Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: Azmodan on September 24, 2007, 05:47:44 PM
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Marto's thread had me wondering- was it really necessary for the Castlevania series to lighten the mood, use anime of shitty quality, and dumb down the plotlines- all for the sake of widening the target audience? Granted, Curse of Darkness's artwork and grim plot did soften the shock of DoS's kid-oriented story and generic new characters, but it still left a noticeable smudge on an otherwise polished game.
Do you all think those efforts were necessary, and do you think it actually worked?
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I remember a similar question was asked to IGA, & he said that he thinks the style half-succeeded, whatever that means. I don't think it's necessary since CV has been around forever. Maybe IGA's bosses simply told him to switch up the style to attract more Japanese gamers?
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I think, when it comes to the DS anime character styles, it has to do with the fact that the sprites are hand drawn. I think maybe the artists who do the characters artwork, also does the drawings for the sprites so it makes it easier to go by. Of course, Kojima could have redesigned them after it was all taken care of, but I have read that her artwork takes awhile to complete and I'm sure with Dracula X Chronicles and other projects outside of Konami, she may just not have had the time.
As much as I love her artwork and I think it's an important part to the games style, it doesn' effect the amount of fun I have playing the games
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Hell, yes. Kids these days need a break from all the Halo and Guitar Hero. They need real games, like this and Contra! Castlevania gave me a profound amount of love for past-generation games.
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I'm sure a lot of the decisions made to attract newer fans has more to do with Konami than it does IGA. Just the nature of corporations these days. :^\
That said, I think they should do whatever they want and make the games they want to make and if kids like it, cool, if not, that's fine too. Castlevania is in a unique position because it's not as huge as Final Fantasy so if they make drastic changes, they don't have as much to lose if people don't like the game.
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I think that they coold attract more people to Castlevania with other ways. That anime style doesn't get fit to the series. I prefer Castlevania games more gothic, dark and scary.
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I want only Kojima`s artwork for Castlevania, especially for the next DS game. I can`t stand those simple anime drawings. That is not Castlevania. I liked playing DOS and POR, but I was put off by artwork. It could be so much better. IGA, please listen to us! [expects IGA to hear this..] And no humor, please. Give us some serious games, gothic, dark, with Ayame`s breathtaking art, Yamane`s excellent music and great gameplay. Oh, and new monster sprites, too. There are more creatures in mythology to be found! Use them, and use your imagination.
Do we have IGA`s e-mail address? ;D
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In Reply To #7
Now this is what i call true words, for description about what castlevania games they should have been. I'm with you all the way and IGA better listen to those words.
Bring Kojima back!!!!!
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I think IGA has a blog somewhere (but of course, Japanese-only)
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I actually like teh anime looks, but yea, it doens't really fit these games. I wish it would come with darker tone and setting.
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I'd have to say the anime artwork doesn't bug me too much but I would much rather prefer the gothic style.
I mean to be honest, I would love more people to get into the series (it's doing pretty good now) but I think RoB (original), Dawn, and PoR are prime examples why anime artwork maybe isn't the best way to go. (Or at least the artist they seem to get for said games, minus the cover for Rondo because that was quite detailed and well done.)
The covers look arguably bad (I still shiver looking at Dawn's) the character designs look arguably horrible (I laughed at how bad the vampire twins looked and past Mina and Yoko, we won't get started on Dawn). While the sprites themselves aren't that bad, I think the anime artwork ruins the tone once we get to the cutscenes or in game story. And that's where it bothers me the most.
I mean, you're suppose to be travelling through a demon invested castle, with the fate of humanity (or in Soma's case, his own) or the lives of your loved ones at stake. But once you put all the silly, generic anime features in the storyline, I find that it becomes far too light hearted and takes away from what could have been (in all three cases) a darker and far more serious seeming tale. PoR bothered me because had it not been bottled down with the silliness, with all the tragic circumstances presented in the game, the presentation could have been a fine one indeed.
You'll notice a big difference when you play the remake of RoB compared to the original and it's cutscenes, since the remake has a darker feel to it and the original is just...laughable at times, esp. whenever Maria is near the screen.
Not sure if what I said makes any since but...
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In Reply To #1
Thank you very much!
Yes, I agree with almost everything in this board. Most of all, aside from the art: STOP the humor bullshit, it's repetitive, and unfitting. Yes, Curse of Darkness and Lament did well with Piko Piko Hammer, goofy familiars, and other SUBTLE things that emphasized humor. None of that immature crap about pervy priests, Military men having middle-school crushes, and much more. Also, please, PLEASE bring back the dark music. Enough of this uppity-hippity crap. There were too many tracks that were just unpleasantly fluffy sounding in both the DS games.
Also, one thing I've always noticed, is that the less characters in a game, the better. Castlevania's always had a desolate feel, and there's always been this sense of seclusion within an expansive area. I don't like the fact that in the new ones, there's someone around every corner, they're too easy to reach, and in the latest one, there's even someone with you at absolutely ANY time, ANY where.
I like the Kojima-illustrated games, because I've noticed a trend. They all have very dark music, all with unique styles, but still GOTHIC, dark, and true to their name, they all have serious mature characters, very elegant appearance, and dark gloomy settings. That, in my opinion, is Castlevania's charm and wonder.
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In Reply To #1
It didn't bother me at first because DoS was the first CV game I played.
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I think the wording of the title of this thread is a little off from what the poster meant.
"Is it necessary to attract children to Castlevania?"
They way it sounds to me is, "is necessary for a 3rd party to introduce kids to the Castlevania franchise."
I'm sure you mean to say is, "Is it necessary to make Castlevania more attractive to kids?"
Assuming that is what you meant and from what other people are talking about in the thread, we're mostly calling into question the new art of the characters; the anime stlye.
I don't think that the new box art for the DS attracted any significant amount of new fans to the series than the traditional art. The reason why is that there is nothing else out there in the media to support the change i.e. a television show. IF Konami had launched a new cartoon series in North America with the same anime style as the box art, then the answer would be a resounding "yes."
Without the support of television, movies or graphic novels, it makes little sense to try to change the outer image of a game to target a younger demographic.
Younger kids like to see and play what older kids are playing. In this situation where the younger kids don't have TV telling them what to buy, they look to see what their peers are playing so those are the kids that the franchise needs to (and usually does) target.
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You know, no matter what the artwork looks like, or how comical the game can be, I'm always super excited when they show new games, I always play the hell out of it, but most importantly I always have fun. I've been playing Castlevania since the beginning and through out the entire series I was maybe disappointed twice, the 64 games, cause they make me nauseous and Harmony of dissonance, just cause I really don't like it. As lame as Sonia is I even find Legends to be fun. I prefer and love the Kojima art and the dark settings but if its fun and its Castlevania, I'm going to play it no matter what.
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I'm sure you mean to say is, "Is it necessary to make Castlevania more attractive to kids?"
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Yes, that's what I meant, I meant to word the title "Was it necessary to make Castlevania appealing to kids?"
And that's actually quite admirable of you, profbeanburrito. It seems nowadays so many Castlevania fans are pessimistic about one thing or another (like me and the anime art, for example), but you play them for the reason they're made; entertainment.
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And that's actually quite admirable of you, profbeanburrito. It seems nowadays so many Castlevania fans are pessimistic about one thing or another (like me and the anime art, for example), but you play them for the reason they're made; entertainment.
Hey thanks! When I was 5-years-old, so many years ago, the first game I owned by myself (my bro and I shared games growing up)Was Castlevania III: Dracula's Curse. And I remember playing that game all the time, even if the farthest I could get was the swamp. So for me, and I'm sure a lot of you too, Castlevania has a very special place in my heart. I'll agree there are things I don't like now and then but even through all the ups and downs of the series I'll always continue to play it no matter what.
Think about this though, Kojima's not going to do CV art forever, and Iga's not always going to be with the series either. It's going to change. Everything about it is at some point. There's not a whole lot we can do about it, so even if there's something you don't like try and make the best of it and enjoy it for its good points.
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They should almost put alcoholic beverages on there, even though they couldn't. : P A dozen or so 12~14 year olds where busted with underages not to far away from me... I swear kids are drinking younger and younger... geeez. : P
But I honestly find it a plus if the artwork turns out good for ANY game, in my eyes that is. It lets me connect more on the game perhaps, I dunno. But I do know that I'd like to see the older style of artwork come back to Castlevania... Dracula Chronicles X is going in the right direction I think!
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In general, attracting a younger audience to the world of Castlevania is good. Coz cmon, we all started out playing Castlevania when we were young and all grew up with it. Why close the doors of Castlevania to new players? Although that said, Castlevania must NOT look kiddie. I mean we all grew up playing Castlevania sporting artwork that are definitely NOT kiddie, so why do we need to do that just to attract a new audiences to the mix? IGA should keep all the qualities that make Castlevania so good and improve on it, while making the series accomodating for new players. Why not have a selectable difficulty in the first place to begin with so that BOTH veteran players and newbies can appreciate the new Castlevania games in their own ways.
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According to Koji, when he was making the gba games a study was conducted that showed the artwork wasn't in accordance to the handheld they were on(being that the target gameboy audience are minors). Thus, the decision was made for the DS games to have a more kid-friendly look, since the age demographic that owns DS are mainly youngin's. On the other hand, he was asked if the decision to change artists was a good one; he stated that he believes him & his team half-succeeded, whatever that means.
Honestly, If the next DS game has similar artwork, will that stop any of you complaining from buying it? It's really not a big deal.
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In Reply To #20
I'll definitely still buy it, though I'd much prefer a darker, more gothic style of artwork. I think IGA knows the anime style doesn't fit Castlevania, and the kicker is, that despite all that research (which, I think a LOT of things are actually OVERresearched these days) they STILL didn't get it right.
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Honestly, If the next DS game has similar artwork, will that stop any of you complaining from buying it? It's really not a big deal.
If it'll be as bad as por, i'll probably pirate it.
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Decisions like kiddie-fying the DS games does seem to smack of a company decision. IGA has more-or-less admitted the series cannot continue as it is and will need to change at some stage. There
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I wouldn't mind it broading out, I just don't want it to have to dumb down to Yu Gi Oh! status just to get there. Keep it gothic and dark, but change whatever else is needed to make it work.
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I wouldn't mind it broading out, I just don't want it to have to dumb down to Yu Gi Oh! status just to get there. Keep it gothic and dark, but change whatever else is needed to make it work.
Agreed. We don't need something that has a distinct style to change. I mean, to me it makes no sense why they'd even call it Castlevania if they changed its course.
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Is it necessary to attract children to Castlevania?
Dracula: Psst! Hey! Hey, boy! You there! Come here, I have some candy for you!
Child: No way mister!
Dracula: Why not? I have candy, don't you want it?
Child: Mommy said I should not talk with evil old vampires that I don't know.
Dracula: I have some Castlevania for you.
Child: Hmmm... I don't know, does it have anime?
Dracula: Yep!
Child: And DragonBallZ-like action?
Dracula: You bet cha!
Child: And even girls with big boobs? And RPG elements?
Dracula: Plenty 'o them!
Child: Yay! Let's go mister!
Dracula: Bwahahahahaha
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In Reply To #26
That's very nice. It make me laugh for some time. Nice thinking.
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Well I am 13 and I am very happy that there is a great game series but they have dimmed it down to anime cartoonish style games, and now CV lost it's gothic touch...