Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: Jorge D. Fuentes on May 28, 2012, 11:26:34 AM
-
Hi! I've been looking at the latest threads and I've been wondering: What do the fans consider to be the very best ideas that the Castlevania series has had?
We can probably place these in 'ideas good at the time of conception', 'ideas that are always good', or something.
I will start with my own list, and you guys can add to it, or debate whether my ideas are good after all (I'm putting 'em 'cuz I think they're pretty good). :D
Ideas that are always good:
-SubWeapons use a separate button, rather than UP+Attack.
This allow you more control, as you can fire them while crouching. Used in Bloodlines, Super CV4, and CV64/LoD.
-Branching Pathways
This gives you a more vast castle and adds an exploration element. I'd prefer if the branching pathways took you to separate stages altogether, but it's also nice when you can tackle the stage itself through another part of it. Used in Castlevania III (to an extent), Rondo of Blood, Castlevania Bloodlines, Metroidvania stages, Rebirth.
-Multiple Characters, that team up
This is probably one of the better ideas, and one of the reasons Castlevania III is very popular. Having a team of people of which you can choose and switch someone is great, especially when they have varying abilities (or even varying subweapons). It is a tried and true good idea, in my opinion. Used in Castlevania III and Dawn of Sorrow (Julius Mode) and Portrait of Ruin.
My favorite method in this idea is when you can switch between them, not necessarily when a character follows another, so I'd prefer something like CVIII or DoS rather than PoR.
-Multiple Characters in Single Mode, with relevant plot
This was done in Castlevania Bloodlines and Rondo of Blood, and came back with CV64/LoD and Sisters Mode PoR, and Julius Mode DoS. I'm fond of playing the game as another character, but I'm not fond of the game just throwing that character into the game with no plot at all (I'm looking at you, SotN, HoD, LoI, CoD). If you're gonna put in a playable character, give them some story if the game uses story. Don't just plaster them into the game. It just seems like an afterthought at times.
-------
Ideas that were good at the time (they may not be so great at other times, but at the time were a welcome addition):
-Sprawling Map, Metroidvania Style
After Super Metroid, when Symphony of the Night came out, this was a welcome change to the franchise. However, it has been so used (and possibly misused) that now it's just an expected thing. Though I generally like it, it was a welcome change to see the "Hub" setup (like in LoI), or how they did with Ecclesia and added stages to a map, etc.
Ideally, I'd like how Simon's Quest did it. You have multiple connecting mapped areas but you also have monster 'lairs' (like the Mansions) that have their own stage. However, everything is connected.
-An Array of Weaponry
Once Symphony of the Night added RPG elements, the sheer amounts of weapons, armor, shields, helmets, and accessories became a staple of the series. While for an Action RPG this is generally a great idea, I don't think it needs to be so vast of an idea for CV titles. I think this appeals more to the people who like to loot and plunder, or to the people that like to grind for the best items... it's OK but I don't think it's a necessary thing for Castlevania to have.
Anything you guys wanna add?
Do you think Summons (SotN, CotM) were awesome and should return?
Did you enjoy climbing on a boss to reach its weakpoint (Eligor from OoE, the Titans from LoS?)
Maybe you enjoyed Devil Forging?
Try and categorize your ideas if possible.
-
One of my favorite features was actually the soul system in the Soma games. HOWEVER, I realize that the idea was exhausted in two games already and I don't see the need for it to return. And yes - there were probably too many souls that nobody ever used. Anyway, for completionist like myself, it was fun to collect the all. I'll put this in the "worked well for its time".
Another thing that may seem insignificant to some, but to me helped making Castlevania stand out, was the stair climbing. It makes the gameplay pretty different from other action games. You can use stairs to your advantage while climbing, say, a clock tower. Because you can't get knocked back while climbing it. Sometimes however, the stairs would make you take unnecessary damage because you couldn't outrun a medusa head or something. I wish it would return someday. It added strategy and personality to the gameplay.
-
I enjoyed CoD's forging system a lot. Combined to the Steal system, it was very cool. I hope to see that again.
-
teh whip
-
The Tactical Soul System was pure genius --not only for how it affected the gameplay, but how it was seamlessly implemented in the storyline as well. None of the other Castlevania systems like spell fusion, DSS, Innocent Devils, etc, ever came close IMO.
-
Soma's soul system was awesome !
-
Too bad you can only use the Tactical Soul System in a Soma game, so it's an idea that worked at the time but may not work all of the time.
-
3D
In the second try.
-
I liked how you could switch characters on the fly without pause when you only have one character out in PoR. Of course, I had hoped that was also the case when you had both characters out, kinda ruins the game's pace when there's pause between character switching. Then again I never liked having a character follow you either.
Oh, and being able to call the partner for an assist attack was a welcome addition too. If these two little things were combined with a DoS Julius Mode-styled game where you can have multiple partners while also adding a function so you can switch in any order then I'd be happy as an oyster.
...Or was it a clam? I forgot.
-
i enjoy combining stuff myself. combining cards in CotM, Spellbook and Subweapons in HoD, Orbs and Subweapons in LoI, different types of glyphs in OoE. even subweapons and light/dark magic in LoS. gimme more of that.
-
Hmm... combining stuff, huh?
How about Weapon Synthesis, from Dawn of Sorrow, then?
-
I think that's closer to CoD's forging system, 'cept you can't do it on the fly.
-
The combo/fighting system from LoS.
It really feels like a more fleshed out version of Lament's system, since Lament was the one that first dabbled in combo moves. But I feel LoS pulls it off better. They are in many cases, more fun to use and not as clunky, since the whip swinging itself is a bit faster and not as slow as in LoI.
I REALLY loved pulling off chainsaws and such. And certain moves and abilities changing depending on Light or Dark Magic usage was real neat. Daggers with dark magic become fire bolts, Fairies with Light magic become suicide bursts, double jumping itself became an attack with Light magic equipped, firing off rays of Light that stunned enemies.
I dug the combat and comboality of LoS. Especially since you couldnt just hack'nslash your way past enemies, and actually had to think a bit or you WOULD be punished for that train of thought, thus making the combo moves much more useful and strategic to use.
Another neat thing I liked, and this is somewhat related- is the Light and Dark Magic system. first off, I liked that they didnt implement some kind of morality system behind it like most games do with light/dark gimmicks, but just separated them into two categories.
Light is defensive while dark is offensive. Dark magic boosts your attack power, and light magic heals you with every hit you give. It definitely added not only a bit more survivability in cases where you were overwhelmed, but again, adds a bit of strategy, having you alternate between light and dark magic to deal some extra damage, and then heal yourself from the hits you take.
-
At the moment the item crash. It looks cool and it does a bit of damage, but holy hell is it op in sotn hydro storm/ holycross anyone?
-
Hydrostorm, like, 2 hits Dracula in the prologue.
-
Hydrostorm, like, 2 hits Dracula in the prologue.
No this cannot be!!! Argggh picture burns into Flame.
-
I actually wish the prologue of sotn was a 1-1 replica of rondo's finale, no extra moves on richter, dracula not a push over either, but the dialog is still classic :p
3D: it worked, but most games were plagued with terra bad camera controls,
2.5D: It was a solid idea, but limiting it to a PSP was the worst idea, it could have been done ona home console in higher res, or HD.
-
3D
In the second try.
Yeah, Legacy of Darkness deserves more acknowledgment.
-
I think he means Lament/Curse.
Legacy of Darkness is still part of the first try.
I think thats what 2nd try was referring to anyway.
-
Combos are a great idea. I'm a bit sick of one-hit attacks.
-
Combos are a great idea. I'm a bit sick of one-hit attacks.
I like a good combo every now and then, but I don't like when it means enemies have too much health. Parts of LoS (and other similar games too for that matter) felt like mini-boss after mini-boss. I want a clearer distinction between regular enemies and bosses. But other than that, combos are fun and look cool.
But I wouldn't mind a game with one-hit attacks, where the challenge lies in the actual level design, not only how much health an enemy have and/or how they dodge/block your attacks. I do however believe that one-hits are a thing of the past. Though I guess we'll see how Mirror of Fate handles this.
-
I think he means Lament/Curse.
Legacy of Darkness is still part of the first try.
I think thats what 2nd try was referring to anyway.
Yeah, Lament of Innocence deserves more acknowledgment.
-
No one mentioned the sub-weapon modifying crystals in LoI? I LOVED that part of the game. You kill a boss, it drops a crystal. You equip the crystal and now all of your subweapons have different attacks then before. So which subweapon you used didn't depend so much on the subweapon, but now depending on the crystal equipped as well. Daggers might still be weak but now you can toss out a bunch of them. Want a boomerang axe? Use a crystal!
But I loathed the item use setup for LoI. If you wanted to use a potion you had to cycle through the menu while the battle was still going. Or there was some aspect I overlooked and would appreciate someone telling me how to get around that.
-
I think he means Lament/Curse.
Legacy of Darkness is still part of the first try.
I think thats what 2nd try was referring to anyway.
Nope, I meant Legacy of Darkness :P
I love that game, guve it framerate and actual physics and it's arguably the best 3D entry of the series, IMO
(Well, for its time)
-
No one mentioned the sub-weapon modifying crystals in LoI? I LOVED that part of the game. You kill a boss, it drops a crystal. You equip the crystal and now all of your subweapons have different attacks then before. So which subweapon you used didn't depend so much on the subweapon, but now depending on the crystal equipped as well. Daggers might still be weak but now you can toss out a bunch of them. Want a boomerang axe? Use a crystal!
But I loathed the item use setup for LoI. If you wanted to use a potion you had to cycle through the menu while the battle was still going. Or there was some aspect I overlooked and would appreciate someone telling me how to get around that.
yeah, LoI's crystal system was good.
I liked it all the more better because it was an explanation for the orbs that bosses drop. Which was amusing.
-
Nope, I meant Legacy of Darkness :P
I love that game, guve it framerate and actual physics and it's arguably the best 3D entry of the series, IMO
(Well, for its time)
(http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/000/681/what-you-did-there-i-see-it.thumbnail.jpg)
-
another acknowlagment is music, the series has constantly evolved, in terms og gameplay, graphics and music, but what I missed most in Lord of Shadows was the familiar themes, the game only had a small limited sound track compared to others, but looked visually stunning, so im my opinion music has to be a very important thing, idea wise it can make or break certain games
-
No one mentioned the sub-weapon modifying crystals in LoI? I LOVED that part of the game. You kill a boss, it drops a crystal. You equip the crystal and now all of your subweapons have different attacks then before. So which subweapon you used didn't depend so much on the subweapon, but now depending on the crystal equipped as well. Daggers might still be weak but now you can toss out a bunch of them. Want a boomerang axe? Use a crystal!
But I loathed the item use setup for LoI. If you wanted to use a potion you had to cycle through the menu while the battle was still going. Or there was some aspect I overlooked and would appreciate someone telling me how to get around that.
I mentioned it as one of the "combining stuff" systems. I really liked how you could flick the controller in a direction to change crystals without having to pause the game and enter an inventory. Liked how in HD, you could do the same thing with spellbooks. Did hate using a real-time menu though, that was way more annoying than useful. If they ever got around to making a Belmonts Revenge Rebirth, my dream system would be to obtain an orb or spellbook or whatever after defeating a boss that had the same element as the castle it was defending, which you could then combine with your sub-weapon and/or whip.
Another system I thought was a leap forward was Soma's Doppelganger soul and Shanoa's glyph sleeves. But I liked Harmony of Despair's "assign four sub-weapons to a button" system the best.
-
What is the #1 game of all time? Legend of Zelda: OOT. That's not my opinion either, although it is one of my favorites. If I was creating a game, I wouldn't rip off its design, but it would be beneficial to ask, what are the elements of this game and why do they work?
Character Development (your character gets older, changes gear)
MUSIC
Plenty of Items
Large Overworld
Side Questing
Memorable characters with their own stories (Malon, Saria)
Touching, slowly progressing story.
LOS had side characters, but their stories were all totally intertwined in your own. They existed in the game solely to serve a purpose to your story.
And I say !@$# Combos. What really grinds my gears about LOS is that Gabriel is a MFin super hero, and the enemies are just as strong to balance, and all just to be flashy and keep the attention spans of today's youth.
-
vkiller86,
Did you respond to the wrong thread?
Just stick to what works, not what doesn't. No 'rants' on this thread.
Hopefully the lurkers from Konami (we know you're here) can see this thread and see what we think worked.
Hopefully.
-
Sorry for being off topic, I just mean numbers don't lie, these things clearly work in Zelda games, they worked in CV games, and I hope Konami continues to use them.
-
-Item Crash
-Subweapon + Orbs (only from LoI) damn i had a good time and had fun a lot with the combinations
-Extra uses of the VK (swinging, climbing and the getoverhere!)
-Insta-death traps
-quote ur idea of personal paths for characters (Legacy of Darkness)
-What if... (Dawn of Sorrow, evil Soma path)
-More vampires (the main boss is Dracula, why only few games has more than 1 vampire? SotN, LoD, OoE, LoS)
-Monsterpedia <3 (a must have)
-NPC interact
-Human bosses (the typical rivals, Soleiyu, Doppelgangers, Richter, Hugh, etc)
-
- references to horror cinema
- references to mythology
- references to history
- scripted encounters (RoB behemoth, death stealing your gear in SotN)
- Whip upgrades
- Unexpected/hidden branching paths (RoB)
- Costume Change (SotN)
- Character transformation (Sotn)
- quirkiness (Sotn Wizard of Oz references, Schmoo)
-
Pretty much everything listed above ^
Schmoo! :D
Also: DSS cards (CotM); I myself love combination/fusion aspects.
-
It's the atmosphere and story on top of the excellent gameplay that drives me to play Castlevanias. But I think a list of things that didn't work would be shorter for me, since the series has way more hits than misses. With solid challenging level design in most of the classics and rewarding metroidvania exploration later.