Topic: "The Dragon Returns" - Castlevania Lords of Shadow Sequel (HERE BE SPOILER INFO)

[Redgrave]

The first vampire in the LoS universe is probably a bernhard.Walter bernhard to be precise.

[DragonSlayr81]

And here I thought people wanted stories set between LoI and CV3.

Considering thats what people bring up whenever someone mentions the cluttered original timeline as the "still more stories that can be told".

Actually, I do. I can't speak for other people, though.

The problem I had with both origin stories is vampires existed before Dracula comes to be.
It kinda takes away from the impact of the story. I want to see the origins of the first most powerful vampire not...... some random ass vampire that came down the line and ended up being the lord of vampires.

Well, both canons seemingly take place in our world(a fictional take, but our world nonetheless), and vampire lore has existed in our world for a long time. Maybe you mean an CV origin where Dracula's, like, ancient Greek or something? Do something like Blade III?

I personally don't mind that Dracula is not the FIRST vampire. IMO, his role should be the most powerful, not the first, but the definitive.

I've been tossing this around, but if they were to go full reboot, yet again, I wouldn't mind if they actually went to what a lot of people wanted, Dracula to be the REAL Vlad III. Maybe an origin tale in the 1400s, based MORE on history, yet still retaining the whole "secret history" aspect. Real Vlad III, somehow, becomes a vampire, and a Belmont(who's maybe close to Dracula, like the captain to his army, maybe another take on Trevor) must kill him and rid the countryside of his evil.

If it were up to me I would retcon the whole deal about the Belmonts not being allowed to touch the whip until 1999 so we could have gotten more games starring Belmonts. That's honestly the only thing I hated about the original timeline, it made no sense.

I would've still kept the "curse", but it wouldn't have lasted as long as it does in IGA's canon. Maybe 100 years(being placed in the early 1800s and being dispelled in the early 1900s). I still like the Morris contribution(particularly the inclusion of Quincey and ties to Stoker's novel, as well as Bloodlines and John Morris), not so much PoR's, though I'd probably retcon it and make a game that's more fitting for that time(WWII, Nazis sending a secret military group to tap into the dark power being released by Dracula's Castle, and the united front sending in a special forces soldier named William "Billy" Belmont to stop them).

[Flame]

We cant retcon the whip thing entirely- or we'd have to retcon Bloodlines.

And that would be a crime.

[DragonSlayr81]

We cant retcon the whip thing entirely- or we'd have to retcon Bloodlines.

And that would be a crime.

I'd never retcon Bloodlines, but after Bloodlines, I'd say that John Morris gave the whip back to the Belmonts, who'd start getting back into the family business, and generation to generation, eventually gave birth to Julius(who I'd keep, because he's still pretty badass). There'd also be no Jonathan Morris, nor PoR in my ideal canon. I WOULD, though, focus more on what the Morris family did after they initially inherited the VK, and I WOULD reinstate Sonia back into the canon, but via a different game. I still like my idea of having her as the blood link to the Morris clan(she marries a man with the Morris surname). Prior to that, I'd have her in a game/story where she's the older sister to the male Belmont heir, some tension between her and her family because they chose her little brother as heir over her, while a dark force appears yet the true heir is too young to wield the VK, so she takes it into her own hands, against her family's wishes, and like a badass, goes out to face it in a maverick-type fashion(which I always thought felt well for the Morris clan, who eventually become Texan cowboy-types before the events of Stoker's Dracula). 

As for when the Belmonts give the whip to the Morris family, I thought of a means where it was possible. Richter, who's now maybe in his thirties(early 1800s), is lured back to Dracula's Castle when his children are taken by a group vampires(Dracula sympathists and loyal servents), and he goes there with a Morris(who's his vampire hunting pupil, so to speak). Eventually something happens where the Belmont blood is fobidden to touch the VK, and the only way the curse can be lifted in through an act of generational purification, which means, like, in 100, through sacred rituals, finally the curse will be lifted(which the vampires are aware of, but believe it would be too late considering Dracula to resurrect sometimes prior to the events of Stoker's novel, and there'd be no Belmont to silence him, as they'd be unaware fo the Morris clan). But, the curse is only on the descendants of Richter and his children, meaning those BEFORE(who are linked by blood) could still wield it, and Richter hands over the VK to his pupil at the end for safe keeping until the Belmont family could once again wield it.

I also had an idea of more Elizabeth Bartley. I'd still keep Mathias as Dracula(as well as the events of LoI), but prior to it, have Elizabeth as a child, the child of Mathias's sister, whom he used to spoil as a child(she was his favorite niece). After Mathias became a vampire, years after living in various areas, he returned to Elizabeth's castle, her now being a beautiful young woman(yet vain and evil), and stays with her for a while and turns her into a vampire.

I ramble on too much. I love fanfic sometimes and the possiblities!

[Flame]

That all... sounds pretty good and plausible actually... a Female Belmont marrying a Morris, therefore causing the loss of the Belmont name there.

I would post more but i'd be derailing the thread so ill just drop this link to another topic here.

http://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/index.php/topic,5048

[Sumac]

If it were up to me I would retcon the whole deal about the Belmonts not being allowed to touch the whip until 1999 so we could have gotten more games starring Belmonts. That's honestly the only thing I hated about the original timeline, it made no sense.

It won't give more place in the timeline since XIX century is already have two battles with Dracula - OOE and Stoker's Dracula. Then there is Bloodlines and POR in XX century. And finally 1999 War. So in the end there is really not so much place to put another Belmont vs Dracula conflict in the last two centruries prior to events of 1999.

I wonder if that post will be "minused" by "overly devoted fans" as the others that were pretty much innocuous? But when you deal with "overly devoted fans" expected the unexpected, I guess. 

[Dominus]

The first vampire in the LoS universe is probably a bernhard.Walter bernhard to be precise.

The Bernhard family struck me as demon cultist or something of that kind. I think the three lords where the first ones of their kind (werewolf, vampire and necromancer/lich)

[CastleDan]

Actually, I do. I can't speak for other people, though.
Well, both canons seemingly take place in our world(a fictional take, but our world nonetheless), and vampire lore has existed in our world for a long time. Maybe you mean an CV origin where Dracula's, like, ancient Greek or something? Do something like Blade III?

I personally don't mind that Dracula is not the FIRST vampire. IMO, his role should be the most powerful, not the first, but the definitive.

I've been tossing this around, but if they were to go full reboot, yet again, I wouldn't mind if they actually went to what a lot of people wanted, Dracula to be the REAL Vlad III. Maybe an origin tale in the 1400s, based MORE on history, yet still retaining the whole "secret history" aspect. Real Vlad III, somehow, becomes a vampire, and a Belmont(who's maybe close to Dracula, like the captain to his army, maybe another take on Trevor) must kill him and rid the countryside of his evil.
 I would've still kept the "curse", but it wouldn't have lasted as long as it does in IGA's canon. Maybe 100 years(being placed in the early 1800s and being dispelled in the early 1900s). I still like the Morris contribution(particularly the inclusion of Quincey and ties to Stoker's novel, as well as Bloodlines and John Morris), not so much PoR's, though I'd probably retcon it and make a game that's more fitting for that time(WWII, Nazis sending a secret military group to tap into the dark power being released by Dracula's Castle, and the united front sending in a special forces soldier named William "Billy" Belmont to stop them).

Yeah but I'm sure you get what I mean. When I think of Lord of the vampires I think...the oldest one, i think the most powerful one. It'd be nice if the dracula in castlevania was the first of it's kind. See...it's kinda missed opportunity. In lords of shadow you had the end boss of the devil, you could have just had the devils minions as enemies and it could have been a great way to introduce the first vampire ( dracula ).....I mean might as well since it already didn't feel very castlevania like. Then this next game could have been years later where he is the lord of vampires and vampires are around now because of him.

It just makes sense to see the origins of the first rather than him just taking some other vampires spot. It's more grand feeling, more special....

[Ahasverus]

Dracula as the first vampire adds no that much to the story, I'm fine with it not being that way. If anything, the "underdog" story makes him kind of sympathetic (Ok, makes Gabriel sympathetic, Mathias was a prick).

And yeah guys what is so bad about a Dracula-less Castlevania? Starring the belmont clan in far away lands, fighting other kind of mythilogies keeping of course the series staples (Castle whips bla bla bla). As many have said we wanted stories between LoS and III, and if I'm not wrong people wanted a game after DoS when the main villain was Galamoth or Olrox. Keeping relations and references to the "Dracula Arc" of Castlevania, I don't see a Dracula less new Castlevania series in a bad way.

(click to show/hide)

And brace yourselves, because if Cox words tell us anything, I have the feeling that this is where we're going

It will be nice for Dracula to have an story arc, maybe at the end, he'll be redeemed and being that so, we need to continue the series, but it also needs a little shake up here and there,  it can't go on and on and on the same way, otherwise we'll stop feeling amusement.

[Dominus]

It will be nice for Dracula to have an story arc, maybe at the end, he'll be redeemed and being that so, we need to continue the series, but it also needs a little shake up here and there,  it can't go on and on and on the same way, otherwise we'll stop feeling amusement.

That was AoS...until Dos came and screwed everything

[Flame]

Well the Sequel novel to DoS has Olrox as the main villain.

The radio drama SoTN sequel has an Incubus as the main bad guy.

And while Mathias was the main puppet master behind LoI, Walter was still the main bad guy. (And its kind of sad, but I find him far more interesting than Dracula)

Dracula-less Castlevania technically is nothing new, but its never been done full out "No Dracula at all" outside of the side material. Not in a full game.

[Neobelmont]

And yeah guys what is so bad about a Dracula-less Castlevania? Starring the belmont clan in far away lands, fighting other kind of mythilogies keeping of course the series staples (Castle whips bla bla bla)[/spoiler]

Belmonts need to kill something when Dracula is not around. You know keep their skills sharp.

[DragonSlayr81]

Yeah but I'm sure you get what I mean. When I think of Lord of the vampires I think...the oldest one, i think the most powerful one. It'd be nice if the dracula in castlevania was the first of it's kind. See...it's kinda missed opportunity. In lords of shadow you had the end boss of the devil, you could have just had the devils minions as enemies and it could have been a great way to introduce the first vampire ( dracula ).....I mean might as well since it already didn't feel very castlevania like. Then this next game could have been years later where he is the lord of vampires and vampires are around now because of him.

It just makes sense to see the origins of the first rather than him just taking some other vampires spot. It's more grand feeling, more special....

Who knows, maybe the "next" reboot we'll get Dracula, the First vampire.

I still don't mind that Dracula isn't the first. I can't see a CV taking place prior to 1000 AD. And it strangely seems that both IGA and MS CHOSE to feature their own "origins" around the time of the Crusades(coincidence or maybe they both just think that time period is "cool"). MS could've very well set LoS some other time(centuries before or centuries later). I just find it funny, in general. 

Dracula as the first vampire adds no that much to the story, I'm fine with it not being that way. If anything, the "underdog" story makes him kind of sympathetic (Ok, makes Gabriel sympathetic, Mathias was a prick).

And yeah guys what is so bad about a Dracula-less Castlevania? Starring the belmont clan in far away lands, fighting other kind of mythilogies keeping of course the series staples (Castle whips bla bla bla). As many have said we wanted stories between LoS and III, and if I'm not wrong people wanted a game after DoS when the main villain was Galamoth or Olrox. Keeping relations and references to the "Dracula Arc" of Castlevania, I don't see a Dracula less new Castlevania series in a bad way.

(click to show/hide)

And brace yourselves, because if Cox words tell us anything, I have the feeling that this is where we're going

It will be nice for Dracula to have an story arc, maybe at the end, he'll be redeemed and being that so, we need to continue the series, but it also needs a little shake up here and there,  it can't go on and on and on the same way, otherwise we'll stop feeling amusement.

I definitely wouldn't mind a non-Dracula CV. Hell, simple idea, Belmont heads to the castle of Elizabeth Bartley to fight her and her minions. No Dracula, but vampires, dark spooky castles, monsters, VK wielding Belmont hero! That's all I'd need. Hell, there are so many vampire characters(both fictional and based on "real" vampires) that could be used. Three we know and have appeared, Carmilla, Elizabeth Bartley and Olrox can each have a game dedicated about their own evil castles located throughout Europe. Hell, you can also bring back Gile De Rais, and add in Lord Ruthven, Countess Dolingen, Antoine Leger, Clara Geisslerin, Francois Bertrand and Arnold Paole. And yes, you can also add in non-vampires as main villains(sorcerers, demons and such). I think I listed earlier about my idea for a CV-like game, but dealing with Lovecraftian themes. Belmonts battling against some Elder God cult members in some abandoned castle in Wales. Or hell, they could work in something with Aleister Crowley. Really, the possibilities are endless. And yeah, like you, I'm pretty open to this, as long as the basic themes are carried over. Belmonts, while their main villain will always be Dracula, are pretty much warriors of good, so anything that threatens the stability of life on the world, they'd be right there to take on.

[Leirbag]

Hi everybody! (first post)

I have a theory about Alucard's true identity :

Yellow eyes , long hair , pale skin ... SATAN... 

[Johnny Alucard]

Hi everybody! (first post)

I have a theory about Alucard's true identity :

Yellow eyes , long hair , pale skin ... SATAN... 

An interesting theory but highly unlikely. Alucard's main thing is being the half-son of Dracula.