Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: KaZudra on October 17, 2011, 07:51:45 AM
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Last time I played the DS games were about a year or two ago, Now that I have come back to the with me new 3DS, I have updated my opinions on them.
Gameplay
DoS- Pretty Fun, but too easy. Julius mode cranked up the challenge a bit, but still too easy.
PoR- from being my least favorite to my most favorite of the DS games, this has a great balance of difficulty and doesn't really give you the over powered stuff early, Questing doesn't give that grinding feel, hell, I only had to grind to max out a couple subweapons, otherwise this game is great.
Though Nest of Evil is where the Recycle-fest is recycling bosses from other games shamelessly.
OoE - now my second favorite, but unlike PoR, once you get the Over-powered stuff, you're untouchable.
its okay, but not as amazing as I though it was...
Story
DoS - Tried to be the most story driven of the 3, but lacks in fleshing out the characters in parts.
PoR - Starting on a fumble this game actually tells the story really well, the characters are pretty fleshed out.
OoE - Still tops in story, characters are fully fleshed out and the ending this hits the right key.
What's better in the 3ds mode?
well, the 3ds gives the true-motion effect to the DS games making the framerates oh so great!
Plus the smoothed upscale is great as it leaves the original quality of the games but takes away the jagged edges and things like that.
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It's bit of the reverse for me. I like OoE the most, followed by PoR and DoS. I thought OoE was vaguely SCIV-ish, in how it felt to progress from wandering Transylvania before finally getting to Dracula's castle. Plus it has Malak's Labyrinth, which is one of my favorite areas in any of the CV games. On the other hand, it suffers from overusing Shanoa's theme in some of the areas, a la CotM's rendition of Sinking Old Sanctuary.
I don't think PoR is as bad as some people have made it out to be recently. I do agree that you become far too overpowered by the end, especially for Jonathan. On the other hand I don't like the protagonists (but Brauner is one of the better villains we've ever had.) And I don't like the Dark Portraits, except for the Dark Academy.
DoS is good, but it never jived with me like the other two. I just think Aria was the better game. DoS has some very intriguing graphics, however, especially the single bent tree in the background when you find the giant composer cricket dude whose name escapes me at the moment.
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I think OoE is the DS winner. Weve established IGA sucks at writing sequels- but is great at original plots.
Gameplay however, hes usually always good at making. The story problem lies in this. the fact that he likes to create the gameplay before the story. And always tries to create some unique gameplay type for each game, and mold the story to that.
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DoS is good, but it never jived with me like the other two. I just think Aria was the better game. DoS has some very intriguing graphics, however, especially the single bent tree in the background when you find the giant composer cricket dude whose name escapes me at the moment.
It's Abaddon. You're welcome.
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OoE has my vote for best also.
I actually like the comparisons to SCIV and CV2.
I like being able to explore the countryside of Transylvania before getting the Dracula's castle. It really did make it still feel like a mertroidvania while also giving us classic elements.
And I really do not see how you could possible think POR is more difficult than OOE.
OOE difficulty in my honest opinion was much higher than POR.
infact, I actually had a less difficult time beating POR than I did beating DOS.
OOE actually made the MP go done whenever you used a weapon which also gave the game's already challenging bosses a bigger advantage which really did up the difficulty.
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It's Abaddon. You're welcome.
But I didn't even thank you for it. So I refuse your information and your love.
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#1 OoE - Best atmosphere and artwork by far. Dark and eerie like a Castlevania game should be. The town and quests gave it a more epic feel. Great level design. A lot of diverse areas. Dracula had a great design. Albus wins an award for best supporting actor.
#2 DoS - Massive game. Big castle. My favorite gameplay of the three. Lots of cool secondary characters added to the plot. Dracula, Alucard and the latest Belmont as well as a Belnades. The most recent game in the timeline.
#3 - PoR - Johnathan was a cool character and a whip user. Too much like a sidestory. Dracula was forced.
I liked all three a lot but OoE is the direction I would like the series to head in.
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OoE has my vote for best also.
I actually like the comparisons to SCIV and CV2.
I like being able to explore the countryside of Transylvania before getting the Dracula's castle. It really did make it still feel like a mertroidvania while also giving us classic elements.
And I really do not see how you could possible think POR is more difficult than OOE.
OOE difficulty in my honest opinion was much higher than POR.
infact, I actually had a less difficult time beating POR than I did beating DOS.
OOE actually made the MP go done whenever you used a weapon which also gave the game's already challenging bosses a bigger advantage which really did up the difficulty.
OoE is Harder, but you can get screen Wiper powers pretty early, thus not keeping the even ratio of PoR
OoE is alson undoubtedly the best of the 3, I'm just loving PoR this time around.
Ironically, I kinda Dis-like DoS even though alot of new material was made for it, It just failed to make a good atmosphere and overall too easy, Easier than SoTN when you use the secret elevator early.
#1 OoE - Best atmosphere and artwork by far. Dark and eerie like a Castlevania game should be. The town and quests gave it a more epic feel. Great level design. A lot of diverse areas. Dracula had a great design. Albus wins an award for best supporting actor.
#2 DoS - Massive game. Big castle. My favorite gameplay of the three. Lots of cool secondary characters added to the plot. Dracula, Alucard and the latest Belmont as well as a Belnades. The most recent game in the timeline.
#3 - PoR - Johnathan was a cool character and a whip user. Too much like a sidestory. Dracula was forced.
I liked all three a lot but OoE is the direction I would like the series to head in.
I'm gonna agree with em all, PoR was better off without a Draciula side-plot, but on the contrary, how else could you get Dreath/Dracula Tag team?
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I think OoE is the DS winner. Weve established IGA sucks at writing sequels- but is great at original plots.
Gameplay however, hes usually always good at making. The story problem lies in this. the fact that he likes to create the gameplay before the story. And always tries to create some unique gameplay type for each game, and mold the story to that.
This has been said time and time again on this forum. It's also the primary reason people bash IGA (I, too, am guilty of this). If these were stand alone games like the Final Fantasy series, there wouldn't be this problem. Each Final Fantasy game has its own individual storyline (with a few exceptions) and that seems to work. Maybe the Castlevania team should adopt that style of stand alone games (they would probably get a lot less flack doing things that way).
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OoE >>>>> DoS > PoR
Always has been, always will be.
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But I didn't even thank you for it. So I refuse your information and your love.
Derp. :P
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DoS is my favourite. I think it's a fantastic game, except maybe the low difficulty level. But that's a problem in all Metroidvanias, except maybe CotM. DoS a very addictive game to me, but in retrospect some of the level design is a bit ho-hum, especially the tower of sinners. Still, it's a very classy and fun game IMO.
After that it's a toss-up between OoE and PoR. I think both games failed in terms of level design. Also, both PoR and OoE recycled graphics and entire rooms like no other Metroidvania before them.
OoE is actually the worst offender in my opinion. Compare, say, the clock tower in PoR and OoE and see what I mean. PoR had a great classic clock tower! On the other hand, OoE seemed like a more interesting game overall with a much better story. It's also a little bit more challenging. By no means is OoE a hard game, but it has its moments. I slaughtered the final boss though. I had a much harder time with the finale in both PoR and DoS.
Meanwhile, PoR has the stronger soundtrack and some memorable moments, like being chased in the beginning of the game, or trying to stop a goddamn train! Also, the Brauner battle is surprisingly original and fun. Charlotte didn't add anything to the gameplay though. I only ever used her when I had to, which was like three or four times throughout the entire game.
I think all three DS games are some of the best 2D action games on the system. This is just me nitpicking.
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the giant composer cricket dude
Kojima-san drew an excellent rendition of Abaddon, don't ya think?
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv119%2Fc0mbat%2Funtitled-2.jpg&hash=2ae206ce821d4c7da649e767a5877bc5f4e5ea48)
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No, that's Kamen Rider. Definitely Kamen Rider.
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@ Crisis + thernz - Yep, that totally looks like from the humanoid Kamen Rider from the 80's i think.
The Greatest Five attack is really awesome, and added bonus cause you have to do all the quests to become overpowered.
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god damnit
cvdf owns me once again
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Haha, revisited? I've yet to buy or play any of them. Not worth my time. Maybe I should finally force myself to play the second two on GBA sometime. Maybe the next time I get sick and am stuck in bed with nothing better to do.
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No, that's Kamen Rider. Definitely Kamen Rider.
Nah, looks more like Xion the Unborn from Bloody Roar if he were Egyptian XD
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Haha, revisited? I've yet to buy or play any of them. Not worth my time. Maybe I should finally force myself to play the second two on GBA sometime. Maybe the next time I get sick and am stuck in bed with nothing better to do.
Well, if you already know they're not worth your time I don't see why you would wanna put yourself through that. It's uncool enough being sick, y'know.
Anyway, this topic made me want a new Metroidvania. Cause they're awesome. Even the bad ones. I'm thinking about picking up Aliens: Infestation which is supposed to play a little like that.
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At the very least, the first two DS games aren't that good. HEH.
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#2 DoS - Massive game. Big castle. My favorite gameplay of the three. Lots of cool secondary characters added to the plot. Dracula, Alucard and the latest Belmont as well as a Belnades. The most recent game in the timeline.
Except those "new characters" were already all present in Aria of Sorrow. The only NEW characters in Dawn of Sorrow were shallow, badly written, and terribly terribly cliche and generic. it was like the 3 stooges, and the plot was ridiculous. Aria presented us with this idea that Dracula Re-incarnated upon his final defeat at the hands of Julius into a normal Human boy. One who once he realizes his true nature wants nothing to do with becoming Dracula, and manages to defeat the flow of chaos within the castle, not only defeating the castle itself, but the very essence that made Dracula Dracula.
Then DoS shits all over what was potentially a great way for the series itself to end, by introducing this huge replica castle, and reveals that after Dracula's death apparently his powers scattered into different newborns, creating some people with supernatural powers. therefore, Soma is no longer unique, his only saving grace as it were, being that he actually harbors the Soul of Dracula and Power of Dominance that comes with it. and so theres these "Dark Lord" candidates now. Because somehow Dracula = Satan or something, and is REQUIRED in order for some bullshit about God being absolute good only when theres an absolute Evil. (which again apparently Dracula is) I dunno bout you, but back before DOS, Dracula was well, just Dracula. it wasn't about absolute evil vs absolute good, it was about a Vampire with anger directing issues deciding to wipe out all of humanity for his Wife's death, all the while being thwarted every generation by the descendants of the man who was once his friend, who pledged his family to hunt him down forever when he was betrayed.
DoS instead tries to take those two arrogant "Dark lord candidates", because apparently, simply having a portion of power that came from Dracula makes you a likely candidate to replace him. It also brought back the power of chaos from like, out of NOWHERE, and it all ends as you'd expect, with it all blowing up in the villains' faces.
I feel that DoS' plot could have been good. When you look at the base idea of someone trying to usurp the void left by Dracula's absence, it sounds like a cool plot. But the way DoS did that, was terrible. I mean, having someone like Olrox, or fuck, even someone like Graham, take over Dracula's "Empire" as it were, would be pretty neat. In fact, having a Human absorb dark powers and/or/souls and shit to become this dark overlord, or even become a vampire, would be pretty cool. I mean, hey, Graham got them powers he was packin' somehow right? But not a cliche trio consisting of the hot headed brawler, the clever smart guy, ad the token witch with the evil cackle who makes some stereotypical villain banter, then cackles as she teleports out trying to have two guys who inherited minuscule insignificant portions of a vampire lord's power trying to see which one of them can replace him...
On that note, I STILL have no idea how the negating of Alucard's powers is supposed to work.
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I'm amazed that anyone cares about the plot in Castlevania games at all. It's basically nonexistent. Just shows how far the series has fallen when people have to look toward the paper thin plots to try to find entertainment.
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You shut your hooker-mouth, Tina!
;D
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I'm amazed that anyone cares about the plot in Castlevania games at all. It's basically nonexistent. Just shows how far the series has fallen when people have to look toward the paper thin plots to try to find entertainment.
Castlevania has had plot ever since Symphony. Even Rondo had more story to it than it's predecessors. It had cutscenes to it.
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Yeah, anime fan service of no substance and Dracula's massive lopsided shoulders with his mouth flapping open and shut saying something generically evil.
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Y-yeah, Rondo doesn't really have a plot. It doesn't really follow any sort of narrative structure. Richter just goes to places and ends up whipping Dracula dead in the face. They're just trials without story-significant substance. But I'm okay with that. At the very least, in Castlevanias with story, they're mostly usually kept to short cutscenes, so they don't dig into the flow.
I'm fine with not knowing more about the Belmonts. I don't need to know about their birthplace or diet. I'm killing Dracula and they have no correspondence with that.
of course then there's lords of shadow with redundant drawn-out narration, a barrage of cutscenes, and walls of text that think the highest form of comedy is referential internet/videogame humor. i like my shit lean like cv1.
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Except those "new characters" were already all present in Aria of Sorrow. The only NEW characters in Dawn of Sorrow were shallow, badly written, and terribly terribly cliche and generic. it was like the 3 stooges, and the plot was ridiculous. Aria presented us with this idea that Dracula Re-incarnated upon his final defeat at the hands of Julius into a normal Human boy. One who once he realizes his true nature wants nothing to do with becoming Dracula, and manages to defeat the flow of chaos within the castle, not only defeating the castle itself, but the very essence that made Dracula Dracula.
Then DoS shits all over what was potentially a great way for the series itself to end, by introducing this huge replica castle, and reveals that after Dracula's death apparently his powers scattered into different newborns, creating some people with supernatural powers. therefore, Soma is no longer unique, his only saving grace as it were, being that he actually harbors the Soul of Dracula and Power of Dominance that comes with it. and so theres these "Dark Lord" candidates now. Because somehow Dracula = Satan or something, and is REQUIRED in order for some bullshit about God being absolute good only when theres an absolute Evil. (which again apparently Dracula is) I dunno bout you, but back before DOS, Dracula was well, just Dracula. it wasn't about absolute evil vs absolute good, it was about a Vampire with anger directing issues deciding to wipe out all of humanity for his Wife's death, all the while being thwarted every generation by the descendants of the man who was once his friend, who pledged his family to hunt him down forever when he was betrayed.
DoS instead tries to take those two arrogant "Dark lord candidates", because apparently, simply having a portion of power that came from Dracula makes you a likely candidate to replace him. It also brought back the power of chaos from like, out of NOWHERE, and it all ends as you'd expect, with it all blowing up in the villains' faces.
I feel that DoS' plot could have been good. When you look at the base idea of someone trying to usurp the void left by Dracula's absence, it sounds like a cool plot. But the way DoS did that, was terrible. I mean, having someone like Olrox, or fuck, even someone like Graham, take over Dracula's "Empire" as it were, would be pretty neat. In fact, having a Human absorb dark powers and/or/souls and shit to become this dark overlord, or even become a vampire, would be pretty cool. I mean, hey, Graham got them powers he was packin' somehow right? But not a cliche trio consisting of the hot headed brawler, the clever smart guy, ad the token witch with the evil cackle who makes some stereotypical villain banter, then cackles as she teleports out trying to have two guys who inherited minuscule insignificant portions of a vampire lord's power trying to see which one of them can replace him...
On that note, I STILL have no idea how the negating of Alucard's powers is supposed to work.
I completely agree with Flame. He/She (I don't know which Flame is) really hit the nail on the head. Though I have one correction: Soma didn't destroy Chaos in AoS. He just severed it from the castle and himself, thus destroying the castle and preventing him from becoming what he was in his previous life.
Like Flame, I believe that DoS had potential. Actually, we didn't need Soma anymore. It could have just been someone seeking the chaos with Julius, Yoko, and Alucard trying to stop him or her. It could have been one of Dracula's former underlings like Olrox. Look at the novel that came out in Japan. From the little I know about it, that is exactly what is happening. Now then, from a story stand point (which some of you don't care about) which seems better?
Again, the sucky story is in large part a result of the way IGA does things (gameplay and battle system first. story second), which is not a good way to approach things like this.
And, like Flame, I never understood how the "reversing the flow of Alucard's powers" worked. My guess is that it's just a copout way of making it so that Soma has to end things instead. Alucard should have been able to end things alone.
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I'm pretty sure the male icon under my avatar should make it obvious what gender I am.
Personally id kind of like Soma becoming a monster/vampire hunter. I mean come on, how cool is that. The reincarnation of Dracula hunting down vampires? besides, its pretty obvious by now that no matter what Julius or Alucard do, they wont stop him from getting involved in that shit.
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I agree about the poor plot in Castlevania. And I prefer DoS over AoS because it's basically AoS done right in terms of gameplay, even if the story "shits all over AoS". The story in AoS wasn't even that great to begin with so it all boils down to this: Which game is more fun to play? DoS, IMO. They're both fab, but DoS wins. Fatality.
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I actually thought DoS made the gameplay worse with its "improvements". I think the only things I preferred in DoS were the bosses and the Lost Village, though I would always prefer Chaos before the snooze of a boss Menace.
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I'm pretty sure the male icon under my avatar should make it obvious what gender I am.
Personally id kind of like Soma becoming a monster/vampire hunter. I mean come on, how cool is that. The reincarnation of Dracula hunting down vampires? besides, its pretty obvious by now that no matter what Julius or Alucard do, they wont stop him from getting involved in that shit.
Sorry about that. I forgot we have our gender icons under our avatars. I do also like the idea of Soma becoming a monster/vampire hunter. And, your right. Somehow, Soma will always get dragged into these situations whether he wants to be involved or not. It seems that in the CV universe, if you have supernatural powers, you will be dragged in regardless of what you want. Julius, Yoko, and Alucard should have taken the time to train Soma after the events of AoS. This way he learns to protect himself and they can keep a close eye on him at the same time. Besides, Julius is getting old and won't be able to help out for much longer. Plus, I like the irony. He goes from being one of humanity's greatest (if not the greatest) enemies and reincarnates to be one of its greatest defenders. It would be like a Belmont and Alucard in one person. That could be really epic.
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I agree about the poor plot in Castlevania. And I prefer DoS over AoS because it's basically AoS done right in terms of gameplay, even if the story "shits all over AoS". The story in AoS wasn't even that great to begin with so it all boils down to this: Which game is more fun to play? DoS, IMO. They're both fab, but DoS wins. Fatality.
AoS' gameplay had nothing wrong with it. In fact, I preferred most of it's souls. They just seemed better. <3 killer mantle
I DID find the succubus sol in DoS amusing, how it made soma take a bite out of an enemy in front of him, but it was hardly practical.
Also, the ability to only be able to get certain weapons by giving up unique irreplaceable boss souls, seems more like a downgrade to me.
DoS was fun, but felt more empty. it didnt have the same charm Aria had. At all. The music was also not as great, even though it was good in it's own right. And lets not forget that it nerfed Julius. I mean, im not xpecting him to be on the same broken level as Aria, but really, He just seemed so watered down. No omni Vanitas, no super jump, and his Holy Cross just didnt look as cool. Alucard got hit with he bat too.
Aria was the superior Sorrow game. In Atmosphere, writing/story, music, and I daresay gameplay. All Dawn really added was the weapon synth, and it involved trading off boss souls or grinding for one specific soul, which got boring really fast, since it could take a long ass time. It also switched around and changed certain soul abilities. Some for the worse. The seal system was also highly unnecessary, and Menace was a shitty final boss. He was only hard because of those godammned things he spews which take huge chunks of health out of you.
Aria also had a few continuity nods here and there, (Olrox's clothes, DRACULA'S Clothes, the Alucard save coffin in the save room background)
Even Yahtzee liked Aria, citing it as one of the "stallions" of the series, along with Symphony.
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Yeah, leveling souls and weapon synthesis just made the grind aspect more apparent. The weapon synthesis also downplayed the exploration aspect of the game, and it showed in the level design. And by tuning down the exploration, they did nothing to replace that. The combat was pretty much like AoS, but slower. Sure, there were new weapon types and special attacks, but they didn't really add much depth if any at all. Any depth added to Castlevania came wtih OoE. AoS's level design was much more tighter too. DoS just felt amorphous at times, like with the Wizardry Lab and Garden of Madness.
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I never did get the hate for the Wizardry Lab. It was one of my favorite areas in DoS.
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But I still had more fun with DoS. So it's superior to me. Except maybe the soundtrack which was ten times better in Aria. And the story but that doesn't count since the story is barely tolerable in any Castlevania. Both games are great though. Aria is 8.5 out of 10, while Dawn is a 9.0. But that's just me (literally, it seems).
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I would both hold them more or less at the same height since they are both great games, but id give Aria the 9.0, and Dawn the 8.5
I hear hour point on story, but I would stay Aria is one of the more "story important" games, since it's story is pretty crucial. (revolves around Dracula's ultimate demise and fate) And if a game is to have a story, it should be a good story. I think you can agree on that no? And since both have them, it has to be considered when judging.
Aria's story is much better written and thought out than Dawn's, which really just feels like a needless sequel to a game that would have probably worked best as a stand alone title.
Badly writtn, characters are cliche and shallow, and the overall air just seems almost... campy... (especially around Soma, who's character feels just plain off)
gameplay was like Aria, but the additions felt somewhat needless, and only served to make the grinding aspect of gathering souls more apparent than it should be. it also caused the level design to suffer a bit, since there was not as much exploration. the music was not as good, and some of the bosses were a bit lackluster. The final one in particular being shrouded in artificial difficulty (Menace was only ever difficult due to those OP things he spawns. DEATH was legit difficult)
I have to give credit though- Gergoth was a really cool boss battle, and Julius mode was just too much fun- the addition of Bloody tears and The beginning was great too. but otherwise, it just feels weaker as a game. not that its bad, just that it feels forced.
And I dont remember where I was going with this.
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Dawn introduced great boss battles; Gergoth, Abaddon.. Menace should've took up both screens, t'would have been pretty epic right thernz?
What I loved about DoS was the little details, like seeing Soma's breath, jumping on cars, sitting in chairs. Seriously I wish Jonathan & Shanoa could sit in chairs too.
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sure, if the boss was adequately designed around that increased playing field.
DoS was great with the small details it had, and it actually attempted to incorporate some pretty nifty secrets. I loved those secrets more than any of AoS's. Eh, I can't really remember AoS's anyway. DoS was more daring in some ways too. Gergoth being the biggest example. It also had those breakable walls that you needed specific souls with, and etc. They were okay ideas, but I didn't really care for them.
They probably only included chairs because of their intent to add Alucard, heh. And then they didn't even bother to let Julius or Yoko sit.
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AoS was much better than DoS in pretty much every category accept graphics and sound. DoS was a good game but had too much forced grinding and some of lamest villains in Castlevania history. AoS had a cool plot with a very interesting mystery vibe and Graham was way better than the 3 stooges.
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One thing I loved about Dawn was the room in the guest house with all the female monsters in the same room.
Heh.
But then again, Aria had the Succubus and Lilith having a bath together.
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With a fucking RUBBER DUCKY floating in the middle.
Seriously, how clever is that?
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Very.
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Let me go off topic for a bit:
Peolpe didn't like the Wizardry Lab!? That was my favorite area in the castle next to the Pinnacle plus it had a catchy tune to boot.
On topic:
DoS: I liked DoS but as everyone has pointed out already, the plot was not very good and the game was a little too easy (but then again so were all the Metroidvania's aside from COTM and OoE) but I did like the soundtrack and Julius mode was the best part of the game for me.
PoR: All I'll say about PoR is that the soundtrack was amazing and I did like the final battle, everything else was just....ehhhh alright *does the so so hand gesture*
OoE: Now this one I liked more than the other two, the music, the art style, the gameplay, the difficulty(im a bit of a masochist) and the story wasn't half bad, especially compaired to DoS and PoR.
Overall for me OoE>>>>DoS>>PoR
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Julius Mode is really what saves DoS. Fighting Soma at the end is an awesome nod to the Promise made between Julius and Soma, and the battle is pretty cool.
I dont really like the wizardry lab music much, other than that its just meeeeh to me. Tower of Sinners or Condemned tower whatever its called, is my favorite area.
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Personally, Demon Castle Pinacle is my favorite song in DoS, but I'm Still WORLDS dissapointed in the soundtrack since the fucking trailer had that shit with full Instruments and not the Midi.
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Julius Mode is really what saves DoS. Fighting Soma at the end is an awesome nod to the Promise made between Julius and Soma, and the battle is pretty cool.
I dont really like the wizardry lab music much, other than that its just meeeeh to me. Tower of Sinners or Condemned tower whatever its called, is my favorite area.
I loved the Wizardry Lab music. But its name does not at all match the mood conveyed. "Dracula's Tears"? Seriously?
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I consider DoS' Bloody tears to be one of the best BT's.