Topic: Rampant Police Brutality and Media censorship in Ferguson Missouri

[Ratty]

The police force in this highly segregated town have clamped down on protests over one the latest in a terrifyingly long string of Police shootings of unarmed young black men. They aren't just trying to silence amateurs with cell phone cameras this time but also media professionals. Here's an account of one at least two reporters, who along with others had peacefully been using the local wi-fi enabled McDonald's as a base of operations, who were assaulted by Police and arrested without charge or cause.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/in-ferguson-washington-post-reporter-wesley-lowery-gives-account-of-his-arrest/2014/08/13/0fe25c0e-2359-11e4-86ca-6f03cbd15c1a_story.html

Here are some highlights from that:

"“My hands are behind my back,” I said. “I’m not resisting. I’m not resisting.” At which point one officer said: “You’re resisting. Stop resisting.”

That was when I was most afraid — more afraid than of the tear gas and rubber bullets.

As they took me into custody, the officers slammed me into a soda machine, at one point setting off the Coke dispenser. They put plastic cuffs on me, then they led me out the door."


"The officers led us outside to a police van. Inside, there was a large man sitting on the floor between the two benches. He began screaming: “I can’t breathe! Call a paramedic! Call a paramedic!”

Ryan and I asked the officers if they intended to help the man. They said he was fine. The screaming went on for the 10 to 15 minutes we stood outside the van.

“I’m going to die!” he screamed. “I’m going to die! I can’t breathe! I’m going to die!” "

Both the reporters were later released without any charges. Though they were told they were arrested for "trespassing on a McDonalds" and that's how they treat the PRESS.
There are also reports that Police are jamming cell phone signals going out of the town.

Here are some statistics on the town. From Mother Jones. http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/08/10-insane-numbers-ferguson-killing

In a town that's 60% black, only 3 of the 53 police officers are black. 1 city council member and no members of the school board are black. Blacks are disproportionately arrested and searched even though whites are more often found to be carrying illegal substances when they are searched, with a ratio of 1/3 whites to 1/5 blacks. 25% of the town overall is below the poverty line, 28% of blacks are below the poverty line. And now with this shooting of an unarmed young man peaceful protests are being dispersed with tear gas and other brutal methods while the police try to silence both the public and the media. Amazingly even as this story is front page news as far away as Australia, most mainstream news networks have ignored or completely sugarcoated what's going on in the United States.

Here's some of the protestors. Their hands up to show they are unarmed and won't violently resist arrest.



Here's the police mocking the protestors.

[Mooning Freddy]

I am actually quite shocked by this. It's not like I haven't heard about police brutality and in many cases light penalties by the judicial system in America in cases where white men have killed black teenagers, claiming it was done in self-defense. But I always used to see Rage Against the Machine's "Killing in the name" as a bit of as exaggeration. Even though one has to assume some police departments may be corrupted or racist, the US has undergone many changes and I suppose it has a high number of black policemen.
On the other hand, I know that there are many bad neighborhoods (I would not say black neighborhoods because the problem is not unique to the black community) where the crime level, especially teenage crime, is so high that the police is scared of getting into. Not fighting the crime level and gangs there hurts, first and foremost, the residents of those neighborhoods who are stuck with a low standard of living and find it more difficult to escape their poverty.
I would be interested to hear PFG's comment on this.

***********************************************************************************************

I've been away from this forum for a while. I don't know whether I should share this, but it's been a horrible period in my country lately. As many of you probably heard, the Hamas organization governing Gaza has pulled Israel into another conflict by launching rockets attacks and infiltrations, and in response Israel launched operation "Protective Edge" for destroying the military capabilities of Hamas. The operation was completed, but with no political results. Hamas has been leading a round of temporary ceasefires while refusing the terms Egypt and Israel set for a permanent one. Voices has been raised in Israel saying that the situation, of repeated armed conflicts that has continued since the Hamas takeover of Gaza in 2007, cannot go on, and that Israel has no choice but to reoccupy the Gaza Strip to drive out the Hamas militants and leadership.
Meanwhile, the media and international institutions were being very critical of Israel, while at the same time not condemning the crimes of Hamas against Israel and the population of Gaza, who suffers the most from Hamas' violence and violations of human rights.
It seems like the entire middle east is going crazy, with ISIS taking over parts of Iraq and Syria, committing gruesome crimes against humanity and creating humanitarian catastrophes. In comparison to those guys, Bashar Assad, the autocrat of Syria who killed hundreds of thousands of his men in the civil war, seems like a nice guy. 
This extremism is pulling our world to the dumpster, and in our global society, don't think any place is safe.
*sigh*

[X]

Disgusting. Absolutely disgusting. Those men in uniform have betrayed the oaths of which they swore to uphold. Personally if I were in charge of the police in that state I would round up every single one of those officers and lock 'em up good. I would also make an example of them to others about what NOT to do while wearing the uniform. The rules an officer of the law must follow are; To serve the public trust, Protect the innocent, Uphold the law. Those men in uniform seriously overstepped their authority and should be forced to pay a very, very high price for their abuse of power. It's just absolutely disgusting!

@Mooning Freddy. I knew you were absent for a while but had no idea that it was about the conflict. You okay over there?

[Gunlord]

If you guys wanna feel a little better, check this out:

http://news.yahoo.com/turmoil-tear-gas-way-hope-ferguson-053336976.html

[darkmanx_429]

I am actually quite shocked by this. It's not like I haven't heard about police brutality and in many cases light penalties by the judicial system in America in cases where white men have killed black teenagers, claiming it was done in self-defense. But I always used to see Rage Against the Machine's "Killing in the name" as a bit of as exaggeration. Even though one has to assume some police departments may be corrupted or racist, the US has undergone many changes and I suppose it has a high number of black policemen.
On the other hand, I know that there are many bad neighborhoods (I would not say black neighborhoods because the problem is not unique to the black community) where the crime level, especially teenage crime, is so high that the police is scared of getting into. Not fighting the crime level and gangs there hurts, first and foremost, the residents of those neighborhoods who are stuck with a low standard of living and find it more difficult to escape their poverty.
I would be interested to hear PFG's comment on this.

***********************************************************************************************

I've been away from this forum for a while. I don't know whether I should share this, but it's been a horrible period in my country lately. As many of you probably heard, the Hamas organization governing Gaza has pulled Israel into another conflict by launching rockets attacks and infiltrations, and in response Israel launched operation "Protective Edge" for destroying the military capabilities of Hamas. The operation was completed, but with no political results. Hamas has been leading a round of temporary ceasefires while refusing the terms Egypt and Israel set for a permanent one. Voices has been raised in Israel saying that the situation, of repeated armed conflicts that has continued since the Hamas takeover of Gaza in 2007, cannot go on, and that Israel has no choice but to reoccupy the Gaza Strip to drive out the Hamas militants and leadership.
Meanwhile, the media and international institutions were being very critical of Israel, while at the same time not condemning the crimes of Hamas against Israel and the population of Gaza, who suffers the most from Hamas' violence and violations of human rights.
It seems like the entire middle east is going crazy, with ISIS taking over parts of Iraq and Syria, committing gruesome crimes against humanity and creating humanitarian catastrophes. In comparison to those guys, Bashar Assad, the autocrat of Syria who killed hundreds of thousands of his men in the civil war, seems like a nice guy. 
This extremism is pulling our world to the dumpster, and in our global society, don't think any place is safe.
*sigh*

Your shocked by this?! Coming from you Freddy I am surprised. Don't let that "bad neighborhood" sh*t fool you. That's just the propaganda the media machine wants you to believe. I've been through my share of "bad neighborhoods" and generally like anywhere else if you mind your own business, don't flash your sh*t, and just be aware of your surroundings you are left alone. Media always want you to think that stuff like this always happens in just the hood. Couldn't been that bad seeing how that "unarmed black teen" was well on his way to college and didn't even fall under being portrayed as a "thug." (The new "N" Word...)

And just because the US likes to throw out the "look how many black people we hired" (which really still insist the case) Affirmative Action took care of that a long time ago. Frankly I am not surprised, especially after seeing and experiencing the rampant discrimination from law enforcement during Hurricane Katrina and countless other things in the past 20 years and beyond.

To me this is just like the LA Riots: Part Two.

You be safe Freddy. You are on right about the world becoming a dumpster. I am a black military man with no criminal record, never done drugs, kept my nose clean. (Yes, I am a square.) Etc. and had my share of racial stuff especially living in the South. My wife is mixed and from Berlin and even though she had her fill of discrimination she had quite the culture shock when she came to the US so it's interesting to hear other people from other countries than the US opinions on matters like that. God know the United States wore out it's welcome a long time ago. I love my country, but living in this racist and now sissified version of America sucks now. I am about to have my first child soon and it does put a perspective on how crappier things have become when it involves people and how they treat one another.

[PFG9000]

If you think you already know what happened between Michael Brown and Darren Wilson, then you've bought into the media hype and ought to be ashamed of yourself.  You weren't there.  The only thing we can say for sure is that looting and rioting are absolutely inappropriate responses to any incident.

The police are constantly misrepresented.  A vocal minority of the public with no comprehension of legal standards and no belief in media bias is constantly playing up every incident to make the police look evil and corrupt.  It's entirely possible that Officer Wilson could have murdered Mr. Brown intentionally.  It's also entirely possible that Officer Wilson shot Mr. Brown in self defense as Mr. Brown was trying to disarm him.  We don't know.  And until more information comes to light, you're just making a fool of yourself by spouting off your uninformed opinion.

[Ratty]

If you think you already know what happened between Michael Brown and Darren Wilson, then you've bought into the media hype and ought to be ashamed of yourself.  You weren't there.  The only thing we can say for sure is that looting and rioting are absolutely inappropriate responses to any incident.

And according to witnesses the looting was isolated to a small group of people on a single day. If the police hadn't enforced a media blackout because they didn't want people to know what was really going on, then maybe we'd have a more unbiased source to go on.

The police are constantly misrepresented.  A vocal minority of the public with no comprehension of legal standards and no belief in media bias is constantly playing up every incident to make the police look evil and corrupt.  It's entirely possible that Officer Wilson could have murdered Mr. Brown intentionally.  It's also entirely possible that Officer Wilson shot Mr. Brown in self defense as Mr. Brown was trying to disarm him.  We don't know.  And until more information comes to light, you're just making a fool of yourself by spouting off your uninformed opinion.

Witnesses who WERE there have said that Brown was either fleeing with his hands up or was facing the cop with his hands up. Except for the police, who's official story was that the shot was fired inside the car during a fight. Considering that the cops had not interviewed key witnesses to the murder over half a week after the fact though, this might not be surprising. The cops apparently DID make sure to show up to his memorial service the day he was killed with guns and attack dogs. Then rolled out in military gear in response to peaceful protests. At which they shot tear gas, rubber bullets and eventually wooden pellets.

Ferguson Riot Police Open Fire Into Peaceful Protest

One of these protests even had a State Senator in it. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/13/state-senator-ferguson_n_5676766.html

They also fired tear gas at journalists before illegally dismantling their cameras.



Almost as if they had something to hide. Like, say, their brutal tactics not being justified by the situation. Because surely if they were facing such strong violent resistance they would want the media there to document the need for their extreme measures.

This is I believe the 4th case of police killing an unarmed black man in a month nationally. And this is the first killing of the year in a town that's 60% black but only has 3 black police officers out of a force of 53.

[darkmanx_429]

If you think you already know what happened between Michael Brown and Darren Wilson, then you've bought into the media hype and ought to be ashamed of yourself.  You weren't there.  The only thing we can say for sure is that looting and rioting are absolutely inappropriate responses to any incident.

The police are constantly misrepresented.  A vocal minority of the public with no comprehension of legal standards and no belief in media bias is constantly playing up every incident to make the police look evil and corrupt.  It's entirely possible that Officer Wilson could have murdered Mr. Brown intentionally.  It's also entirely possible that Officer Wilson shot Mr. Brown in self defense as Mr. Brown was trying to disarm him.  We don't know.  And until more information comes to light, you're just making a fool of yourself by spouting off your uninformed opinion.

Some good points, but I don't agree what with you said about this:

The police are constantly misrepresented.

Since when?! Not saying that I am the expert or anything, but with my experience with the Military and Law enforcement I have had my fair share of encounters of racists, bigots, etc. Hell I have had issues with some of my fellow officers that wanted to do harm to me just because of my skin color, hiding tickets that I wrote, etc. I have had Supervisors that even encouraged officers to racially profile people that we stop for Probable Cause. I.E. if you see this kinda car with rims and a minority is driving it then it must have some drugs in it and you should find a reason to pull it over, things like that.

I think you are jumping to assumptions that everyone is out for the police. Just because you have some authority does not give you the right to treat people anyway you feel fit. We have laws that we are governed by. What warrants that kind of Use of Force to unarmed citizens and news reporters. Really? Running point at news reporters with an M16 in a tactical stance? That's just absurd.

Don't get me wrong though, there are always those A Holes that try to play the system. You pulled me over because of this and that even when you feel that you are justified...they are just as bad as the corrupt ones in any job not just Law Enforcement or the Military.

[PFG9000]

Since when?!

Are you a LEO?  The way you talk about your experience, writing tickets, and having a supervisor telling you to make traffic stops, it sounds like you are.  Have you never had a story completely misrepresented by the media?  I'm an officer.  I see it probably on a monthly basis here in Green Bay, if not more often.  If it's that common in little ol' GB, I'm sure it's common everywhere.  It's frustrating, because there are incidents involving me that are dragged through the media and turned into something that has nothing to do with what actually happened, just because it makes a good story.  And after that, I'll have people mentioning that incident and telling me how corrupt the police are, not realizing that I have first-hand knowledge of what actually happened, and they don't.

Of course this doesn't mean that police never do any wrong.  But the media is constantly twisting things, and people eat it up because they want to believe the police are corrupt.  You really have to question what you hear about in the news.  Even video evidence can be twisted, because it shows one angle at one brief moment in time.  (Think about instant replay in sporting events, and how different angles on one play can tell different stories.)  Eye witness accounts are not always accurate either.  Witnesses have their own biases and agendas, and sometimes the human mind fills in things that the eyes don't actually see.

So yes, maybe you're Ratty and you've already made up your mind on something you don't know anything about.  Maybe you hated police or you hated young Black people before this story came out, so your mind is already made up.  But if you're wise, you keep an open mind, and you consider that the media might just not be giving you the full story, then you'll see that reserving judgment is best.

Whatever you do, just don't go out and incite riots and loot businesses that had nothing to do with the original incident.  Because that would just make you a douchebag.

[uzo]

I wasn't out in the field, but I did handle computer investigations. In my time at the Sheriff's Office I saw a pretty ridiculous amount of misrepresentation of the facility and the officers there in the media. They love blaming cops unquestionably whenever something goes down. Often times the misinformation ends up us being sued and losing as a result.

I don't claim to know what happened in Missouri, but I did want to at least share my experience in law enforcement.

[BLOOD MONKEY]

Almost as if they had something to hide.

Does this surprise you in any government matters?

[darkmanx_429]

Are you a LEO?  The way you talk about your experience, writing tickets, and having a supervisor telling you to make traffic stops, it sounds like you are.  Have you never had a story completely misrepresented by the media?  I'm an officer.  I see it probably on a monthly basis here in Green Bay, if not more often.  If it's that common in little ol' GB, I'm sure it's common everywhere.  It's frustrating, because there are incidents involving me that are dragged through the media and turned into something that has nothing to do with what actually happened, just because it makes a good story.  And after that, I'll have people mentioning that incident and telling me how corrupt the police are, not realizing that I have first-hand knowledge of what actually happened, and they don't.

Of course this doesn't mean that police never do any wrong.  But the media is constantly twisting things, and people eat it up because they want to believe the police are corrupt.  You really have to question what you hear about in the news.  Even video evidence can be twisted, because it shows one angle at one brief moment in time.  (Think about instant replay in sporting events, and how different angles on one play can tell different stories.)  Eye witness accounts are not always accurate either.  Witnesses have their own biases and agendas, and sometimes the human mind fills in things that the eyes don't actually see.

So yes, maybe you're Ratty and you've already made up your mind on something you don't know anything about.  Maybe you hated police or you hated young Black people before this story came out, so your mind is already made up.  But if you're wise, you keep an open mind, and you consider that the media might just not be giving you the full story, then you'll see that reserving judgment is best.

Whatever you do, just don't go out and incite riots and loot businesses that had nothing to do with the original incident.  Because that would just make you a douchebag.

Yep. At one time I was a field agent and I can only account for my experiences in my department so I understand first hand some of the issues that come up while being out in the field and having to be in and diffuse certain situations. I have found 9 times out of 10 by just treating and more importantly talking to people like you would want to be treated you can diffuse a majority of situations even hostile ones. I am also making a point that just because you might be an authority figure that there are always bad apples in the group. Just being a cop automatically doesn't make you right! Let's not split hair's here I totally agree with you there on your other points. I am sure you probably experienced encounters like that in your department as well that put you in compromising situations.

And for the record I haven't made my mind up about anything. I just dislike more than anything the media's portrayal of the situation especially when concerning black youths and under-privileged neighborhoods. God knows that the media in the US likes to make it seem it's the majority of minorities that are doing crime everyday. At least that's my observation as a black man in America.

Nice to have intelligent convo on the thread!

[Shiroi Koumori]

Media sensationalism. Always gets the viewers.

As for police brutality, I believe, based on what I've heard in my country, has two sides. Sometimes, the bad cops start it and sometimes it is a reaction from the cops due to the stuff done by other people.

[Mooning Freddy]

Don't want to get involved in a discussion I don't know too much about, but I'll just add something about how the media portrays demonstrations. There is this habit to Western media to portray law enforcement in demonstrations as the bad guys, who use brutal methods against peaceful demonstrators. While there are cases where this is true, people seem to get the wrong idea about demonstrations sometimes.
From my experience with demonstrations in the West Bank, those demonstrations are almost never "peaceful". When you think "demonstration" you imagine people with signs standing peacefully and protesting. Demonstrations here seem to always start violently, with teenagers blocking roads, burning tires and throwing rocks at cars. When the army or border guard intervene, they are forced to use tear gas and rubber bullets to restore the order and protect innocents. Sometimes the demonstrators would throw Molotov bottles at the law enforcement, and that is quite far from being peaceful. One needs to understand those soldiers or policemen are often risking their lives trying to contain the demonstrations, since many demonstrators really wouldn't mind hurting them. And in those cases in which demonstrators are hurt or killed, often while confronting soldiers, they are always presented as the good guys, while the soldiers or cops are bastards because they're using excessive force against "peaceful" demonstrators.

[Dracula9]

Is it bad that, due to both sides always getting misrepresented my media hype, opinionated allegations, and word-of-mouth retellings, I don't really give much of a shit about all this? I mean, I'm not without sympathy for those involved, but since you can't say it's the cops without the cops and their circles biting your head off, and since you can't say it's the demonstrators without the demonstrators and their supporters biting your head off, anything of this nature becomes so entangled and convoluted in moral relativism, that I don't feel like I can develop any sort of opinion on it without half the fuckin' planet telling me just how wrong and ignorant I am, regardless of how much research I've put into it.

Case and point.