Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: Belmont Stakes on June 11, 2012, 11:28:27 PM
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I am gonna post this despite the AVGN's and Egoraptor's rant on this game and anyone else who pisses, moans and drinks
Rolling Rock. Please forgive me for beating a dead horse or vampire or whatever but that is why we play these games so we can do those things.
With that let's get started with how this game got the shit end of the stick.
1. Multi directional scrolling
In SCVIV second level this works, in CVII it doesn't. Why? Because the Super NES is a better system for one but CVII doesn't have any points where it reverts to straight up to down or left to right scrolling. The diagonal scrolling slows the game down. Check out Bionic Commando. That game gets it right. Also I noticed that in this game screens only load graphics when you exit an area on the left or the right but not if you go up or down stairs (similar to ladders in NG3's case). I don't get that. It takes away from the feel of the game I think. If you fall down a pit in CV or DC you die but Simon's Quest you die only if there is water, spikes below or if you land on an enemy when having low health but you have to wait five hours before you land. Again
slow down.
2. Too many players on the field. If you look at the CV and CVIII this doesn't happen. You can have four zombies and a bat
coming to suck your whatever and give you putrification and herpes. Yet there is no slow down. In contrast CVII has this issue.
Let's think about the disappearing monster trick. If you are in the first game and you out pace a zombie and it ends up out
of the screen it doesn't come back. If you are walking in a CVII town and you see a zombie flash on the edge of the screen
it's coming after you and after four of them there is slow down. The fact that there are certain random trigger or cue points
for an enemy to appear and attack makes enemy placement in the other two games look innovative, challenging and ground breaking. Enemies spawn and re-spawn sometimes randomly in the other games but here it's fixed spots that don't change.
3. The waste of space. If you look at the map of CVII you will notice there is a lot of open space that is never used. There
are certain areas in the game that serve no purpose. Bordia Mountains oh look invisible staircase. Debious Woods has this open area with the gypsy to find to give your whip fire but there is no danger here. This can be attributed to the fact that the game has an open world design. I.E do you notice that you can go anywhere that there are no blocks barring your way. If you use a code to jump Yuba Lake you will end up in Marsh or cemetery and if you do it in the other Lake near Debious Woods you end up stuck in the wall. Which brings me to the next issue.
4. Mirroring. The mansions and certain areas are unique in design and yet other areas of this game are carbon copies. Why is this?Veros looks like Yomi and Doina. The bridges and certain forests look identical. You never see that in CV and maybe twice in CVIII.
5. Lack of diversity. These monsters and other characters need to take up affirmative action suits and demand a more robust
line of enemies and towns folk to piss off Simon. Skeletons are overused and werewolves are used in one area. You already
know about the lack of level ending bosses so lets move on shall we?
6. Re-spawn points. Egoraptor brought this up. unless you jump from a high place into water or lose fighting Dracula you end
up re-spawning where you last stood. In Zelda II you at least get sent back to the entrance point of any screen. It's one thing
and bad enough to coddle a kid in sports but in video games???? VIDEO GAMES????? C'MON! Are you fucking shittin me?!!
7. Lack of diverse graphics. Open up the Simon's Quest ROM. The graphics are recycled and never really change except in rare
instances (see point 4). I mean the graphics in Dr Jeckyll and Mister Hyde could have been used in this game and then they would have been actually served a purpose as opposed to being squandered in a game that has so many flaws like this one.
8. Lack of hazards. In CVIII you have areas with water that push you left or right and although places like Vlad Mountain and
Rover mansion have a similar hazard in them they don't have birds, or other flying monsters or projectiles further impeding your path. Plus with no time limit there
is no sense of urgency.
9. The improper use of secondary weapons. Holy water has been one of the biggest challenge killers in the series in this game it is basically for stunning and
destroying walls but it has very little use. The flame makes searching for and acquiring all other weapons in the game useless. The rib gives you a shield which would
be fair in the later parts of the game but in the early parts I want to dodge fireballs and yes I realize you can not destroy them only the monster who shoots them.
Dagger.....useless needs to be powered up or traded like the crystal for a stronger knife. There is no Axe no Stop Watch and no Boomerang. Lame. Also no way to
acquire them without hearts as currency. Should have had money in the game to buy stuff.
10. No candles, no secret treasures no switches. Nuff said.
There are other things I don't like but I will leave it at that. This game in many ways is the poster child and prototype for every disappointment in the series.
It may have been a harbinger for the failures to follow.
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Hm. I think you're being pretty hard on this game. It's definitely not my favorite in the series, but I enjoy it for what it is.
Anyway, I think some of the issues you bring up here (such as the empty game world) are valid, and I've often wondered if the game was maybe released in a somewhat unfinished state? When I play Simon's Quest I've always felt like the developers wanted to do more things with this game but time and hardware restrictions made them abandon a lot of stuff. Maybe the game was a bit too ambitious for the NES?
This is why I think Simon's Quest is the Castlevania game that most deserves a fullfledged remake. Konami could do so many great things with it, cause the foundation and the overall concept is pretty great. Though the empty and lonely game world actually kinda still attracts me, so I wouldn't want them to turn Simon's Quest into a loud, in-your-face anime Metroidvania with too much story or too many characters. It needs to be mysterious.
Maybe the atmosphere in Simon's Quest was unintentional, but it's very eerie and strange (in a good way).
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Though the empty and lonely game world actually kinda still attracts me, so I wouldn't want them to turn Simon's Quest into a loud, in-your-face anime Metroidvania with too much story or too many characters.
Same here. I really liked that desolate, abandoned feeling some of the locations had. I liked how it fit in with the story, too.
Although it's been criticized, I loved the color palette, too...I thought it added to the atmosphere pretty well.
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I don't hate the game, I like the RPG aspects of it. I felt it sort of paved the way for SOTN a little. There were some difficult parts of Simon's Quest where some first time players may have no idea what they are supposed to do, or where they are supposed to go.
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1. Multi directional scrolling
In SCVIV second level this works, in CVII it doesn't. Why? Because the Super NES is a better system for one but CVII doesn't have any points where it reverts to straight up to down or left to right scrolling. The diagonal scrolling slows the game down. Check out Bionic Commando. That game gets it right. Also I noticed that in this game screens only load graphics when you exit an area on the left or the right but not if you go up or down stairs (similar to ladders in NG3's case). I don't get that. It takes away from the feel of the game I think. If you fall down a pit in CV or DC you die but Simon's Quest you die only if there is water, spikes below or if you land on an enemy when having low health but you have to wait five hours before you land. Again
slow down.
2. Too many players on the field. If you look at the CV and CVIII this doesn't happen. You can have four zombies and a bat
coming to suck your whatever and give you putrification and herpes. Yet there is no slow down. In contrast CVII has this issue.
Let's think about the disappearing monster trick. If you are in the first game and you out pace a zombie and it ends up out
of the screen it doesn't come back. If you are walking in a CVII town and you see a zombie flash on the edge of the screen
it's coming after you and after four of them there is slow down. The fact that there are certain random trigger or cue points
for an enemy to appear and attack makes enemy placement in the other two games look innovative, challenging and ground breaking. Enemies spawn and re-spawn sometimes randomly in the other games but here it's fixed spots that don't change.
3. The waste of space. If you look at the map of CVII you will notice there is a lot of open space that is never used. There
are certain areas in the game that serve no purpose. Bordia Mountains oh look invisible staircase. Debious Woods has this open area with the gypsy to find to give your whip fire but there is no danger here. This can be attributed to the fact that the game has an open world design. I.E do you notice that you can go anywhere that there are no blocks barring your way. If you use a code to jump Yuba Lake you will end up in Marsh or cemetery and if you do it in the other Lake near Debious Woods you end up stuck in the wall. Which brings me to the next issue.
4. Mirroring. The mansions and certain areas are unique in design and yet other areas of this game are carbon copies. Why is this?Veros looks like Yomi and Doina. The bridges and certain forests look identical. You never see that in CV and maybe twice in CVIII.
5. Lack of diversity. These monsters and other characters need to take up affirmative action suits and demand a more robust
line of enemies and towns folk to piss off Simon. Skeletons are overused and werewolves are used in one area. You already
know about the lack of level ending bosses so lets move on shall we?
6. Re-spawn points. Egoraptor brought this up. unless you jump from a high place into water or lose fighting Dracula you end
up re-spawning where you last stood. In Zelda II you at least get sent back to the entrance point of any screen. It's one thing
and bad enough to coddle a kid in sports but in video games???? VIDEO GAMES????? C'MON! Are you fucking shittin me?!!
7. Lack of diverse graphics. Open up the Simon's Quest ROM. The graphics are recycled and never really change except in rare
instances (see point 4). I mean the graphics in Dr Jeckyll and Mister Hyde could have been used in this game and then they would have been actually served a purpose as opposed to being squandered in a game that has so many flaws like this one.
8. Lack of hazards. In CVIII you have areas with water that push you left or right and although places like Vlad Mountain and
Rover mansion have a similar hazard in them they don't have birds, or other flying monsters or projectiles further impeding your path. Plus with no time limit there
is no sense of urgency.
9. The improper use of secondary weapons. Holy water has been one of the biggest challenge killers in the series in this game it is basically for stunning and
destroying walls but it has very little use. The flame makes searching for and acquiring all other weapons in the game useless. The rib gives you a shield which would
be fair in the later parts of the game but in the early parts I want to dodge fireballs and yes I realize you can not destroy them only the monster who shoots them.
Dagger.....useless needs to be powered up or traded like the crystal for a stronger knife. There is no Axe no Stop Watch and no Boomerang. Lame. Also no way to
acquire them without hearts as currency. Should have had money in the game to buy stuff.
10. No candles, no secret treasures no switches. Nuff said.
11. None of the above matters because Simon's Quest is awesome.
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There was nothing random in CV3. The "randomly spawning" enemies in CV3 were handled by controller objects placed at specific points in the room. They were programmed to spawn an enemy (zombie, bat, medusa head, or winged demon) at specific intervals as soon as the controller object came into view. Killing the enemy would reset the counter. The only reason it seemed random was because Trevor was always moving.. The only thing "random" in CV3 was the password generator and the speed at which enemies moved (see my thread in the Fan Stuff forum), and even that was scripted to the point a robot could account for any randomness.
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It saddens me when people belittle Simon's Quest. I love that game!
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11. None of the above matters because Simon's Quest is awesome.
Precisely. CV2 is one of my favorite games in the series, thanks to the lonely atmosphere and little interesting things here and there. The only thing that this game should had is a in game map and clearer tips on what player objective is.
1. There are no problems with diagonal scrolling. Game works normal. If anything, it maybe affecting something for you, but from technical standpoint it is works absolutely normal.
2. I don't see a problem here. Slowdown is minimal and enemies spawn quite afar from the player, so there is no problem whatsoever in countering them. And no, in other Castlevanias enemies have fixed spawns, except for random moving enemies like Bats or Medusa Heads.
3. It is absolutely normal from a design standpoint. It works for atmosphere of the game and give a breathing space for the player.
4. The game is very big and NES is not powerfull enough to give every area an unique look. It is normal and not a problem also. Besides there is no reason to make woods or town look different. Woods ae woods. There is only so many ways you can make them look.
5. Bullshit. Many areas has unique monsters (Firemen, Medusa Heads, Harpies, Eyaballs, Clawmen, Slimes e.t.c.). Yes, Skeletons are in every area, but I believe developers thought it would be a good iea to have a common regular enemy, since the game is not divided by levels.
6. Bullshit. Never had any problems with that. It is very comfortable that you respawn in the last place you've died - you can immediately try to overcome obstacle instead of waiting to get to it. If you have problems with that more likely you need to train better in this game.
7. Horrible crime. Not. Many games recycle sprites. CV3 recysle a lot of things for example.
8. CV2 is built in different way than CV1 and CV3. One should remember it before accusing game in some shit. Exploration first, action second.
9. Bullshit. Want challenge? Shut down shield and jump over the projectiles to your heart content. Maybe evelopers go a bit overboard with daggers, but all other weapon could be used in different situations. And Holy Water is mostly for estroying walls in this game. Experimenting is good.
10. Practically none of the other Castlevanias had secret treasures, aside from AK68K. And monsters give you stuff instead of candles. No big deal. If you are not one of this obsessed individuals who like superficial stuff over important things.
In short this list is overblown bullshit, much like AVGN's review (despite my great respect for this reviewer).
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2. I don't see a problem here. Slowdown is minimal and enemies spawn quite afar from the player, so there is no problem whatsoever in countering them. And no, in other Castlevanias enemies have fixed spawns, except for random moving enemies like Bats or Medusa Heads.
*points to post above this quote*
Bats and Medusa Heads weren't random. Their spawns were very simplistically structured. As long as the spawn control object was within Trevor's view, it would spawn a bat or Medusa Head (or any other constant spawn) at a position relative to Trevor's y-coordinate based on Trevor's position in the stage.
The NES games actually had no true randomness. Like I said, you could program a robot to play through the game in such a way that every play-through would be the EXACT same. So if you think CV and CV3 were good games because of the enemy placements, including the constant spawners, then tip your hat to the designers because every aspect of CV3 was tightly scripted without a shred of randomness. Of course, one could simply adjust the definition of "random" to make CV games legitimately random -- everything is coded based on one (or, once in a blue moon, two) constantly increasing (or decreasing) bytes, but I'm just saying.
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In short this list is overblown bullshit, much like AVGN's review (despite my great respect for this reviewer).
Didn't the creator of the AVGN say that he actually likes Simon's Quest in a 'the making of' video?
Anyway... what I find funny is that you didn't even mention one of the most commonly complained about features- how cryptic the game can get. In a remake of Simon's Quest this could be easily dealt with by fixing dialogue. What I would do is keep in the 'lying townsfolk' but add in a log that automatically kept notes on what each villager said. I'd also add an item you could get that would help you tell if a villager was lying or not. There you go. Maintains the original intent of the game while improving the system.
I feel the need to repeat what Sumac said: There is NOTHING wrong with the respawn points. You know what made Zelda II so unbearable for so many players? The fact that you could claw your way through the palaces only to run out of lives at the very end and have to start from the very beginning of the world (exception is the final palace), over and over and over. I think that respawning at the start of a screen would be an acceptable middle ground.
As far as recycled area appearances and enemies go, that's very common in NES games- heck, it's very common in Castlevania, period! But I would hope that if the game is ever remade that they give each area a little more uniqueness. Same goes for the mansions (would be really cool if each mansion looked very different). And I think it's indisputable that the game could use more, better bosses. Succubus would be a good choice as there wasn't one in I or III.
8. Lack of hazards.
I agree that the game could use some more environmental hazards/platforming additions (OoE's trees that you could jump on would be an awesome addition to Simon's Quest's forests, for example). But... um, there were hazards that attacked you from above in the mansions. Slimes and spiders are the ones I remember off the top of my head... I think there were also falling spikes and maybe falling boulders somewhere, and then there are monsters on higher levels throwing projectiles that can hit you.
My real beef with this point of yours is the complaint about time. I prefer the time mechanic in Simon's Quest. I think it's neat that you've gotta book it to get the good ending. Only complaints with the time systems are the lack of night/day only monsters beyond the towns and the amount of time it takes to transition from day to night to day.
9. Holy water has been one of the biggest challenge killers in the series in this game it is basically for stunning and destroying walls but it has very little use. The flame makes searching for and acquiring all other weapons in the game useless.
*facepalm* Holy water was given a new use, flame took on the old role of the holy water. The HORROR!
The rib gives you a shield which would be fair in the later parts of the game but in the early parts I want to dodge fireballs and yes I realize you can not destroy them only the monster who shoots them.
I agree; I think the rib and eye should swap places.
Dagger.....useless needs to be powered up or traded like the crystal for a stronger knife. There is no Axe no Stop Watch and no Boomerang. Lame.
Daggers should have replaced each other. There should have been an axe and the cross you get near the end of the game should have been a sub-weapon. The stop-watch is completely unnecessary as the game is but it could be worked in and made useful with modifications to level design.
Also no way to acquire them without hearts as currency. Should have had money in the game to buy stuff.
EXP should have been given automatically when you kill monsters, and they should have dropped money and on rare occasions meat. Hearts should have been in candlesticks in towns and mansions, and in other natural places outside (like cocoons, rocks, bushes, etc).
I can think of LOTS of little tiny things that would make Simon's Quest better, and only three big ones. Level design could have been more nuanced, experience/money/sub-weapon ammo system could use updating, and it needs more, better bosses.
As it is I still love Simon's Quest. The atmosphere is absolutely fantastic.
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My only problems with Simon's Quest are 1: The villagers whose hints are supposed to give you direction, are mostly useless and confusing. Its been debated whether the lines are just poorly translated or the devs were intentionally trying to confuse the player. And 2: The game is very easy and the fact you can just walk past some of the bosses. Other than these two issues, I really enjoy the game and its creepy atmosphere. It was an important entry for the series as it built off the RPG elements introduced in Vampire Killer, and improved on them greatly.
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Simon's Quest gave us such an awesome soundtrack. That makes up for all of its flaws, IMO
Why Yamane never remixed Dwelling of Doom or Monster Dance is beyond me
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Why Yamane never remixed Dwelling of Doom or Monster Dance is beyond me
Also has one of my favorite menu songs and death songs.
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Also has one of my favorite menu songs and death songs.
Message of Darkness creeped me the balls out when I was a kid:
Castlevania 2: Simon's Quest- Message of Darkness (Title Screen) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1N12MyyHpE#)
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It saddens me when people belittle Simon's Quest. I love that game!
I like it somewhat, but I get really bored of it at points, also I never heard anything bad about this game till AVGN reviewed it, sort of how like out of nowhere cv64 sucked or something, next someone is going to say ScvIV is misguided/ or sucks because all what matters is the whip or something :rollseyes: it's freaking annoying.
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Thank you for your many replies. Now if I may retort let me first say this. The reason why I posted this is to vent my frustration about this game. It is not a bad game per say but it is not all it could be (like Judgement, COD, LOI, LOS). Castlevania games are rarely almost never done without any care where they end up as pieces of shit.
1. This soundtrack is fan-fuck-tastic. If you think I hate this game listen to a revision I did of Message on youtube.
Castlevania II Message of Darkness remix (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kBji6cqGwY#) (and the stereotypical Mick Foley cheap pop for me).
2. The vibe and atmosphere are excellent and epic but the night and day transitions could be no, not faster no no more realistic. Change palletes for each area as the clock ticks from day to night to day. Again,
wasted space. Open the ROM and see how neglected this bastard child of game is. They did you wrong....wrong. You didn't
deserve it. Excuse me......got something in my eye. I really do. It's all about the possibilites not the criticism.
3. I did not want to if possible re-tread on old complaints about this game like the cryptic clues and lies and the pallette and such.
4. Holy water to break blocks is fine if you don't have to search under every rock literally. (Bites off hand for the faceplam :P).
5. Re-spawn points. Yes games like Zelda II and Ninja Gaiden I and III are too harsh in this respect. But did any of you have issue with starting over on level five of CV one when you lost to Death?
6. Slow down in the other CV games did not happen in Bionic it did but from enemies not from free
scrolling. What else do you want me to say?
7. CVIII was a bigger game than CVII and it managed to be very unique on all stages. I can think of one that incorporated elements from 3 different levels but it was unique too.
8. Just so you know my goal is more so to inspire creative thought and ideas of what could be fun in a castlevania game.
Forgive me if the aim of my post came off as harsh. That is not the desired effect I wish to achieve here.
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While SQ is not my favorite I enjoyed it. I still haven't got the best ending though. While it has flaws it's still fun. I like how RoB starts you out in a SQ town too.
Fun fact: I thought OoE's exploration elements were going to be like SQ. I mean traveling to and fro town to town until finally you reach Castlevania at the end. Now yes that's kinda what OoE does but I mean without the ability to touch where you want to go. I mean good old fashion Belmont pimp struting. I hope that makes sense?
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Like any game, SQ has it's good/bad/questionable parts. But overall, the game still to this day has one of the best atmospheres of any CV ever made. The whole game from start-finish just feels forlorn, creepy and desolate.
Plus, it was innovative. SQ was very unique for it's time and opened up a lot of new things for future games in the series.
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When I think about it there were a lot of things in Goonies II the game that I thought would fit well in a Castlevania game and I wish they had put it in if not this game then one of the subsequent NES titles had they not decided to stop at 3. That game had vibrant graphics, fun music, interesting enemies (spiders, snakes, zombies no gangsters please) bridges to cross an occasional old person to punch for bad grammar, hey it's not real and it's all in fun. I stand by how I feel about the flaws of Simon's Quest and wish they improved on them before releasing it into population. Still I do agree from a standpoint of music, atmosphere/mood and deviated game play they had a good idea and truth be told it is closer to Castlevania the way I see it more so than many titles that came after it.
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I love Goonies II! In fact, I love all the big 2's. Zelda 2, Super Mario Bros. 2, Castlevania 2. It was so great being a kid in the 80's!
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I love Goonies II! In fact, I love all the big 2's. Zelda 2, Super Mario Bros. 2, Castlevania 2. It was so great being a kid in the 80's!
I was with you until you said Zelda 2.
That game is definitely an acquired taste.
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I love Goonies II! In fact, I love all the big 2's. Zelda 2, Super Mario Bros. 2, Castlevania 2. It was so great being a kid in the 80's!
Same here, except... I grew up in the 90's...
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I thought OoE's exploration elements were going to be like SQ. I mean traveling to and fro town to town until finally you reach Castlevania at the end. Now yes that's kinda what OoE does but I mean without the ability to touch where you want to go. I mean good old fashion Belmont pimp struting. I hope that makes sense?
I think OoE could've been structured more like Simon's Quest and I would've probably liked it even more. I mean, take away the map screen and instead make the levels interconnected like in SQ. Maybe put little warp points in-between levels (cause the game would've been a pain to traverse otherwise since it's a much bigger game than Simon's Quest was).
Also, some of the levels in OoE could've had entrances like the mansions in SQ where you press "up" to enter. That would've been great! And the starting town could've had exits on each side, leading to... dunno... one of the forest levels on the east side, and maybe a swamp level to the west.
Oh, and THIS: The town should've had "Silence of Daylight" playing in the background for lulz (and awesomeness).
I've actually been thinking about doing some cut'n'paste just to see how the levels in OoE could've been connected. We would obviously have to change the order in which some of the levels are played, and maybe change the level layout slightly in some places so that everything made sense.
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IMHO, LoS kinda felt Simon's Quest-ish at times with all the different locales. Just the vibe I got at times throughout the game.
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I'm probably biased because CVII was the first game I ever, -ever- played, but I really don't think there's much of a point to being hypercritical of it. I'd dearly love to see a remake that fixes the few -true- problems (like where were the bosses? I kind of dug that, with the idea of the drac-parts hidden in various deserted locales, but bosses are important to gameplay, yo) and most especially updates to Dwelling of Doom--one of the best, if not THE best, atmosphere tracks. But as to the game in its original incarnation...it's fairly common for NES games to be somewhat lacking in polishing, it seems, even enjoyable ones (Fester's Quest or Maniac Mansion anyone?). There's always something I'd like to have seen done in a more sensible way in NES offerings, but it's hardly lacking in innovation. And if you think about it, it's only following the law of second games anyway: Mario II, Zelda II, Star Tropics II...what is it with II's being weird? Though I love them. I think people tend to forget A)how arcane and bizarre NES games tended to be in those days and B) AVGN was joking in character guys. It's not actually an awful game. Just dated.
I liked OoE's CVII-ish elements, and though I haven't gotten to LoS yet I'm excited for it for that reason as well, but I'd still really love a more closely related re-do of CVII.
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I guess the best thing about Simon's Quest is that it's one CV that has a perfectly flawless soundtrack. Except maybe for Dracula's battle theme, but the fight itself it structured to be very short and chaotic.
It's definitely the first "serious" Castlevania. CV1 was pretty goofy and lighthearted, more like playing through a menagerie of Halloween store decorations. That's one reason why it's such a fun game. Simon's Quest has an unparalleled dark, uncertain atmosphere to it.
In some ways Simon's Quest feels more like a sequel to Vampire Killer than what it does to CV1. VK has a slightly more serious tone than CV1.
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If this game had a map/compas and more helpfull dialogues it woud have been perfect.
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This is a game where you will really need a walkthrough/faq since townsfolk are useless except for the merchants.
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This is a game where you will really need a walkthrough/faq since townsfolk are useless except for the merchants.
Everyone always says that, but it's not true. My family sussed Simon's Quest without a guide. Did the same with Zelda 1 and Zelda 2, both of which are very difficult to navigate without guides. I'd argue that Zelda 2 is even more obscure with Kasuto, the Hidden Palace, etc...
People took all the townsfolk hints the wrong way. All the hints are telling you to do is "Try doing something at this spot." So you go to the spot and you do EVERYTHING you can do; and as far as the Deborah Cliff and such go, the game DOES tell you to kneel before places with crystals and that you need the red crystal there. I'd argue that the only 'obscure' necessary detail is that you need to equip the heart and talk to the ferryman to get to one of the mansions.
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My only ONLY beef with Simon's Quest? It needed a more lengthy soundtrack.
The songs we got were BEAST.
But I wish, for example, each mansion had its own theme, or the underground areas had their own theme, etc.
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Everyone always says that, but it's not true. My family sussed Simon's Quest without a guide. Did the same with Zelda 1 and Zelda 2, both of which are very difficult to navigate without guides. I'd argue that Zelda 2 is even more obscure with Kasuto, the Hidden Palace, etc...
People took all the townsfolk hints the wrong way. All the hints are telling you to do is "Try doing something at this spot." So you go to the spot and you do EVERYTHING you can do; and as far as the Deborah Cliff and such go, the game DOES tell you to kneel before places with crystals and that you need the red crystal there. I'd argue that the only 'obscure' necessary detail is that you need to equip the heart and talk to the ferryman to get to one of the mansions.
Exactly this. I never had a guide for those games, or Star Tropics, etc. It's not like the options were unlimited, just non-intuitive at times. And having to exhaust every possibility was the point. You can just as easily say SOTN would occasionally be incomprehensible without a guide--Richter's moves aren't explicitly laid out for you, the whole shield rod thing, honestly all the button inputs that aren't handed to you in the store and some of the weirder weapon effects...Gamers are expected to be curious and exhaustive in problem-solving. But for Simon's Quest that doesn't just get you a more complete gameplay, it's actually required.
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Actually, Richer's moves were listed in the instruction manual.
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How sensible! If only I ever managed to buy games with manuals still intact that would probably make a lot of games easier, I'm sure. Growing up as a poor kid sucks :p
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Growing up as a poor kid sucks :p
Yes. Yes, it does. XD
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Exactly this. I never had a guide for those games, or Star Tropics, etc. It's not like the options were unlimited, just non-intuitive at times. And having to exhaust every possibility was the point. You can just as easily say SOTN would occasionally be incomprehensible without a guide--Richter's moves aren't explicitly laid out for you, the whole shield rod thing, honestly all the button inputs that aren't handed to you in the store and some of the weirder weapon effects...Gamers are expected to be curious and exhaustive in problem-solving. But for Simon's Quest that doesn't just get you a more complete gameplay, it's actually required.
You beat Simon's Quest without a guide or tips of any nature? I applaud you, sir.
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Not just me--my mom did too. Same with Zelda I & II. Strategy guides were not too easy to find back then, and it's not like the internet was gonna cough up the answers, haha. I can't remember if either of us beat Maniac Mansion completely, but I do remember getting pretty far with it, which, having tried to play that fairly recently, I have a newfound amazement for kid-me's patience. Apparently having Nintendo Power would also have made my life easier...but in a time with no internet as we know it and a place like rural Arkansas (don't think I met another gamer until college...), what can you do but keep wandering around and mashing buttons? Ah, a simpler time... ;)
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I remember calling a game tip hotline for CV2 alot...which my parents didn't like too much. I did however, manage to beat the zelda games without any help...well my dad tried to help.
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Not just me--my mom did too. Same with Zelda I & II.
Same here, though my mom never found the Hidden Palace in Zelda 2; I was the first person to find that. We have a manilla folder floating around somewhere filled with graph paper maps and notes and such...
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I finished Castlevania II with the help of other peoples hints. That sucked. Ruined what would have been a great experience for me game wise. SOTN was also ruined for me because the guy in the EB (now Gamestop) told me about the holy glasses. Zelda II I figured out all by my onesies. GREAT SUCCESS. Same with Zelda I.
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I personally Love Simon's quest because sometimes I like to play a Castlevania title where I am not ripping my hair out of my head trying to beat it. I love the RPG element and the fact you can go to different towns and talk to people. Plus ya can't go wrong with the Music
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Its took me a while to chime in on this what with cv2 bein my all time fav game... but theres NOTHIN wrong with it. The only thing wrong with it is ppl that never played it or never grew up in the real NES days goin back and playin it now after bein spoiled by games spoon feedin ya every lil detail so you CANT miss anything. In those days guides and faqs and walkthrus = friends in the lunch line or durin recess. You got by with what lil help you could find if any and figured the rest out for yourself.
You cant approach, play, or even review these old games goin in with the mentality of now. If you didnt play lots of games back THEN on the actual systems you shouldnt be tryin to review em NOW
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You cant approach, play, or even review these old games goin in with the mentality of now. If you didnt play lots of games back THEN on the actual systems you shouldnt be tryin to review em NOW
In my book: Castlevania II: Simon's Quest > Most Modern Video Games
Still, EVERY video game has its faults. Even the ones we think are the most brilliant.
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The game is not really the problem. It's the lack of care and programming that went into it. Look at the water level in Castlevania III. The water comes in and fills up the screen after facing the Bone Dragon King and then continues to rise after that. Are you telling me that with the two lakes that you kneel at that these programmers could not have done the same thing. We are just talking water falling to be drawn programmed and some blue graphics to be at the top of the lake. It is indicative of how the series has been repressed. I bet there were programmers who wanted to have these more technical ideas put in there but for some reason there was not time. They had a deadline to meet. But Castlevania III nah we'll take our time on it. Low and behold an epic game is made. Why not Simon's Quest? I guess we needed the AVGN to become a You Tube maven. Is that the right usage of the word maven? I don't know. Can we check on that?
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The game is not really the problem. It's the lack of care and programming that went into it.
I think your example with the lake is quite...farfethced, to say the least. I don't see how it indicative of the lack of care. There certainly was enough care to program multiple subweapons, day-night cycle, timer, that decides which ending you receive, multiple villagers and the like. I am not belittle CV3, but this theory about "rising water" sounds like some sort of conspirological stuff.
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I don't find it that farfetched. It's apparent that CVII didn't have anywhere near the polish that CVIII had. I happen to like Simon's Quest a lot, but it does feel sloppier than the other 2 NES games for sure. I wouldn't be surprised if it were ever revealed that the game was rushed quite a bit. Like Whip Her Snapper said, there could've been ideas or improvements that ended up on the cutting room floor due to time constraints.
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I don't find it that farfetched. It's apparent that CVII didn't have anywhere near the polish that CVIII had. I happen to like Simon's Quest a lot, but it does feel sloppier than the other 2 NES games for sure. I wouldn't be surprised if it were ever revealed that the game was rushed quite a bit. Like Whip Her Snapper said, there could've been ideas or improvements that ended up on the cutting room floor due to time constraints.
Good call. There are graphics in the ROM image that are there more than once and not needed, while others like the unused zombie graphics are in there only one time. There are nine music tracks on this game, 3 bosses and very little in the way of diverse backgrounds. Though CV1 has less enemies there is better placement and movement routine. Plus it has 16 tracks and 6 bosses. CVIII 34 enemies 15 bosses 27 tracks. CVII is not a bad game. It has a lot of very innovative elements it just wasn't given the care it should have been given. I am not going to gripe about the day night transition being slow that added to the atmosphere (Ninja Gaiden one had a similar fade out load graphics operation, no complaints). The day night thing could have been more realistic with changing the pallette slowly over each hour passing.
If it could be done again.
CVIII graphics and platforming, CVI character movement routines and enemy placement, CVII puzzles, adventure and story.
You could mix the tracks as not a one of the tracks from these games are anything short of epic.
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There are nine music tracks on this game, 3 bosses and very little in the way of diverse backgrounds.
Lack of different backgrounds could have been the result of the size of the game. Besides, as I said many times before, there is only so much ways you can depict forest or lake.
Besides, CV2 was adventure oriented, not action oriented game, like CV1 and CV3. That's why enemies have simple movements and patterns. There are mere obstacles for player to avoid in his adventure, not the main focus of the gameplay.
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You know, ten years ago on this board, almost nobody would ever speak ill of Simon's Quest. It was accepted as a kick-ass game—which it is.
I kind of wonder if it's people who are more new to the series who aren't that favorable toward it. I'm not saying that all people who dislike it fit into that category, but it may explain the insurgence of SQ haters.
It's actually my second favorite of the NES games after the first one, and one of my top favorite games in the series.
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Lack of different backgrounds could have been the result of the size of the game. Besides, as I said many times before, there is only so much ways you can depict forest or lake.
Besides, CV2 was adventure oriented, not action oriented game, like CV1 and CV3. That's why enemies have simple movements and patterns. There are mere obstacles for player to avoid in his adventure, not the main focus of the game play.
I think Battle of Olympus had about four different forest backgrounds & GI Joe I am pretty sure had multiple forest interpretations too. There is nothing wrong with it being adventure oriented but a lot of adventure games had action elements in it that made it more challenging. The puzzles in this game were a good idea as was night and day, the mansions, the body parts etc. The game as was stated was probably rushed. Are there any complaints as to how difficult CVIII was who is not named AVGN? So leave the challenge in. I needed help to finish Simon's Quest and I beat that before CVI and I will tell you here and now CVI was more rewarding to play and beat.
You know, ten years ago on this board, almost nobody would ever speak ill of Simon's Quest. It was accepted as a kick-ass game—which it is.
I kind of wonder if it's people who are more new to the series who aren't that favorable toward it. I'm not saying that all people who dislike it fit into that category, but it may explain the insurgence of SQ haters.
It's actually my second favorite of the NES games after the first one, and one of my top favorite games in the series.
To this I say I may very well be (no joke) the oldest person in this forum and that is frightening. Spout out some of your ages and I will tell you if you are older than me or not. NAH don't do that too embarrassing. Just to be clear. This game is not bad. I would buy this for the soundtrack alone. The game is like others in the series, Dracula X, CV64, Judgement as it was not allowed the time to be more than what it is. I guess I am just a fan of the first game engine more so than this. However, because of the genius elements in this game I say it would have been cool to see them meshed with the first game's engine.
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You know, ten years ago on this board, almost nobody would ever speak ill of Simon's Quest. It was accepted as a kick-ass game—which it is.
I kind of wonder if it's people who are more new to the series who aren't that favorable toward it. I'm not saying that all people who dislike it fit into that category, but it may explain the insurgence of SQ haters.
It's actually my second favorite of the NES games after the first one, and one of my top favorite games in the series.
That could be, but speaking for myself, even when I was a kid I wasn't a huge fan of the game. The music was awesome, and night-time scared the piss out of me, but the townspeople confused me and I got stuck at the tornado wall before finally getting past it 10 years later.
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My parents purchame me the game for christmas 89, I asked for CV1 but I've recieve SQ. My mother freak out when she saw the hangmans in the 1st mansion. It took me like 2 years before older dudes helped me to finish the game. For a french canadian kid it sucked because we had no translation for videogames and my parents are still very bad in english.
My father and I solve a big part of the game exepte the tornado.
Even today this is one of my favorite games and inspiration in my guitar playing, we play bloody tears in concert.