Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: Mobius on January 16, 2009, 05:44:21 PM
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;D
Okay, okay. You all know the drill here. CastleVania is, insofar as I'm concerned, home to quite a few poorly thought-out, unimaginative, sometimes downright unnecessary supporting cast members. Now in my estimation, this is most evident in the titles overseen by Igarashi-sama (*grips sinuses and squeezes eyes shut, dismally shaking head*). However, I am curious to see what others here think. No need to vote if you don't want to (as an American, I happen to believe in total freedom of choice), but so share your thoughts if you have any on the non-playable characters that pepper our beloved franchise. Do tell, why are maidens in distress like Lydie and Mina just so badly executed and what, in fact, might have made them better characters?
...Even though I could probably sum up the answer to that in one word here many of you might agree on: DEPTH!
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I agree, the Igavanias have had some very poorly executed characters. My vote also goes to Mina Hakuba, for being a healthy mix of annoying AND pointless.
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I can't really say any of them are "useless". They're random NPCs; what more do you want(some others might be inexcusable, though, isn't that right, young Henry?)? Also, you only listed characters from IGA's games, and Annette's last name is unknown(she's not Maria's sister).
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Correction. I listed only characters from the established, official timeline. If Konami stated that Annette and Maria are not related, incidentally, I wasn't aware of it. Nor was I aware that young Henry was in any way useless since he kinda' sorta' led me through the Villa garden maze and sorta' youknow became playable wielding a nice, big boomstick too.
And I mean useless in the sense that none of them were in actuality NEEDED to advance the story in their respective games. The only exception to this is Sarah of course, but I had to add her since Konami saw fit to grant her no redeeming merits other than a big pair of blue eyes. I mean, how the heck was I supposed to feel bad for her, or for that matter even Leon, when the time for her ultimate sacrifice came?
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Don't look into the Death Star.
But since he wasn't available, I chose Mina. Useless twit.
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If Konami stated that Annette and Maria are not related, incidentally, I wasn't aware of it.
they did, back when dxc came out and as far as i remember some guy asked that question to iga. he just said that they're unrelated strangers.
they were related only in snes dracula xx, which isn't even canon.
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In Reply To #6
Oh snap. I never knew. So--.... Richter just happened to save some random little magical girl... who uh... followed this strange man into Dracula's castle....
You know what? Screw it. - Now I know and knowing is half the battle.
~GEE EYE JO-O-O-OE!
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Richter just happened to save some random little magical girl
yeah, just as he saved a random nun and random doctor's daughter.
anette was the only villager that was kidnapped with a purpose, being richter's girlfriend (in dxc dracula and shaft captrure her personally), while the others were probably too slow to run away from drac's evil forces.
also in dxc, it looked like maria's powers awakened after richter saved her, so maybe she decided that since he saved her and thanks to him she got super powers, she might as well help him. :o
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In Reply To #7
Actually... wasn't she already in the Castle?
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Right, right. I keep forgetting about Isis and what'sername.
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In Reply To #10
Iris and Tera.
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In Reply To #4
Well, the idea of having to kill your own vampire girlfriend with a whip is kinda tragic, whoever she is
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Lydie.
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Lydie.
She was the entire reason Juste and Maxim went into the castle and went through all of that trouble. She wasn't useless, just a troublemaker.
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Ok by your logic, Slippy the Toad is useful for being the motivation for both Fox McCloud and Falco Lombardi to constantly save his ass.
You know Super Mario Bros. used that plot too, does that make Peach useful? (...She might be now, but she wasn't then). FUCK -- even the "other princesses" were more useful for pointing Mario in the right direction.
Lydie didn't even do THAT. She just sat there as the bait. But like I said the RoB girls aren't too far off there.
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if lydie counts, then so does ada from lod. after all lydie was based on her, the stuff that happens to them is pretty much identical. :o
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Also, why the hell is Hammer on the list? He sells you weapons and stuff.
Same with Master Librarian. Because Alucard knew him when young, the old geezer was happy to help him... for a little price. Not to mention he's packing an Axelord armor on him. ;D
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Ok, Lydie is useless, but not as useless as Mina. Young Henry is still pretty useless. It's not like Cornell had to save him, he just did it to be good, but it ended up making him look like even more of an idiot than before. He could have just wandered around for half an hour and lied to his mom to get This the copper key. Actually, even adult Henry is useless, so Henry himself is just completely useless. :o
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Adult Henry rescues the children, which is more than can be said of other extra modes, so I wouldn't call him useless at all.
Plus he's very fun to play as. Gun-toting and all.
As for Child Henry... there's a chainsaw-wielding maniac in the maze. He could've just been scared shitless and been frozen with fear. I'm sure many would choose to hide rather than run in that same scenario.
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As for Child Henry... there's a chainsaw-wielding maniac in the maze. He could've just been scared shitless and been frozen with fear. I'm sure many would choose to hide rather than run in that same scenario.
And that makes him useful?
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Mina gave the talisman to soma; tha'ts something useful.-
Lydie is just a maidmstrees in danger.
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Mina gave the talisman to soma
No she didn't. It was called Mina's Talisman, but she didn't give it to him.
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In Reply To #20
I guess you've never heard of 'usefulness as a plot device'.
It wouldn't matter anyway, since I don't know what your criteria for usefulness is, but it sounds like you have to be the Messiah to make the cut.
The one-liner responses do not help the thread either, either.
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In Reply To #20
I guess you've never heard of 'usefulness as a plot device'.
You're saying Henry isn't useless because he decided to hide. That makes no sense.
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In Reply To #24
As usual, you misread and gather whatever you want from what others post.
I could argue that Henry himself is as useful as any 10-year frightened child would be, and his existence is useful because it shows the player the human side of Cornell... but no you probably couldn't grasp that.
By that logic, the villagers in Simon's Quest are far less useful since they "just pace back and forth". There's some that don't even move.
But Lydie doesn't move either. In fact you don't see her 'til the end of the game... she is,essentially, a living MacGuffin.
How about the useless peeping eyes behind the windows? They serve no purpose other than rule of cool. Does Rule of Cool apply to your definition of 'usefulness'?
Better define 'usefulness' because I'd rather these things all be there rather than not, since otherwise all these games would be lacking in color/soul.
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Out of those I would say Lydie.
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his existence is useful because it shows the player the human side of Cornell
Ada already does that job.
How about the useless peeping eyes behind the windows? They serve no purpose other than rule of cool. Does Rule of Cool apply to your definition of 'usefulness'?
They aren't NPCs. You're very much exaggerating.
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Ada already does that job.
They aren't NPCs. You're very much exaggerating.
Yes, because it's something only one character can ever do (not that one meets Ada 'til the end anyway... in fact, aside from her involvement as a plot device, she's about as useful as Lydie is). Honestly, you have your own little ruleset for everything.
And you're picky about everything else, unless it's someone other than you. Then they're exaggerating or wrong. Not just in this thread but all threads you've been participating on as of late. We do have a 'don't be an ass rule', which you constantly bend or break.
I'm issuing a Warning for the flamebait/troll way in which you post. Watch yourself.
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People should know better than to take my posts so seriously.
EDIT by Moderation:
They should not have to.
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Sarah Tarantoulle (Lament of Innocence) - The Damsel in Distress, but at least she helped in the storyline a little bit
Annette Renard (Rondo of Blood) - Another Damsel in Distress, not anything spectacular, just a reason to get the story in motion. Like MANY others.
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(not that one meets Ada 'til the end anyway... in fact, aside from her involvement as a plot device, she's about as useful as Lydie is)
well, that's not hard since lydie was basically ada 2.0 with a new look, straight down to the plot involvement and things that happen to her.
they're both kidnapped by the hero's friend and rival who's under the influence of dracula, they're both placed somewhere close to the end of the game, once the hero finds them death comes and steals them away, and then both are used by the final boss to power up. :o
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How could you vote for Germain. Look at that awesome top hat.
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Yeah I'm gonna have to throw my vote out to Saint Germain. Until he shows up as a useful character in a future CV game, I'm gonna say that IGA was hard-up for a supporting character. He really was kinda useless.
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The most awesome character to have a top hat is, in my opinion, Albert Simon from Shadow Hearts series. He kick serious ass. But as he's not a Castlevania character... St Germain looks like just plain silly..But if he was a bit more useful...
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The most awesome character to have a top hat is
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fantasticfiction.co.uk%2Fimages%2Fn14%2Fn70274.jpg&hash=eb08a6cb0213f35e390ab3df4505ffd5c73dff9d)
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The Count of St. Germain helps control the flow of time. Without his advice, Hector might've succumbed to the dark side. He could even be responsible for Aeon's existence.
It's been a couple of years since I played curse, plz excuse if my assumption isn't accurate :P
Also, he alludes to 1999. I'm sure we'll see him in a more active role in that game. prunyioouuu~
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In Reply To #15
I vote Mina.
She's nothing more than a cookie-cutter maiden in distress. She didn't even give Soma the talisman. I would've liked to have seen her become more important than just bait.
I almost voted Hammer, but his antics were too cute to ignore. ;D
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ST. F***IN GERMAIN!!!! hes so badass :P
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Hey at least we got a good, challenging fight against ol' Germaine. Also he has a good song :)
I'd say that's more useful than most of those damsels on the list.
But yeah story wise, he's entirely wasted.
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In Reply To #39
Well, them thar reasons are precisely why I did not cast my vote for St. Gee, seeing as I agree with you one hundred percent there on all yer fine points, Anty. His music was a real breath of fresh air on that whole grating soundtrack to be sure.
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Can I throw in a vote for all the villagers in Simon's Quest?
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In Reply To #41
Yes you can! Those bastards would often steer Simon in the wrong direction... sending him off on wild Graveyard Duck chases and promising him sex at midnight by the river, etc. etc...
**mutters incoherently**
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How could you vote for Germain. Look at that awesome top hat.
I am disgusted by the fact that people voted for St.Germain. I mean come on, he has the Immortal fragment which is used to get the Gatling gun! And he instills faith in Hector and later on reason to suspect Zead's motives.
Furthermore;
top hat.