Topic: Is going into the marines worth it for free college?

[CastleToastM]

I had a recruiter call yesterday and invited me for a interview. I went and learned about the benifits, and took the asvab test. I got a 76, whatever that means. He said it was good. Compared to other people who took it, it's a pretty good score.

For some reason, the marines have been very interested in me. Ever since my Junior year, I've gotten calls and advertisements through the mail relating to the marines. Now they've sent someone in person. My recruiter told me that the marines have already spent 6,000 to 8,000 dollars on me already. That's more than 40% of my father's yearly income. For my family, that's a huge amount of money.

The screening process is very selective. You must not have any felonies, not even tried any drug, have a GPA of over 2.5, took two AP classes at the same time in any year, not have any medical conditions, not had any surgeries, not have braces or any surgical pins, be 17 or older, be graduating and not fail any grade even once, not have a GED or drop out, and score more than a 50 on the asvab. Even then, they only seek students whom they personally believe can succeed in the marines.

Only a select few get pulled out and talked to in person. Especially in my school. There has only been a total of three who meets all qualifications out of 1,600 students. The average asvab score is 35, despite it being a rather moderately easy test. In my opinion, anyways.

Only two got picked by the air force, and those two are going to the air force academy.

They're offering to give me free college while I serve the marines. I'll be able to work off my four years at the same time I'm earning my bachelors.

The amount of money my family has saved for me for college is in the negatives. If I even want to think about going to college on my own, I'll be forced to use student loans, and the time I pay it off, it'll be triple the original price. I basically have nothing to go to college with, and I can't learn computer animation without going to college.

My passion and desire to do animation is great enough, that joining the marines seems very tempting.

But my father is opposed to the very idea. He says that the army is a bunch of lying, stealing crooks who only want more cannon fodder or bullet catchers for their military. My recruit says that I won't be sent to active duty or a war zone due to the fact that I'm the only male who can carry on my family name unless I choose to go. My father says this is a lie, and I'll be eventually be forced to be sent to battle.

I for one, refuse to go to battle. I don't want to take the life of another human. The very idea horrifies me. I also don't want to sign my own life away to an organization who deals with war and fighting. If I do join, the chance that I'll be shipped away will always be there.

My recruiter says that if I so choose, after boot camp, I can do a job relating to computers. Repair, programming, ect. I can just do computer related stuff for those four years of service.

Another thing that I won't like is the boot camp. I'm not exactly physically fit. I can barely run a fourth of a mile, let alone one and a half in 13 minutes. I also can't even imagine what boot camp will even be like. My recruiter says they'll start out small and eventually get up to speed. It's three months of boot camp before the four years of service.

http://www.marines.com/main/index/making_marines/recruit_training/marine-bootcamp
I've been researching the marines and what I should expect, and quite frankly, it seems like some tough stuff.

http://www.airforce.com/opportunities/enlisted/basic-training/
Sure as hell makes the air force boot camp look like an afternoon at a playground. Not only that, the air force is only two months, compared to three at the marines.

I'm currently trying to find some information on the marines vs the air force. I have no idea what the air force has to offer. I have little to no interest in aeronautics or piloting anything that doesn't touch the ground. If it goes in the air or water, I don't have any interest in it, or being on it.

But getting into the marines is a guarentee if I so choose to go there. The marines want me to go there, and they will (and have) spend several thousand to do so.

[JR]

I for one, refuse to go to battle. I don't want to take the life of another human. The very idea horrifies me. I also don't want to sign my own life away to an organization who deals with war and fighting. If I do join, the chance that I'll be shipped away will always be there.

Sounds like you might have answered your own question right there. Even if you are away from the frontlines, you will still be contributing to warfare in some shape or form. Not saying that's a good or bad thing, just something you should keep in mind.

If you're still considering, you will definitely want to do some more research. I think recruiters have a reputation of making active duty sound like a trip to Disneyland, so you may want to get a definitive answer on the whole only-male-child-of-the-household thing...from a neutral source. Find out for certain what your rights are as a conscientious objector if you sign up for the Marines, or if they let you do that at all.

Just as a warning, I have an uncle who joined the Navy during the Vietnam War, under the assumption that he wouldn't see action. Through some events I don't really know (since he doesn't really talk about it himself and I've only heard through other family members), he worked as a medic and saw some things that kinda ruined his life. He's been dependent on my grandma ever since. So not seeing combat doesn't necessarily mean you won't witness some horrible things. I'm sure things are handled differently than they were back when we had a draft going on, but I'm just throwing that out there.

I had to deal with recruiters in high school, too, because of high ASVAB scores. I couldn't manage to tell the recruiter no, so when he set up a time for a visit, I just made sure I wasn't home. Kind of a dick move, I guess, but I didn't know how to tell them I wasn't interested.  

[Bloodreign]

I ducked plenty of recruiters myself, high ASVAB scores and all. They will sweet talk the hell out of you into joining, I knew war was hell and I had a friend who promised to make a lifetime out of the marines. After his 4 years was up, he said fuck that and got the hell out without re-enlisting, hell he tried to get me to go with him in the marines, I wasn't having that.

[Successor The Cruel]

Hell no, unless you want to live a crap life and/or die/get wounded.  Go to http://www.fafsa.gov, get some financial aid and go from there.

[X]

I wouldn't bother going. You don't need to go to collage to learn computer animation anymore. You can just as easily learn that stuff off the net nowadays. Self-teaching is way better then schooling and far less expensive. But it helps to have some pointers from people you know who've already taken it. Since Drafting is no longer an acceptable means of recruitment they will sweet-talk you into it with their so-called guarantees, pensions, free schooling, so-on and so-fourth, blah-blah-blee-blah. War is not for the faint of heart and you sound like me; a pacifist by nature. You won't kill cause it disturbs you on some deeper level. These are your nature warning signs. They're there to help guide and protect you if you listen to them. In your defense and with credit to your father's advice, don't enlist. While it is your choice, listen to your inner voice. <--dude! This rhymes 

All joking aside, tell those military pussies you're not interested and leave it at that.

-X

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

The Military Recruiter was extremely interested in me in high school, until after I went to the recruitment location and found out I did not qualify because of Asthma and because of possible back problems.

Afterwards,the Recruiter never contacted me again.  Turns out it was for the best because, with my grades, and my low family income, FAFSA provided me with most of my college funding all the way until my last year.  And since I kept my college grades up, my college debt once I was done wasn't very high at all.  It was paid within the first two years of my first job.

So find out all the facts and what you're eligible for now, before diving into the military.  I'm not knocking folks who go, but know all of your options before you do.  Oftentimes, the recruiters are itching to pick up people who are suckered into "you get money for college" thing.

Lastly, it sounds like if it weren't offering the GI Bill, you wouldn't at all be interested in doing it.  Because of this, I can guarantee that you will not get the most out of the place as those who go voluntarily and for their own military enrichment.

[Vampire Killer]

If you're going to join the military, join the Airforce. Otherwise, don't bother unless you enjoy being used as cannon fodder.

[CastleToastM]

I wonder, what if I mention to the recruiter that I rather join the air force? What are my chances of getting in?

I have a novel that I'm writing. I need like two chapters, and it's done. If I get it published (which I have no idea how to get something published, then have it sold) would that be enough to get me through a community college?

I really need this bit of information. I need that to be an option. What I also need is time. I can't research that right now.

As I mentioned in the topic title, all I want is a free way through college. It does not in any way have to be easy. As long as I get a career that I want, I will do anything, other than take a life, to get it.

My passion and desire burns with great intensity. I want nothing to stand in my way.

Something I learned just today is that one of my best friends since the 7th grade is joining the marines. He's signed up and is going 100%. If I do decide to go to boot camp within the month, I will be going to the same boot camp as he and six other students from the school.

Because there will be a potential six students going, I can tell by that information, and I understand now, that I am certainly not the only one he has personally talked to like this.

[X]

I have a novel that I'm writing. I need like two chapters, and it's done. If I get it published (which I have no idea how to get something published, then have it sold) would that be enough to get me through a community college?

You will need to get in touch with a publisher in order to help publish your novel. But that's not necessarily the case anymore. You can self-publish your own work. It's been done by those whom publishers tend to overlook because they don't feel that 'said individual' has any focus or enough talent to write a good story. If you're book does manage to get published and recognized then you'll receive the payment of your work, but it may or may not be enough to fund your collage education. It all depends really. It might be easier to talk with someone who already has had their work published. If you know anyone like that in your area then don't wait around. It is unfortunate that collage and university aren't free even though the laws about education are quite clear.

-X

[Mooning Freddy]

(reserve) Sgt. Freddy here!

From what I've heard so far, it sounds like you consider joining the army, but not being very serious about it. It's all because of your American recruiters who try to "lure" people into the army (marines) any way possible. That kind of behavior sounds very wrong IMO, being a soldiers is a great responsibility, and they shouldn't try to convince any kids who like playing FPS and think they know anything about the army.
It seems to me like you want money. And you know what? You don't recruit for the money.
Wanna hear it again? You don't recruit because you need money.
Third time?  YOU SHOULDN'T RECRUIT BECAUSE OF THE MONEY.

I don't care how much they pay you. You ain't some mercenary who fights for money. You need to be a patriot and believe in the military campaigns your country is leading around the world. Because a soldier must believe in whatever he's doing.
You also don't have to be a fighter or on the battlefield, but still, you'd have to accept the military discipline in your work.
There are other ways to make money, you know. Think about it. Maybe you're not the type to be a soldier.

My case was different. I had no choice. I was recruited because in my country, it's the law. I received around 200$ a month, and that's quite a high salary for a soldier in my country,  since I was a fighter. And still, I was proud to be a soldier, because I knew that I'm defending my home from potential terrorism.
If I was in your place, I don't know whether or not I would have decided to recruit. Probably not, if there was a chance I'd find myself fighting for a lost cause in Afghanistan.

There was an Israeli reporter, Ilana Dayan, who went to Afghanistan to make a report about the American soldiers there. She presented in the report a harsh reality of soldiers fighting an invisible enemy in a hostile environment, with a civilian population which moves back and forth between not cooperating to assisting the enemy.  It's an attrition warfare in which the Americans can't win, losing soldiers every day. In the report she interviewed a soldier who explained that each time he leaves the camp, he knows there's a possibility he won't return. "Death is inevitable" he said, to what Dayan responded, "John, you're 21."

Fact - in Afghanistan עובדה- באפגניסטן

If there's something I can say about the soldiers in Afghanistan, is that I'm sure as HELL they're not fighting for the money.

[CastleToastM]

Sgt. Freddy: You know, what you said really hit. If I join now, with only the benifits in mind, I'll be a mercenary.

What I want to do is ask the recruiter WHY the marines want me as much as he explains.

And why he follows me around school, constantly asking what I'm waiting for.

I've already asked to see the documents and be able to analyze them in a home setting before making a decsion.

I asked him how the hell joining the marines and working for them will better further my animation skills. He answered almost immediately that they'll be giving me college for that. By the way that he worded it: Nothing. It won't help my animation skills at all. It'll be the college that will be assiting that.

I researched the novel thing, and by what I found out, with the amount of pressure I have going on, using that as a means would be the equilivant of making a gamble. In this current point of time, I can't rely on that on being an option.

And the fact that my best friend is going to boot camp won't leave my mind. My habits have already been reversed and I've started to think about working out a lot more heavily. I'm also starting to feel a bit more confident about boot camp.

Despite the fact that I have the knowledge of the internet under my thumb, I continue to have mixed feelings about the marines.

I can be an objective mercenary or a poor citizen. I really need more options. Either way, I'm gambling with my future.

[X]

Exactly. Your life is in your hands and there's little more any of us here at the dungeon can offer to help you with. Just keep your chin up,  pick a path and see what the future brings you.

-X

[Successor The Cruel]

Man, forget those recruiters.  They do that stuff to all kinds of people.  They're not much better than salesmen.

You're going to have to research stuff.  There are options open to people in your shoes, you just have to take advantage of them.  If you don't have the money for college, again, go to the FAFSA website and register for federal aid.  To put it bluntly, you can get up to around $6,000 or so from that.  Also, there is the Board of Governor's Waiver that can waive your tuition fees... but, then again, I think that may only be a California thing.  Anyway, point being that there are things set up to help you.  There are many people who aren't paying college tuition directly out of their pocket, so to speak.

Also, if you want to know more about publishing a book, this is a useful place to visit http://www.writingforums.org/.  They talk about that stuff all the time over there.  You'd do well to browse around their forum for information, or just straight out ask them.

[Tanatra]

I spent 2 years of my life trying (and in training) to become an officer in the Marine Corps. It's a long story why it didn't work out - I'd be happy to share it with you, but for now I think it's best if I focused on your situation. I have a lot of stuff to say, so the important things are in bold for your convenience:

Citizen Freddy is spot-on. That Marine recruiter sounds like a piece of shit; When I was interested in the Marines, they didn't tell me about benefits or play down how difficult training would be, they straight up told me "I have plenty of guys just like you wanting to be in the Marine Corps. Why should I pick you over them?" Depending on how you answered, you could be either be shown the way out or registered for your MEPS within the hour.

The Marines are fiercely adamant about something called esprit de corps - pride in what you are doing and why you are doing it. Granted, all the branches of the military are like that, but nowhere near to the extent of the Marine Corps in my experience. Anyone thinking about going into the military is going to be preoccupied with the benefits of doing so; the esprit de corps will come during your training, but just make sure that you're going in for the right reasons. If you're just in it for the money/benefits, then believe me, your drill instructors will notice, and the very last thing you want at bootcamp is for your instructors to take a special interest in you.

I'll go ahead and say that Marines probably have it the worst out of all the military branches. To put it in perspective, the Army/Navy/Air Force each have annual budget of about $300 billion annually. The Marines serve under the Department of the Navy and have to make do with whatever money the Navy sets aside for them, which is usually less than $30 billion a year. You'll still get the same pay & benefits as servicemen in the other branches, but your amenities and living situation will be far less comfortable. Also, the Marines are unique in that every last one of them goes through training to be basic infantry, even the ones who aren't selected to become infantry during training. You'll be spending a lot of time out in the field and traversing 5-15 miles a day with over 100 lbs. on your back. However, the other branches are starting to follow suite in doing this, because the traditional definition of "the front lines" has become quite blurred in the last decade.

Marines live hard lives, but very rewarding ones. I was miserable the whole time I was at Officer Candidates School, but looking back on it I have nothing but the fondest of memories of it. There's literally not a day goes by that I don't think about my training, and it's been over a year & a half!

Good luck with your decision, man. Personally, I say go for it and enlist. You'll mature and grow as a person immeasurably while serving in the military. Sure, the Marines are hard, but after you've completed training, you'll look back on it and say "Holy shit! I did that!" and your confidence level will just go through the roof. Anyone who is hesitant to go through with something simply because it is hard is just being a pussy IMO, pure and simple.

Also, if you want to know more about publishing a book, this is a useful place to visit http://www.writingforums.org/.  They talk about that stuff all the time over there.  You'd do well to browse around their forum for information, or just straight out ask them.

Here's another outstanding writing resource:

http://www.absolutewrite.com/forums/

That site is particularly good for connections & learning the ins & outs of the publishing industry. Literary agents frequent the forums quite often.

[CastleToastM]

Well, I just decided to so some exercise this Wednesday, and I must say, just an hour of it is quite some hard work.

I wasn't even working out that whole hour. More like twenty minutes.

Like hell if I'm joining the Marines. I can't even run a block without collapsing to my knees and gasping for air as though I'm dying.

The Marines sure are complete morons if they're seriously looking for people like me. That, or they're desperate.

Why would they want hypocritical hemophobia pacifist who can't even jog to save his life in their ranks? Not only that, but one that's in it just to become a mercenary, and not a Marine?

If there was anything I learned from this, it's that I need to keep exercising. Sure has motivated me to do so.

Strange thing: Once I made my decision (I never told the Recruiter yet) in my mind to not go, the guy has disappeared and I can't even find him anymore. One day he's escorting me to all my classes while carrying my shit and telling me just how fucking damn badass I am because I can lift a pencil with my arm horizontal, and the next, gone.

Another strange thing: As soon as I decided not to go to the Marines, I've been getting mail from the Navy to join their ranks. They sent me a personalized letter and everything to contact a recruiter. Not only that, but their offering the exact same things the Marines were offering me.