Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: KaZudra on August 15, 2016, 05:28:35 PM
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Symphony of The Night is Castlevania's "Lightning in the Bottle", you can play it countless times and find something new or even play it in a new way and it has considerably aged very well. But, aside from the PSP remake, How could This gem be remastered when it's very good to begin with?
Good thing is, when searching for ways to improve personal projects, I cam across a few amazing things that could ultimately benefit a possible SOTN remaster.
16:9 Resolution, it's rather simple, just draw more on the screen and force center some of the smaller rooms, you could even go as far as utilizing more vertical space as scaling 2D elements aren't as restricting as they were in the past.
https://youtu.be/8-XrMA1ayf4 (https://youtu.be/8-XrMA1ayf4)
Dynamic Lighting, with techniques as lightmapping, it can be utilized greatly with giving candles light sources, and other sources of dynamic light. The end result would leave a more stunning approach as background elements pop more giving the illusion of depth a greater effect.
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F2.bp.blogspot.com%2F-NEFaqDiqqSU%2FVIIA2on16UI%2FAAAAAAAABlg%2FTSVhPmxFtJc%2Fs800%2FSprite_DLight_Infograph.png&hash=8e9cbd0e45ecc5394fc7985b386b22a25f02d51f)
Cleaning up that inventory, and Keybindings.
The Saturn SotN gave us one great thing, a devoted button just for usable items. With this you get a more flowing game in which you pop a potion whilst Shield dashing without the annoying menu transitions.
Speaking of those menus, the biggest thing SoTN has is it's massive inventory, Let's clean this up a bit and make things nicer to find, the Organize function is great, but you'll find yourself still going to the bottom because you switched equipment to use a potion.
3-frame input window and more simplified Spells.
How many times have you Dark Metamorphisis'd when trying to soul steal? How many times did you just not do the spell because you have to do inputs questionably as complex as a KOF MAX DM? That can be cleared up with simple solutions by tuning some inputs and making it slightly more lenient to perform.
Retuned Difficulty, This is a must because it addresses the major flaw in SoTN and all IGAvanias; The Difficulty Curve.
The game may start off rather difficult, then it feels "just right" but half way through the inverted castle nothing in the game could pose any sort of threat to you.
Why not just have enemies progress with the player; Let's say Skeleton is weak, but after hitting a certain level, Skeleton would now be at level 2, now being just as challenging as he was in the begging and maybe packing a few new tricks up his sleeves to keep the player surprised.
OPTIONAL; 32:32 tiles
a 2x redraw of the Entirety of SotN would be stunning, but It will be a great deal of work.
OPTIONAL; Foreground play
A great way to give depth in a 2D game is to use foreground textures occasionally, it would give the player a better sense of the scale of that room or hallway.
What do you guys think?
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16:9 Resolution, it's rather simple, just draw more on the screen and force center some of the smaller rooms, you could even go as far as utilizing more vertical space as scaling 2D elements aren't as restricting as they were in the past.
Resolution increase is an obvious one. A larger field of view would certainly make the game look nicer, if anything.
Dynamic Lighting, with techniques as lightmapping, it can be utilized greatly with giving candles light sources, and other sources of dynamic light. The end result would leave a more stunning approach as background elements pop more giving the illusion of depth a greater effect.
This work wonders at having the opening and some of the underground areas give off a darker and creepier vibe than ever before. The catacombs in particular would especially benefit from this.
As for inventory, yes, clean that up. Simply making it similar to later Igavanias would suffice, as those had much cleaner inventories. As for Alucard's spells, they don't even need those inputs. Just make them similar to Harmony of Despair. One button mixed with a directional input.
Retuned Difficulty, This is a must because it addresses the major flaw in SoTN and all IGAvanias; The Difficulty Curve.
The game may start off rather difficult, then it feels "just right" but half way through the inverted castle nothing in the game could pose any sort of threat to you.
Why not just have enemies progress with the player; Let's say Skeleton is weak, but after hitting a certain level, Skeleton would now be at level 2, now being just as challenging as he was in the begging and maybe packing a few new tricks up his sleeves to keep the player surprised.
Absolutely on rebalancing the difficulty, but enemies scaling with you in level completely defeats the purpose of leveling up in the first place. There's no point in increasing your stats and levels if the enemies just get stronger too. It's simply artificial difficulty and you may as well remove the leveling system in the first place.
Other ways of doing it better would simply be: Make it take longer to level up, maybe? I dunno about anyone else, but I found leveling up to be obnoxiously easy in SotN. Lowering the amount of EXP you get from kills might alleviate this, saving the big amounts for boss fights and other tough enemies like Final Armor.
Give enemies special abilities and stuff that they use only once you become much stronger (say, two or three levels higher)? Mermen fire off their water beams instead of fireballs, zombies will occasionally run at you rather than simply shamble, skeletons throw their bones in straight lines as well as upward arcs, etc. This would especially surprise the player if instead of them simply getting stronger, instead their enemy behavior changes.
Later on in the game when you're like Level 30 and you decide to go back to the Castle Entrance, SotN had the right idea and added new stronger enemies to the area. But if these were done in larger numbers, it'd be a lot cooler. This would give off a better vibe of Shaft realizing what he put out wasn't enough and sends stronger forces after you.
OPTIONAL; Foreground play
A great way to give depth in a 2D game is to use foreground textures occasionally, it would give the player a better sense of the scale of that room or hallway.
I agree to this ONLY if the foreground elements become transparent when you pass behind them, or you can see a silhouette of all characters and interactive elements behind it. If all it does is simply inhibit view for the sake of atmosphere, then it's a pointless addition that hurts the game more than it enhances it. I've played too many 2D games where you can't see anything behind a pillar and fighting enemies and such becomes a hassle.
Otherwise, I'd love a remastered SotN. The closest thing we're getting to that right now is Esco's remake, but I feel like we'll have an actual SotN remake by the time Esco's comes out.
If there's anything I'd throw into the pot, it's a better sense of direction. Later Igavanias (aside from OoE) don't make it completely clear where to go, but SotN just outright has no conveyance a lot of the time.
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-Remake the whole game 2.5D style.
-Add the areas on the saturn version missing on the PSX.
-All the 3 Characters playable.
-New Game+.
-Hard Difficulty.
-Boss Rush Mode.
-New enemies and items.
-New and longer cutscenes getting deeper into the story.
-Bestiary on the pause menu.
-More and usefull Familiars.
-Better exp system (farming exp from lvl65 or higher is annoying).
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Actually there is a way to avoid difficulty and enemy scaling issues while catering to the spectrum of SOTN and Metroidvania fans. Just add difficulty settings which were in POR and OOE; Normal, Hard, and max caps which go from none>100>>>>1.
As Claimh said there's really no point in leveling up if your enemies gain more levels by default. Especially by the time the second Castle is reached they become incrementally difficult.
I would also say that the second Castle should be re-worked to retain the inverted map but perhaps being tweaked internally and visually to make more sense. From an atmospheric point of view for example, the Castle's entrance (Inverted) could show a sky rather than a ceiling plane and a drawbridge (where the player enters Castlevania in the first castle.) Perhaps the inverted catacombs could have water droplets trickling to the floor, seeing as the pools of water are on the ceiling. The same logic could be applied to enemies and their placement, as some areas of the inverted castle were done well but others became dead zones.
A couple of extra tracks for the inverted castle may also be nice. People criticise the game for its lacking in this regard, but tracks like The Lost Painting are top tier imo.
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A couple of extra tracks for the inverted castle may also be nice. People criticise the game for its lacking in this regard, but tracks like The Lost Painting are top tier imo.
They could've used NitM's extra tracks for some of the inverted castle areas in the DXC's SotN.
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If there's one thing I would ask for, it's a properly rebalanced Maria. Her Saturn incarnation was pretty broken, while her PSP incarnation was pretty much the opposite, almost completely helpless with how little damage she can take and give.
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If there's one thing I would ask for, it's a properly rebalanced Maria. Her Saturn incarnation was pretty broken, while her PSP incarnation was pretty much the opposite, almost completely helpless with how little damage she can take and give.
I like broken Maria though. They should just include both iterations but include a nerfed SS version (in strength and magic)
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Maria has more power than a Belmont, so she should be broken.
Talking about her, they should add Monster!Maria
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At least they could remove the waiting time after you die. Even for a punishment of dying its far too horrid.
Making the game harder would also be great.
And maybe not restrict but make the use of some forms more difficult so that when you feel bored you don't use the forms to "cheat".
Also like some one already said new visual effects would be great.
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At least they could remove the waiting time after you die. Even for a punishment of dying its far too horrid.
Yes, include a retry function which takes you to the previous save point.
And maybe not restrict but make the use of some forms more difficult so that when you feel bored you don't use the forms to "cheat".
If Maria's invincibility drained her health, I'm sure that would actually make her game harder, seeing as you need to cross spikes etc at some point.
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At least they could remove the waiting time after you die. Even for a punishment of dying its far too horrid.
100% agree. I think I've been spoiled by modern games like Uncharted, The Last of Us, or even games as far back as Jak & Daxter, that just straight-up throw you back into the game right after death. It's gotten to the point where sitting through a game over screen, especially one as long as SotN's, is mind-numbingly annoying. At least make it a short screen like later Igavanias (that can be skipped, too).
If Maria's invincibility drained her health, I'm sure that would actually make her game harder, seeing as you need to cross spikes etc at some point.
Kiiiiiiiiiinda defeats the purpose of invincibility if you lose your health while using it. And your point about making the game harder, that's straight-up artificial difficulty. They need to make the game harder in meaningful ways, not cheap ways.
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Kiiiiiiiiiinda defeats the purpose of invincibility if you lose your health while using it.
Not if your health drains slowly and you're using it to cross difficult areas.
They need to make the game harder in meaningful ways, not cheap ways.
Cheap is overusing invincibility. One may argue Lv1 hard mode is cheap, but it's an option that I would take nonetheless.
Take DMC4SE's Legendary Knight or Dante must die mode for example, that's cheap in certain areas, but it's an option for those who like the challenge.
As one example, if you could use the invincibility to cross spikes but then had to deactivate it 5-10 seconds after to not lose too much life, this would mean you could potentially cross the room into a neighbouring save point. Or you could use it temporarily but you couldn't keep spamming it to fight certain enemies and bosses, for eg Galamoth.
This is why I'm saying have the different iterations of Maria. Keep the broken Maria for the more casual player who wants to trash the Castle, add more difficulty in other ways which don't apply to classic CV (which btw was incredibly cheap at times) because they're not the same thing.
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Mostly merging and refining the DXC and Saturn versions. I'd want Richter in his goddamn SOTN outfit, a story for Richter (make it a prequel that explains how Shaft got the jump on him) and another for Maria (probably one concurrent with Alucard's take on events), and the additional areas, items, and enemies from the Saturn port (just not sucky this time, and much more sprawling in the case of the new areas). Also standard stuff like a resolution bump, dynamic lighting, and a remastered soundtrack would all work.
Now if we were talking FULL REMAKE (SOTN being one of the few Castlevanias that really deserves one), this list would get a whole lot longer.
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Mostly merging and refining the DXC and Saturn versions. I'd want Richter in his goddamn SOTN outfit, a story for Richter (make it a prequel that explains how Shaft got the jump on him) and another for Maria (probably one concurrent with Alucard's take on events), and the additional areas, items, and enemies from the Saturn port (just not sucky this time, and much more sprawling in the case of the new areas). Also standard stuff like a resolution bump, dynamic lighting, and a remastered soundtrack would all work.
Now if we were talking FULL REMAKE (SOTN being one of the few Castlevanias that really deserves one), this list would get a whole lot longer.
Only problem with a full remake is that there is no guarantee that the lightning in the bottle will be captured.
I mean, a full remake would be great, there are plenty of secret power-ups that can be implemented and refined mechanics, let's say, Wolf Speed Boost can open areas up and other things, but too much tampering could change why people liked it in the first place.
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I love that you responded to the least important/relevant part of my post there.
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I love that you responded to the least important/relevant part of my post there.
I agree with the other stuff, with some re-tuning the Saturn content would be great, I would personally utilize the new areas as more linking throughout the castle so routing can be more emphasized rather than backtracking.
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Mostly merging and refining the DXC and Saturn versions. I'd want Richter in his goddamn SOTN outfit, a story for Richter (make it a prequel that explains how Shaft got the jump on him) and another for Maria (probably one concurrent with Alucard's take on events), and the additional areas, items, and enemies from the Saturn port (just not sucky this time, and much more sprawling in the case of the new areas). Also standard stuff like a resolution bump, dynamic lighting, and a remastered soundtrack would all work.
Of these, the only thing I'd demand is an SotN outfit for Richter. A proper one, not the shoddy one from the Saturn version. A Richter story would be really cool, and hell, they could even make his story just a retelling of Rondo in SotN's format (though everything from Stage 1 would have to be retold in the opening text crawl due to the lack of a town).
Actually, I'd like that. Richter's story could be a retelling of Rondo of Blood, ending with his "Die Monster!" fight from the beginning of SotN (though no cheap ass "RECKON YOUR STRENGTH" Maria saving you, and obviously a restructured final boss to make him actually difficult), and Maria's could be a story taking place between Rondo and Symphony that details Richter's disappearance, detailing what she did during Alucard's story, and her and Richter escaping the castle after Alucard ascends to the Inverted Castle.
Thus, you'd have a version of SotN that tells the entire Dracula X storyline in one game.
As for the new areas, yeah, I'd love if they were expanded and actually served a purpose. As far as I remember of the Saturn version, you don't really get anything for going into them, and they don't even add toward map completion. In particular, a revisit to our good friend The Forgotten One could be added to the Cursed Prison.
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Actually, I'd like that. Richter's story could be a retelling of Rondo of Blood, ending with his "Die Monster!" fight from the beginning of SotN...
Thus, you'd have a version of SotN that tells the entire Dracula X storyline in one game.
I like this idea very much.
As for the new areas, yeah, I'd love if they were expanded and actually served a purpose. As far as I remember of the Saturn version, you don't really get anything for going into them, and they don't even add toward map completion. In particular, a revisit to our good friend The Forgotten One could be added to the Cursed Prison.
The Cursed prison actually does serve a purpose, it's much quicker than having to track all the way around before you have superjump or bat. I always felt that part of the Castle was lacking a connection and was pleasantly surprised at this. Plus its tracks in both Castles were really nice from memory.
The underground garden doesn't really serve a purpose but at least there is a boss fight there.
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The Cursed prison actually does serve a purpose, it's much quicker than having to track all the way around before you have superjump or bat. I always felt that part of the Castle was lacking a connection and was pleasantly surprised at this. Plus its tracks in both Castles were really nice from memory.
The underground garden doesn't really serve a purpose but at least there is a boss fight there.
To be fair, Symphony's castle wasn't all that big to begin with, on top of the fact that there are teleport rooms littered everywhere in the castle. It does add a mild convenience having that extra track there, but it seems like a waste to add this whole new area of the castle and only use it as a shortcut. That could've been done simply by just extending the two connecting areas.
The Cursed Prison can serve as a connected area and have something worthwhile about it otherwise. A cool boss fight that leads to a nice item or something like that would be cool. Does the Underground Garden have anything like that after the boss fight or is the boss fight just there?
Y'KNOW BECAUSE I BROUGHT UP TELEPORT ROOMS, maybe giving us the ability to choose where to teleport to would be nice.
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There should be 4 playable characters:
A whip-snapping vampire hunter who is a member of the Belmont clan. Another playable character would be Alucard. He
is Dracula's son who first made an appearence in the classic Nintendo Entertainment System game, Castlevania III. There should also be a sword-slinging bounty hunter and a peasent girl.
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There should be 4 playable characters:
The 4th one should play more like Grant. The other 3 are already basically covered.