Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: Dremn on October 27, 2010, 12:44:16 AM
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Eventually Konami will announce a Castlevania title for the 3DS. Tradition states that a handheld is given at least three Castlevania titles, so what would you guys like to see happen?
I personally want them to go back to traditional Castlevania, like the original games and ReBirth. I like the MetroidVanias but I'm tired of those being the main focus. Plus, if they ever do make the 1999 game I would hope Julius's game plays like all the other Belmont games, linear platformers with optional routes with difficulty and frustration.
That's just my two cents, what do you guys want to see Konami make?
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I'd like to see them cancel it for a console hd 2d game.
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I wouldn't mind if they tried to copy LoS a bit and have the game spread out over several chapters and stages along with optional backtracking. Also, they should have multiple playable characters and just built the entire game around that concept or something. And we all know that the 3D in IGA's new game will just be a gimmick that you will end up using a total of 1 times so I won't even bother trying to think of something.
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Eventually Konami will announce a Castlevania title for the 3DS. Tradition states that a handheld is given at least three Castlevania titles, so what would you guys like to see happen?
I personally want them to go back to traditional Castlevania, like the original games and ReBirth. I like the MetroidVanias but I'm tired of those being the main focus. Plus, if they ever do make the 1999 game I would hope Julius's game plays like all the other Belmont games, linear platformers with optional routes with difficulty and frustration.
That's just my two cents, what do you guys want to see Konami make?
Castlevania Chronicles: Dracula's Curse
or
I think it might be neat to see the 1999 game marry the best of both worlds. Classic Castlevania stages leading up to the castle --and Castleroid style inside the Castle. That would rock my world.
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Definitely 2D gameplay, but with elements shown in 3D, in front of the screen. I am sure it would look awesome.
I hope Michiru Yamane does some or all the music. I hope Ayami Kojima will paint the artwork. IGA should lead.
I don′t care if it is Metroid- or Classicvania. I love them both. Just don′t make a game with 3D gameplay. Yikes. 2D gameplay should stay at least on handhelds.
My suggestions are:
-1999 game
-Dracula`s curse remake
-another game with Soma..he can be the antagonist
-a different new game, like Ecclesia
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I gotta be honest;
I'm actually ready for another Metroidvania. This time, I want it to be like Ecclesia with the countryside and whatnot, BUT I want the stages to be connected like in Simon's Quest. No overworld map, no portraits - just one big world!
Also, I think the RPG elements need to change so that the game is more challenging. You should be able to increase your health and magic meters by picking up heart containers and stuff. NO MORE LEVELING UP. This way the game would be even more like Metroid but I think it's the right move.
Also, the strength and defense of the main character should be dependant on the weapons and armor the player picks up only. I guess accessories like gauntlets and bracelets are fine too.
THAT'S what I wanna see for the 3DS.
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A 3D game!....o wait.....Iga can't make 3D games
They better do CVIII chronicles......then again it would piss me off more than what they did with DXC, still no PS3 port.
I could honestly care less what Iga makes, I'll buy it and play it regardless but doesn't mean i have to like it.
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A remake of Simon's Quest with a new translation would be awesome, or a new classic style game. If they did remake SQ, they would need to keep the gameplay similar to what is already was, just up the difficulty. Adding too many elements from the later Metroidvanias would ruin the gameplay IMO.
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why does everyone here want a CVIII remake so bad, we all know you'll find more problems with it/what they should've done instead of enjoying it for what it is (*coughdxcrebirthcough*)
An original game with all-new playstyle will be the best option.
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why does everyone here want a CVIII remake so bad, we all know you'll find more problems with it/what they should've done instead of enjoying it for what it is (*coughdxcrebirthcough*)
An original game with all-new playstyle will be the best option.
I don't mean a rebirth title, I mean a chronicles remake which is one thing IGA knows how to do, and quite well.
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1. I wouldn't want to see IGA at the helm; he had a dozen chances already and I think he's really reached the top he can do with the formula he can do well (the Metroidvanias) while at the same time showing he's borderline disasterous at anything new.
I'd honestly take some new talent to the stage. Konami is bound to have young producers willing to prove themselves, and a 3DS title should be cheap enough to act as the stepping stone for such talent.
2. I wouldn't mind Michiru Yamane at the helm of the music, or just any of the old composers. I'd want some musical continuity in the sidescrolling titles (sidescrollers don't need nor support dramatic music). I'd love them to use the more powerful hardware to give us better sound-quality remixes of old tracks, and some catchy new stuff.
3. I'd definitely not want Kojima back for the artwork side of things; I really like her style - as long as it's not applied to Castlevania. I'd love a bold new direction for the artwork, in the vein of the many innovative 2D titles of the last years, or as something completely new, but it should definitely look DIFFERENT. Really different. Big sprites, quality backgrounds and all that. Fluid animation with tons of hand drawn sprites and the like.
In all honesty, I think the natural home of the next sidescrolling CV is XBLA/PSN; an HD CV title with a DS price tag (around 40$) in full 2D glory. A man can dream.
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A 2.5D classicvania would be sweet, but it will most likely be another metroidvania though.(I don't mind the metroidvania format but I want to see a return form of the classic style ala Adventure Rebirth)
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I really like her style - as long as it's not applied to Castlevania.
Excuse me, what? Her style fits perfectly with the games. Although I wouldn't mind seeing Masaki return
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Excuse me, what? Her style fits perfectly with the games. Although I wouldn't mind seeing Masaki return
I guess we just disagree on that. I really don't imagine the Castlevania characters in such an effeminated light.
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I don't really see the characters so "effeminated" so whatever. Her highly-detailed art is what helped make Castlevania relevant again.
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I gotta be honest;
I'm actually ready for another Metroidvania. This time, I want it to be like Ecclesia with the countryside and whatnot, BUT I want the stages to be connected like in Simon's Quest. No overworld map, no portraits - just one big world!
Also, I think the RPG elements need to change so that the game is more challenging. You should be able to increase your health and magic meters by picking up heart containers and stuff. NO MORE LEVELING UP. This way the game would be even more like Metroid but I think it's the right move.
Also, the strength and defense of the main character should be dependant on the weapons and armor the player picks up only. I guess accessories like gauntlets and bracelets are fine too.
THAT'S what I wanna see for the 3DS.
This.
or a Dracula's Curse remake would be great.
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I don't really see the characters so "effeminated" so whatever. Her highly-detailed art is what helped make Castlevania relevant again.
I don't know; I started playing CV in a time when I had to use my fantasy to imagine what those characters looked like, and her interpretation of what those characters look like is completely removed from my fantasy. It's an absolutely legitimate way to portray them, and she has real talent (her non-Castlevania work and expecially the non-character artwork material is beautiful), but her Simon isn't my Simon because her Simon is a muscleguy with a woman's head. Her character work is way too inspired to Riyoko Ikeda's work for my tastes - and it's a kind of artwork specifically targeted at girls for quite specific reasons.
I would be digressing here, but while I really respect her as an artist, I can't say she did much for CV in my eyes; in fact, due to the absolutely lackluster artwork talent behind most designs in the saga (LoS aside) she ended up giving it a personality that possibly condemned it to obscurity. I won't go as far as saying CV needed more dudebro to succeed, but Kojima is probably way too close to the other side of the spectrum. Nothing she did was mediocre (if anything, a bit derivative but that's understandable) but it didn't fit CV at all in my eyes.
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I have to agree. Her characters look like women when they're supposed to be men. From a historicle point of view, if such a man were to exsist in 'said time' in Romania, they would probably by lynched in some fasion or another. The fear that existed back in those days was astonomical! So while her art is unique and very detailed, it just doesn't suit the Castlevania atmopsphere very well; historicly and otherwise.
-X
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I don't really see the characters so "effeminated" so whatever. Her highly-detailed art is what helped make Castlevania relevant again.
i COMPLETELY agree dude.
so many people around here like to call her characters gay and stuff like that which ridiculous to me since IMO her artwork is beautifull and MUCH more detailed the the artrwork from Classic CVs.
but let me get ontopic lol.
my conditions for a CV game on 3ds it
1. graphics 2.5d
2.gameplay metroidvania
3.YAMANE ARTWORK! ;D
4.Story Battle of 1999
5.multiple characters to choose from.
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Well X, weren't you upset that there's not enough female lead characters in CV, & now the male characters we do have are too effeminate? Heheh
@Valtiel:
I started playing CV when CV was first released as well, & I didn't have any beef with any of the designs. When all that changed, I didn't have a problem with that either (excluding Judgment). I guess I'm one of those rare fans that likes pretty much everything CV has to offer, without letting any personal fantasies get in the way *shrug*
Had they made Gabriel with long curly white hair similar to the boxart, would you call that too effeminate as well?
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Well X, weren't you upset that there's not enough female lead characters in CV, & now the male characters we do have are too effeminate? Heheh
@Valtiel:
I started playing CV when CV was first released as well, & I didn't have any beef with any of the designs. When all that changed, I didn't have a problem with that either (excluding Judgment). I guess I'm one of those rare fans that likes pretty much everything CV has to offer, without letting any personal fantasies get in the way *shrug*
Had they made Gabriel with long curly white hair similar to the boxart, would you call that too effeminate as well?
I can agree with most of the things you say... but Order of Shadows? really? PoR was forgivable though it had many flaws, but games like Order of shadows and the like should not exist.
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"1. graphics 2.5d
2.gameplay metroidvania
3.YAMANE ARTWORK!
4.Story Battle of 1999
5.multiple characters to choose from."
yes
"Definitely 2D gameplay, but with elements shown in 3D, in front of the screen. I am sure it would look awesome.
I hope Michiru Yamane does some or all the music. I hope Ayami Kojima will paint the artwork. IGA should lead.
I don′t care if it is Metroid- or Classicvania. I love them both. Just don′t make a game with 3D gameplay. Yikes. 2D gameplay should stay at least on handhelds.
My suggestions are:
-1999 game
-Dracula`s curse remake
-another game with Soma..he can be the antagonist
-a different new game, like Ecclesia"
YES
"I think it might be neat to see the 1999 game marry the best of both worlds. Classic Castlevania stages leading up to the castle --and Castleroid style inside the Castle. That would rock my world."
YES!!!!
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"1. graphics 2.5d
2.gameplay metroidvania
3.YAMANE ARTWORK!
4.Story Battle of 1999
5.multiple characters to choose from."
yes
"Definitely 2D gameplay, but with elements shown in 3D, in front of the screen. I am sure it would look awesome.
I hope Michiru Yamane does some or all the music. I hope Ayami Kojima will paint the artwork. IGA should lead.
I don′t care if it is Metroid- or Classicvania. I love them both. Just don′t make a game with 3D gameplay. Yikes. 2D gameplay should stay at least on handhelds.
My suggestions are:
-1999 game
-Dracula`s curse remake
-another game with Soma..he can be the antagonist
-a different new game, like Ecclesia"
YES
"I think it might be neat to see the 1999 game marry the best of both worlds. Classic Castlevania stages leading up to the castle --and Castleroid style inside the Castle. That would rock my world."
YES!!!!
just woke up so i got Yamane confused with Ayami concerning the artwork so my bad lol.
although i'm glad you agree with my point of view ;D
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just woke up so i got Yamane confused with Ayami concerning the artwork so my bad lol.
although i'm glad you agree with my point of view ;D
I really like the idea of multiple characters to choose from in games. I also really want to see IGA's Alucard come back in a big way. Hopefully the 3DS will be good enough for his triumphant return. Although I'd really like to see him in a PS3/360 game.
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I really like the idea of multiple characters to choose from in games. I also really want to see IGA's Alucard come back in a big way. Hopefully the 3DS will be good enough for his triumphant return. Although I'd really like to see him in a PS3/360 game.
I don't think there is any room left in the time line for his "triumphant return". Solution: retcon all of iga's games from the "official time line" then we have plenty of room :D for new developers to make new CV games. Seems a little ridiculous don't you think?
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In Reply To #20,
I never played OoS so I can't judge that game :p
In fact they should port it to 3DS!! and the characters all should have dresses on with long white hair~
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I don't think there is any room left in the time line for his "triumphant return". Solution: retcon all of iga's games from the "official time line" then we have plenty of room :D for new developers to make new CV games. Seems a little ridiculous don't you think?
why isn't there any more time line left?
because YOU say so or because you don't want it to be since you love Cox's interpretation of Castlevania so so much lol
are do i need to remind you of the yet to be explained battle of 1999.
IGA still has a major opportunity to make a great game out of that battle
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I'd want the 1999 game. Iga as lead. Kojima as artist, and Yamane and another past composer to co-op the music. Similar to OoE, much of the game will take place outside with Julius and his team travelling to the castle...and the final stage will, of course, be the castle. The outside areas will be larger and more varied than OoE's though. It will have Julius mode style character switching and actual CG cut scenes rather than the sprite scenes we've been getting.
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why isn't there any more time line left?
because YOU say so or because you don't want it to be since you love Cox's interpretation of Castlevania so so much lol
are do i need to remind you of the yet to be explained battle of 1999.
IGA still has a major opportunity to make a great game out of that battle
You may want to read my post a little more carefully because I was being sarcastic about retconning Iga's games.
Sure we have the 1999 game (which I'm guessing is what you were referring to when you said "triumphant return"?) but other than that I don't see much room. Every time Iga produces a new game he adds more restrictions to the story arc making the next game seem less and less important to the series.
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You may want to read my post a little more carefully because I was being sarcastic about retconning Iga's games.
Sure we have the 1999 game (which I'm guessing is what you were referring to when you said "triumphant return"?) but other than that I don't see much room. Every time Iga produces a new game he adds more restrictions to the story arc making the next game seem less and less important to the series.
and you may want to read MY post more carefully since i never said he would make a "truimphant return".
i had a feeling you were being sarcastic yet i felt the need to post anyway since you appear to have a high dislike for Iga and his Castlevania titles
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Sure we have the 1999 game (which I'm guessing is what you were referring to when you said "triumphant return"?) but other than that I don't see much room.
There's a 300 year gap between Lament & CVIII..
382 years to be exact!
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I always wanted that time to be the time Dracula builds his power in the dark side of the world. I mean, he's jsut a vampire... doens't explain how he gets Galamoth, other vampires, werewolves and such under him. It would make sense that there wouldn't be a whole lot of news of evil in between because they are fighting among themselves, instigated by Dracula on his quest to rule.
That in itself could be an awesome game. I'd make a fan game on it but I lack skillz. :'(
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I'd want the 1999 game. Iga as lead. Kojima as artist, and Yamane and another past composer to co-op the music. Similar to OoE, much of the game will take place outside with Julius and his team travelling to the castle...and the final stage will, of course, be the castle. The outside areas will be larger and more varied than OoE's though. It will have Julius mode style character switching and actual CG cut scenes rather than the sprite scenes we've been getting.
This sounds pretty good.
------on a different note---------
Isn't there a lot of extra room in IGA's timeline still? Do we know all the details following SotN and before Ecclesia? Has there ever been an explanation for the disappearance of the Belmont's? It seems to me there are still a lot of gaps inbetween SotN and AoS.
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Make a Simon's Quest style game, set it in 1999, have it star Julius, and bring back Masaki Hirooka for the art design.
If there was anything I adored about Ecclesia, it was the art design. It was the perfect style for a "Castlevania" game.
It was the perfect balance of the darker, barbaric gothic of the older games and the elegant, supernatural gothic of the previous metroidvanias. When I was walking around the locals, despite the supernatural elements, all the locations felt very real. Dracula's castle seemed like a real castle, just full of supernatural things. The character designs were also spectacular. The outfits were well designed but still somewhat realistic, not only for the time period, but they just looked like something someone would actually wear. Dracula had the young immortal feel and yet still felt very old, dark, and evil, and I found the lack of visually effeminate men refreshing.
Sure, it's an art style, and I love most of Kojima's work, but in my opinion, men should look like men. I see no reason why all these men younger than immortal have the facial structure of a woman in her mid thirties. Simon is completely ripped, but apparently his neck has a testosterone seal on it because his head is completely androgynous. The only thing that balances out their feminine traits is the fact that the women are HYPER feminized.
Not to say I don't love the detail and elegance of Kojima's artwork, I just think Masaki fits Castlevania much better.
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I don't know exactly what I'd want from a 3DS 'vania outside of a pretty 2.5D game. There are many storylines I'd like to see elaborated on or finished.
I'd like a Legend of Dracula III with Soleil. ...yeah. Can't say much more there. Maybe have him fight Elizabeth Bathory/Bartley.
A sort of Castlevania retelling of the events in Bram Stoker's book would not only be cool but could be a variation on the party systems in Dracula's Curse or Dawn of Sorrow's Julius mode. The game could start with Quincey Morris and Van Helsing and those other guys pursuing Dracula into his rebuilding castle; put in a race against time to prevent Mina from succumbing to vampirism and you already have possibilities for multiple endings. Different characters would obviously have different abilities to explore and whatnot. I'm kind of surprised no other Castlevanias have tried this out.
Another idea would be a modern one that takes place after the Demon Castle Wars but before Aria. I imagine it'd focus a lot on the cult that wants a new Dracula replacement, and it could be a modern take on the original game's "movie monster" theme with... well... newer movies and books, maybe also some obscure Native American and South American folklore.
I was really keen on a World War II themed Castlevania after Bloodlines, but Portrait or Ruin took that idea and... did absolutely nothing with it. What a waste. Don't imagine it will be touched for a while.
As long as a 3DS one is 2.5D or 2D and not a mini-game clusterfuck like HD or Judgment, I'll buy it no questions asked. I'd like a 3D one, but after Lords of Shadow I'm absolutely convinced that no human being can make Castlevania 3D without majorly fucking up in at least one area, so...
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Make a Simon's Quest style game, set it in 1999, have it star Julius, and bring back Masaki Hirooka for the art design.
If there was anything I adored about Ecclesia, it was the art design. It was the perfect style for a "Castlevania" game.
It was the perfect balance of the darker, barbaric gothic of the older games and the elegant, supernatural gothic of the previous metroidvanias. When I was walking around the locals, despite the supernatural elements, all the locations felt very real. Dracula's castle seemed like a real castle, just full of supernatural things. The character designs were also spectacular. The outfits were well designed but still somewhat realistic, not only for the time period, but they just looked like something someone would actually wear. Dracula had the young immortal feel and yet still felt very old, dark, and evil, and I found the lack of visually effeminate men refreshing.
Sure, it's an art style, and I love most of Kojima's work, but in my opinion, men should look like men. I see no reason why all these men younger than immortal have the facial structure of a woman in her mid thirties. Simon is completely ripped, but apparently his neck has a testosterone seal on it because his head is completely androgynous. The only thing that balances out their feminine traits is the fact that the women are HYPER feminized.
Not to say I don't love the detail and elegance of Kojima's artwork, I just think Masaki fits Castlevania much better.
Spot on.
Ecclesia captured the Castlevania feel while sporting high quality artwork in a way, sadly, Kojima never did.
Appreciating Kojima's work is fine (I do too); saying that it's fitting for Castlevania is also a completely respectable opinion (I disagree, but nothing makes my opinion "right"); but saying that Yamane's interpretation of Simon Belmont (or Leon, or Alucard, or her long hair version of Richter) isn't effeminated is stretching it.
It's expecially baffling because when she exercises restraint in drawing the heroes as man and not dolls, some of the stuff is quite fitting. The Hector artwork was more than fine. I'd be fine with something along those lines, even if I think there's better options.
As for the curly Gabriel, I'd not be particularly fussed with issues of him looking effeminated (beard and features are anything but effeminated), but I'm persuaded he would look quite redicolous (much like Simon did in Chronicles). How would he get those beautiful curls in the middle of nowhere? My girlfriend has long, curly hairs. They require a lot of attention or else they flatten and lose volume and end up looking like little more than wavy hair. I like that piece of artwork, but I'm glad he doesn't look like that ingame.
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There's a 300 year gap between Lament & CVIII..
382 years to be exact!
That can't be used because Trevor was the first person to defeat Dracula chronologically. But side stories are always cool ;D
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Ayami's artwork is fine. I love how the general mood towards IGA changes every time a new game comes out. I have a blast with any Castlevania game he's made because I don't nitpick the hell out of them. Just face it: Castlevania is a goofy game series. Sure there are some serious moments, but for the most part, they are crazy. I sometimes wonder if we are all playing the same game series!
Anyway, just give me a new IGAvania and I'll be happy.
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Ayami's artwork is fine. I love how the general mood towards IGA changes every time a new game comes out. I have a blast with any Castlevania game he's made because I don't nitpick the hell out of them. Just face it: Castlevania is a goofy game series. Sure there are some serious moments, but for the most part, they are crazy. I sometimes wonder if we are all playing the same game series!
Anyway, just give me a new IGAvania and I'll be happy.
Well said. Welcome to the CVDungeon :)
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Well said. Welcome to the CVDungeon :)
Thanks, I registered a long time ago and just kind of lurked. Felt it was time to join the discussions. :)
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Where's my big welcome ;)
anyway...
Make a Simon's Quest style game, set it in 1999, have it star Julius, and bring back Masaki Hirooka for the art design.
If there was anything I adored about Ecclesia, it was the art design. It was the perfect style for a "Castlevania" game.
It was the perfect balance of the darker, barbaric gothic of the older games and the elegant, supernatural gothic of the previous metroidvanias. When I was walking around the locals, despite the supernatural elements, all the locations felt very real. Dracula's castle seemed like a real castle, just full of supernatural things. The character designs were also spectacular. The outfits were well designed but still somewhat realistic, not only for the time period, but they just looked like something someone would actually wear. Dracula had the young immortal feel and yet still felt very old, dark, and evil, and I found the lack of visually effeminate men refreshing.
Sure, it's an art style, and I love most of Kojima's work, but in my opinion, men should look like men. I see no reason why all these men younger than immortal have the facial structure of a woman in her mid thirties. Simon is completely ripped, but apparently his neck has a testosterone seal on it because his head is completely androgynous. The only thing that balances out their feminine traits is the fact that the women are HYPER feminized.
Not to say I don't love the detail and elegance of Kojima's artwork, I just think Masaki fits Castlevania much better.
I'm completely with you and the other guy about Ecclesias style. I loved the environments and the way the towns people looked. But does the character artist change that? I mean SotN and AoS to me were even darker. It wasn't til after those games with DoS and PoR where the artstyle became cartoony. Basically what I'm saying is that if Masaki drew Alucard. He'd still look like Alucard. If Masaki drew Soma he'd still look like Soma. Do the environments and overall game art have anything to do with the character designer? For the record I think Kojima and Masaki are both excellent character artists.
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If it's Metroidvania or Classic style I don't care, I just want it to be 2D gameplay. But, I want it to have new assets, totally new sprites. And when I say totally new, I say all of them.
Artstyle like Ecclesia or something similar/better. Multiple characters, one big world map, and memorable music.
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i thought aos was more of a bridge into the lighter forays on the ds. it really had this pastel feel to the palette, plus the introduction of a teenage protagonist like soma added this bit of quirkiness that was expanded (and butchered) on in the first two ds titles.
i like masaaki, but some of his villager faces are just misshapen. he has this very noticeable background on anime. of course, kojima has all her errors, but i personally find misshapen things more glaring than proportional errors, especially when we mostly just see bust shots in the games. im not sure if they actually affect the aesthetic of the game. dracula's throne art in ooe vastly differs from the throne in-game, and etc. environmental design seems separate from the character illustrators.
i'd personally like another game following the principles of ooe, with fast action, though i would also like much more exploration akin to sotn or hod.
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I was hoping for the 3ds version to have this kind of fluidity (I posted this once before)
Castlevania: Lords of Shadow - Abilities Sketch (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fc8mekIdsNo#)
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That's pretty sweet. Could be helpful if someone wanted to make fan sprites.
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Where's my big welcome ;)
anyway...
I'm completely with you and the other guy about Ecclesias style. I loved the environments and the way the towns people looked. But does the character artist change that? I mean SotN and AoS to me were even darker. It wasn't til after those games with DoS and PoR where the artstyle became cartoony. Basically what I'm saying is that if Masaki drew Alucard. He'd still look like Alucard. If Masaki drew Soma he'd still look like Soma. Do the environments and overall game art have anything to do with the character designer? For the record I think Kojima and Masaki are both excellent character artists.
They're not just character designers, they're art designers. They decide how EVERYTHING looks.
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I loved Masaki, his style is japanease yet elegant yet digerible. He's my favourite Cv (old saga) artist , yep, I like him more than Kojima (His designs aren auto-plagiarism thanks god)
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They're not just character designers, they're art designers. They decide how EVERYTHING looks.
Oh okay, in that case I think I like Kojima marginally better just because of the way the levels and monsters look. Masaki is a close second though.
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The problem is that IGA games had no art director. He recycles old sprites so the new artist only has influence over new monsters. That's why Ecclesia's bestiary is completely nonsensical, robots, Undertakers and buddhist gods? at the same time? zOMG :P
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That's pretty sweet. Could be helpful if someone wanted to make fan sprites.
Anyone wanna give that a try?
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i honestly think there are different artists for the backgrounds. all the concept art for cod, with the enemies, ids, and backgrounds were distinctly non-kojima in style. besides, knowing the way kojima does horror, the enemies in loi and cod would have been much more gruesome. iga also said he got the enemy designers for silent hill to do cod's enemies (which somehow didn't help at all uh).
also, the trend of using a wide range of mythological creatures has been set since sotn, and even a bit before that with the japanese rabbit demons in cviv and cviii, panzuzu, and etc, ahasverus.
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I undersnatdn that and it's one of the things that I like the most of CV, that i's almost universal, however, some later games really have disjointed esthethics between different types of enemies, because you know, 1991 designs are naturally very different to 2008's, an Ecclesia for example has enemies sprites from all that time frame.
Is that expensive to redraw an axe warrior?
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that's a completely different complaint from what you said earlier. i actually agree with how the aesthetics are disjointed. the problem is that the newer sprite artists aren't adapting to the preset styles, not that the styles are old. it's more like,
hey bro, maybe you should actually sprite in the same style
rather than
hey bro, you should redraw everything
though, i'd prefer the latter kinda. well kinda not, because the current artists kinda pale to the sotn and rondo sprite artists.
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i honestly think there are different artists for the backgrounds. all the concept art for cod, with the enemies, ids, and backgrounds were distinctly non-kojima in style. besides, knowing the way kojima does horror, the enemies in loi and cod would have been much more gruesome. iga also said he got the enemy designers for silent hill to do cod's enemies (which somehow didn't help at all uh).
also, the trend of using a wide range of mythological creatures has been set since sotn, and even a bit before that with the japanese rabbit demons in cviv and cviii, panzuzu, and etc, ahasverus.
There ARE different artists. This is a common known thing about video games. Character designers are just that, artists that design the characters. Ayami Kojima has NO part in designing how the backgrounds of IGA's CVs look, just like Tetsuya Nomura isn't responsible for the look of the towns in "his" Final Fantasy games. Hell, Nomura's not even responsible for the NCP art. In Final Fantasy, in particular, a lot of location art, NPC art and promo art(which is actually credited to Nomura) is done by Yusuke Naora. These companies HAVE designers that speicifically work on various aspects of the game. No one artist does EVERYTHING. You have people who design the monsters, people who design the weapons, people who design the look of the various locations, all are different.
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Ayami's artwork is fine. I love how the general mood towards IGA changes every time a new game comes out. I have a blast with any Castlevania game he's made because I don't nitpick the hell out of them. Just face it: Castlevania is a goofy game series. Sure there are some serious moments, but for the most part, they are crazy. I sometimes wonder if we are all playing the same game series!
Anyway, just give me a new IGAvania and I'll be happy.
The perception of IGA is shifting because the confusion surrounding him is so deep. A lot of people deem him responsible for SotN still.
I'm not sure I agree that CV is a goofy game series. I agree that IGA *turned* it into a goofy game series, for the better or the worse. In terms of atmosphere and storyline he did fundamentally two things: he took the goofy looks of the 8/16 bit era (that were probably rooted more in the consoles technical limitations than an actual artistic direction) and made it the canon of the series. He also took the "experimental" approach of Rondo and made CV a full fledged anime game (a dream he only fully realized with the Sorrow games and Judgement).
I think it's easy to see why the fanbase is so polarized about him. For one thing, CV is a fairly "stale" series. It's a good thing in many ways - we like that playstyle, and almost no other game delivers it, and basically no other game delivers it as well as CV does. It's also a playstyle that benefits from every minor upgrade - just look at how few differences Ecclesia introduced and how different it still felt - so for fans it's a more than appreciable situation. We like those games and we keep getting them.
On the other hand, we are constantly aware that we could get much better games. It's not just technical issues, even if seeing the series try to spearhead the 2D technology survivors instead of merely jogging along would be great. The saga rarely sees drastical improvements, and it's rarely evolving - every game is fundamentally the same with a new gimmic tacked on, and such gimmick is discarded in the next game. It's a formula that has little hope of ever growing. On the other hand, it looks like ALL the bad design decisions instead are there to stay, so we're permanently stuck with prehistorical level design and inconsistent design decision like the faulty level up system that removes all challenges from a saga that was historically known for being "hard"; and so on. It would be unfair to fault IGA for all this - expecially since despite all this the saga remained on very good quality levels on almost all installments - but to me the feeling I get when playing a CV is constantly that of not getting the great game I could be playing. The most memorable exception is OoE, but OoE is sort of like LoS - a game with ten thousands layers of awesome that almost make it look like another saga. I'd want something revolutionary yet familiar. LoS is possibly moving in the right direction, but it needs to iron a few things. Story is the first - it can't live on the premise that the story of the other games "suck". We want to be captivated, and LoS was too lightweight on lore and more importantly character building. I said it elsewhere - now we need a cast, recurring villains, legends. Something to fantasize about between a game and the other. A legacy.
But returning to IGA, I think the first reason we're polarized about him is his handling of the CV "lore". Like someone said, it's a goofy saga by now. It's become 3 parts Bleach 4 parts Pokemon with a slice of Gintama and some gothic seasoning on top. I can see why someone can like it, or even love it, but CV didn't start like that. I'll be honest to admit that to me Aria was the game that almost killed the saga. I wasn't against the timeframe (as I'm not against something like the ending of LoS hints at) but to me CV is gothic dark fantasy, not a generic anime show about teenager students awakening the power of evil within themselves. It really felt like throwing away the entire legacy and saying "screw this, let's see if we can make this popular with some anime bs".
So this very long rant (sorry ;D ) is just to say that I may be alone but while I'm still completely fine about the game part of IGA's entries, I'm firmly convinced he took the saga in a place where I don't really want to follow him. It's just too silly and juvenile now, and not what hooked me to the series in the first place. I'm one of those fans who's been clamoring for the 1999 game for years. After Aria, I don't want to see it anymore. LoS' secret ending gave me the 1999 game vibe IGA took from me, and I hope they'll eventually deliver that. But Judgement was the biggest chance to see the saga and its characters through IGA's eyes, and it definitely made me certain he's on a trail I don't want to follow.
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^well said my friend, well said. :)
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There ARE different artists. This is a common known thing about video games. Character designers are just that, artists that design the characters. Ayami Kojima has NO part in designing how the backgrounds of IGA's CVs look, just like Tetsuya Nomura isn't responsible for the look of the towns in "his" Final Fantasy games. Hell, Nomura's not even responsible for the NCP art. In Final Fantasy, in particular, a lot of location art, NPC art and promo art(which is actually credited to Nomura) is done by Yusuke Naora. These companies HAVE designers that speicifically work on various aspects of the game. No one artist does EVERYTHING. You have people who design the monsters, people who design the weapons, people who design the look of the various locations, all are different.
This is what I thought but I don't really know much about the video game industry and how it works. I know that I loved the way the backgrounds and monsters were done in Ecclesia. As far as character art goes I think Kojima and Masaki are both really talented. I think I'll still give the edge to Kojima though. Didn't she do the art in Harmony of Despair? The characters looked great in that and not overly feminine (See John and especially Julius). To me that's how it should be. Some of the characters should be more elegant (like alucard and soma) but then the Belmonts should always be manly. I liked Leon Belmont's design and Juste too but I don't think that is right for a Belmont.
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Some of the characters should be more elegant (like alucard and soma) but then the Belmonts should always be manly. I liked Leon Belmont's design and Juste too but I don't think that is right for a Belmont.
I see what you mean but I think there's room for manly Belmonts and then for more "delicate" ones. And female Belmonts and old Belmonts and all that.
It's very hard to actually gauge how much Kojima mattered in the end in the games, tho. I mean, ok, the covers. But look at SotN: does the Richter in the portraits have anything in common with the Richter sprite? Until they stick to handhelds and unless they finally pull out 2D art, the artist's influence is only really gonna show in portraits (as far as characters go). Considering Kojima is more or less fantastic at everything aside from faces, you can see how her talent was more or less wasted on the saga so far.
Either they give her the tools (ie HD) to let her stylistic approach transpire in the actual game (and that CV will look like NOTHING she worked on before) or she'll be stuck doing covers for games that end up being blocky, Genesis-era pixel messes that are full of happy-happy joy-joy colors. I guess it's my biggest beef with her artwork - I could look past the feminine gloss (expecially since she proved she can deliver masculine guys with Hector), but it's so completely disconnected from the actual game that it ends up feeling glued on. If IGA had the guts of letting her draw the characters, and monsters, and environment with a toolset and team that can re-create her style IN THE GAME, I'd be totally up for it.
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In Reply To Valtiel,
Wow, I guess you should work for Konami as senior advisor or something since you obviously know what's best for CV more than anyone else. About half your posts here have been nothing but criticizing the series, while saying ambiguous statements like "i think such n such is great but here's why it sucks."
The anime influences have been there since the beginning, while being enhanced in Rondo (It's a JAPANESE game series, after all, which was, uh, influenced by an anime called VAMPIRE HUNTER D). Yes, it was annoying with PoR, but that's about it. Do you see a Saturday-morning cartoon being syndicated on your TV station? It's really not that bad (but it's gotta be, since you're so fixated on it). Konami never whored out CV like Nintendo does with Pokemon. There's nothing really wrong with IGA's games, they are playable from beginning to end. Are there any outstanding glitches that make jumping impossible? Is the button layout "not castlevania enough?" Sure, there could be more platforming & new sprites here 'n there, but other than that they are exceptional games, aesthetics aside.
If you were to make a "this is what's wrong with CV" thread, you wouldn't be able to fit all your complaints in a single post amirite? The series has always been a goofy saga, from the random enemies to the ridiculous platforming (nothing more goofy than flying Medusa Heads in a CLOCK TOWER). I think this was said in the Metroid thread, something like
fan: this is what CASTLEVANIA IS & SHOULD BE!
Konami: lol nah this is what CV actually is.
I'm with you on how Konami should have the balls to launch CV in new areas, but what's the point in pointing out every single flaw the games have to offer? Does anybody here really lose any sleep at night due to these flaws? If so then you shouldn't be here in the first place.
I respect your opinion on CV. Everybody's entitled to one, but if the opinion is nothing but "castlevania isn't what it should be wahhhh" over & over, then.. maybe it's time to move on. and Ahasverus agreeing with you every sentence.
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I also can't stand the "iga using anime" complaint. I am not really a fan of anime, but I have no problem with it being used in the castlevania series occasionally. Rondo of blood is mostly referenced, but even look at the artwork in the original castlevania and simons quest japanese manual. Every nes game had badass box art but the real art is always in the manuals and the first two cv games both have anime-like art. I have the simon art from cv1 as my icon and if you look at it, he's not some huge babarian guy, he's got a small build.
This goes the same for the Kojima art, they don't look like huge buff warriors, and that's ok, cause the original simon doesn't always look that way either
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Ok, how the hell was Castlevania not goofy? It had references to old Hammer horror films. You play a barbarian with a whip that fights Dracula. I'm sorry, but that's a little cheesy. I LOVE that about Castlevania but you seem to want everything to be epic and deadly serious in your Castlevania. Why don't you and Ahasverus make your own game? I know that's one of the lamest things to throw at someone for ragging on a game but it seems to fit you two perfectly.
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I also can't stand the "iga using anime" complaint. I am not really a fan of anime, but I have no problem with it being used in the castlevania series occasionally. Rondo of blood is mostly referenced, but even look at the artwork in the original castlevania and simons quest japanese manual. Every nes game had badass box art but the real art is always in the manuals and the first two cv games both have anime-like art. I have the simon art from cv1 as my icon and if you look at it, he's not some huge babarian guy, he's got a small build.
This goes the same for the Kojima art, they don't look like huge buff warriors, and that's ok, cause the original simon doesn't always look that way either
I just want to say, that I'm not some huge anime scholar but I do watch some occasionally (movies at least, I can't get into shows). That said, it's always annoyed me at how people get so crazy about it and act like it's the plague. It's just animation made with Japanese principles. That's it. A JAPANESE developer putting JAPANESE animation in their game... wow, that's a stretch!
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In reply to Crisis,
Wow, I guess you should work for Konami as senior advisor or something since you obviously know what's best for CV more than anyone else. About half your posts here have been nothing but criticizing the series, while saying ambiguous statements like "i think such n such is great but here's why it sucks."
You seem to have a fairly narrow vision of what a fan is. Being a fan doesn't mean subscribing to what an author makes and considering everything he does perfect.
I started playing CV when it was born, as I'm NES/C64 gamer. I was a kid back then, and to me it was a fantastic gothic story with monsters and stuff and there was a dude with a whip and even if the gameplay sucked (it didn't, to be clear, but I'm making a point) I would have loved it because it was magic and I loved the concept. I grew up with these games and some I loved and some I didn't. I liked SotN but probably half as much as some other fans did. I loved CotM to bits and most other fans think it's derivative and an inferior clone. I had a crapaton of issues with LoI and still it's one of my favourite PS2 games. I hated CoD, instead. I think OoE is an incredibly, unbelievably amazing game and Portrait of Ruin is an actually very decent CV game and I hated the Sorrow games with a passion.
I like Castlevania. I like it a lot. Heck, outside of the Sorrow games (and CoD), I wouldn't say I disliked any CV game yet. I do however feel like the saga didn't deliver what it could. Time went by and we got the Resident Evils and the Devil May Crys and the Silent Hills and the Princess Crowns and the Odin Spheres and the Bayonettas and all that jazz. We saw videogames reinventing themselves 15 times over every year, and yet since SotN Castlevania has delivered the exact same game installment after installment. Don't misunderstand - I like that game. I keep dishing money to replay that game. My DS is a dust collector as I have basically no other game for it than the CVs. I love the series to bits, but I think some of the games are worse than they could be, and I think the saga as a whole has issues. If 10 years from now CV games still look and play the same I wonder if we will have a CV saga at all.
I don't have a very precise idea of you as a poster, but I seem to recall you being fairly critic about LoS. A lot of people (legitimately) said "I don't like where Cox is taking Castlevania" or "this isn't how Castlevania should be, in my opinion". I think it's completely normal. I have a similar approach with IGA. I think that after SotN he didn't have the guts or capability to stand by the things I liked in CV and instead he kept pushing things that had little to do with the saga or that were borrowed from other games (the Metroid design, leveling up etc). He managed to deliver mostly quality games; I just disagree with some of his decisions and I think he's taking the story in a disasterous direction.
The anime influences have been there since the beginning, while being enhanced in Rondo (It's a JAPANESE game series, after all, which was, uh, influenced by an anime called VAMPIRE HUNTER D). Yes, it was annoying with PoR, but that's about it.
I'd say Rondo was quite a huge departure for the saga; it's pointless to discuss it now, but while I really like Rondo as a game (it's one of my faves actually) *some* of the anime stuff I'd rather wish never happened. However, there's a misunderstanding here: I got nothing against CV staying closer to its japanese roots. In fact, I was extremely bothered about LoS being developed in Europe. CV *is* japanese and there are some things about it that LoS fails to capture (to summarize it as well as I can, CV despite being a gothic adventure is extremely, uhm, "energetic", and LoS is generally moody and depressing, a flaw that hit LoI too). I'm fine with anime drawings and jrock music and all. I just think Aria and Dawn went toward a very specific kind of anime subset that have bloody nothing to do with the saga.
There's nothing really wrong with IGA's games, they are playable from beginning to end. Are there any outstanding glitches that make jumping impossible? Is the button layout "not castlevania enough?" Sure, there could be more platforming & new sprites here 'n there, but other than that they are exceptional games, aesthetics aside.
Those are not the flaws I refer to. As I said, taken individually all these games range from good to excellent to absolutely and insanely fantastic. And I'm not one of those "they don't make them like they did anymore" guys. Some of the recent games are the best. OoE is a masterpiece.
However, once you look at them as a whole the problem arises. CotM is too much like SotN. PoR is too much like CotM. AoS is too much like PoR. And CotM. And SotN. This is what I refer to when I say things are "stale". People see the recycling of sprites as a sympthom of the lack of budget. I don't buy that. People is pushing out innovative 2D games every year on XBLA and PSn and handhelds with minimal budgets.
I don't know how long you've been playing CV. It's 20 years for me. Every release is a joy, but there's also this crawling feeling that yes, it's a SotN reskin. Again. Is that a problem? Not that much. I can still like the saga as it is. I will keep buying the games. But I'll keep seeing other sagas and other games daring new things and I'll keep wishing CV did that because CV is my favourite saga and I'd want to see the great ideas happen here.
I said it elsewhere. Sometimes it feels like the innovations that don't really work (see leveling - and I guess it could work, handled differently; heck, at this point I'm not sure I'd want to see it go, I'm so used to it) get attached to the saga but other things aren't tried. Why did we never get a CV game with combo-based, brawler like combat? Why didn't we ever get a CV that broke the room format and went full, consistent side scrolling? Why we never got a game that tried something new art-wise? Why we never got a game that tried making CV more fast paced, or one that made it slower? Heck, why we got a *fighting game* and we never got an RPG?
I understand a part of this is probably rooted to the fact that there's something like liking a series too much. I remember playing Vagrant Story and thinking "I wish this was a CV game". That's going too far, I guess. But as a fan, seeing other sagas I like grow and change (and fail and get back again) while in many ways I'm still playing SotN... every 2 years or so.
I don't think it's so absurd to want something new. And while I really liked LoS, I sort of want the japanese team came out with something like that, because they could have kept it closer to home.
I'm with you on how Konami should have the balls to launch CV in new areas, but what's the point in pointing out every single flaw the games have to offer? Does anybody here really lose any sleep at night due to these flaws? If so then you shouldn't be here in the first place.
Once again, it's a matter of perspective. The list of things I like about CV is about 3000 times longer than the list of things I don't. However the staleness is a VERY big, pressing, colossal, elephant-in-the-living-room issue. It's not a detail. And again... it's been 20 years. And now someone did something new with CV, and it's very good but also sensibly different, and I'm not entirely sure about how I feel about it because a part of me still wants that to happen within CV's original environment.
I love all CV games, but Aria and Dawn (Aria is actually quite good in the game side, if I could stand the story). Now those 2 I really dislike. Yes, I could write a book on how wrong those 2 games are. I may come out more negative about the saga than I really am because my basic assumption is that everyone here loves CV. But the issues are there and they're somewhat hard to ignore. Still it's a very exciting time because something is changing in the saga; I'm not referring to LoS only, but also to Castlevania HD. I don't particularly like CV HD as a product, but there's a very strong chance that it's a move to test the XBLA/PSN market and that market is the place that can give us some hope for another 2D console game. Let's hope the feedback at Konami is positive. And when things change, it's fairly natural to point out all the problems in order to see them solved. Look at the LoS feedback: it's almost entirely made of "I liked/loved LoS but..." followed by huge posts of criticism. It's natural. I don't jump on those posts because they're negative towards I game I love because *I* am often negative about the games I love.
I think the bigger problem may be that I got no faith anymore in IGA. I'll try to keep that for myself, since I know it's annoying to hear someone being negative about someone or something you appreciate, but that is that. I don't think he's the right man for CV anymore, and I doubt I'll change my mind.
I respect your opinion on CV. Everybody's entitled to one, but if the opinion is nothing but "castlevania isn't what it should be wahhhh" over & over, then.. maybe it's time to move on. and Ahasverus agreeing with you every sentence.
I understand your perspective, but I didn't say "CV isn't what it should be". I said "CV isn't what it could be". It's a sensibly difference; one thing is like saying "CV is a cat, but it should be an airplane!". The other is "CV is a cat, but it could be a tiger". I'm not saying "these game would be good if", I'm just saying these games could be even better.
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I also can't stand the "iga using anime" complaint. I am not really a fan of anime, but I have no problem with it being used in the castlevania series occasionally. Rondo of blood is mostly referenced, but even look at the artwork in the original castlevania and simons quest japanese manual. Every nes game had badass box art but the real art is always in the manuals and the first two cv games both have anime-like art. I have the simon art from cv1 as my icon and if you look at it, he's not some huge babarian guy, he's got a small build.
This goes the same for the Kojima art, they don't look like huge buff warriors, and that's ok, cause the original simon doesn't always look that way either
Castlevania had anime since Rondo, and it was fine. My comment on anime is tied to Aria and Dawn specifically, and it's not because of the art style. The story and character dynamics are the problems. The story turns from a goofy but cool take on Hammer movies and gothic horror to the most generic "schoolboy to the rescue" plot that every single anime that is popular right now has. CV is a japanese game. Anime cutscenes are absolutely perfect for it. But the Soma Cruz plotline is the eastern equivalent of dudebro-ing the saga.
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Ok, how the hell was Castlevania not goofy? It had references to old Hammer horror films. You play a barbarian with a whip that fights Dracula. I'm sorry, but that's a little cheesy. I LOVE that about Castlevania but you seem to want everything to be epic and deadly serious in your Castlevania. Why don't you and Ahasverus make your own game? I know that's one of the lamest things to throw at someone for ragging on a game but it seems to fit you two perfectly.
Once again, that's not the kind of cheesiness I'm referring too. There's the cheesiness of Rondo's scenes and the Frankenstein monster animations and then there's skeletons with vacuum cleaners and the like. But this would require a quite in-dept discussion, and I doubt we have the time or interest. In short, there's a difference between portraying something "serious" with a lighthearted style, and portraying something actually silly. Case in point, SotN: it's goofy, but it's not silly. The sillyness came after it.
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All the cheesiness in Castlevania has always been silly. Remember that the first four game or so were supposed to be a parody of classic horror films of some sorts. Every game has its own silly things and insight gags. Whetever is are the eyeballs from Adventure, monster name puns, or the maids from AoS, its all the same.
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i think he's okay with that nagumo. i think he's more bothered by stuff like jonathan and charlotte and yoko-obsessed hammer. and soma. and you know, how repetitive things have gotten. i'll have to disagree with how he finds the gba saga too similar to sotn and the others though. cotm and hod were especially quirky in how things were dealt.
then there's ooe, which is hopefully a sign of that trend breaking: ooe revamped the combat considerably. i mean, the only thing i would find ooe too similar to the other ds titles is movement and physics. beyond that, it has a distinctly different style of progression, principles on inventory, emphasis on weaknesses, enemy placement, etc. the differences between it and other recent vanias are as substantial as the differences between any classic game.
you can probably argue that any of the iterations after sotn have enough differences in gameplay to rival the differences in classic titles actually. i would say the feeling of sameness can be attributed to the lack of dramatic events within the environment. gimmicks and unique level design within stages and the like rather than actual gameplay systems.
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Oh yeah.
That applies to only two games though. Luckily its a thing of the past now. They probably had to put in that stuff in order to appeal to the audience they were targetting.
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In terms of a 3DS CV game, I'd want to see the 1999 battle. But I don't think that the MetroidVania styler of gameplay would fit the bill. It's afterall, the 1999 battle; the Demon Castle wars. It's in war time so it should be a traditional style of gameplay and not and RPG that will slow things down. In war time, everything happes so fast and so fiercely that the only way to properly reflect this is to make a fast-paced CV game and only a traditional level-by-level gameplay of CV's past (Cv 1, ,3, 4, Adventure 1 & 2, Bloodlines, Rondo, Dracula X) can deliver it.
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All this constant nitpicking about CV is starting to become an eyesore, so I'll just leave it at that. It's really getting monotonous.
Wasn't it confirmed that classic titles will be available for the 3DS? I wonder if Konami will release a compilation, or just 1 game at a time. A demo for CV1 was revealed already, but it's not likely they'll add anything else to tweak the gameplay. IGA confirmed he's been playing with a 3DS Development Kit, so I'm eager to see what he comes up with.. hopefully the 1999 game won't be a launch title (I'd rather the team get used to the hardware first, before making something epic like 1999 right off the bat)
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Love anime, but I much prefer the elegant look from Sotn... and PoR made anime + cv = nasty.
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The thing about PoR and even DoS was that the type of anime they used was based on modern style stock anime. It's really the more basic of basic anime styles out there. Maybe had they did something more darker and mature, it would've resonated with fans. The only reason IGA chose the "cliche style" was to try to get all those kids who like Pokemon and Yu-Gi-Oh! onto the bandwagon.
Though yeah, I didn't like the anime-styled stories either. The whole bit about, "She's got you under her finger..." or something in DoS had me rolling my eyes. That was like something you'd find in a shoujo toon. "Nyah! Onechan!!" ;D.
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The only reason IGA chose the "cliche style" was to try to get all those kids who like Pokemon and Yu-Gi-Oh! onto the bandwagon.
I honestly don't think IGA is to blame for that. My guess is Konami has a lot of demands and ideas and this was probably coming from someone higher than IGA. (I mean, a person with a higher position, but yeah - that person was probably high on something else too.. lol).
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Love anime, but I much prefer the elegant look from Sotn... and PoR made anime + cv = nasty.
SotN character designs definitely drew inspiration from anime though. I'm sure Vampire Hunter D has been influencing the art in the series since day one. I agree that the art in Dawn and Portrait was really bad though.
Once again, that's not the kind of cheesiness I'm referring too. There's the cheesiness of Rondo's scenes and the Frankenstein monster animations and then there's skeletons with vacuum cleaners and the like. But this would require a quite in-dept discussion, and I doubt we have the time or interest. In short, there's a difference between portraying something "serious" with a lighthearted style, and portraying something actually silly. Case in point, SotN: it's goofy, but it's not silly. The sillyness came after it.
First off, Symphony had enemies based on the Wizard of Oz! How is that not silly? And second, goofy and silly are synonyms, I don't understand what you are trying to say. Also, the reason Symphony still worked with its outrageous designs was that they still managed to fit them into their levels well, unlike those horrid maids vacuum cleaners ( who if I recall were vacuuming a cave in one room?). That wasn't just goofy, it was also a really bad idea. But many other monsters that were goofy were used by other teams. For instance, the skeleton acrobat character seems kind of ridiculous, but it still worked (and he was also in CotM). Mercury Steam introduced the Chupacabra, which also was silly (and annoying...). Also, haven't the maids been around since the early 90s? Really, what did IGA add that in and make the games more silly outside of the horrid story and characters in DoS and PoR (which he has regretted)?
I don't like IGAs recent direction with the series (DoS and especially PoR were bad), I don't even like OoE, but really he hasn't been anymore goofy than the previous Castlevania teams. In fact, DXC was significantly darker than the original Rondo, but still managed to capture that same goofy feeling at times and quickly switch back to being darker. If IGA made a new game with that sort of style, it would probably be perfect. It was significantly better than what Mercury Steam did. But I doubt IGA is going to do much better at this point, so I really just want a new team altogether to work on a 3DS castlevania. If Mercury steam isn't able to deliver in the sequel, Konami needs to find another studio.
Also, the original Castlevania was far more silly than you are admitting. Just watch the credits again.
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SotN character designs definitely drew inspiration from anime though. I'm sure Vampire Hunter D has been influencing the art in the series since day one. I agree that the art in Dawn and Portrait was really bad though.
Maybe, but I never really viewed it that way. As I've seen some other drawings that look similar while not having any thing related to anime.
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I honestly don't think IGA is to blame for that. My guess is Konami has a lot of demands and ideas and this was probably coming from someone higher than IGA. (I mean, a person with a higher position, but yeah - that person was probably high on something else too.. lol).
I'd say this is more than likely. I think IGA's been pulled in almost any direction by now; I have my issues with his direction but I'm sure he's having a terrible time in his position, and it's not his fault.
Harry, Wizard of Oz omages aren't silly - they're classy. I'm not sure we have the same definition of "silly" (I'm not a native english speaker so in case we don't, it's probably my fault). I don't see silly as the opposite of "serious". CV never was serious, and can never be. Heck, even LoS isn't "serious" (and the Chupacabra isn't the only thing to point at). Something can be goofy and creepy at the same time, like the Flea Men. Looking at something more realistic-looking, take the Marionettes from DMC. They were absolutely goofy, but still gothic and creepy and they didn't disrupt any "serious" moment that came after it. Vacuum cleaners and the like mean that any possible "epicness" in the story is gone. The illusion of disbelief is broken - it's just a game. It's Super Mario now.
I hope I made myself clear now.
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I'd say this is more than likely. I think IGA's been pulled in almost any direction by now; I have my issues with his direction but I'm sure he's having a terrible time in his position, and it's not his fault.
Harry, Wizard of Oz omages aren't silly - they're classy. I'm not sure we have the same definition of "silly" (I'm not a native english speaker so in case we don't, it's probably my fault). I don't see silly as the opposite of "serious". CV never was serious, and can never be. Heck, even LoS isn't "serious" (and the Chupacabra isn't the only thing to point at). Something can be goofy and creepy at the same time, like the Flea Men. Looking at something more realistic-looking, take the Marionettes from DMC. They were absolutely goofy, but still gothic and creepy and they didn't disrupt any "serious" moment that came after it. Vacuum cleaners and the like mean that any possible "epicness" in the story is gone. The illusion of disbelief is broken - it's just a game. It's Super Mario now.
I hope I made myself clear now.
But how is fighting a tin man classy? I understand the dislike of the vacuum cleaners (I agree with that), as its just to the point of being ridiculous, and I agree that Castlevania has never been serious, but IGAs game are just as silly as many previous games in the series. They always had a contrast between things which are what you would expect from a gothic themed game, and also still had fun characters and elements. For instance, in the KCEK game CV64, was drowning in dark atmosphere, but they still had skeletons on motorcycles. But that was fine, because in Castlevania less serious elements have always been used along side darker ones, which is one of the reasons why the series awesome. Sort of like in the original DMC, where you fight all of these monsters in a creepy castle, but Dante still has a bunch of cheesy one-liners (flock off feather face), and it still works.
What I'm trying to say is that IGA didn't really make the series any sillier than it already was. Yes, he made some really bad decisions about Dawn and Portrait, but overall he has tried to stay faithful (even if he has failed) to what the series has always been about. He just is a bad designer he keeps using clashing art styles and poor gimmicks with no intent on progressing, but he has always maintained that feeling of what is Castlevania. Even Portrait and Dawn, with their terrible stories and art, were able to maintain that feeling at times, even if the suspension of disbelief was broken at times (well, a lot of times), but that vast majority of IGAs work has been able to maintain that feeling.
Castlevania has never been about maintaining "epicness", it has always drawn many elements together, whether there cheesy or not, and making them work along side each other. A little anime style girl defeating the forces of darkness isn't any sillier than a barbarian eating meat he finds inside the walls of a castle. I disagree with you on Lords, I think they were trying to be serious. For instance, Cox and Mercury Steam seem to be too occupied with making it epic and adult (like the nudity, which was completely uncalled for), and the comical elements they had (like the chupacabra) seemed like an afterthought and weren't very endearing or charming. It was way to serious (which you said yourself, is something that Castlevania has never been), and it paid more homages to Metal Gear Solid and Portal than the series it was based on (name drops don't count). The game was just filled with grotesque, uninspired imagery and lacked any charm. The removal of some of the silly things the series originally had has made Castlevania lose a bit of its soul.
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But how is fighting a tin man classy? I understand the dislike of the vacuum cleaners (I agree with that), as its just to the point of being ridiculous, and I agree that Castlevania has never been serious, but IGAs game are just as silly as many previous games in the series. They always had a contrast between things which are what you would expect from a gothic themed game, and also still had fun characters and elements. For instance, in the KCEK game CV64, was drowning in dark atmosphere, but they still had skeletons on motorcycles. But that was fine, because in Castlevania serious elements have always been used along side darker ones, which is one of the reasons why the series awesome. Sort of like in the original DMC, where you fight all of these monsters in a creepy castle, but Dante still has a bunch of cheesy one-liners (flock off feather face), and it still works.
What I'm trying to say is that IGA didn't really make the series any sillier than it already was. Yes, he made some really bad decisions about Dawn and Portrait, but overall he has tried to stay faithful (even if he has failed) to what the series has always been about. He just is a bad designer he keeps using clashing art styles and poor gimmicks with no intent on progressing, but he has always maintained that feeling of what is Castlevania. Even Portrait and Dawn, with their terrible stories and art, were able to maintain that feeling at times, even if the suspension of disbelief was broken at times (well, a lot of times), but that vast majority of IGAs work has been able to maintain that feeling.
Castlevania has never been about maintaining "epicness", it has always drawn many elements together, whether there cheesy or not, and making them work along side each other. A little anime style girl defeating the forces of darkness isn't any sillier than a barbarian eating meat he finds inside the walls of a castle. I disagree with you on Lords, I think they were trying to be serious. For instance, Cox and Mercury Steam seem to be too occupied with making it epic and adult (like the nudity, which was completely uncalled for), and the comical elements they had (like the chupacabra) seemed like an afterthought and weren't very endearing or charming. It was way to serious (which you said yourself, is something that Castlevania has never been), and it paid more homages to Metal Gear Solid and Portal than the series it was based on (name drops don't count). The game was just filled with grotesque, uninspired imagery and lacked any charm. The removal of some of the silly things the series originally had has made Castlevania lose a bit of its soul.
Great post, but didn't Castlevania always have nudity? At least from SotN onward? I definately remember some bare chests.
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The japanese version of SOTN had a naked Succubus, other than that I think the nudity has been covered up untill LOS.
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@Harrycombs
You bring up a very good point however, after HoDiss is where IGA faltered. AoS is a great game no doubt but it was as much of a departure from CV as LoS is. The soul system, the plot (I can over look this), and even the final boss were just out there. The next 2 games were just like AoS, only with OoE did he regain what was lost. Although LoS is a little bit too epic and serious (it's still very somber, which is as much a part of CV as its parodies) that is how games are made nowadays. I'm up for a little compromise, the game does have to sell after all.
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The japanese version of SOTN had a naked Succubus, other than that I think the nudity has been covered up untill LOS.
Yeah those must have been the breasts I was thinking of lol.
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Well, there was nudity in the statues since CVIII, I believe. But it's really of little concern or subtly done, because nothing is really shown. In the case of LoS, it's just upfront and doesn't really make sense in the context. The design of the subweapon demon is pretty different from others and the pose of the female just makes it well, very upfront and noticeable, and the idea that Gabriel and Claudia use them is just hgfd.
That said, DoS Succubi were just odd. Completely nude, save for boots. Uh. Okay.
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So, do you guys think there really is another Castlevania in development as we speak? IGA must be doing something, but maybe he's working on other projects like he said in some interview a couple of months ago.. It would be really strange to go back to the timeline again though. Would Konami even allow it?
The next game from Mercury Steam (if there even is one) will most likely end up on PS3/XB360 (I think we can all agree on that with 99.9% certainty) and that will probably not be finished until early 2012 at best given the small team that was working on LoS... I don't think we'll be seeing anything new on the Wii, and definitely not on the PSP or the DS either. That leaves us with the 3DS as the only option...
Or maybe there's absolutely no new Castlevania in development whatsoever. Though we've been spoiled for the last 10 years with so many games it's hard to imagine there would suddenly be nothing. Or maybe we'll get another iPhone puzzle game while we wait for the LoS sequel, which in my opinion wouldn't really count..
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So, do you guys think there really is another Castlevania in development as we speak? IGA must be doing something, but maybe he's working on other projects like he said in some interview a couple of months ago.. It would be really strange to go back to the timeline again though. Would Konami even allow it?
The next game from Mercury Steam (if there even is one) will most likely end up on PS3/XB360 (I think we can all agree on that with 99.9% certainty) and that will probably not be finished until early 2012 at best given the small team that was working on LoS... I don't think we'll be seeing anything new on the Wii, and definitely not on the PSP or the DS either. That leaves us with the 3DS as the only option...
Or maybe there's absolutely no new Castlevania in development whatsoever. Though we've been spoiled for the last 10 years with so many games it's hard to imagine there would suddenly be nothing. Or maybe we'll get another iPhone puzzle game while we wait for the LoS sequel, which in my opinion wouldn't really count..
I really hope there is another Castlevania in the works. I know they won't stop the series entirely so it's really a decision of if it's going to be Iga or Cox that makes the next one. I'm personally hoping for an Igavania next and then maybe they will alternate. I don't think there will be another DS castlevania with the 3DS so close and we know IGA has been playing around with a 3DS Dev kit. I seem to remember him saying on his blog he wanted to do a PS3/360 game which would be a dream come true for me but I don't think it will happen now. Maybe maybe not.
I'll say this though, I don't think IGA's canon is dead yet.
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I really hope there is another Castlevania in the works. I know they won't stop the series entirely so it's really a decision of if it's going to be Iga or Cox that makes the next one. I'm personally hoping for an Igavania next and then maybe they will alternate. I don't think there will be another DS castlevania with the 3DS so close and we know IGA has been playing around with a 3DS Dev kit. I seem to remember him saying on his blog he wanted to do a PS3/360 game which would be a dream come true for me but I don't think it will happen now. Maybe maybe not.
I'll say this though, I don't think IGA's canon is dead yet.
I actually think that we'll be seeing someone new producing Castlevania in the near future too. Cox already said he would like to make one more game, and then pass the torch. Meanwhile, Igarashi has been at the helm for so long it's unlikely he'll be going on for much longer. I predict Cox making one more Castlevania, and IGA making maybe three more, tops. Maybe even less. There are many young, talented game developers entering the industry all the time, hopefully with some new and fresh ideas too. God knows what Castlevania will look like in 5 years..
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I would like to see The Castlevania Dungeon make the next Castlevania game.
Make it happen Konami!!
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I actually think that we'll be seeing someone new producing Castlevania in the near future too. Cox already said he would like to make one more game, and then pass the torch. Meanwhile, Igarashi has been at the helm for so long it's unlikely he'll be going on for much longer. I predict Cox making one more Castlevania, and IGA making maybe three more, tops. Maybe even less. There are many young, talented game developers entering the industry all the time, hopefully with some new and fresh ideas too. God knows what Castlevania will look like in 5 years..
I love it when someone comes and brings a lot of new fresh ideas to the table with a game. As much as I like IGA and his games I know they wont go on forever and I know someone's bound to come along and change the series. Who knows by how much, and I'm okay with that. My only concern is with the iconic characters (specifically Alucard) which I hope don't get altered too much. Other than that bring on the innovation.
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It was easier back in the day when no one knew nor cared about producers, composers and such. We just got new Castlevania games and played them, no questions asked.
At some point when I was really young I kinda thought Nintendo made ALL games btw, LOL!
"I play this game on my Nintendo console so it must be made by Nintendo. Nintendo is the best! They make games with plumbers, vampire hunters, little blue robots and even the ninja turtles!". ;D
I was a carefree child.
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Bring back the nudity! I like how SotN has it..both Succubus and naked statues. I hate how in DXC the werewolf has pants. That′s just ridiculous. He appears naked when you fight him and when he is defeated he gets panties?! Really??? That is my only problem with DXC, which I find perfect if it wasn′t for something like this. So, bring back the nudity!!!!
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I don't really care what they add in or make like I just want to play as a Belmont.
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It was easier back in the day when no one knew nor cared about producers, composers and such. We just got new Castlevania games and played them, no questions asked.
At some point when I was really young I kinda thought Nintendo made ALL games btw, LOL!
"I play this game on my Nintendo console so it must be made by Nintendo. Nintendo is the best! They make games with plumbers, vampire hunters, little blue robots and even the ninja turtles!". ;D
I was a carefree child.
When I was real little I didn't even know the games I was playing were Japanese. Then I grew up, played Japanese games on my consoles and western games on my PC, I loved both and still do. Now all I ever hear from my fellow gamers is about east vs. west. I don't like it but oh well.
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I would like to see The Castlevania Dungeon make the next Castlevania game.
Make it happen Konami!!
But would we be able to reach an agreement?
Personally, I'm unsure about what I want right now. I really, really liked LoS (it's a runner up for GOTG for me right now), but my fantasy is still an home console 2D HD Castlevania game. 1999 game. Full HD. Huge sprites, enourmous setpieces, colossal bosses and whatnot. Completely revamp the combat, keep it familiar for the traversing and "trash mobs" (CV needs to be fast) and throw in some design oddballs (combo system based on different weapons, dodge moves, heck, a PARRY manouver that works on bosses and all the magic you can think of).
I think they can keep CV on life support almost indefinitely with the handheld titles. Production cost is incredibly low, the userbase is massive and all that. However, if they want to "rebirth" the series, they need a full fledged title and while LoS is great, CV is still mostly 2D for me. My point being, they need to be bold with the next game. The PS360 equivalent of OoE, on steroids. The biggest 2D game ever or bust.
On the other hand, the anticipation for LoS' sequel is building on me. If Gabe is Dracula, that potentially opens up a lot of design freedom for the team. Yes, he won't be a boss, but that means they can use him as a connection to the CV lore and then build games that defy the serie's conventions. They could send him to victorian london (would make for such a great gothic setting) or digging in pyramids in Egipt and fighting ancient mummies or to India or Japan or almost anything you can think of. When he's a villain, you rarely stop thinking "how did Dracula spend eternity?", but imagine the possibilities.
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Where the hell did everyone read you will be layin AS Gabriel in 1999? I think's that's pretty much unlikely, I think Gab will be the bad one in the "present" MS game (Not that the NEXT one will set in modern days, more so considering that Simon and Alucard are confirmed to appear in next titles) even if it's the "wrong" bad guy according to the story.
Now, the 2Ds game, I'm hoping for a 2D MercurySteam game. I loved how combat was managed in the 2.5 D stages of LoS and mercuryEngine is capable of Holy shit graphics so I would love them to make a 2.5/2D game
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I would like to see The Castlevania Dungeon make the next Castlevania game.
Make it happen Konami!!
oh god no
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Where the hell did everyone read you will be layin AS Gabriel in 1999? I think's that's pretty much unlikely, I think Gab will be the bad one in the "present" MS game (Not that the NEXT one will set in modern days, more so considering that Simon and Alucard are confirmed to appear in next titles) even if it's the "wrong" bad guy according to the story.
Now, the 2Ds game, I'm hoping for a 2D MercurySteam game. I loved how combat was managed in the 2.5 D stages of LoS and mercuryEngine is capable of Holy shit graphics so I would love them to make a 2.5/2D game
YES PLZ. But please, keep the QTEs out.
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I would like to see The Castlevania Dungeon make the next Castlevania game.
Make it happen Konami!!
That would probably start World War III.
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I would like to see The Castlevania Dungeon make the next Castlevania game.
Make it happen Konami!!
NOPE
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I would rather MercurySteam stick to 3-d and stay the hell away from 2-d. They did well in 3-d, let's not give them a chance to mess up whatever credibility they gained from LoS.
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I would like to see The Castlevania Dungeon make the next Castlevania game.
Make it happen Konami!!
Why not? I think I'd be cool. we all know what we don't want to see in our games so this should be very easy to do. as everybody has their own likes for the series, everybody could do a game that fits with what they would like to see in a CV game rather then leaving it up to producers whom just can't get the message we're all sending.
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Where the hell did everyone read you will be layin AS Gabriel in 1999? I think's that's pretty much unlikely, I think Gab will be the bad one in the "present" MS game (Not that the NEXT one will set in modern days, more so considering that Simon and Alucard are confirmed to appear in next titles) even if it's the "wrong" bad guy according to the story.
Now, the 2Ds game, I'm hoping for a 2D MercurySteam game. I loved how combat was managed in the 2.5 D stages of LoS and mercuryEngine is capable of Holy shit graphics so I would love them to make a 2.5/2D game
Because the potential is huuuuuge. We got a taste of playing as Dracula with Soma, but he was sort of a puss and didn't really feel like a vampire.
Now, once again the dilemma is big. We could get more Mercury Steam games that follow the LoS 3D formula and give us Belmonts vs Dracula and all the awesome things we know - and I think nobody here would say "no" to that. It's what CV has been for 20 years, I guess some could say something new could be good, but in the end it would be the safest bet with the fans.
OR, they could play the next games with Gabe still being the star, and developing him as Dracula over the next few games, as a guy who heals drinking blood instead of using light magic and so on. It would feel sensibly different from the traditional Castlevania games, for sure, but I'm not sure it's a road unworthy of being explored.
I mean, I can totally imagine a game where you play as a Gabe on his path to becoming a vampire, where you can suck the blood of your enemies and briefly inherit their characteristics (drain a werewolf and become stronger and faster, or later on become capable of draining bloodless enemies and drain skeletons to grow a bone armor or medusa to fly around).
Heck, I'm sort of thinking of a CV game working more or less like the Assassin Creed games, with Dracula moving from Sofia to Paris to London and roamin the cities fighting other creatures of the night and feeding on the people. And doing all those sort of incredible things the "realistic" approach of most sandbox games don't let you do.
I can imagine Dracula sprinting over a rooftop before launching himself in a jump so high that he lands on one of Notre Dame's towers, smashing stones and letting debris falling on the ground. Or him fighting a summon demonic being in the middle of the London Bridge with terrified citizens running everywhere.
Yes yes I know, it's a wholly different game. It's somewhat of an heresy, but I'd be there day 1 anyways.
I think one potential advantage of still using Gabriel is that they can use a couple games to show him getting so cool and powerful and menacing and yes, even evil, that it builds up his character for the games where you're actually gonna try and bring him down as a Belmont. It worked wonders with Legacy of Kain. When you played as Kain, you knew you were gonna be the villain and when later you faced him, you could really think "he's the ruler of the Underworld and I really wouldn't want to fight him because I've seen what he's capable of".
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It'd be cool to see Castlevania Resurrection gets resurrected on the 3DS.
:D
I doubt it would happen though. :(
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OR, they could play the next games with Gabe still being the star, and developing him as Dracula over the next few games, as a guy who heals drinking blood instead of using light magic and so on. It would feel sensibly different from the traditional Castlevania games, for sure, but I'm not sure it's a road unworthy of being explored.
I mean, I can totally imagine a game where you play as a Gabe on his path to becoming a vampire, where you can suck the blood of your enemies and briefly inherit their characteristics (drain a werewolf and become stronger and faster, or later on become capable of draining bloodless enemies and drain skeletons to grow a bone armor or medusa to fly around).
A saga like that exists, and it's called Legacy of Kain. Oh, and is unbeatable BTW, no other videogame in history has/had/will have/ the kind of narrative cohesion that saga has, so CV would play in second place.
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A saga like that exists, and it's called Legacy of Kain. Oh, and is unbeatable BTW, no other videogame in history has/had/will have/ the kind of narrative cohesion that saga has, so CV would play in second place.
Mmh, I'm a huge LoK fan, but I don't think it's that unbeateable. It's a very hard challenge, to be sure, but it's definitely possible to compete with Legacy of Kain (the PS1-zelda clone) in terms of narrative (I still consider it as the best game in the saga, but it's so technically limited that a simple facelift would be a huge improvement) and the Raziel episodes are built on such an extreme premise (that the world is a shell of its former self) that none of the elements I'm speaking with (vampire interaction with mortals above all) was really touched.
It's be doable, in my opinion. Heck, I'd love to try to say the least ;D .
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I've always had this Idea about a Castlevania game Maybe the 3ds game should have you playing as Mathias/Dracula Soon after the events of Lament of innocence where he is learning how to master his new powers and taking out the Rival Vampire clans it can explain most of the origins of Dracula's powers as well as how he rose to power as the king of the night I Imagine there being a power vacuum amongst the Vampire nobility after Walter's death and Mathias not being fully accepted until he shows the other lords his power the gameplay can be like a classic metroidvania but with character upgrades like the ones in harmony of despair where player stats can only be increased by equipment and health/mp max ups (like previous games) without leveling up and it could use a variant of the Tactical soul system in the sorrow series but with the freedom and functionality of the glyph system in order of ecclesia
feel free to criticize so far I think my Idea isn't that great I just had to get it out there :P
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Great post, but didn't Castlevania always have nudity? At least from SotN onward? I definately remember some bare chests.
I don't mind nudity in statues or in the succubus, but the nudity in LoS was not tasteful at all. Why the hell were the faeries of all things nude? And that demon you summon was a terrible idea (they should have replaced it with Grand Cross).
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Personally I want 2.5D classic'vania with simple, but solid gameplay, with beatiful art, interesting levels and castle, that takes only 1/3 of the game.
What I expect is just another "metroidvania" clone, with 40% sprites lifted from previous games, taking place in a giant horribly designed empty castle, devoid of any idea or soul. Decent art (maybe) and nonessential storyline, overdriven with animeish elements. Oh, and the basic storyline must include elements from Circle of the Moon. Again. Just because.
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Personally I want 2.5D classic'vania with simple, but solid gameplay, with beatiful art, interesting levels and castle, that takes only 1/3 of the game.
What I expect is just another "metroidvania" clone, with 40% sprites lifted from previous games, taking place in a giant horribly designed empty castle, devoid of any idea or soul. Decent art (maybe) and nonessential storyline, overdriven with animeish elements. Oh, and the basic storyline must include elements from Circle of the Moon. Again. Just because.
I'd actually like a merger of the two for a change: Classictroid.
The initial play of the game will be stage based all the way to the end, but once you pass a stage, you could immediately go back and trek through areas you completed through a map(like castletroid map). To progress through the game, you HAVE to complete stage by stage, but after, the ones you've completed can be explored freely and seemlessly(I don't mean, like DXC, where you can re-do Stage 2, but if you are in Stage 3, you can go back through the door you've just entered, and freely, like SotN, just explore the previous ones, perhaps with no loadtime, as if Stage 1 and 2 have been combined into one explorable area connected via few doors. The castle won't be handled like a castletroid, either. But stages with a few alternate branches, leading up towards the keep(maybe like CV3). Of cource, I'd love 2.5D with nice art!!
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So you mean after I completed several levels they will be combined in one big area to explore?
Strange idea, to be honest.
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I don't mind nudity in statues or in the succubus, but the nudity in LoS was not tasteful at all. Why the hell were the faeries of all things nude? And that demon you summon was a terrible idea (they should have replaced it with Grand Cross).
Agreed. Im all for boobs but Lords of Shadow didn't seem to play the card at the right time.
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I don't mind nudity in statues or in the succubus, but the nudity in LoS was not tasteful at all. Why the hell were the faeries of all things nude? And that demon you summon was a terrible idea (they should have replaced it with Grand Cross).
I'm surprised the crystal wasn't affected by magic at all...
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Oh, and the basic storyline must include elements from Circle of the Moon. Again. Just because.
Which CoTM took from SoTN lol. I agree about wanting a CV with solid gameplay, art, and interesting levels though.
Also, what DragonSlayr seems to be describing is like a more evolved OoE, but I don't think it'll be all that great to force the player into staying in a stage. I think switching between linear and non-linear modes would disjoint the game too much. If they did that, I would hope that there's a visual/stage design reason for it, like certain events in it force you to progress but then after, it's no longer there, hinting that you can re-explore it in a non-linear fashion. That'd be neat, having a stage play differently from the first time you went through it. It'll also allow them to also use more classic level design during the first play maybe.
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DragonSlayr makes it sound like the later Mega Man games. You do a stage, but can revisit it to pick up what you might've missed the first time.
-X
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Which CoTM took from SoTN lol.
I think SOTN was different in that regard. After all Richter never appeared in this game as Alucard ally. So he didn't bertrayed Alucard, he didn't even know him.
Storyline about your ally bertraying you was used in the COTM first, though it could be loosely based on the SOTN idea, but I don't think so.
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You could say that Richter being a Belmont made Alucard feel betrayed enough. On the other hand, Hugh never really betrayed you in CoTM either. He was manipulated by Dracula. It's similar to Shaft's control of Richter. I don't think the added familiarity causes much difference. It's more like Hugh adopted the roles of both Richter and Maria, except he was jealous instead of uh, cheery.
Betrayal itself is such a common theme throughout all works of fiction; it's really just putting too much value on such a simple story like CoTM or SoTN to say that the others ripped elements from them. That said, it's still incredibly repetitive and bland and I rather them not use it again. So I am disagreeing with my old post, and saying that the titles did not rip off each other because by having such general guidelines, someone would be valid in saying that LoS is a rip off of CoTM and AoS which is just sdhfasdf.
i would only say that only hod is really close to cotm's style of betrayal anyway. arguably, hod's approach was much more interesting in its execution as well since it actually affected gameplay. well, i dont think either have a really strong story anyway.
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So I am disagreeing with my old post,
lol pwned!!!!!!1 XDD