Topic: Are Japanese developers just misogynistic pigs?

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

Keep filling those other Bingo tiles, K.K.  I2, N5, and possibly G5.

[K.K. Drunkinski]

Come on, mang. I ain't even trying to complain about anyone being treated unfairly. I have a happy sex life, don't believe there's some weird conspiracy against men, and don't believe there are armies of evil women coming to chop our nuts off. If my comments came off as sounding butthurt, or full of self-pity, I didn't mean to. Seriously, if ya knew me in real life, you'd know I'm a firm believer in EVERYONE learning to just be comfortable with what gets em off, and I SUPPORT both the male and female bodies being looked at as sexual objects in certain areas, like movies, games, etc. The only thing that gets on my nerves are people being uncomfortable about sexuality, even when it's over-the-top, and i mean people on both sides of the spectrum. Women who want to ban porn grate on my nerves just as equally as fat, fedora wearing neckbeards who think it's someone else's fault that they can't get laid.

[nokundhi]

Wow, just wow. Have you considered to stop judging other cultures by your oppressive western standards, bigot?

[K.K. Drunkinski]

Judging other cultures??? I haven't said a single mean thing about any non-western culture. Are you guys not getting that I like what they do in Japan?

[beingthehero]

But who will protect us from the cooties

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

Come on, mang. I ain't even trying to complain about anyone being treated unfairly. I have a happy sex life, don't believe there's some weird conspiracy against men, and don't believe there are armies of evil women coming to chop our nuts off. If my comments came off as sounding butthurt, or full of self-pity, I didn't mean to. Seriously, if ya knew me in real life, you'd know I'm a firm believer in EVERYONE learning to just be comfortable with what gets em off, and I SUPPORT both the male and female bodies being looked at as sexual objects in certain areas, like movies, games, etc. The only thing that gets on my nerves are people being uncomfortable about sexuality, even when it's over-the-top, and i mean people on both sides of the spectrum. Women who want to ban porn grate on my nerves just as equally as fat, fedora wearing neckbeards who think it's someone else's fault that they can't get laid.

I'm not judging you.
However, the responses you were saying basically fit into classic textbook responses from people who want to maintain the current gaming status quo.
That's why I had to pull the Bingo card out; to show you that these lines of reasoning aren't particularly helping.

"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."

Scantily-clad men isn't in any way 'balancing out the scales' the way you're suggesting, because women don't have the privilege that men have, so it doesn't work the same way.

[K.K. Drunkinski]

It's all cool man. I just been trying to emphasize that I'm not part of that "men's rights" crowd or anything, cuz I myself personally can not stand those duders. I think they're pathetic. I don't see some war between the sexes going on, except in the minds of those who want there to be one. I'm aware that there are places and societies that do indeed subjugate and treat women like shit, but I don't hang around or keep the company of people who do that wacked out shit.

[Gunlord]

Yeah K.K., I'm definitely with you there. Not to pimp myself out, but I've written a couple entries on my blog about why I'm not down with the "men's rights/manosphere" scene. You might like em

http://gunlord500.wordpress.com/category/manosphere/

[Flame]

In some kind of weird polarization, theres actually a shit load of 'strong independant female characters' in Japanese media that are basically dressed like strippers. Its especially prevalent in those shows and games where every cast member is a female. You know the intention is to make them all basically each an example of a certain fetish or style for every man to pick out what they'd like to be with the most. Yet some of the character's writing (albeit very shallow at times) can lead to some of those characters having the traits people want strong female characters to have.

It makes you wonder, in regards to Japan specifically, how exactly do they see these things? Why bother writing characters that way if they're just sexual fetish avatars? Or do they see these things differently? Perhaps some sort of detachment from the design?

Well, the way i see it, some times, it's about a female character who is strong, but not afraid of her sexuality.

there is absolutely nothing wrong with a female character who says "I am a strong woman and I AM in fact, a woman." Someone like Bayonetta is essentially kamiya's "ideal woman", but that doesn't stop her from being a strong character in her own right. The fact that she's all sexy, is just her style. She's sexy and she knows it. She totally basks in her sexuality, while not being a slut. In fact, she's very likely a virgin.

The problem lots of times, is people (read: neo feminists) seeing a sexy female character and cry out because it's inconceivable for a woman to be comfortable in her sexuality and show it while being a strong character. And so you get Western videogames which take it to the opposite extreme and turn their women into men.

to me, while sure, lots of times a sexy female character is created as fetish fuel- many of those characters, especially if they are main characters, are also created to not only be pretty to look or drool at, but to be a fun, good character. You don't want a shitty main character just for the sake of fanservice. You want the character to be likable regardless.

Really, Bayonetta is the best example for this stuff.

I think in regards to East vs West, US in particular, mind you- The West, the US specifically is really prude. like, oftentimes downright puritanical sex is bad, and touching yourself at night will make you go to hell.

Japan meanwhile, doesn't have that, and so they have no issues with sexuality in cartoons or games. And mind you, they have their own cultural stigmas in regards to sexuality. Even the french don't give a shit. Look at Wakfu.

While in the US a show gets cancelled because of the booty quake dance, in the rest of the world there's far more risque shit.

to sum up my point, I think that we in the west tend to be too critical and prudish over sexuality in games, especially when it comes to sexy female characters, and ESPECIALLY with neo-feminists attacking anything and everything that has women not conforming to their ideas. Yknow, people like Anita Sarkeesian who dont actually play videogames to know what the character is like, but bash it just because it's sexy.

[uzo]

I've got nothing against a female being strong and sexy. I just have a hard time believing the character's looks are meant to be more than eye candy when the entire cast of characters is a fetish lineup.

[Maedhros]

Never affected any fun I had with games.

Seriously, I leave questions like these to the developers. All I want is a good game. It doesn't matter if I play as a independent/strong woman/man or an animal or whatever. Even on story driven games.

[KaZudra]

Shanoa, that is all.
Independent, Strong, and as Graceful as a swan.
She is like if lightning was well written. and she is a prime example of women in games done right, and she's a japanese character.


Now Let's take Bioware and DA:I
Claims that women are equal than men but resorts to the most one-dimensional writing that even Japanese developers are cringing.

[Flame]

I've got nothing against a female being strong and sexy. I just have a hard time believing the character's looks are meant to be more than eye candy when the entire cast of characters is a fetish lineup.

No doubt.

Though im ok with those too. Sometimes eye candy is just eye candy, but I really see no problem with it myself.

[X]

Shanoa, that is all.
Independent, Strong, and as Graceful as a swan.
She is like if lightning was well written. and she is a prime example of women in games done right, and she's a japanese character.

Definitely agree here. All that was missing was a whip glyph and she'd be perfect 

[Neobelmont]

Shanoa, that is all.
Independent, Strong, and as Graceful as a swan.
She is like if lightning was well written. and she is a prime example of women in games done right, and she's a japanese character.


Now Let's take Bioware and DA:I
Claims that women are equal than men but resorts to the most one-dimensional writing that even Japanese developers are cringing.

An other good character I like was Lyndis I just think strong women or at least different women the FE series always comes to my mind. Heck Minerva is a superwoman if I am using this term correctly and she still has the soft spot for her sis Maria iirc.

Heck another strong character I think is awesome is Sophitia. She  deserves a mom of the year award. Not only is she an awesome woman but she's still feminine, and a mother but she also can kick your butt to the moon and back. Strong yet, can still fall in love with someone and have kids to me that's a good character woman or not.