of paper with the pillar symbols on it then I wouldn't need to worry about save states. But, kinda lazy that way 

[redrum]

DANGEROUS AREA: The Catwalk and Gears room.

yes!  i love how crazy difficult this puzzle is.  it requires such a steady hand that so much as a phone call can break your concentration and send you exploding across the area.  perhaps i'm alone in this, but i hoped that LoD was gonna make it *MORE* difficult.

i've been looking for the text dump i did for this game, but it seems to be lost along with my pitfall2600 data...

people love to bash the camera & general controls for this game, but it plays as easily as mario64 ever did for me.  i'm not sure what the hang up is for everyone.  as for the motorcycle skeleton, he gets no love but i think he's fantastic!