Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: Mathias_The_Resolute on March 19, 2013, 05:29:32 AM
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This has been something thats been throbing my head. The whip is used to kill Dracula and various ancient demons because it bears powerful Holy energy, But Leon Belmont had said to Death "I have the power to destroy ALL related to the vampires, though you have divine powers you are NO exception!" this means he can destroy anything relating to vampires with ease even a vampire himself but this is the question. IF the whip is supposed to annihalite anything evil regardless of its power or abilities does this mean the whip can destroy powerful vampires? one example would be a vampire with god-like powers or a vampire with the ability to regenerate countless times. an example would be Kain the vampire or Dracula's Hellsing counterpart (who possesses Cheap powers) can it destroy all types of vampires?
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As far as any of us know the Vampirekiller is the ultimate bane of evil, like the Master Sword is in Zelda. But the Belmont family themselves have their own inherent magical properties within their bloodline that allows them to slay the undead more successfully then your standard, run-of-the-mill vampire hunter and without the need of the standard vampire hunting arsenal. This was known long before IGA brought out LoI. But when LoI came out, it only helped to cement that fact. Dracula is so-far the only Vampire whom has yet to die permanently from the Vampirekiller aside from Death, And Dracula is the all-powerful Vampire king in the CV universe with god-like powers. No other vampire has such abilities, not even Brauner or Olrox. Dracula can only be entombed for a maximum sleep of one century before awakening as his regeneration cycle dictates. And at which time he is all-powerful. If monsters like Kain or Helsing's Dracula were to go up against a Belmont using the Vampirekiller I think they'd go down after a while (Helsing's Dracula more quicker then Kain). But because they're both 'undead' they are no exception.
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I tend to consider Death to just be a really powerful necromancer, AKA a necromancer so powerful he calls himself Death incarnate. But not the grim reaper himself.
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I tend to consider Death to just be a really powerful necromancer, AKA a necromancer so powerful he calls himself Death incarnate. But not the grim reaper himself.
Death is called Grim Reaper in the japanese versions (atleast the early ones).
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He is known as "Shinigami" in Japan, or Death God. Him being just a powerful Necromancer is actually a more accurate description for Zobek, since due to his unnatural birth he can control other Necromancers. There are Necromancers in the original canon too (CotM, Shaft perhaps) but there's no indication that they are controlled by Death.
Despite Lords of Shadow giving us their own origin for "The Lord of the Dead," in canon CV Death never had nor needed a back story; he simply is, always has & always will be. Which is why Leon declares despite him having divine powers, he is no exception to the might of Vampire Killer!
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http://castlevania.wikia.com/wiki/Death (http://castlevania.wikia.com/wiki/Death)
Death (死神 Grim Reaper, lit.transl.Death God), also known as the Grim Reaper, is a major villain from Konami's Castlevania series.
My afirmation doesnt seems invalid.
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I always just found it weird for Death to be on Dracula's side. if that were the case, wouldn't Dracula automatically win? Maybe it's something to do with the Japanese mythology behind individual Death Gods? (Of course originally it was just to make a big ol' monster fest castle with all traditional movie monsters)
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Maybe it has something to do with his ressurection cycle thing.
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^ One could argue that "death" can be delayed but never stopped, which is why the PCs are able to beat him back but not destroy him. Frankly we could really use more info on those stones from LoI. Sigh.
Edit: Oh, yeah, there's also the indication that Death doesn't have a complete hold on anything, what with Elizabetha being reincarnated into Lisa and Dracula into Soma, though one could argue that Death is actually responsible for that, too. Would make sense.
As far as any of us know the Vampirekiller is the ultimate bane of evil, like the Master Sword is in Zelda.
This is a decent comparison, considering how the VK was tied to the Belmont line during the ritual that forged it, and the Master Sword went through something similar. Leon could not harm Walter with anything less than the complete VK, much like in WW when the weakened MS couldn't damage Ganondorf. Leon said he would 'kill the night'; I think it's safe to say that all creatures of the night are vulnerable to the VK, save perhaps incorporeal critters like ghosts and such. Death would be no exception to that.
Edit: There's also a possibility that Death is vulnerable to it because of the 'living' soul within the VK. VK has been demonstrated to have some strange sentience.
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Death serves the holder of the Crimson Stone, right? Given that the Crimson stones bares a resemblance to the Philosopher's stone, it could stand to reason that Death was bound to the stone by some alchemist in the past. However, being that the classic canon specifies that Death is a divine being, and thus a servant of God, it also stands to reason that God still holds a divine leash on Death preventing the holder of the Crimson Stone from utilizing all of Death's powers.
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As far as any of us know the Vampirekiller is the ultimate bane of evil, like the Master Sword is in Zelda. But the Belmont family themselves have their own inherent magical properties within their bloodline that allows them to slay the undead more successfully then your standard, run-of-the-mill vampire hunter and without the need of the standard vampire hunting arsenal. This was known long before IGA brought out LoI. But when LoI came out, it only helped to cement that fact. Dracula is so-far the only Vampire whom has yet to die permanently from the Vampirekiller aside from Death, And Dracula is the all-powerful Vampire king in the CV universe with god-like powers. No other vampire has such abilities, not even Brauner or Olrox. Dracula can only be entombed for a maximum sleep of one century before awakening as his regeneration cycle dictates. And at which time he is all-powerful. If monsters like Kain or Helsing's Dracula were to go up against a Belmont using the Vampirekiller I think they'd go down after a while (Helsing's Dracula more quicker then Kain). But because they're both 'undead' they are no exception.
Thanks for the answer dude. it really answers the question behind the whip's powerful properties,
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Now they need to explain the origin of the sub-weapons (Legends did it but in a strange way). Or its from the guys that tried to kill Dracula/Walter and failed?
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Now they need to explain the origin of the sub-weapons (Legends did it but in a strange way). Or its from the guys that tried to kill Dracula/Walter and failed?
One could guess that the classic sub-weapons are objects that Rinaldo made and gave to hunters who subsequently kicked the bucket. It was implied that most of the objects Leon finds and uses are there for that reason, anyway. But... in game, they have some connection to the orbs that Walter used to seal his keep. Hmm... If I were to come up with an all-encompassing explanation, I'd say that Matthias made them, which is why Leon has the dagger/knife when he starts out and the rest are in Walter's domain as part of his plan to see Leon get through Walter's game. Would also allow for a story connection to be made between the sub-weapons and the orbs.
Or we could go with the explanation that they're gifts from souls trapped in candles (lol).
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I think Dracula is never utterly defeated because he wasn't a true vampire. The human aspect of him, the tenacity of a human soul even bespoied, grants him a slow but tenacious healing power real vampires lack. Real vampires have rapid healing, but because of that they have a lower threshold, whereas Dracula has slower healing and thus a higher threshold before his body can succumb to the holy powers of the whip.
Or it's because he keeps convincing the Belmonts to aim for his head and it's just a fake head.
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I would have preferred if the Vampire Killer had a more interesting origin. Perhaps, a gift from an angel? Maybe made out of the dragon form that Satan took on during his battle, and defeat, with the Archangel Michael.
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It would only work in the LOS universe, at least for me.
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Filling the gaps/plot hole in the old canon is a fool's hope.
There's no consensus, and there will never will; just let your imagination go with whatever you like the most, makig it your personal story.
I think that's why most of us hold the old canon dearly, because it was not Cox's story or IGA's story, it was ours.
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Or it's because he keeps convincing the Belmonts to aim for his head and it's just a fake head.
Dave Cox thought it was a mask lol
I would have preferred if the Vampire Killer had a more interesting origin. Perhaps, a gift from an angel? Maybe made out of the dragon form that Satan took on during his battle, and defeat, with the Archangel Michael
How about the Poltergeist King? lol
Actually I had some of my own personal ideas that the Vampire Killer was originally the whip that the Romans used to torture Jesus prior to his crucifixion, which is how it got it's Holy elements (soaked with Jesus' blood. and to take it a step further, mmmmaybe that Roman that was responsible was a distant Belmont descendant :o)
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I like the whip's origin story from the All About Akumajo Dracula guide. Simon makes it himself by using the stem of a rose.
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Thanks everyone for commenting on this thread. I believe the Subweapons were created by Rinaldo. It is true that Hellsing's Dracula will stand no chance against a belmont given the fact that he prefers to be slained by a human rather then a Monster or a "Dog of the church" I don't know much about Kain only that he is a vampire king in another game.
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Thanks everyone for commenting on this thread. I believe the Subweapons were created by Rinaldo.
But as I said before, Leon showed up at Rinaldo's with the knife already.
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The sub-weapons can easily be magical weapons once used by other warriors that were made for the purposes of slaying Walter, but were unsuccessful. And they don't have to all be crafted by Rinaldo either as there are lots of other magic users in the world.