Castlevania Dungeon Forums

The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: KaZudra on December 19, 2016, 12:25:23 PM

Title: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: KaZudra on December 19, 2016, 12:25:23 PM
The Concept isn't a remake in a sense, but a redesign of a flawed game, adding changes and polish to refine the rough edges or even outright change the core gameplay to suit a better experience.

Rules:
Most assets must remain the same.
Story elements can be changed, voice actors can recast or reprise.
Cut-scenes can be redone in both FMV or in-engine.
All technical aspects are open for change.
Games can be redesigned with another platform in mind.

And GO!
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: Dracula9 on December 19, 2016, 01:50:10 PM
Atari E.T.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: Ratty on December 19, 2016, 02:34:18 PM
This for Castlevania games only or all games in general? If the latter we'll wanna move the thread to a different sub-forum. Feels kinda like a "classic discussions" thread anyway.

But for the question itself assuming this is for Castlevania games only, I'd have to go with the classic response of Castlevania Legends. I'd say Castlevania Adventure to but of course that's already been remade.

And of course I would absolutely love to see the N64 games released in a compilation for the PC. Along with all the other games in the series to varying degrees.
Title: BMC_War Machine
Post by: BMC_War Machine on December 19, 2016, 02:52:53 PM
Lords of Shadow 2






















Lol
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: aensland on December 19, 2016, 06:34:16 PM
Harmony of Dissonance.

Came too early.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: zangetsu468 on December 19, 2016, 06:43:58 PM
Castlevania 64/ LOD.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: theplottwist on December 19, 2016, 07:24:50 PM
Order of Shadows.

I know for a fact that the developers could and would do much better if they had the chance.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: SecretWeapon on December 19, 2016, 09:37:15 PM
LoS 2 is a given. To begin explain properly the Castle/Kid Trevor/Marie thing right. Second give Drac and Alucard rest

MoF should have been the story of the Founders.

PoR problems are mostly gp wise. Both it and Judgement could have used a different artstyle too

Artstyle its truly what made judgement stillborn because its a decent game on its own. Better cutscenes would have been good too (as in, more than just standing moving their mouths)
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: Aceearly1993 on December 19, 2016, 11:24:48 PM
Castlevania Dracula X SNES (Dracula XX/Vampire's Kiss). They could've done it way better if not for a stripped-down-replacement thing of Rondo of Blood. Refined control engine, balanced stage/boss setting, multiple game rounds with increased difficulty on the second round and afterwards, a more cinematic ending with another continuation to the main timeline...Oh and Maria's playable appearance

Haunted Castle...Balance all things under classic CV rules
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: zangetsu468 on December 20, 2016, 07:28:47 AM
Castlevania Dracula X SNES (Dracula XX/Vampire's Kiss). They could've done it way better if not for a stripped-down-replacement thing of Rondo of Blood. Refined control engine, balanced stage/boss setting

Are you kidding? If we're talking about balance, Rondo is severely unbalanced compared to XX/ VK. I'm no anti-purist, but every stage in Rondo bar 5' 2 was cake compared to XX, and that was the only stage with no actual boss. At least XX built upon the difficulty stage by stage and included an alternate route with an increased difficulty in defeating Death. (arguably one of the tougher CV bosses around).
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: uzo on December 20, 2016, 01:35:28 PM
Not Lords of Shadow.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: Claimh Solais on December 20, 2016, 02:38:25 PM
Are you kidding? If we're talking about balance, Rondo is severely unbalanced compared to XX/ VK. I'm no anti-purist, but every stage in Rondo bar 5' 2 was cake compared to XX, and that was the only stage with no actual boss. At least XX built upon the difficulty stage by stage and included an alternate route with an increased difficulty in defeating Death. (arguably one of the tougher CV bosses around).

A game being easy doesn't make it imbalanced, though. There's a fair and consistent rise in difficulty as the game goes on. Simply being easier isn't imbalanced.

Dracula X on SNES is flat-out poorly designed, though. Game controls stiffly, hit detection is whack, lack of invincibility frames leads to repeated and unfair damage, the final boss fight is poorly designed and is the epitome of artificial difficulty, the whole key side-quest is an absolute chore, etc.

Dracula X's first stage starts off easy enough, but the difficulty immediately ramps up to 11 right afterward. That game is in total need of a balancing overhaul.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: zangetsu468 on December 20, 2016, 02:58:12 PM
A game being easy doesn't make it imbalanced, though. There's a fair and consistent rise in difficulty as the game goes on. Simply being easier isn't imbalanced.

Dracula X on SNES is flat-out poorly designed, though. Game controls stiffly, hit detection is whack, lack of invincibility frames leads to repeated and unfair damage, the final boss fight is poorly designed and is the epitome of artificial difficulty, the whole key side-quest is an absolute chore, etc.

Dracula X's first stage starts off easy enough, but the difficulty immediately ramps up to 11 right afterward. That game is in total need of a balancing overhaul.

But Rondo is just flat out easy, there's little to no challenge throughout the entirety of the game. Even finding the women is of little to no challenge, and Maria basically breaks the game. The key quest is the more difficult version of the game. You work your butt off and you're rewarded with a better boss fight and a better ending, simple. This is good design if anything, there's a harder difficulty which is designed into the game, for those who care little to nothing about the ending they can skip it, if you want the real ending, get the key, bet the white knight and save Maria.

Saying something is unfair, particularly in a 16 bit game is a matter of personal bias, unless you're playing The Wizard of Oz for Snes where you're literally falling through platforms which are supposed to be there - then complain. If anything XX's whip mechanic actually covers Richter's back at close range more so than Rondo's does. By your logic of 'fair' the first Legend of Zelda is not a fair game, how is anyone supposed to know to burn a bush on a specific screen with a candle? I played XX many times and never noticed an issue with hit detection. Link me to a video showing XX's unfair hit detection and I will view it.

I think gamers these days are far too precious, and it shows in your comments. #gitgud
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: Jazz Paladin Productions on December 20, 2016, 03:14:42 PM

Dracula X's first stage starts off easy enough, but the difficulty immediately ramps up to 11 right afterward. That game is in total need of a balancing overhaul.

I seem to remember thinking at first it was tough...it's been a while, but I seem to remember the second form being easy once you find the right strategy, I think it just revolves around using the axe and being on a specific pillar outside of dracs range of attack, but the axe can still hit.


However, I will echo the sentiment that the level design  was indeed horrible. I couldn't stand the way you'd leave an area and end up someplace looking entirely different and facing the opposite direction to boot! Totally felt like a lack of congruity , and yeah, the aforementioned issues with hit detection and invincible frames...eww...'nuff said.

Still, I do find that I like the visuals and aesthetics on the SNES are overall better than rondo. Too bad the gameplay had to suffer.

Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: JR on December 21, 2016, 03:35:39 AM
At the risk of beating a dead horse...Simon's Quest. I loved the game, but it would be cool to see a version that addressed gripes that a lot of people had.

They could change some of the means of progression to be less obtuse (like kneeling at the right place with the right crystal), but still keep them as a decent challenge to solve.

They could definitely rework a lot of the messages the townspeople give you so that they make more sense (although I still like the idea of some of them being liars). Maybe give one or two of the houses some secret monster/cult-like lairs that could work as combat areas, just to add to the sinister feel of the game, and the creepiness of some of the people you interact with, with them being followers of Dracula or something. I dunno, I'm really just spitballing with this one.

Keep the dilapidated look of the mansions, but make the bosses engaging and worthwhile. Every mansion should have its own boss. Maybe scrap Carmilla's Mask entirely and just put a more interesting boss in its place.

Keep Dracula's castle ruins, but make the fight with Dracula more memorable. Revamp his appearance, but his wraith in black look was kind of cool, so still go off of that.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: GuyStarwind on December 21, 2016, 02:31:25 PM
The 64 games for sure. Yeah, I know they have some problems but they also have some really great elements. I really enjoy having vampires as common enemies and having them being able to turn you into one. I also thought the simply old school feel was nice. I'm fine with just a whip and some sub-weapons. Don't get me wrong I don't hate games with various weapons, armor, and level progression but I do enjoy a game where I can show my skill as a player and not how many hours I spent grinding.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: Lumi Kløvstad on December 23, 2016, 10:23:24 PM
I've said it before and I'll say it until the end of time.
Order. Of. Freaking. Shadows.

It was as perfect a Castlevania as could be imagined on the mobile platform when it was released, and now that Unreal Engine 4 is available to mobile devs, just imagine what it could be now. I mean, we laugh at mobile gamers, but if you handed that project to Gameloft or GluMobile, they'd treat it with damn near religious reverence and do their utmost to deliver the best Castlevania possible on mobile TODAY.

And it would then make a billion dollars and Konami would have to take notice.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: redrum on December 24, 2016, 12:08:55 PM
Not Lords of Shadow.

it's a ghost?  or am i...?
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: KaZudra on December 25, 2016, 06:10:39 AM
Curse of Darkness - Borrow more from DMC, DmC, and Baynetta.
Allow you to carry two weapons and switch at any time, with a DMC/Bayonetta deep combo system with Innocent Devils allow for more deeper combos, needless to say it'll do without the heavy dynasty warriors influence.
Stage design will actually have structure as opposed to one large corridor to a large open area, DmC influence for actual platforming (which is, the best reason to play it).

Lament of Innocence - Use of 3D/2D switching.
Use the fixed camera as an advantage, For example; The platforming section in Snti-souls mysery lab, once you climb the stairs it'll be 2D, but if you fall off the platforms OR reach the doors the camera with fix back to 3D, also use of panning will be applied heavily.

Lords of Shadow 2 - EVERYTHING.
Rewrite basically the entire story, Dialogue, and progression of the game, redo some parts of the stage design, restore planned Dragon Segments, Add Satan Boss fight, and move Alucard fight to the prologue, Make the Castle/City Dynamic actually make sense, Incorperate Alcuard and Victor segments into the main game (to give a larger scope in pacing).
Make Death an actual character, Make Satan's children not just thrown in for macguffins.

Bubsy - Just because I wanna make a good Bubsy game as a joke.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: VladCT on December 25, 2016, 06:14:30 AM
Curse of Darkness - Borrow more from DMC, DmC, and Baynetta.
Allow you to carry two weapons and switch at any time, with a DMC/Bayonetta deep combo system with Innocent Devils allow for more deeper combos, needless to say it'll do without the heavy dynasty warriors influence.
Stage design will actually have structure as opposed to one large corridor to a large open area, DmC influence for actual platforming (which is, the best reason to play it).
Don't forget dialing running speed back up to at least LoI speed.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: KaZudra on December 25, 2016, 06:58:05 AM
Don't forget dialing running speed back up to at least LoI speed.
OH GOD YES. I'm still dissapointed there was nothing to increase running speed legit and cheat.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: zangetsu468 on December 26, 2016, 06:22:38 PM
I seem to remember thinking at first it was tough...it's been a while, but I seem to remember the second form being easy once you find the right strategy, I think it just revolves around using the axe and being on a specific pillar outside of dracs range of attack, but the axe can still hit.

For anyone who has played the last level 3 times or more, it's simple: Get the axe in the room before Dracula.
Go to the lowest possible platform on the far right hand side of the screen. Attack Dracula with the axe. If he appears on the platform you're occupying then go to the higher one (to the left) and dodge his attacks.
If for some reason you get hit on that lowest platform, you will get pushed back but not fall off. Rinse and repeat.

Keep the dilapidated look of the mansions, but make the bosses engaging and worthwhile. Every mansion should have its own boss. Maybe scrap Carmilla's Mask entirely and just put a more interesting boss in its place.

This. I would've loved to have seen a Simon's Quest remake in 3d, properly done.

Bubsy - Just because I wanna make a good Bubsy game as a joke.

Bubsy 3D>>>>>>>> ALL  ;D
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: FeRcHuLeS on December 26, 2016, 06:45:45 PM
LoI and CoD look like unfinished, unpolished games like 50 and 70 percent finished respectively,

LoI: lack of items, repetitive lesser enemies and stages the last boss is not Dracula but Death
CoD: lack of items (at least more than LoI how about an item that let to walk in the middle air things like that) , repetitive lesser enemies and stages. And in this game I would rather prefer Hector's girlfriend/wife to be captive instead of being murdered at the begining, so that another condiment to the story would be to find her and have endings based on whether she was saved or not.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: zangetsu468 on December 26, 2016, 09:00:47 PM
LoI: lack of items, repetitive lesser enemies and stages the last boss is not Dracula but Death
Completely in agreement about lesser enemies that are just colour coded differently, but poor AI is as bad and comes a close second.
The thing with Mathias is, he would've been weaker than Walter, so even if he could theoretically use Walter's power (post-Crimson Stone absorption) it wouldn't matter a pinch, as Walter got spanked by VK Leon.
Mathias wouldn't be able to win as VK Leon>Walter+Mathias.

CoD: lack of items (at least more than LoI how about an item that let to walk in the middle air things like that)

What's the point of items that let you walk on air in environments with zero platforming? COD would require an entire overhaul of its levels if this were the case.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: FeRcHuLeS on December 28, 2016, 07:19:06 AM

What's the point of items that let you walk on air in environments with zero platforming? COD would require an entire overhaul of its levels if this were the case.

I planned to post the platforming topic but I forgot it, well that's the reason I posted this game was only 70% finished, so the rest was about the lack of vertical platforms besides repetitive lesser enemies and stages that look empty sometimes like the rooms in the castle.
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: zangetsu468 on December 29, 2016, 10:33:23 AM
I planned to post the platforming topic but I forgot it, well that's the reason I posted this game was only 70% finished, so the rest was about the lack of vertical platforms besides repetitive lesser enemies and stages that look empty sometimes like the rooms in the castle.

LOI didn't have heaps of verticality either, but at least it had some.

The generic enemies in COD aren't as bad as LOI's in theory. LOI feels more like a Castlevania game imho, but at least COD introduced a lot of unseen enemies to LOI, to name a few; the ripper, cockatrice, the mages, mermen, the harpy. That alone is probably half the number of enemy types in LOI  :rollseyes:
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: suomynona on December 29, 2016, 07:47:01 PM
Entire of Gameboy, DS games and Harmony of Dissonance.

For DS games, rather then changing the gameplay much (except for that damn seal), I need much change on "artwork", graphics, sprites and music. But for GB, it really needs to be changed upside down. Harmony of Dissonance... I only need to change graphic quality and music quality. Leave the gameplay on.
 
Well, if there is a chance, I would remake every game to fix the errors and make them all Super Castlevania or SotN standard; Kojima artwork and full voiceover and much more background differences.

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
Post by: Belmont Stakes on January 01, 2017, 10:28:36 AM

Castlevania II Simon's Quest: this one is Slam dunk city.

Just tweak the day night and text message speed ala Mighty Guru patch.
More lively enemies more akin to the movement in the first CV but CVIII behaviors work in some instances.
Level design more reminscent of CV1, CVIII, Adventure of Link, Battle of Olympus.
More bosses.
Less confusion.
More varied backgrounds.
Improved leveling up and currency grinding system, Zelda II got that to work ok IMO.
The Return of the major sub items from one and three. Axe, boomerang, stopwatch. The daggers could use a touch and the holy water.
Walk chicken, no communion offerings to restore health.
No slowdown from too much on screen. Just speed it up a little.
Make the platforming like CV1 but also add a difficulty setting so new players can learn at their own pace.

Side note. I agree with the learning curve problem with online Flaming Piles of Shit I mean First Person Shooters analogy.
I.E. the frustration fighting leet skill gamers who are only there to pwn new players and never let them learn and improve.
Win win.


All of the 3D Castlevania titles
For the N64 series
Legacy of Darkness should be the one game in which the two titles in their fullness are produced on.
Fix the heroes jump. It looks like Cornell and Reinhardt stepped on a tack or a fragmentation mine covered in syphilized horse shit and got a piece of shrapnel up their asses.
Update the graphics and make the platforming a little bit smoother.
The N64 titles weren't garbage fires but someone did leave them in a dumpster.

Lament of Innocence
Better dialogue on the part of Leon and Succubus some of them are Chek Sheeps Milk and Venezualan Beaver Cheese that rival SOTN.........BTW reference anyone?   ;D
Control tweak for Leon I hate his backflip and the doublejump.
No DoubleJump walljumps are fine and fix his wall grapple/whip swing.
More platforming and death pits.
Varied graphics for backgrounds.
More forgiving perfect guard.....slightly.
Difficulty setting.
Some better or more varied enemy AI.

Curse of Darkness
"See Lament of Innocence"
Fix Those damn Conehead orge types they look stupid.
Fix the Golem ID some of them look like caca.

Lords of Shadow series
For LOS1
Collsion detection
Camera
More variety of enemies see LOI and COD enemy list some of them are really fun.
More classic lesser enemies and bosses.
Fix some of the Lycan backgrounds.
More challenging swinging, rappling and wall climbing. I mean that some of them were just formalities others didn't function properly leading to unfair falling.

For LOS2
Redesign Dracula's look
Remove Modern Day, though I like the arts district, the church and Drac's hideout.
Rework the final boss for both the main game and DLC.
Give Alucard a bigger quest he was awesome here.....the DLC was the way the game should have looked, you missed out Konami.
Rework the story
Again
More variety of enemies see LOI and COD enemy list some of them fucking rock.
Give Victor his own quest, whoever posted this idea originally, good fucking call.
Platforming, platforming, platforming!!!!!

LOS MOF
Whip animation fix.
Better enemy visuals and AI.
See above "see aboves" where applicable....yeah.
No dash float or double jump unless you are Alucard.

Judgement
Two D fighting

Bloodlines
Great game
Deserves an update on graphics
Get rid of that damn two step whip animation, so what Morris is from Texas.
Not much you can do to improve this one....it's that good.

SOTN
Difficulty setting for us masochists
Alucard has many abilities that can translate over into a platfom game setting where if he misuses a specific ability it could spell
instant game over or if otherwise bring instant victory.
Oh yeah and platforming.

One last thing
In the quest to avoid alienating the Metroidvania fans I would like to supplement the platforming element what I would call
a difficulty setting I call Creature of Chaos mode.
Here's how it works
You take the entire state of Kansas and oh sorry had a George Carlin moment....
For the Castle you have blood switches throughout the castle.
Depending on their toggled state you will may get:
1. Lesser enemies in more frequency and more death pits and spike traps and sech.
2. No death pits etc. with more powerful enemies but fewer of them.
3. Lit and darkened rooms.
4. Gauntlet runs.
5. Some combination of each.

Add these to the see above lists.
If you can put them in Judgement seamlessly.....awesome.