Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: Vermanubis on June 16, 2008, 09:36:14 PM
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Do you believe that, while SoTN was amazing, that it was definitely not the best in the series? >_>
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it's subjective to the individuals tatse. so basically, if that's what the majority feels, you still don't have to agree.
i actually share igarashi's opinion on the matter, that 3 was about as good as it gets. he even references it a couple of times in symphony, and of course there's trevors appearance in curse.
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In Reply To #1
I half disagree. Everytime I go back to play SOTN it just proves to me I never get tired of it.
On the other hand, Dracula's Curse was a phenomenal example of what the old style CVs could do.
So, I hold those two up on about the same pedestal.
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If you look at many gaming websites, top ten lists, best games of 1997 lists, etcetera.. SotN will always be there.
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If you look at many gaming websites, top ten lists, best games of 1997 lists, etcetera.. SotN will always be there.
It really was an amazing accomplishment for its time. The incredible art and music direction were just standards we weren't quite used to in gaming, and some could argue that Symphony still holds the title.
Despite its low difficulty, in my mind it is a masterpiece.
But again, so is Dracula's Curse (which consequently also was known for its graphics and music at the time).
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In Reply To #4
I've only seen a few with those conditions but...
And I agree with ANTRAXX. SotN was incredible, but looking back, it's really not much different that today's Metroidvania's. Story and characters and artwork, music, and all that were just unforgettably enchanting, and it was the first of it's kind, so at the time, and even stil today, it is phenomenal, so yes, it certainly one of the best, if not the definite best.
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In my taste, Rondo of Blood (PC-Engine SuperCD ROM) and The Accursed Seal (NES) take the cake for me. Legend of the Demon Castle was excellent too, like a NES version of Rondo of Blood, especially the Japanese version, with the VRC6 audio chip.
Symphony of the Night was nice and all, but I think there's better in the series.
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I hold Rondo up high onmy list, too, but it's level design is just too weird sometimes. I don't feel as comfortable playing it.
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My 3 favorites were:
Super Castlevania IV
Dracula's Curse
Bloodlines
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I prefer the Sorrow titles more than SotN.
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I think Aria is actually IGA's masterpiece. Pretty well everything in that game worked well and felt right. It was a beautiful game with extremely precise controls, a really creative story, good atmosphere, and extremely interesting game mechanics. So technically, I think it is better than SotN. But SotN will always be my favorite because of how it perfectly embodies the ideal feel for the series in all regards.
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For me, one of the best was Super Castlevania IV and still it is along with Symphony of The Night. Super Castlevania has for me the most gothic atmosphere in the series, you can play outside the castle, super music for his time, but Symphony's new battle system, graphics, Alucard as the main hero and scenario they were something new to me and that is why i love it so much along with Super Castlevania IV!!!!
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To me, Symphony of the Night is still the best. I could be biased, since it's the first CV I played and I have an emotional attachment to it, but still. It's still so beautiful and perfect for me. Even though it's easy. :)
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In Reply To #9
Yup, SuperCVIV and Bloodlines are my top games too, along with CotM though.
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SoTN is my faveroute metroidvania, and probably my faveroute game in the series. CV3, SCV4 and rondo are my faveroute oldschool cvs. I find it hard to choose between those games.
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in reply to #1
noewwwwww way is SOTN the best CV. The original trilogy are all leaps and bounds gameplaywise and musicwise above SOTN. I think SOTN is the best recent CV considering what we've gotten since. (not to say any of the new CV are bad, I love them but they can't compare to the oldschool ones, they're two entirely diff types of games). The first two have the difficulty perfect and the gameplay is such that even though it's hard as fuck you keep going back because it just pulls you in. Hell I spent a good month the first time I got to death going back and trying to beat him and it never got old because there were all these different tactics and strategies I'd keep coming up with and the battle getting to him was so much fun and perfecting the route to him so I could get there with a fighting chance took a lot of time and was a lot of fun as well. The newer games just don't have the same kind of replay value the originals had. I haven't really gone back to play any of them more than once every few years since CV IV. III is perfect as well but in a diff way than I and II. For the first time we had a real in game story and the character had real in game motivation for his actions. The inclusion of allies would have been kickass enough but the game itself is huge without getting repetitive and boring and you get to choose which route you go to the castle which really set the replay value at a whole new high. (which I don't think has been attainable since) III is more of like an adventure and I and II are like linear quests. CV IV was awesome but was too easy in my opinion coming off of the ones before it, it also got repetitive after awhiel and I'd have to take a break, the game would have really benefitted from the ability to run or just walk faster. Rondo is an awesome castlevania game as well and is the closest the series has come to perfect in my opinion since the first 3, it got everything right the only thing that could have been improved was the challenge and the replay value wasn't as high, once I finished the game for some reason I just didn't really get the urge to go back and play it like I did with the previous ones. I still get cravings for the old ones every now and then and have to go back and play them like Mario, Mario 2 (J) and Mario 3.
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Do you believe that, while SoTN was amazing, that it was definitely not the best in the series? >_>
I definitely agree with your words. Other CVs surpassed SotN.
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I think Aria is actually IGA's masterpiece. Pretty well everything in that game worked well and felt right. It was a beautiful game with extremely precise controls, a really creative story, good atmosphere, and extremely interesting game mechanics. So technically, I think it is better than SotN. But SotN will always be my favorite because of how it perfectly embodies the ideal feel for the series in all regards.
Kind of funny, because I think Dawn is the better title. I thought it took everything that Aria did so awesome and improved on it. What a wonderful little series AoS and DoS turned out to be.
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Kind of funny, because I think Dawn is the better title.
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SoTN Was the only 2d Metroidvania with CD quality music, so personally it remains my favorite in terms of quality and presentation.
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SOTN - has the best animations and richest art but personally Aria is the best metroid style game for me.
its either SCIV/Rondo or 3 for the best oldskool though
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I suppose SotN isn't really the best CV, but it's still my favorite.
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What #2 said, but SotN has definitely been the most commercially and critically succesful game in the series and widely known among non-fans too.
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I suppose SotN isn't really the best CV, but it's still my favorite.
I would say the opposite. SotN isn't my favorite, but I'd probably say it's the best.
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I think that's interesting in terms of music. SoTN is famous for the variety of styles it encompasses (a booming baroque choral piece, rococco harpsichord, spanish guitar, etc.) but other Castlevanias had the hints of stylistic diversity as well--the booming Baroque theme in the giant chandelier room in SCIV, for instance.
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In Reply To #19
Really? I guess you're right, AoS did have some flaws in level design, but you can't say that DoS... actually, no other castle, besides SoTN, has had a more stunning and enchanting appearance to me... so I guess you're right, DoS does have better levels and design, yet I still prefer AoS.
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Castlevania 3 has been and will always be (more than likely) my favorite...but I couldn't honestly say which Castlevania is actually the 'best' (in terms of gameplay and such) in the series. :hums Mad Forest instead:
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Much as I love Symphony, it's not the best. I'd reserve that for the 64 games or Castlevania IV. III, Simon's Quest and Rondo are up there too, and Symphony's defintely near the top of the list, but it's not the best.
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Of course, hardcore fans such as yourselves wouldn't admit that SotN is the best. But as for the rest of the population, to them, it is.
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Of course, hardcore fans such as yourselves wouldn't admit that SotN is the best. But as for the rest of the population, to them, it is.
So true!
Also, I guess its a good thing this topic title says "In your honest OPINION" Because otherwise its really hard to say which Castlevania truly is the best..
Its all about personal preference and experience! ^_^
But yeah..I love every CV except Haunted Castle and the N64 titles. :P
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In Reply To #28
Woah, you're saying 64 titles might be the BEST?? I love 'em too man, but come one! Even pork is better than them!
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The 64 games had so much potential. You can see the seed of so many great, unique ideas; it's just that they're so often executed so poorly. The garden maze chase is just awful in either version, or either character mode (a shit stain on an otherwise brilliant level); the camera is broken between the games as well.
I think a remake now could really bring its colors forth, but IGA would never do it.
Sorry off-topic.
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In Reply To #32
Yeah, but Iga is too stupid and in denial that these gemstones even existed.
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I love sotn, but I love SCIV also. I never thought it was much different in difficulty from the first Castlevania. And The second was incredibly easy. Dawn was to me the best Castlevania game after sotn, but not as good. There is just an aura about sotn, all the small details add up to alot. For me its SOTN/SC4,Rondo, and then the first Castlevania.
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In Reply To #28
Woah, you're saying 64 titles might be the BEST?? I love 'em too man, but come one! Even pork is better than them!
blasphemous heretic
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In Reply To #35
Much as I love Symphony, it's not the best. I'd reserve that for the 64 games or Castlevania IV.
I'm surprised to hear that out of DoctaMario.
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In Reply To #36
he's a big n64 games fan, so that's not surprising really. :o
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Agreed.
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Curse of Darkness and Lament of Innocence are my favorites.
All Castlevania games are great except Haunted Castle that was a disaster.
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I hate to break it to you, but Castlevania Legacy of darkness is THE BEST CASTLEVANIA GAME EVER BY A MILE! The game isn't given enough credit for whatever reason, but nonetheless, it's my favorite, and so far, the other Castlevania titles are total failures in comparison!
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blasphemous heretic
Agreed!
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In Reply To #32
Yeah, but Iga is too stupid and in denial that these gemstones even existed.
It's painful, really, how hard you're trying to be "I hate IGA guys, does that mean I'm cool like you guyz?!"
IGA's said time and time again it's because the directors of those games intended for them to be side-stories. He's complimented them as intriguing in their presentation, plus he has KCEK members on his team.
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Iga is awesome, and though I haven't liked some of his previous games, I still don't go around saying I hate him! If it weren't for him, Castlevania would've died off completely, so you should be thankful that he saved it!
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Since I've only played a few castlevania games, never the 3D games, I couldn't say wich is the best CV...but i cuold say that my favourite CV is, and always will be Symphony Of The Night, because, It's So simple, but amazing, that is a perfect game, I never get bored playing it, has a lot of things about mythology, ancient histories, symbolisms, and a lot of things that you can learn, I thing is awsome...
anyways, my top 3 would be:
1. SOTN(PSX)
2. AoS(GBA)
3. Castlevania I(Nes)
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This isn't a definite ranking, but this is kinda how I'd rank some of my more favorite games in the series:
IV
I
Bloodlines
Rondo of Blood
II
III
SOTN
Again, this isn't concrete. I absolutely adore SOTN and have played through it a million times since it first came out, and it's easily, EASILY the best of the Metroidvanias by about a trillion light years, but what can I say, I love (most of) the old stuff more. Though all those games I mentioned are pretty much equal in terms of quality and fun, so don't go thinking I regard it as much lower than the others.
As for the couple hateful comments toward Haunted Castle...I think it's pretty fun. Of course, only if you're playing the easier versions. (The main ROM floating around is disastrously difficult.) Plus, one can't deny how farking awesome the music is.
Only CV games I haven't played are the first two Game Boy ones, which is unfortunate. One of these days...
Oh, and that crummy-looking cellphone game, if that even counts.
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IV
I
Bloodlines
Rondo of Blood
II
III
SOTN
I guess that's why your name is Abnormal Freak....lol, j/k
In my honest opinion, SotN is still the best.
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Pfft! As if those games aren't awesome?
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SotN is overrated.
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Whatever, semenswapmonster!
:)
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III,VI,COTM,SOTN/BLoodLines
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Whatever, semenswapmonster!
:)
>:(
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Well, I love SotN. It has great graphics, gameplay and sound. But for some reason I seldomly play it. Maybe it's because inverted castle annoys me greatly, but there has to be more to it. Anyway, my current favourites are DoS, AoS, PoR, CV4 and CV. After them comes SotN. At least I think so.
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VI
Since when! :o
I think SOTN's inverted castle is just fine. If I recall, AOS or HOD did something more retarded, where you're treading through the exact same areas but in a different dimension or something. Now THAT was hokey.
Besides, without the inverted castle, there would be no Inverted Castlevania Dungeon. :) By that name, at least.
Only thing I hate about the inverted castle is the same song is played in most of the areas, and it gets old, and quick.
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In Reply To #53
Ah shut up, I mean IV. Sides Vampire's Kiss or whatever could probably be counted as VI that or bloodlines.
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The inverted castle is probably the low point of SOTN to me. Other than that it's a decent game.
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It really is subjective, whether Symphony is the best. I love Symphony personally, and occasionally replay it from time to time as with most Castlevania games. The one that impressed me most however, with its mood and aesthetics, and often matching music, was Super Castlevania IV. I just love the level design, and for it being one of the "oldschool" Castlevania's, it does what it does as well as possible gameplay-wise, and mood-wise. It's dark and creepy, just like any Castlevania should be. So in my mind, it's the best.
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In Reply To #1
Dracula's Curse is the best in the series, hands down
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Symphony of the Night sucks.
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In Reply To #58
No it doesn't!
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Castlevania: Judgment sucks.
FIXED!
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In Reply To #60
And how would you know that?
Symphony of the Night sucks.
It doesn't really suck, but it is no way as good as people say it is.
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I can't believe some of the distaste for SOTN, saying it either sucks or is overrated. :P The game is incredibly innovative, the graphics and music are top-notch, it's loads of fun, it's the only Metroidvania that has really well-done castle structuring, and so on. This baffles me just like all the comments about Citizen Kane being a crappy movie. I mean, seriously--WTF, people?
Only thing I'm not too particularly fond of is how incredibly easy the game is, but there are some challenges now and then.
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In Reply To #61
Well, back in 1997 the standards for games was very different. When SotN was unleashed upon the world, it was a fresh take on the CV mythos; fans and non-fans of the series adored it, difficulty aside. So, the majority says SotN is phenomenal while the minority "just don't get it".
Also, from what I've seen anyway, most top 50 or top 100 greatest games of all time lists include SotN, and it's almost always in the top 20 or 10.
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In Reply To #60
And how would you know that?
It doesn't really suck, but it is no way as good as people say it is.
lol, it was just a troll.
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I can't believe some of the distaste for SOTN, saying it either sucks or is overrated. :P The game is incredibly innovative, the graphics and music are top-notch, it's loads of fun, it's the only Metroidvania that has really well-done castle structuring, and so on. This baffles me just like all the comments about Citizen Kane being a crappy movie. I mean, seriously--WTF, people?
The game has a lot of flaws. The Inverted Castle is crap(and that is a very bad thing considering it's the second half of the game), most of the weapons are useless, there are a lot of unnecessary things just thrown in for kicks, it has a lot of glitches, the game feels incomplete and probably is, and the game is mind bogglingly easy. If it ever gets remade(again, and when it's a good time for it), it should get fixed because it's in dire need of that in many ways. SotN definitely does not deserve its title as "best Castlevania game ever".
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In Reply To #65
I love SotN night I think it's a great game, but yeah, it does have its flaws. I totally agree the inverted castle is a waste. Anything important or cool you basically get in the regular castle. It baffles me when people bitch about the second portraits in PoR, but then seem to forget, or never mention the lack of detail and work put into the inverted castle.
Again, a great game, and my favorite Metroid-Vania style game (although that could be due to nestalgia)It is defiantly not the best game of the series. Personally, it's about 3rd or 4th on my list, hard to say sometimes
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It baffles me when people bitch about the second portraits in PoR, but then seem to forget, or never mention the lack of detail and work put into the inverted castle.
For starters, the seconds portraits in PoR are basically the same thing as the past portraits. You pretty much just do the same thing all over again. The Inverted Castle may suck, but at least it differed from the normal castle and the creators were actually able to make a castle that could work upside down.
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Alot of people here seem like they didn't play SOTN when it was originally released. Keep in mind this title came out over 10 years ago, and re-invented the series. You must admit it was a big jump from Bloodlines at that time.
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While on the subject of SOTN, being someone who studies the occult, has anyone else noticed the symbols on the walls in the room of the first boss fight? Very similiar to the symbols of the gate of the Necronomicon (or Yog-Sohoth). Then there's Cthulhu popping up in the series. Betcha Iga's a bigtime Lovecraft fan like myself.
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Very similiar to the symbols of the gate of the Necronomicon (or Yog-Sohoth).
They're pentagrams.
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So has anyone noticed that Malachi looks like Cthulhu, while Cthulhu looks like some random demon? I bet they just confuzzled the names.
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The game has a lot of flaws. The Inverted Castle is crap(and that is a very bad thing considering it's the second half of the game), most of the weapons are useless, there are a lot of unnecessary things just thrown in for kicks, it has a lot of glitches, the game feels incomplete and probably is, and the game is mind bogglingly easy. If it ever gets remade(again, and when it's a good time for it), it should get fixed because it's in dire need of that in many ways. SotN definitely does not deserve its title as "best Castlevania game ever".
I guess I can understand not liking the inverted castle, but I find it fun, the bosses are all completely new, and it's far less repetitive and stupid than AOS' "second castle," which as I recall is exactly the same thing. (That was AOS and not HOD, right? Maybe I'm confused.)
AOS, DOS, and POR have useless weapons also, but despite that the variety is fun regardless--or at least I find it fun in SOTN. The other games, not so much. SOTN has soooo many weapons and items that you really don't ever need to use, but it's fun at least once to go through them all and see the neat little things some of them do. Same with all the items--especially the ones that cause huge naked chicks to appear on the screen. Throwing peanuts in the air and trying to catch them in your mouth to regain just a few points of health? Come on! Little details like that are so much fun! The other games have very few such tiny, useless, albeit fun details.
What are these "unnecessary things" you speak of? 'Cos I love all the weird little details and things in the game. Makes it feel far more complete than the other games.
Glitches? Yeah, there are the well-known glitches, some of which cause the progress percentage of the game to go higher--so are they really glitches, or intentional? Either way, they're fun, and I've NEVER done anything in the game that has somehow screwed me over. Seriously, when has a glitch in SOTN ever ruined your play experience? None of it gets in the way. Besides that, some of the other games have glitches also. Being able to go outside of the castle in AOS (or was that DOS)? You're not just going to look over that, are you?
What makes SOTN feel incomplete? I hope you don't say "'cos it doesn't have the ability to play Maria and the new areas like in the Saturn version," because those were all added LATER and as far as I know were not intended to be put in the original game. I've never played the Saturn version, but I hear the new areas are poorly-designed, the new sprites suck ass, and there's nothing special about the new tunes either (which, if I'm not mistaken, weren't even written by Yamane).
Yeah, the game is easy, but aside from COTM, are any of the other Metroidvanias anything more than a cakewalk? Seriously. ALL of IGA's SOTN-style Castlevanias are a breeze. Except that none of those other games have the insane challenge of a boss like Galamoth. Sure, the boss is pretty easy to get through if you have the right equipment and/or the fairy familiar healing you constantly, but he's still a pretty darn tough cookie. COTM is the only Metroidvania that really poses a consistent challenge.
As for SOTN being considered the best Castlevania, yeah I agree it doesn't quite deserve that title, but it certainly is deserving of its high praise and being considered ONE of the best. And it's so good that I honestly don't mind if somebody DOES think it's THE best, because it really IS so good. And if nothing else, arguing that any of the other Metroidvanias are superior or come even close to its brilliance and replayability is just a dead argument from the start because it's simply not true. :)
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In Reply To #72
AOS didn't really have a second castle, it was more like a mini corridor. I think HoD is the one you're thinking of.
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I haven't played either game since they came out, so yeah, I probably got confused. :o I've tried replaying the both of them several times but usually just get bored.
Though I did just order a Game Boy Player, ha, and intend to play through the games again.
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In my case it's just the other way round. While I have played through AoS hundrets of times, I played through SotN... 3 times? Maybe 4? For me CV1 and AoS have the best replay quality.
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:o
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I guess I can understand not liking the inverted castle, but I find it fun, the bosses are all completely new, and it's far less repetitive and stupid than AOS' "second castle," which as I recall is exactly the same thing. (That was AOS and not HOD, right? Maybe I'm confused.)
AOS, DOS, and POR have useless weapons also, but despite that the variety is fun regardless--or at least I find it fun in SOTN. The other games, not so much. SOTN has soooo many weapons and items that you really don't ever need to use, but it's fun at least once to go through them all and see the neat little things some of them do. Same with all the items--especially the ones that cause huge naked chicks to appear on the screen. Throwing peanuts in the air and trying to catch them in your mouth to regain just a few points of health? Come on! Little details like that are so much fun! The other games have very few such tiny, useless, albeit fun details.
What are these "unnecessary things" you speak of? 'Cos I love all the weird little details and things in the game. Makes it feel far more complete than the other games.
Glitches? Yeah, there are the well-known glitches, some of which cause the progress percentage of the game to go higher--so are they really glitches, or intentional? Either way, they're fun, and I've NEVER done anything in the game that has somehow screwed me over. Seriously, when has a glitch in SOTN ever ruined your play experience? None of it gets in the way. Besides that, some of the other games have glitches also. Being able to go outside of the castle in AOS (or was that DOS)? You're not just going to look over that, are you?
What makes SOTN feel incomplete? I hope you don't say "'cos it doesn't have the ability to play Maria and the new areas like in the Saturn version," because those were all added LATER and as far as I know were not intended to be put in the original game. I've never played the Saturn version, but I hear the new areas are poorly-designed, the new sprites suck ass, and there's nothing special about the new tunes either (which, if I'm not mistaken, weren't even written by Yamane).
Yeah, the game is easy, but aside from COTM, are any of the other Metroidvanias anything more than a cakewalk? Seriously. ALL of IGA's SOTN-style Castlevanias are a breeze. Except that none of those other games have the insane challenge of a boss like Galamoth. Sure, the boss is pretty easy to get through if you have the right equipment and/or the fairy familiar healing you constantly, but he's still a pretty darn tough cookie. COTM is the only Metroidvania that really poses a consistent challenge.
As for SOTN being considered the best Castlevania, yeah I agree it doesn't quite deserve that title, but it certainly is deserving of its high praise and being considered ONE of the best. And it's so good that I honestly don't mind if somebody DOES think it's THE best, because it really IS so good. And if nothing else, arguing that any of the other Metroidvanias are superior or come even close to its brilliance and replayability is just a dead argument from the start because it's simply not true. :)
The bosses may be completely new, but they're so pathetic that they can be beaten before the boss music starts(I'm looking at you, especially, Akmodan). HoD might have had that second castle, but it had a good feeling to it, and it did have huge differences later on with enemies and slight level design changes and cool and necessary items.
The other games do have useless weapons too, but not as much as SotN. What kind of joke is Red Rust and Tyrfing anyway? They weren't even worth putting in the game. The little details are also pretty nice, but I doubt there are many people that can tolerate checking them all out(or even at all probably). A lot of things just don't need to be there and instead of those things, there could have been better things that could have been necessary and probably much cooler.
The unnecessary things are most of the inventory entirely, the spells, the useless special attacks, the wolf form(all the forms could have been put to much better use), etc. There are just too many unnecessary and gimmicky things.
Sure the glitches don't really mess up the experience, but the fact that there are so many of them is part of the reason the game feels incomplete.
The game feels incomplete because a bunch of things thrown together with no purpose. It feels like an unfinished ROM hack or fangame. The game also seems a little short, and there are a lot of things that could have been put into it. It feels as rushed as PoR(maybe more, even).
All metroidvanias are a breeze, but SotN is the easiest of them all. It might just be one of the easiest games of all time. It's pathetic. It doesn't even have a hard mode. Sure it has luck mode, but the difficulty is way imbalanced. Luck mode starts off very hard, but then you're back to being a god and you're able to sweep through the game just like in normal mode. At least the hard modes in the other games are actually harder than the normal games, even if hardly any work was put into them.
The game does not deserve the praise it gets. It's not that good. Games like AoS and DoS already surpassed it in so many ways. It has horrible flaws, and after replaying it a few times, you just get sick of it to the point in which you might not want to see it anymore. It should stop getting so much praise because it is not only annoying, but the game doesn't deserve it. It's good, but not that good.
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I'd say you're pretty much in the minority there. :P Most people say that SOTN is an astounding game, and thank goodness for that. There are right opinions and then there are wrong ones, too. ;)
Red Rust is awesome, by the way. Gotta love picking up the sword for the first time and thinking, "Hmm, what's this one like?" only to find that it's rusted in the sheath and Alucard is puzzled, ha ha. That's just one of the little details that I love. It's humorous.
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I'd say you're pretty much in the minority there. :P Most people say that SOTN is an astounding game, and thank goodness for that. There are right opinions and then there are wrong ones, too. ;)
So, you're opinionated.
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Everybody is. :o
Though I'd say I'm truthionated. ;)
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Everybody is. :o
Though I'd say I'm truthionated. ;)
Wrong. You're saying I'm wrong because I think SotN isn't as good as people say it is. You can't even accept any flaws. You're being a fanboy. Also, opinionated means holding stubbornly and often unreasonably to one's own opinions.
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You seem to be taking things a little more seriously than they really are. :P
I don't see how me liking SOTN so much can be attributed to me "holding stubbornly and unreasonably" to my own opinions. None of the things that you mentioned disliking about SOTN are things that I agree with--quite the opposite, I find a lot of what you dislike to be things that add to why I love it. There's nothing unreasonable about that at all. I don't see the so-called flaws that you do, but if somehow not acknowledging such "flaws" makes me a fanboy, then so be it.
People can have their own opinions, I won't try to rob them of that. I'm only (partly) joking anyway. Though I am glad your opinion on SOTN is a minority one. :)
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In Reply To #82
You were saying I was wrong and you were right. That doesn't work.
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joke, n. something that is amusing or ridiculous, esp. because of being ludicrously inadequate or a sham; a thing, situation, or person laughed at rather than taken seriously; farce.
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In Reply To #84
Well excuuuuuuse me!
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:)
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In Reply To #85
you forgot the "Princess" on the end of that =D
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In Reply To #77
Sure the glitches don't really mess up the experience, but the fact that there are so many of them is part of the reason the game feels incomplete.
portrait has just as many or more, some of them easy to do and game breaking (crashes). sotn's glitches are mostly just fun little things that are pretty damn hard to replicate.
why aren't you egging it instead? :o
Games like AoS and DoS already surpassed it in so many ways.
sprite quality wise? nope. palette wise? nope. special effect wise? nope. atmosphere? nope. level design? nope. attention to detail? nope. character wise? not really (aos's too japanese in series that were always rooted in europe, dos is animu).
:o
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In Reply To #88
Gameplay wise.
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In Reply To #88
Gameplay wise.
then he wouldn't say "surpassed it in so many ways." but "surpassed it in one thing."
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sprite quality wise? nope. palette wise? nope. special effect wise? nope. atmosphere? nope. level design? nope. attention to detail? nope. character wise? not really (aos's too japanese in series that were always rooted in europe, dos is animu).
Yeah, you're right, it makes me wonder why none of this magic can be recaptured today.. I mean, it seems like the level of talent has really took a few steps back nowadays. sotn was just cool on so many levels. Dracula's castle was bizarre, beautiful, creepy etc. I'll never forget the first time ever I put the cd in my ps-x, playing through that game is mesmerizing.
Face it, Symphony is just that good
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In Reply To #90
That's what it is for me.
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In Reply To #90
You can't even attack diagonally in AoS.
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You can't even attack diagonally in AoS.
But various weapons attack differently unlike in SotN in which every weapon attacks the same aside from different speeds.
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i think you got that backwards. in aos every weapon works identically. in sotn many weapons have cool special effects like flames, icicles, vortexes etc.
it's only animations that differ. aos's weapons all work the same as others of the same type.
and then, many have cool unique special attacks. in aos there's nothing like that.
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In Reply To #95
But then there's the unique magic/soul-system, which is actually useful unlike SotN's gimmick-spells. And btw, maybe in SotN some weapons have special effects, but in AoS there are weapons which actually differ. Like smallswords and Zweih
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like i said, animation. sotn was the first game in the series to do that, so it was experimenting with it. aos was way after that when they got everything estabilished.
and the experimental game got more unique weapons with cool effects, while the mass produced clones got spriteswaps of the first sword type you found.
as for spells vs souls, bad comparison. spells were a totally different thing. closer to that would be items you gather that you can use against enemies (explosives, darts, bows+arrows etc) and subweapons.
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In Reply To #70
No, they're not . play it again smarty. In the room of the first boss fight.
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SotN actually has an excellent variety of weapons. I have no idea what people are talking about saying they all attack the same. You had an assortment of standard swords, yes, but you also had daggers, chakrams, rune swords, heaven swords, crissigreams, katanas (with the swirl attack effect)--and thats not even mentioning the various swords with effects added to the regular attacks (flames, ice, thunder, blasts of light, thrust attacks (Zweihander) and so on ...). Variety was great, IMO.
And as Serio mentioned, there were quite a number of disposable weapons in SotN that had similar effects to the souls in AoS. Various surikens, bombs, pentragrams and so on.
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In Reply To #98
Nothing better than to bump a topic just to make an ass out of yourself, huh?
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In Reply To #99
They all attack the same way. The Crissaegrim is the only one that attacks different but it's a broken weapon.
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In Reply To #99
They all attack the same way. The Crissaegrim is the only one that attacks different but it's a broken weapon.
I don't see how all the weapons I put down attack in the same way. I mentioned that there are swords that attack in the same way, but the game also has special attacks embedded into certain swords and others are downright unique weapons. This is an undeniable FACT. Beyond actually making a comprehensive list, I don't see what more I could do to hammer this point in.
All right, exhaustive list it is;
Nunchaku - please explain to me how this attacks the same???
Claymore/Flamberge/Zweihander/Estoc/Obsidian Sword - can be used to thrust forward
Katana/Muramasa/Osafune/Yasutsuna - creates a whirlwind attack in front of Alucard.
Sword of Dawn - summons warriors (ie: unique)
Basilard/Combat Knife - stabs (ie: NOT LIKE SWORDS)
Knuckle Duster/Jewel Knuckles - punches (ie: NOT LIKE SWORDS)
Holbein Dagger - mini criss.
Rapier/Werebane - super fast slashing attack.
Blue Knuckles - uppercut attack.
Chakram - throwing weapon.
Shield Rod - can be used to summon shield monsters.
Moon Rod - summons moons to attack.
Shotel - can be thrown.
Heaven Sowrd - can be thrown. Powerful attack with two combined.
Firebrand - creates a wall of fire.
Icebrand - creates a wall of ice.
Thunderbrand - creates a wall of thunder.
Vorpal Blade - creates a vacuum blade.
Holy Sword - creates an explosion of light.
Iron Fist - a rapid pummel attack.
Marsil - creates a giant explosion on screen.
Criss - creates many rapid vacuum blades.
Mourneblade - sucks enemy HP and gives it to Alucard.
First of Tulkas - shoots fireballs. awesome. also rapid pummel attack.
Rune Sword - large flying weapon.
Alucard Sword - teleportation attack.
I know there are quite a few "clone" swords, but you seem to be completely ignoring the unique weapons as well. Not to mention that even the "clone" swords have unique elemental properties or other special properties (mind you not all of them, but it at least looks like they made an effort). Overall, if you count all the special weapon attacks, useable items and spells and compared them to the souls in AoS, you see that both games have a lot of selection/depth.
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In Reply To #100
Aww, don't be mad cause I'm right and you probably don't even know what I'm talking about anyway.
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don't forget the ever elusive, runesword.
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Nunchaku - please explain to me how this attacks the same??? The fact that it attacks twice makes it unique?
Claymore/Flamberge/Zweihander/Estoc/Obsidian Sword - can be used to thrust forward Useless and reckless.
Katana/Muramasa/Osafune/Yasutsuna - creates a whirlwind attack in front of Alucard. not too useful.
Sword of Dawn - summons warriors (ie: unique)
Basilard/Combat Knife - stabs (ie: NOT LIKE SWORDS but still very alike)
Knuckle Duster/Jewel Knuckles - punches (ie: NOT LIKE SWORDS)
Holbein Dagger - mini criss. I haven't seen this one.
Rapier/Werebane - super fast slashing attack. useless.
Blue Knuckles - uppercut attack. way too short ranged and weak.
Chakram - throwing weapon. Too weak(I think).
Shield Rod - can be used to summon shield monsters.
Moon Rod - summons moons to attack.
Shotel - can be thrown. No real point to that.
Heaven Sowrd - can be thrown.
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In Reply To #105
What a frustrating person you are. It's almost pointless to provide evidence seeing as you either use your own biased interpretation of that information or ignore it completed (or are just terribly terribly wrong).
The fact that it attacks twice makes it unique?
Yes. That and there is no other weapon of its kind in SotN. I honestly have no idea what definition of unique you're going by, but I'm using the standard dictionary definition.
Useless and reckless.
The thrust is very useful against flying enemies since it can be used in the air, has a surprisingly wide area of affect and the range is quite good as well. Besides, I was making a lits of unique attacks. And this is one of them.
not too useful.
Wut ... ? The katanas are arguably some of the strongest most versatile weapons in the game. The whirlwind attack covers a large area and is quick and powerful. And the Muramasa is just broken, don't even get me started. IIRC, either all or some of the whirlwind attacks be used while running (very useful). So ... yeah, you're completely wrong. Imagine that!
but still very alike
Yeah, no, not really. Stabbing is extremely fast, but has poor range. Great to use with Dark Metamorphosis to recover HP quickly. The daggers also have a special attack that lets them be used like normal swords, which refutes your point even further (that they are still alike--if this were the case, why bother adding the special attack?).
I haven't seen this one.
Thank you for showing me your ignorance. If you're going to argue, at least be familiar with the game. At least go and TRY OUT these combinations. It seems like you're just being a stubborn jerk about it. You: "Even though the evidence is here, and these are good points, I'll completely ignore them, since my mind is already made up 100%".
useless.
Wow. Again ... wut ...? The Rapier and Werebane special attacks are some of the strongest in the game as far as damage per second goes. Are we even playing the same game? Not to mention this ability kicks ass and is very unique.
cheap and there is really no point in having it
You can't be serious? Have many swords are there in AoS that fall under this same category? Yeah, SotN has them too (clone swords), but AoS has them just as well. Ugh. UGH.
*bangs head against a wall repeatedly*
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In Reply To #106
Now you're just taking this too seriously. Why get angry and call me a stubborn jerk?
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if you're going to suggest sotn's swords are all the same and not unique, why aren't you attacking aos, dos and pork? they're total copyfests.
let's take dos
swords:
short sword = does a slash with sotn animation. special does the same thing.
long sword = see short sword
hrunting = see short sword
joyeuse = see short sword
ice brand = wow, original. it creates an ice cube, special sends an ice cloud
burtgang = see short sword
now let's move to big swords:
claymore = does an overhead slash. special does the same thing.
great sword = see claymore
dainsleif = see claymore
balmung = see claymore
claimh solais = see claymore. special has a large sprite added instead, but it still does the exact same thing.
and so on. each of the "weapon classes" is just one weapon copied over and over, there's less unique weapons in dos and pork than 1/4 of sotn's unique weaponry.
see the problem here? :o
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In Reply To #108
True. If only they had SotN's special attacks just for some variety.
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But that's exactly what I meant. In DoS, there are quite a few different classes of weapons, like short swords, axes, lances... in SotN there's one. I never talked about special attacks or something. And even they are better in DoS. Though there are none in AoS, you're right.
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In Reply To #110
sotn has punches, stabs and sword slashes. that's more than 1.
and wow, big deal, most of the sword types use one animation for al. so? it's just an aesthetic, plus sotn was the first game in the series to even have equippable weapons, as an experiment. it still had way more original stuff than all of the ds titles combined.
btw. from the looks of it, ooe also has one animation per hand for its glyphs, whether it's a sword, fireball or spear. :o
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In Reply To #111
I noticed that too. Though it's not really necessary, it's cool, they put that much love into the animation.
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no i mean, ooe has the alucard syndrome. chanoix uses the exact same animation for all the glyphs from what i saw, no matter if it's a sword, a spear or a knife she throws.
she has separate animation for each hand (which is cool), but other than that she seems to use less animations than even alucard, from the trailers at least.
we'll see in 17 days if it's true, along with the area sizes, if they're really just 10-20 rooms large.
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The only two things I saw were her standard attack animation and the animation, when she throws knives. There she throws her arm up into the air.