Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: machetespeghetti on February 08, 2014, 09:36:00 PM
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According to the japanese snes port of RoB the game is a sequel rather than a port. The game would have had to take place somewhere between RoB and Sotn. (going by maria's appearence being about the same as rondo's) probably closer to rondo. But where was shaft?
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Doesn't Dracula X have the same story as Rondo of Blood? It can't be a sequel if it has the same story.
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Not according to the japanese snes port.
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It's not though. RoB was never released outside of Japan. So, everyone else got Castlevania: Dracula X/Vampire's Kiss. It takes place at the same time, but is clearly different and inferior in my opinion. RoB was only released outside of Japan as an extra in the Dracula X Chronicles for PSP.
FYI, RoB has a sequel. It's SotN.
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I always thought it was the watered down version on RoB
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I always thought it was the watered down version on RoB
but all the stages are different. the first stages has the same setting, but is still very different. besides, as I said, it is clearly inferior.
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The game was supposed to be a port of Rondo on the SNES, but Konami got in some kind of legal trouble with the people behind the PC Engine, I believe. This forced them to change all the stages. Though not the characters apperently.
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It always seemed half finished, like something happened in the middle of production.
But, this is the first I've heard about any legal trouble seeing as Konami has always been identified as developer and publisher with no mention of any other people.
Not according to the japanese snes port.
How so?
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I heard something about a legal issue too, you guys think they could have a game almost the same as RoB without the cutscenes and cd quality music?
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I heard something about a legal issue too, you guys think they could have a game almost the same as RoB without the cutscenes and cd quality music?
I think RoB could have remained as is on the SNES, just without the CD quality music, some sounds and voiceovers. Rondo I've noticed has a simpler color palette structure then what the SNES is capable of. The cut scenes while animated are simplistic enough that the SNES can easily pull it off. But since we didn't get Rondo and instead got CV Dracula X I believe it was some sort of legal issue. But that begs the question; Konami is the one who owns the rights to CV. So how come they weren't aloud to ship Rondo as is over to the states when it's their product. But on the plus side I think some of the Rondo tracks actually sound better on the SNES. Take Vampirekiller as a real good example. In Rondo we hear the tune and then there's this pause in the music for roughly a second or two. Why? Why was that even necessary? To me it ruined the flow of the piece. At least in the SNES version the tune is not interrupted by some useless pause.
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I think RoB could have remained as is on the SNES, just without the CD quality music, some sounds and voiceovers. Rondo I've noticed has a simpler color palette structure then what the SNES is capable of. The cut scenes while animated are simplistic enough that the SNES can easily pull it off. But since we didn't get Rondo and instead got CV Dracula X I believe it was some sort of legal issue. But that begs the question; Konami is the one who owns the rights to CV. So how come they weren't aloud to ship Rondo as is over to the states when it's their product. But on the plus side I think some of the Rondo tracks actually sound better on the SNES. Take Vampirekiller as a real good example. In Rondo we hear the tune and then there's this pause in the music for roughly a second or two. Why? Why was that even necessary? To me it ruined the flow of the piece. At least in the SNES version the tune is not interrupted by some useless pause.
yes, it's thjeir product. but there's also the PC engine folks to think about. The game may have been made to take advantage of the system, and there was probably sime kind of exclusivity deal or something. they wanted to bring it over, to a different system, and the PC engine folks most likely got upset and had some kind of legal standing in the matter. SO it was resolved by making it an entirely different game.
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I wonder if anyone around here is talented enough to create a better port of rondo through snes coding. or if not the snes maybe the sega 32x (making good use of a bad add on) Maybe both? Hell while we are at it lets port cv4 to genisis and bloodlines to snes!
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Hell while we are at it lets port cv4 to genisis and bloodlines to snes!
LoL! I don't believe that SCV4 would port very well over to the Genesis. Much of it would be lost in translation. Bloodlines on the other hand would be a more successful venture. But again there are some things about the Genesis that would be lost in translation on the SNES so it could go either way.
I wonder if anyone around here is talented enough to create a better port of rondo through snes coding.
I would love to see this done. Heck, I'd pay top dollar to see this done (successfully of course).
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What's been said is what i have always heard to be the truth about this. Dracula X is half port and half redesign. It is exactly the "watered down version" of ROB. I didn't know anything about the legal issues, but that makes good sense and finished the story as to why they would cut down such a great game.
In response to those who mentioned making a full port of ROB. You better believe i would be on board.
@ X. I would also be willing to pay big coin to see it happen and own a copy. The sun would shine extra bright on that day i think.
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X: the music pausing after playing is a product of music being streamed from the disc, each time the song finishes it has to reload. Trust me Rondo isn't the only game to have this happen, I've seen it happen on PS1 and Saturn games as well.
As for which systems had RoB here in the west after it's initial release, not just the PSP, there was also the Wii VC release.
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X: the music pausing after playing is a product of music being streamed from the disc, each time the song finishes it has to reload. Trust me Rondo isn't the only game to have this happen, I've seen it happen on PS1 and Saturn games as well.
That's not the pause I was talking about,lol. The pause I'm referring to is near the en of vampirekiller. The music plays normally then it pauses just as the song is about to hit the climax of the tune itself. Then it continues on. Here's the comparisons between the two;
Castlevania Dracula X OST: Stage 2 Vampire Killer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rR1W_OsAc6k#)
Castlevania Rondo of Blood Music - Vampire Killer (Stage 2b) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlayiIBH75o#)
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Thanks for pointing that out on the music. Back to the subject I know dracula x was the american version of Rondo but the japanese snes version (same thing as U.S. version but uncensored) is Akumajo dracula (xx) you would think that would mean part 2, but then Sotn would have to be porn making it (xxx)
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They moved the pause to the beginning of the track and shortened it. That does work much better.
That is one way to interpret the XX, but you could also interpret it as an extension or an alternate version too.
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Seeing you guys discussing this game made me remember of one of the things that boggled my mind when I played it. I mean, take a look at this:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ezimba.com%2Fwork%2F140211C%2Fezimba18940684411804.png&hash=c31d926bc2730756a6aca2e8e9099c7dde17a6ef)
There is something very wrong with this part of the game (last stage). Can any of you tell what is it?
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You are climbing up the castle keep but the castle is in the background
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You are climbing up the castle keep but the castle is in the background
Diddo. It's like they got lazy on the last stage.
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You are climbing up the castle keep but the castle is in the background
That or there is a GINORMOUS mirror in front of the castle.
No really. The first time I saw it I was "Wait wat.. Wat...?".
As X masterfully put: Absolutelly lazy. But strangelly amusing.
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Seeing you guys discussing this game made me remember of one of the things that boggled my mind when I played it. I mean, take a look at this:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ezimba.com%2Fwork%2F140211C%2Fezimba18940684411804.png&hash=c31d926bc2730756a6aca2e8e9099c7dde17a6ef)
There is something very wrong with this part of the game (last stage). Can any of you tell what is it?
Yeah. That was pretty stupid.
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Seeing you guys discussing this game made me remember of one of the things that boggled my mind when I played it. I mean, take a look at this:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ezimba.com%2Fwork%2F140211C%2Fezimba18940684411804.png&hash=c31d926bc2730756a6aca2e8e9099c7dde17a6ef)
There is something very wrong with this part of the game (last stage). Can any of you tell what is it?
It strikes a nice picture, though
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It does once you remove the foreground graphics and character sprites. Easily doable on an emulator.
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It´s the same Castle that shows in the map, at the begining of every stage, correct?
Am I the only one that likes that part of the last stage? Lazy, yes, but impressive to me, in that day when I played...
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It´s the same Castle that shows in the map, at the begining of every stage, correct?
Am I the only one that likes that part of the last stage? Lazy, yes, but impressive to me, in that day when I played...
The problem here is not even the graphics or disposition of the scene. I mean, look at that map screen. It's fuckin' GORGEOUS, moreso than Rondo IMO.
But what deals the killing blow is: Richter is inside the castle. How can the castle be in the background? It's a huge ass painting or something?
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The problem here is not even the graphics or disposition of the scene. I mean, look at that map screen. It's fuckin' GORGEOUS, moreso than Rondo IMO.
But what deals the killing blow is: Richter is inside the castle. How can the castle be in the background? It's a huge ass painting or something?
Yep, is kind of weird. The first time that I reach the last stage, I suposed that you are entering the castle from outside. I mean, you are in a journey to the castle from the begining, right? Then, at the last stage you see the whole castle before entering it... But, seeing the castle at the distance, and a seconds later being inside of it, and at the Castle Keep... oh man, I see the point :P...
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Yes, i agree. I noticed this and it's.... Just bad! No way to cover it up really. It's clearly a mental mistake by somebody, lol. I'm sure somebody would argue that it's an illusion and the castle is trying to stop the main character from completing the game by drawing him away in another direction or some garbage like that. In the same way they try to piece together timelines between vintage games and modern ones ;)
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The map screen clearly shows the level takes place within the tower in the background but the one in the background show a caved in staircase leading to the keep. ?
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The map screen clearly shows the level takes place within the tower in the background but the one in the background show a caved in staircase leading to the keep. ?
That's because the image is stretched out of proper proportion in order for it to fit the background. On the map screen it's normal, however this image was blown up a bit to fit as a back drop piece for the final stage so the pixelation is off somewhat.
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Yes, i agree. I noticed this and it's.... Just bad! No way to cover it up really. It's clearly a mental mistake by somebody, lol. I'm sure somebody would argue that it's an illusion and the castle is trying to stop the main character from completing the game by drawing him away in another direction or some garbage like that. In the same way they try to piece together timelines between vintage games and modern ones ;)
Heyyyyy I like this one ;D
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According to this site, Akumajo Dracula XX was once called Akumajo Dracula X II (working title).
http://draken.fc2web.com/houmotu_1.htm (http://draken.fc2web.com/houmotu_1.htm)
google translate (http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=ja&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=ja&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fdraken.fc2web.com%2Fhoumotu_1.htm&act=url)
It may mean that this was once made as a sequel.
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Seeing you guys discussing this game made me remember of one of the things that boggled my mind when I played it. I mean, take a look at this:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ezimba.com%2Fwork%2F140211C%2Fezimba18940684411804.png&hash=c31d926bc2730756a6aca2e8e9099c7dde17a6ef)
There is something very wrong with this part of the game (last stage). Can any of you tell what is it?
It's not a mistake, that's the inverted Castle from SOTN ;P
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According to this site, Akumajo Dracula XX was once called Akumajo Dracula X II (working title).
http://draken.fc2web.com/houmotu_1.htm (http://draken.fc2web.com/houmotu_1.htm)
google translate (http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=ja&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=ja&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fdraken.fc2web.com%2Fhoumotu_1.htm&act=url)
It may mean that this was once made as a sequel.
Wow! Interesting! Could it also mean Akumajo Dracula XII? XII means 12 when written together.
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Wow! Interesting! Could it also mean Akumajo Dracula XII? XII means 12 when written together.
The possibility may exist. Mega Drive Vampire Killer is XI. In the case of XII, it is the new castlevania game. In the case of X-II, it is the RoB sequel.
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The image is really small, but on closer inspection, I think it says X-II, not XII (the yellow letters). I remembered this magazine article that says Gekka no Yasokyoku was also called Dracula X 2 initially.
http://www.castlevaniadungeon.net/features/magscans/EGM88p41.jpg (http://www.castlevaniadungeon.net/features/magscans/EGM88p41.jpg)
Perhaps Akumajo Dracula XX was supposed to be the RoB sequel, but then the original RoB team decided to make a sequel of their own, and they decided to make it a port instead?
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Asking a developer/staff member from that era would give us a true answer.
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My belief with regards to that image is that the people in charge of making the backgrounds and placing them did not place this in the correct location.
It 'probably' was supposed to be a background for the ClockTower stage, since it actually is on the opposite side of the castle, in a location where that view would be reasonable...
...problem is, once the clocktower stage was designed, it ended up coming out of a cavern and possessed no windows until the boss fight.
So it seems like, rather than waste a beautiful background, they decided to go all roflcopter and place it 'somewhere' so that it doesn't go to waste.
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I would have made more sense for the castle to be a back drop for the clocktower stage even if it was for only one screen. But because of their final decision we ended up with something that came off as very lazy.
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Hmmmm
----ROB-ADXX-SOTN---
\/
Possible sequel/F**k up?
WAIT! this was how Richter ended up in the castle when he got possessed we can assume all of the bosses including dracula were an illusion created by shaft. we never see the castle crumble.
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The image is really small, but on closer inspection, I think it says X-II, not XII (the yellow letters). I remembered this magazine article that says Gekka no Yasokyoku was also called Dracula X 2 initially.
http://www.castlevaniadungeon.net/features/magscans/EGM88p41.jpg (http://www.castlevaniadungeon.net/features/magscans/EGM88p41.jpg)
Perhaps Akumajo Dracula XX was supposed to be the RoB sequel, but then the original RoB team decided to make a sequel of their own, and they decided to make it a port instead?
That doesn't quite make sense since the earliest presentation in game magazines showed it to be a direct port, and then when it came time to review the thing it got borked.
Now I'm curious to see how it was handled in the Japanese game mags of the time.
Hmmmm
----ROB-ADXX-SOTN---
\/
Possible sequel/F**k up?
WAIT! this was how Richter ended up in the castle when he got possessed we can assume all of the bosses including dracula were an illusion created by shaft. we never see the castle crumble.
Ha! That's a way better then what they did. Worthy of being hacked into the game.
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The image is really small, but on closer inspection, I think it says X-II, not XII (the yellow letters). I remembered this magazine article that says Gekka no Yasokyoku was also called Dracula X 2 initially.
http://www.castlevaniadungeon.net/features/magscans/EGM88p41.jpg (http://www.castlevaniadungeon.net/features/magscans/EGM88p41.jpg)
Perhaps Akumajo Dracula XX was supposed to be the RoB sequel, but then the original RoB team decided to make a sequel of their own, and they decided to make it a port instead?
Actually, a cancelled SEGA 32x game called "Castlevania: The Bloodletting" was originally intended to be a sequel of Rondo of Blood.
Anyway, I always find Dracula X to be a "badly designed" port of Rondo of Blood since the Turbografx 16 wasn't selling well in America and the game never came out. Eventually, Konami made a port of Rondo of Blood which became Dracula X
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The Bloodletting for 32X was revealed to be a hoax, was it not?
As for Dracula X, I don't even think it qualifies as a proper port. I mean it's a port of Richter's basic play mechanics, but that's it. They left out so much of the game that it falls far short of anyone being able to call it a port with a straight face. If anything it's a remake. A half-assed one, but a remake nonetheless.
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The controls weren't even ported over properly, and you can't do that "whip and quickly press down to near-simultaneously whip above and below" trick from Rondo.
It's a shoddy unique port, but I still love it.
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The Bloodletting for 32X was revealed to be a hoax, was it not?
That was Shin Dracula X. The Bloodletting 32X game evolved into the final product known as SotN.
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That doesn't quite make sense since the earliest presentation in game magazines showed it to be a direct port, and then when it came time to review the thing it got borked.
Now I'm curious to see how it was handled in the Japanese game mags of the time.
Ha! That's a way better then what they did. Worthy of being hacked into the game.
Actually, that's not true. I checked out scans of old magazines and early screenshots of the game looked exactly like the game does now. There's no evidence the game was a straight port before, and that they later changed it. Agreed about the Japanese magazines. They could shed some light on the matter.
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I always thought it's a watered down dracula x
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that's basically what we ended up getting so it's not like you're wrong or anything.
it just had different intents in development. they probably decided early on to not make snes dracula x an actual port of rondo in any case.
bloodletting was never a hoax, but i believe it eventually became sotn. there's actually no evidence toward it being a sequel to rondo of blood though iirc.
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The assumption that Bloodletting was a sequel to RoB stemmed from the fact it starred Richter.
While the sprites were resused for SotN, I wished the designs themselves were kept because they were the most 90's x-treme things and it would've been wonderful. Like a Street of Rage/CV crossover.
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Actually, that's not true. I checked out scans of old magazines and early screenshots of the game looked exactly like the game does now. There's no evidence the game was a straight port before, and that they later changed it. Agreed about the Japanese magazines. They could shed some light on the matter.
I blame my point of view on this:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.castlevaniadungeon.net%2Ffeatures%2Fmagscans%2FEGM71p88.jpg&hash=6c2900d10b55d8c8a52d74d3457a9a99d7a2d045)
They could just be reusing the pics from the Rondo of Blood review, however.
In speaking about things being sequels, let us not gloss over the fact that SotN IS the sequel to RoB. After all both games have the same Belmont & Maria and are the only two games with the Dracula X title.
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Yeah, I know you were going to bring up that scan. :P A while back I was also looking for early screens of XX that looked like Rondo, but I could only find previews that used images from the original version. I also found this scan:
http://www.castlevaniadungeon.net/features/magscans/bv-cv-dx-egm-1995.jpg (http://www.castlevaniadungeon.net/features/magscans/bv-cv-dx-egm-1995.jpg)
It says the game is still early in development, but the game looks exactly look it does when it came out. This whole "Akumajo Dracula X II" thing makes me suspect the intented sequel theory may have some merit after all.
Edit: In fact, this EGM scan comes after the Dracula X preview that you posted, Inccubus. So that seems to imply that those screens where from the original Rondo.
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Under closer inspection of the top and middle picture you can see differences from the pc-engine version
pic 1 huge keyhole on door
middle pic in that screen of rondo I don't recall bone towers
knowing they could have made a better port pisses me off >:(
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That big cartoony lock has always been there (you have to beat the big skeleton and the lock breaks after the bell rings), and I'm pretty sure the bone pillar is in that spot.
An actual SNES port of Rondo would have been super awesome, though, had they used the system's wider color palette and touched up the backgrounds a bit. I don't see any reason why there couldn't have been a really faithful and even in some ways improved port, barring CD music. The cutscenes are mostly static and could probably be recreated faithfully (without voice acting), as Cybernator has a similar style of super cool anime-looking scenes.
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No the bone pillars are non existant in that room in rondo I just played the level on my wii.
you were right about the lock.
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They were probably reused press release shots from Rondo.
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Someone, quick, hack the DraculaXX ROM so that it becomes Rondo of Blood in terms of stage design.
'cuz graphics-wise, I LOVE the way DraculaXX looks. The backgrounds and foregrounds have a beautiful comic-book look and the palette is bright.
DraculaX (RoB, that is), by comparison, uses very boring 16x16 tiles very often, and uses Black a lot (like rgb0,0,0 black). It looks very nice, but I know it can look better on a SNES...
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differences
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As mentioned, probably early shots from Rondo, not a Super NES port.
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You're probably right. If i can recall correctly i heard something somewhere on the deep web about an invisible staircase in dracula x (snes) leading to a boss fight and alternate route. probably BS but it makes me wonder if alternate routes where hidden to a point where only 1 can be found
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Someone, quick, hack the DraculaXX ROM so that it becomes Rondo of Blood in terms of stage design.
'cuz graphics-wise, I LOVE the way DraculaXX looks. The backgrounds and foregrounds have a beautiful comic-book look and the palette is bright.
DraculaX (RoB, that is), by comparison, uses very boring 16x16 tiles very often, and uses Black a lot (like rgb0,0,0 black). It looks very nice, but I know it can look better on a SNES...
That´s the things that I liked more of SNES Dracula X. I was impressed at the first stage (burning village) when I see it for the first time. Also, I prefer the music in it, too (I really love the Dance of Illusions track :D). If only there had been more stages in the SNES version...
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Dracula X is a snes port of Rondo of Blood, but changed a lot.
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Ritchet is so cool, he is playable in three games, and four stories, including two which belongs to him. This is even stated in the game itself. Funny how he longs for Maria's virginity, even after she is longing for Alucards. "Ritchet: but he is like Ten thousand years old. Maria: But you met me when I was like nine....."
Rondo of Blood
Vampire Kiss
That one fight in Symphony, which is part of another game
Symphony mini-game, which him and Maria shares.
Vampire Kiss/Dracula X/Rondo of Blood/post-Symphony/and pre-Syphony are all Castlevania V. If it has it's own television series.
While not true, It is also kinda insane, of the idea, that Ritchet was so obsessed with fighting Drac, that he unleashed him, over and over, and over, and over just to face him again and again. I know it was the wizard, working beyond the grave, but man that is insane.
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Ritchet is so cool, he is playable in three games, and four stories, including two which belongs to him. This is even stated in the game itself. Funny how he longs for Maria's virginity, even after she is longing for Alucards. "Ritchet: but he is like Ten thousand years old. Maria: But you met me when I was like nine....."
Rondo of Blood
Vampire Kiss
That one fight in Symphony, which is part of another game
Symphony mini-game, which him and Maria shares.
Vampire Kiss/Dracula X/Rondo of Blood/post-Symphony/and pre-Syphony are all Castlevania V. If it has it's own television series.
While not true, It is also kinda insane, of the idea, that Ritchet was so obsessed with fighting Drac, that he unleashed him, over and over, and over, and over just to face him again and again. I know it was the wizard, working beyond the grave, but man that is insane.
(https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQiQyLfY7u7M1oxDXmLywtrGuQSc23seG-5GB8Du-qjMLUDC7twaQ)