Castlevania Dungeon Forums
Off Topic => Off Topic => Topic started by: SonOfBelmont on August 16, 2008, 12:12:42 AM
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Okay I was watching a video on you tube about a guy lived though a fatal car crash ,aka Semi vs. Jelopi, unscaved (may have been a bruse here and there). But as I read the comments I noticed that for every person that said God saved the man two atheists came and critized religion. Another said they don't want us "superstitous" thoughts pushed on to them, okay first off how is saying God saved a life pushing religion on to anyone, or as they call preaching. Wow if anything else Atheists should just shut their mouths and go become soil (I am not because I am possibly going to Hell...maybe Heaven). If you dont like something dont get involved right? Sometimes I think people pose to be Atheists to be asses and morons. Sorry but its the teen population that makes up most of the Atheist group (16-20), and I too am a teen. Well if you are an atheist dont be a jerk and post anything offence...you know what you should have even joined this forum you know why? THE BELMONTS BELIVES IN GOD! DRACULA BELIVES AND HATES GOD! ALUCARD BELIVES IN GOD! AND NO THE BOMERANG ISNT A BOMERANG IS A CROSS AND THE THING THAT LOOKS LIKE A BIBLE IS A BIBLE SO GUESS WHAT? Castlevania has extreamly close ties to Christianty, Jeudism, Islam, Japanese calture...hum but there isnt one athiests in the game I wonder...sorry about the out burst just a little tried...strach that I am always mad just like my idol...DARTH VADER!
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First off, keep this discussion tame people. I mean it.
Religion actually takes a very back seat approach in Castlevania, so to say that atheists (or anti-theists) should not be posting here is a rather large stretch, and borders on flaming/trolling. So consider this a warning, SonofBelmont.
If this topic was posted as an intent to rant about and flame/troll atheists and/or anti-theists (which can be inferred by you telling a particular group that they shouldn't be here), then it will be closed.
*ahem* Secondly.
As an atheist myself (born and raised, I might add, not a self-proclaimed one to rebel against my peers), I'd like to give a short lesson in etymology.
Atheists and Anti-Theists are often mistaken for the other, even in their own groups. Many people who actually claim to be atheist are in fact anti-theist.
The word "Atheist" is derived from Greek. "A" meaning "Without" and "Theist", meaning "Belief in God or Gods". Atheist literally means "One without belief in a God or Gods."
Anti-Theist, on the other hand. "Anti" meaning "Against" and "Theist" meaning "Belief in God or Gods". So Anti-theist literally means "One who is against the belief in God or Gods."
Personally, I hate it when anti-theists claim to be atheists because it gives real atheists a bad name. Atheists will point out injustices in having religion take a precedence in events and such, but will not outright scorn religion and say it should be done away with, or outright insult an entire religion or person for being religious. Anti-Theists will.
This ends your etymology lesson. ;)
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You can't get something from nothing.
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I will ignore whatever you said about Castlevania and this forum because it has nothing to do with your argument. This forum is about fans of a certain game no matter what their religious (or non-religious) belonging is.
Now as for the anti-religious comments on the internet, that's quite true. Too many people forget that in a democratic society, along with freedom from religious compulsion, there is also a freedom of religion, and this means every person has the right to express his religious belief without being insulted or forced to shut up.
Because there was a country where religion was heavily criticized and religious people were seen as strange and stupid. The country burned and destroyed many churches, others were abandoned or turned into warehouses. Any religion was treated as "Opium for the people", and Atheism was taught as an obligation lesson in schools.
This country was the Soviet Union, a totalitarian state where social freedoms were limited and your life course was pretty much dictated by the Communist party and its requirements.
No modern country wishes to become like the Soviet Union. So even if you are an Atheist, respect people's freedom of religion. And if you still think that colorful ads that call you to visit prayers at Sunday morning is religious oppression, remember that in Gaza women are forced to wear head covering and men to grow beards out of fear to be beaten up by the authorities.
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As an atheist myself (born and raised, I might add, not a self-proclaimed one to rebel against my peers), I'd like to give a short lesson in etymology.
Atheists and Anti-Theists are often mistaken for the other, even in their own groups. Many people who actually claim to be atheist are in fact anti-theist.
The word "Atheist" is derived from Greek. "A" meaning "Without" and "Theist", meaning "Belief in God or Gods". Atheist literally means "One without belief in a God or Gods."
but don't some athiests believe in a divine creator who started the big bang? I thought alot of athiests believe that there is a god he just doesn't do anything in our universe and leaves it up to us. That the various religions and so called god or gods of those religions aren't correct?
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The simple answer is that Youtube is filled with love!
I mean jerks.
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okay first off how is saying God saved a life pushing religion on to anyone, or as they call preaching
In terms of Atheism vs Religion, this is a catch-22. Neither side can hear the other's opinions without feeling some sort of need to defend their belief, or at least explain it. Because most people live by these beliefs. If the atheist posted first and stated the exact opposite: that "God definitely didn't save the man", (even if just mentioned casually with the rest of his words), religious people would step in to voice their disagreement.
Well if you haven't noticed, no one would write a phrase like that casually, (although with increasing disharmony between both groups, that could change). Atheist's also wouldn't mention God this way,for doing so would seem to say they believe in God in the first place. Atheists don't point a finger at any one thing to explain the workings of the universe, they generally accept a notion of random chaos. However, religious believers personify circumstance through a sentient being. Because they give this being a name, they might think it a casual thing to mention it to explain things.
What religious people might not understnd is that the very word "God" is not at all a casual term to an atheist. It's a direct conflict to an atheist's beliefs. In as much as a religious person would feel uneasy about hearing a proposed factual statement that, "An all powerful being doesn't exist and so definitely didn't save a person."
And yet religious people are SO quick to point the finger to God when they survive something. The fact of the matter is, neither side can be proven, but one simple word from the religious side, "God", is all an atheist needs to hear to think this person believes a fact entirely against his own. So simply stating this word IS like pushing it off as fact onto non-believers. It IS preaching one's beliefs.
Wow if anything else Atheists should just shut their mouths and go become soil (I am not because I am possibly going to Hell...maybe Heaven)
You are being no different than what you claimed of the atheists, in this case.
And here's my take on the event:
How can God save a person from a crash if God was the one that created the crash? If one's going by the logic that God has the power to stop elements, or moments of the crash from harming one or the other driver, why not just use that
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What peculiar discussion.
The word "God" is fundamentally incorrect IMO. Regardless of the religion, the very word invokes the greek pantheon. Tired cliches of the wizened, white-bearded, muscular Zeus sitting atop his ivory throne and staring down through the clouds and willing the destiny of all humanity.
I believe there is something --an order to the universe --an intelligent design. I cannot accept that an orderly universe, clearly governed by binding physical laws, came about by a random chaotic event. Nor can I deny that life, even if governed by those laws, is unique amongst creation and nothing less than a miracle. Something exists --"God" is just not the most appropriate word due to the aforementioned baggage.
As for the subject-matter.. I have personally had a few brushes with death and it is quite a humbling experience each and every time. It reinforces a sense of worth and purpose --a sense of destiny. And that in turn reinforces the belief in a will and a power higher than my own.
Unfortunately, the organized religions are highly dubious. While most preach wise morals and philosophy, none are tolerant of mindful dissent. Others are outright scams run by greedy egomaniacs, pedophiles, or worse... And most recklessly wield frightful power to control billions of the towntrodden sheep looking for some purpose and meaning in their lives.
Atheism (or perhaps anti-theism) is no less dubious however.... I oppose any atheist agenda of eliminating religious rights from the public square --as what happened in the Soviet Union. The Soviets said to their people "Don't worship your superstitious "god" --worship the state, the law and the lawgiver. Such a movement is ultimately facist IMO, and ultimately a religion unto itself.
It's a sad thing that reasonable people looking for supreme truth have nowhere to reliable to turn.
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In Reply To #2
Wouldn't Antitheists be a subcategory of Atheists?
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In Reply To #5
What you're referencing to is Agnosticism, a half-religious, half-atheist. That's someone who believes that God/s may exist, and they're not going to refute that, but neither are they going to necessarily worship said possible God/s.
In Reply To #9
Eh, I suppose. I like to think of anti-theists more as Zealous Atheists, myself. Much like Fundamentalists* are Zealous (insert religion here).
* - Your version of Fundamentalist may vary. As a midwesterner, a fundamentalist (to me) is one who is outrageously religious to an unnecessary extent and makes the entire religion look horrific.
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In Reply To #10
As an Agnostic (formerly Roman Catholic), I feel I must speak a bit about it.
An Agnostic is the person who is on the side of the fence. The true equal in terms of the big religion debate, and it is because of pure logic that I happen to take the Agnostic path.
Basically, it is logically impossible with the current knowledge base, to prove OR disprove that a "God" exists. However, since the Universe is very vast, what we know, at the moment, may not be the absolute "Truth" of the matter.
Since I cannot prove that God exists, there is no reason for me to follow in his/her teachings and religions. However, since I also cannot prove that God does NOT exist, I cannot, by the same token, judge whether other religions are right or wrong in his/her Eyes. I only know my own morals and my own judgment of what is right and wrong...
...which is further enriched by the beauty of being unburdened by any one religion, thus being blinded from the great knowledges that exist out there. I can read about any religion, take the things that I believe are positive about it, and apply it to my own personal set of Morals without actively calling myself that religion.
It's almost like saying "I have my own religion, but I do not deny the positives about yours. As for God, if he/she does exist, it makes no difference to me, for I am a good person in my own way, regardless".
When someone asks me if I believe in God, I usually say "I believe God 'could' exist". Usually either pleases the person asking, or terribly upsets them, heh heh... their follow-up questions usually end up with me saying "If your God does exist, then I'm sure I'll make the 'cut' on Judgment Day".
And that's all I have to say, about that. :P
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In Reply To #2
I really don't care about any of this stuff.
You gave him a warning yet you gleefully responded to his post? I see a good discussion going on here, so I don't think that it's fair to give him a warning.
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In Reply To #10
Actually Clara he is referring to daiyism(sp?) the belief that god created the world, but has no hand in how it goes not. Agnostics don't have a particular belief, they don't outright deny god, but they also don't believe in any religion.
That said, I am an atheist, and I love Castlevania. Your argument that I should not be here is ridiculous, since when do you have to believe in something to enjoy it? Do you believe in every movie you watch? Or game you play? When cv was made it had christian things in it ONLY to mirror the hollywood horror movies, the game makers were not trying to make us love Jesus.
You need some education, and a lesson in tolerance. because you (sonofbelmont) are the one being insanely intolerant here.
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In Reply To #2
I really don't care about any of this stuff.
You gave him a warning yet you gleefully responded to his post? I see a good discussion going on here, so I don't think that it's fair to give him a warning.
If you don't care about any of this, then was it necessary to come here just to say that? If you have nothing to contribute, and merely wanted to question why I said what I said, you could have taken this to PM.
The way in which he worded his statement was rather insulting (Saying that Atheists should just go become soil, or that they shouldn't be here because there aren't any atheists in Castlevania - that's like saying black people shouldn't have posted here before Aria of Sorrow). Sure there's a great discussion, but then again, I was the first one to reply so there wasn't this discussion when the warning was given.
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In Reply To #14
Oh don't start this up again. =P
HAMMER IS NOT BLACK
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In Reply To #15
He could be.
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In Reply To #16
Except that he has white skin.
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You know what... Whatever, I read this again, and the fact that this guy can say this shit about atheist's like me and get nothing, but the mods show him respect and tell others not to say anything mean back show how fucking terrible and backwards the moderation here is. Jorge, and Clara especially, this place has become a popularity contest and it's sickening. Ban me already, I only wish i could simply delete myself from here.
This idiot who made the thread can't even spell extreme right.
The mods here are garbage who play favorites and have an extreme double standards for themselves and any posters they consider friends.
Peace out you guys, I've loved my stay here. It's been a good bunch of years, but this place has really taken a swan dive. This place is dead anyway, the chapel is where you should go if you're sick of all the bullshit from everyone here.
Bye to all the posters I respect. I'd love it if you'd head to the chapel, a forum that is active, for a site that actually updates.
Love, Peace, and Afro Grease.
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You know what... Whatever, I read this again, and the fact that this guy can say this shit about atheist's like me and get nothing, but the mods show him respect and tell others not to say anything mean back show how fucking terrible and backwards the moderation here is.
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In Reply To #10
Actually Clara he is referring to daiyism(sp?)
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In Reply To #16
Except that he has white skin.
Hammer's black.
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In Reply To #18
Right, cuz a verbal warning for a first-time offender means NOTHING, whereas you've been on your final warning for as long as a lot of us can remember.
Cya.
Stay on topic, everyone.
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Okay I was watching a video on you tube about a guy lived though a fatal car crash ,aka Semi vs. Jelopi, unscaved (may have been a bruse here and there). But as I read the comments I noticed that for every person that said God saved the man two atheists came and critized religion. Another said they don't want us "superstitous" thoughts pushed on to them, okay first off how is saying God saved a life pushing religion on to anyone, or as they call preaching. Wow if anything else Atheists should just shut their mouths and go become soil (I am not because I am possibly going to Hell...maybe Heaven). If you dont like something dont get involved right? Sometimes I think people pose to be Atheists to be asses and morons. Sorry but its the teen population that makes up most of the Atheist group (16-20), and I too am a teen. Well if you are an atheist dont be a jerk and post anything offence...you know what you should have even joined this forum you know why? THE BELMONTS BELIVES IN GOD! DRACULA BELIVES AND HATES GOD! ALUCARD BELIVES IN GOD! AND NO THE BOMERANG ISNT A BOMERANG IS A CROSS AND THE THING THAT LOOKS LIKE A BIBLE IS A BIBLE SO GUESS WHAT? Castlevania has extreamly close ties to Christianty, Jeudism, Islam, Japanese calture...hum but there isnt one athiests in the game I wonder...sorry about the out burst just a little tried...strach that I am always mad just like my idol...DARTH VADER!
So...you're complaining about the same thing you're doing in this thread, except you're playing for the other team.
And why does it matter if the Belmonts believe in god?
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I dont know particularly which way I lean. I know I dont really believe in a "god" as it were. It there was some higher power its either gone now or doesnt care.
As for religions and their "were the supreme beings blah blah blah" thats all just arrogance. Theres absolutely no way no how not even the slightest possibility were alone in the universe. Somewhere out there theres other planets with other intelligent life. Maybe or maybe not in our own solar system but it IS out there somewhere. That alone should prove theres no higher power that created us in its image etc. Unless it really is like that old Far Side comic of the young god.
All my religious feelings can be summed up with a single quote: "So tell me not of avatars. Show me not your proof that yours is the true god. I grant you your beliefs without question and without judgment, but if you grant me what is in my heart, then such tangible evidence is irrelevant."
I carry a fancy laminated card in my wallet with that on it and anytime a religious conversation comes up its my conversation ender when the religious types try to start disproving everything I say.
And I think the proper term for you (clara) were callin Fundamentalist is actually Zealot. Fanatically religious.
As for JoW... Ive been waitin on when hed go off again. He was doin good for awhile but Im personally surprised it took him this long to go off again.
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In Reply To #10
As an Agnostic (formerly Roman Catholic), I feel I must speak a bit about it.
Exactly the same situation with me. It eventually got to the point where I realized I couldn't follow Catholicism in good conscience, and the main reason I followed it was out of fear of hell. That's not a dig on Catholics or Christians, either...it's just not for me.
I think it's definitely possible that there is a higher power. But it's nothing I concern myself with too much, since it could go either way for me. I think most people will live by what they think is right, whether or not they actually believe in something.
I just think both sides could lighten up a little...not on this thread, but in general. There are religious people who could stop pushing their beliefs on others around them, and there are non-religious people who could stop making themselves out to be so oppressed.