Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: DraculaCronqvist on July 05, 2017, 09:59:13 PM
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So, this is a thread not for those who like Lords of Shadows and its sequels, but for those who disliked or even hated it. If you are a non-fan, was there anything that you still liked about the three games, the story, the design? Any element at all that you feel was good or salvageable about the series you do not like? Playing devil's advocate here, so to speak, as I myself really loathe the LoS universe. But even I found a few things I liked, even though it was in no way enough to salvage the whole thing for me in any capacity.
For instance, the Combat Cross was one of the things I liked. I liked the design and the idea behind it, that you had to upgrade it gradually to make it stronger and unlock more abilities.
So, what things from LoS and its sequels did you like as someone who generally doesn't like that universe?
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As a game I enjoyed the 1st LoS a lot. As a Castlevania game I think MoF was great though I've admittedly only played the HD version.
Storywise I love the idea of a Belmont being turned into a vampire by Dracula. Don't love it being Trevor becoming Alucard, and hate the aspect of Dracula starting the Belmont line but the concept itself was pretty great, and well executed.
I like the brotherhood of light a lot, especially in LoS2, unfortunately they were the only interesting part of that game. Well... The toymaker was pretty cool.
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Carmilla's cleavage
thread over
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Patrick Stewart.
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Robert Carlyle ♥
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Carmilla's cleavage
thread over
Fucken oath. Two weapons that can cleave vision with 1 strike..
I liked the gameplay of the first LOS for the most part, parrying felt rewarding.
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How old are you guys?
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How old are you guys?
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I'm a fan of LoS1, save for Gabriel's incredible bursts of dumbness and the final stretch of the plot (ta-dah! Zobek made you kill your wife!... ta-dah! Zobek is the mastermind!... ta-dah! a guy previously hinted only by two lines in the entire game is that actual mastermind!... ta-dah! Gabriel is Dracula!)
Mirror of Fate... I'm a fan only of the graphics and that's the most I can say without laughing.
LoS2 I'm a fan of the graphics, of many character designs and the fact they made the "castle is an actual living entity" concept much more obvious and scary... That's pretty much it.
On the whole trilogy I'm a huge fan of the acting. But acting alone can't save a game.
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How old are you guys?
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Okay, so we got some joke answers and some people who apparently can't read, as this is for those who didn't like LoS at all but only certain aspects of it here and there.
EDIT: Then again, LoS in itself is a joke, so I should perhaps not have expected much.
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I was deathly serious
Carmilla's tits are the only good thing in 2
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I was deathly serious
Carmilla's tits are the only good thing in 2
Huh... well, in that case. XD
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I was deathly serious
Carmilla's tits are the only 2 good things in 2
Added a number to your statement.
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Actually on a more serious note
-I ain't in the "dislike most but still like a few" in regards to 1. I overall enjoyed and like 1.
-MoF IMO is just stupid. Looks pretty but that's about it and even that's a stretch at times (LOL CELSHADED BRIGHTASS CUTSCENES WHY NOT).
Now as for things I liked, either genuinely or somewhat ironically. Should be able to tell which.
-2 has Carmilla's glorious bust and I have no shame in admitting I enjoyed it. The implication is that the castle consciousness or whatever gave her her original form because her vampire form couldn't seduce Gabe the first time, and that's the only sensible reason I can think of as to why she's suddenly human again. So since the actual plot intent was sex appeal and seduction, I have N O S H A M E. Carmilla in general I liked a bit (partly yes because she's damn hot), though the seduction aspect doesn't really work when you're literally just a mental figment and can't actually offer anything substantial.
-Death by blowjob symbolism? Totally stupid and nonsensical but damn if I won't give 2 points for that ballsy shamelessness and continuation of the tease.
-2 has Marie actually taking a somewhat more active role than in 1, and I like this. Doesn't change that she still stays a damsel in distress a few times, but at least the Carmilla fight takes an interesting approach of "yes, I'm a born-again Heaven Human that can't really help you much here because I can't fight, but I can offer you my body and my blood so that you may be healed and strengthened to destroy this great foe." I mean Marie is basically a Jesus redemption allegory in that respect.
-I liked Nergal, oddly enough. Reminded me a lot of how I always pictured Olrox to be personality-wise. Can't say much else for him though.
-Gabula mic-dropping the Paladin by doing the same freestyle rap only better. 10/10 scene.
-The triumphant return of Japan's favorite metal cylinder portable ashtray that all the cool videogame smokers use! (these things are actually p. handy for that but they're shoddily made and fall apart easily)
-Zobek Death was neat I guess. Not particularly interesting as a fight because lol MINION SUMMON GANK cliche but at least the design was neat. Also why is Zobek the only Lord who gets to keep his voice when he transforms? We ever gonna get a fuckin' answer on that? It's been driving me nuts for ages.
-I liked the modern aspect of 2, at least in concept. Its execution was shit because of little things like how the fuck is a dude that's been asleep/away for a thousand years gonna know what the term "pharmaceutical company" means without any explanation given, but at least it tried.
-Oh man remember those punching weapons ripped straight from Devil May Cry and God of War? Those were awesome!
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-Zobek Death was neat I guess. Not particularly interesting as a fight because lol MINION SUMMON GANK cliche but at least the design was neat. Also why is Zobek the only Lord who gets to keep his voice when he transforms? We ever gonna get a fuckin' answer on that? It's been driving me nuts for ages.
Patrick Stewart.
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Actually on a more serious note
-I ain't in the "dislike most but still like a few" in regards to 1. I overall enjoyed and like 1.
-MoF IMO is just stupid. Looks pretty but that's about it and even that's a stretch at times (LOL CELSHADED BRIGHTASS CUTSCENES WHY NOT).
Now as for things I liked, either genuinely or somewhat ironically. Should be able to tell which.
-2 has Carmilla's glorious bust and I have no shame in admitting I enjoyed it. The implication is that the castle consciousness or whatever gave her her original form because her vampire form couldn't seduce Gabe the first time, and that's the only sensible reason I can think of as to why she's suddenly human again. So since the actual plot intent was sex appeal and seduction, I have N O S H A M E. Carmilla in general I liked a bit (partly yes because she's damn hot), though the seduction aspect doesn't really work when you're literally just a mental figment and can't actually offer anything substantial.
-Death by blowjob symbolism? Totally stupid and nonsensical but damn if I won't give 2 points for that ballsy shamelessness and continuation of the tease.
-2 has Marie actually taking a somewhat more active role than in 1, and I like this. Doesn't change that she still stays a damsel in distress a few times, but at least the Carmilla fight takes an interesting approach of "yes, I'm a born-again Heaven Human that can't really help you much here because I can't fight, but I can offer you my body and my blood so that you may be healed and strengthened to destroy this great foe." I mean Marie is basically a Jesus redemption allegory in that respect.
-I liked Nergal, oddly enough. Reminded me a lot of how I always pictured Olrox to be personality-wise. Can't say much else for him though.
-Gabula mic-dropping the Paladin by doing the same freestyle rap only better. 10/10 scene.
-The triumphant return of Japan's favorite metal cylinder portable ashtray that all the cool videogame smokers use! (these things are actually p. handy for that but they're shoddily made and fall apart easily)
-Zobek Death was neat I guess. Not particularly interesting as a fight because lol MINION SUMMON GANK cliche but at least the design was neat. Also why is Zobek the only Lord who gets to keep his voice when he transforms? We ever gonna get a fuckin' answer on that? It's been driving me nuts for ages.
-I liked the modern aspect of 2, at least in concept. Its execution was shit because of little things like how the fuck is a dude that's been asleep/away for a thousand years gonna know what the term "pharmaceutical company" means without any explanation given, but at least it tried.
-Oh man remember those punching weapons ripped straight from Devil May Cry and God of War? Those were awesome!
So you only spoke for MoF and LoS2, good. Because if you liked LoS1, that would defeat the purpose of this thread. Thanks for the actually genuine answer.
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Voice acting. Some good art direction. Some good songs. I can't stand the LoS series.
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Honestly, the only thing i liked is the character's design and art diretion in general. Those games are more plot focused, but the atmosphere was off in a way. Dunno, it didn't feel like Castlevania, LOS could be any other random adventure game. The reboot i wanted was a serie of games with good gameplay and graphics, consolidating all the classic timeline in a cohesive fleshed out story, that probably the castlevania's tv show will do it, insted of Lord of Shadows.
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I liked the fact that you play as a Belmont again is one of it greatest selling points. as I really feel that if IGA had used a Belmont in his new 3d trailer, instead of Alucard he would have kept CV.
As when I saw it I was like wow a what's this, then I saw Alucard. I groaned and rolled my eyes, yet again another try to get the same magic SoTN had. just a cash grab.
and yet then we Mercury Steam, they showed us a cool holy knight, finally A Belmont is back, the guys that made CV what it is.
and I feel that's why MS got CV, and really some of this is on IGAs shoulders.
As no one can say that IGA did not save Cv, as it was going under and he brought back to life.
but he never evolved the game play, it just got more and more far removed from what CV was.
And I feel not using the Belmont's in favour of item collecting was just a really lazy way of doing things. there's so much you could do with the whip. And the worst part was that MS really dropped the ball in a lot of places.
But nuff of that. and yes robert carlyle was fantasic in it, as well as Patrick Stewart . and the gameplay of LOs1 was really well done, it made you feel like you were on an epic quest. It was a shame that there was no real Vampire Killer and that he became Dracula. But all and all a great game.
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The graphics. And Carmilla's sexy bode 8)
Nothing else in that series is relevant to me.
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The graphics. And Carmilla's sexy bode 8)
Nothing else in that series is relevant to me.
No I know what you mean, I feel that LoS1 was like a great side story but it should never had been pushed as the new look For CV. and its sad. they should have gone with Platinum Games fail that Team Ninja. keep in japan, Only few western developers, could handle a full reboot of CV and Mercury Steam was just not up to the task. I mean when you look at CV it is that great Japanese idea of the west, and gothic architecture. it something that really only japan can do.
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I liked the overall character design and characterisation of Gabriel in the first LOS. I think it worked and suited "Castlevania", even if you were to minus the deceased wife aspect - which was basically plot-fodder for commencing and concluding your quest. (Unfortunately the overall world itself didn't work as well as Gabriel did.) The whole Gabriel became Dracula hook i.e. the end of his characterisation didn't really work for me, I mean I think the concept was cool and would've worked better as an alternate ending/ spin-off series, but not as the main story.
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There are a LOT of things I disliked about the LoS series. Though, what I DID like was the look and representation of Dracula's Castle in LoS2 (and the parts in the first LoS). I think they made it (especially with the scenic vistas) look like the MASSIVE behemoth-of-a-castle I always thought it was to be in the pre-LoS games. That and the whole Toymaker area of LoS2. I thought that area (for as small as it was) looked cool.
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im bored so I feel like debating some of yous guys points, disclaimer that I stilll respect everyone's opinion.. just doing this for fun
Those games are more plot focused, but the atmosphere was off in a way. Dunno, it didn't feel like Castlevania, LOS could be any other random adventure game.
The irony here is, had it been titled "Folklore: Tale of the Lords of Shadow" or somethin, while still maintaining all the gameplay, story, etc. everyone here will be pointing out how much in common it has with the Castlevania series.
as I really feel that if IGA had used a Belmont in his new 3d trailer, instead of Alucard he would have kept CV.
Im not sure how you came to this conclusion. Alucard is arguably more popular than any Belmont; there are many non-fans of Castlevania that can still identify Alucard, yet if you show them a picture of Christopher or Trevor, they'll respond with "whos that" or "which 1 is that." Lets be real, they are all just copy-and-paste portraits of one another, whereas Alucard maintains a unique presence among the series
Pretty sure Konami made it clear that they wanted the series to be among the AAA action titles at the time in terms of gameplay & presentation, it had nothing to do with "Belmonts are the #1 selling point of the series." They are important, yes, but not THE MOST important. They weren't confident that IGA & his team could pull it off, so they went with the European team. it's as simple as that, really
and the gameplay of LOs1 was really well done, it made you feel like you were on an epic quest. It was a shame that there was no real Vampire Killer and that he became Dracula. But all and all a great game.
What do you mean by "no real Vampire Killer" exactly? Did you want it to be a leather whip? The weakest form of the weapon in the classic games, until upgraded to the chain flail, which is what the Combat Cross was from the start. in LoS2, the game's plot makes it known that the original CC Gabriel once wielded is the one true "Vampire Killer" of that world. It's their interpretation of the classic weapon
and to be honest, the importance of the "Vampire Killer" title wasn't all that integral to the plot of the classic games (perhaps not up until Bloodlines was produced). As far as we the players were concerned, it was just a magical whip that was probably switched out & replaced in each game (especially so in CVII: Simon's Quest). there was never any indication that a single whip was handed down to each successor. IGA really pushed for how important it truly was in the later games
Dave Cox stated in multiple interviews that their interpretation of Castlevania should be viewed as a "what-if" story, an "elseworlds" take on the traditional mythos where they take unexpected turns & liberties with the plot, just like how there are hundreds of alternative comic book stories that change the storylines of heroes (Superman: Red Son comes to mind, which proposes the idea of Clark landing in the Soviet Union when he was an infant, as opposed to him landing in Smallville, Kansas).
This is exactly what the LoS series is (what if the first Belmont turned to the darkside & became Dracula, thus cursing his descendants to hunt down the family shame for centuries). Konami couldve easily produced "Akumajo Dracula"-style games concurrent with the LoS games, and no fan would've been confused.
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im bored so I feel like debating some of yous guys points, disclaimer that I stilll respect everyone's opinion.. just doing this for fun
The irony here is, had it been titled "Folklore: Tale of the Lords of Shadow" or somethin, while still maintaining all the gameplay, story, etc. everyone here will be pointing out how much in common it has with the Castlevania series.
Im not sure how you came to this conclusion. Alucard is arguably more popular than any Belmont; there are many non-fans of Castlevania that can still identify Alucard, yet if you show them a picture of Christopher or Trevor, they'll respond with "whos that" or "which 1 is that." Lets be real, they are all just copy-and-paste portraits of one another, whereas Alucard maintains a unique presence among the series
Pretty sure Konami made it clear that they wanted the series to be among the AAA action titles at the time in terms of gameplay & presentation, it had nothing to do with "Belmonts are the #1 selling point of the series." They are important, yes, but not THE MOST important. They weren't confident that IGA & his team could pull it off, so they went with the European team. it's as simple as that, really
What do you mean by "no real Vampire Killer" exactly? Did you want it to be a leather whip? The weakest form of the weapon in the classic games, until upgraded to the chain flail, which is what the Combat Cross was from the start. in LoS2, the game's plot makes it known that the original CC Gabriel once wielded is the one true "Vampire Killer" of that world. It's their interpretation of the classic weapon
and to be honest, the importance of the "Vampire Killer" title wasn't all that integral to the plot of the classic games (perhaps not up until Bloodlines was produced). As far as we the players were concerned, it was just a magical whip that was probably switched out & replaced in each game (especially so in CVII: Simon's Quest). there was never any indication that a single whip was handed down to each successor. IGA really pushed for how important it truly was in the later games
Dave Cox stated in multiple interviews that their interpretation of Castlevania should be viewed as a "what-if" story, an "elseworlds" take on the traditional mythos where they take unexpected turns & liberties with the plot, just like how there are hundreds of alternative comic book stories that change the storylines of heroes (Superman: Red Son comes to mind, which proposes the idea of Clark landing in the Soviet Union when he was an infant, as opposed to him landing in Smallville, Kansas).
This is exactly what the LoS series is (what if the first Belmont turned to the darkside & became Dracula, thus cursing his descendants to hunt down the family shame for centuries). Konami couldve easily produced "Akumajo Dracula"-style games concurrent with the LoS games, and no fan would've been confused.
Are joking, ether you've only just started playing CV or your Alucard fan boy.
Simon Belmont is one of the most popular video game charterers of all time.
Everyone knows him, and they know his sprite. the idea of a man and chain whip makes anyone think ohh yeah Simon, and the theme Vampire Killer. Anyone that's played games Knows Simon, and the whip is one of the most well recognized part of CV, even non fans know Simon.
you show em CV and they say oh that guy with the whip. that can brake walls for wall food. So yeah we all saw LoS1 and saw the holy knight, and thought ok yeah, back to the roots.
and I meant a holy whip. That can burn and kill a vampires and demons on contact.
And the combat cross is not one as that's why you need the holy water... or other wise it would have been well we don't need that relic cos I have a whip that's full of holy magic. And kill monster no prob.
not a just a chain.
And the whip had always been very big part, in promotional materials for the first game it said he has a baptised whip.
And almost always says a something like "the magic whip that has been passed down from grandfather, to father, that sort of thing. yes in Simons quest is was buy a new one. But the rest was always talking of it being passed down.
So TBH I think that having a Belmont back really helped Los.
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Are joking, ether you've only just started playing CV or your Alucard fan boy
OUCH... well you got me there ;D
Anyone that’s played games Knows Simon
I wish this was the case my fren... but it really isn’t. He’s not as recognizable as Mario or hell, even Crash Bandicoot. people especially casual gamers are quicker to recognize Pac-Man before Simon. that’s prolly because Castlevania especially the early ones was always kinda a niche series, due to its sheer difficulty. But are you trying to say that if IGA had used Simon (the red-haired, CV Chronicles/Judgment version that was “popular” at the time) in his trailer then he would’ve kept the series?
Is he iconic? Yes absolutely. I’m not saying he isn’t. But that doesn’t mean he’s also instantly recognizable amongst the entire gaming community, especially since there are way more game protagonists these days that have since overshadowed him. I don’t believe he’s on the same level as Mega Man in terms of worldwide notoriety.
I’m kinda confused by your wording so forgive me, it seems like English isn’t your native language. I believe that you’re confusing the plot with the gameplay when you say
and I meant a holy whip. That can burn and kill a vampires and demons on contact
But how many times do we actually fight other vampires in Castlevania games? Only a handful, at best? The Combat Cross, as explained by the in-game description, was drenched in holy water during its construction, it was baptized with holy rituals, and the metal stake at the base was added as the “finishing touch” to officially give it the title “Vampire Killer,” since stakes historically are the most popular way to “kill” a vampire. So I’m still confused as to what your argument against the Combat Cross not being a true vampire killer *FOR THE LORDS OF SHADOW MYTHOS* is, since all the evidence I presented states otherwise. I suggest you look up the Combat Cross on the Castlevania Wiki if you don’t believe my words ;)
Edit: concerning what you said about the games always saying “the whip has been passed down from grandfather & so forth for generations,” that’s both true & untrue. The early games, from what I recall, barely place an extreme importance on a “single whip” being passed down. Instead they placed importance on the Belmont BLOODLINE, that just happens to use a whip as their weapon of choice. In the IGA era the whip has substantially more significance, and the fact that Belmonts wielding random whips was pretty much retconned at that point. CV:Belmont’s Revenge, I believe it states that there was a holy ceremony that gave Christoph’s son Soleiyu the TITLE of Vampire Hunter/Killer. Which suggests that they’ve been doing this for centuries. It doesn’t say “Soleiyu inherited the title from his father and thus was granted the Holy Whip Vampire Killer which was passed down from the Belmont Family for ages.” He even has his OWN whip when you fight him in the game, so...
like I said before, Belmonts being important to CV? Yaaas, especially to us hardcore fans. But that’s not the sole reason everyone else buy the games, it’s not “playing as a Belmont is paramount to our enjoyment of the series” for them
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I liked the artwork and they're version of Simon looked cool.
It's all I got.
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I liked the artwork and they're version of Simon looked cool.
It's all I got.
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Edit: concerning what you said about the games always saying “the whip has been passed down from grandfather & so forth for generations,” that’s both true & untrue. The early games, from what I recall, barely place an extreme importance on a “single whip” being passed down. Instead they placed importance on the Belmont BLOODLINE, that just happens to use a whip as their weapon of choice. In the IGA era the whip has substantially more significance, and the fact that Belmonts wielding random whips was pretty much retconned at that point.
There is no controversy. In the first game, the very last line of the story says that the "whip with mysterious powers" was inherited by Simon from his forefathers. CVIII later establishes that the whip, along with the other weapons, are handed down from generation to generation. So it's a no brainer that they were using the same whip everytime (even on Christopher's case, Soleiyu inherited only the title, not the whip. They were supposed to form a vampire-hunting team, explaining why Christopher retained the whip).
I do agree with your point that the bloodline was more important. But there really WAS an importance on the whip being the same, and it was established right in the first game, even if it's true jtat many players didn't have access to this information.
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OUCH... well you got me there ;D
I wish this was the case my fren... but it really isn’t. He’s not as recognizable as Mario or hell, even Crash Bandicoot. people especially casual gamers are quicker to recognize Pac-Man before Simon. that’s prolly because Castlevania especially the early ones was always kinda a niche series, due to its sheer difficulty. But are you trying to say that if IGA had used Simon (the red-haired, CV Chronicles/Judgment version that was “popular” at the time) in his trailer then he would’ve kept the series?
Is he iconic? Yes absolutely. I’m not saying he isn’t. But that doesn’t mean he’s also instantly recognizable amongst the entire gaming community, especially since there are way more game protagonists these days that have since overshadowed him. I don’t believe he’s on the same level as Mega Man in terms of worldwide notoriety.
I’m kinda confused by your wording so forgive me, it seems like English isn’t your native language. I believe that you’re confusing the plot with the gameplay when you say
But how many times do we actually fight other vampires in Castlevania games? Only a handful, at best? The Combat Cross, as explained by the in-game description, was drenched in holy water during its construction, it was baptized with holy rituals, and the metal stake at the base was added as the “finishing touch” to officially give it the title “Vampire Killer,” since stakes historically are the most popular way to “kill” a vampire. So I’m still confused as to what your argument against the Combat Cross not being a true vampire killer *FOR THE LORDS OF SHADOW MYTHOS* is, since all the evidence I presented states otherwise. I suggest you look up the Combat Cross on the Castlevania Wiki if you don’t believe my words ;)
Edit: concerning what you said about the games always saying “the whip has been passed down from grandfather & so forth for generations,” that’s both true & untrue. The early games, from what I recall, barely place an extreme importance on a “single whip” being passed down. Instead they placed importance on the Belmont BLOODLINE, that just happens to use a whip as their weapon of choice. In the IGA era the whip has substantially more significance, and the fact that Belmonts wielding random whips was pretty much retconned at that point. CV:Belmont’s Revenge, I believe it states that there was a holy ceremony that gave Christoph’s son Soleiyu the TITLE of Vampire Hunter/Killer. Which suggests that they’ve been doing this for centuries. It doesn’t say “Soleiyu inherited the title from his father and thus was granted the Holy Whip Vampire Killer which was passed down from the Belmont Family for ages.” He even has his OWN whip when you fight him in the game, so...
like I said before, Belmonts being important to CV? Yaaas, especially to us hardcore fans. But that’s not the sole reason everyone else buy the games, it’s not “playing as a Belmont is paramount to our enjoyment of the series” for them
And if you read the wiki son you'll see that it says
"Although the Vampire Killer itself gets no permanent damage upgrade or has any outstanding supernatural powers"
That's why they needed the Holy water, cos the combat cross was NOT the bane of the night. The vampire killer is a holy relic that destroys monsters on contact as it has supernatural powers, that all evil are weak against cos of its Holy power.
And the combat cross, is just a chain whip, yes it has some it has holy water on it. But like it says it has NO outstanding supernatural powers.
That's what I mean by True Vampire Killer. And the very fact, that you can't tell what the difference between Vampire Killer the Sorcery Whip" (妖鞭バンパイアキラー). The whip that will destroy all who are related to the kindred of the night.
And the Combat cross, which in the end is just a chain, a powerful chain, but just a Chain, Tells me that you have very little understanding of The Castlevania Mythos
And Pro Tip Son I'm from the UK and English is my first language ;)
As for Simon, yes, yes!!! he is I don't know what rock you've been living under but, he was one of big names of the 8 bit world, when you think of CV you think him every bit as big a mega man.
And a niche series, crash bandicoot really, really. Sorry is this a wind Up, I mean are you really saying that Simon Belmont, one of biggest games on the bloody NES and made Simon a household name, is Not as big as some Very BAD sonic clone. You really need to get your facts right Sunshine
It was one of the Big Games of its time everyone had herd of it, i didn't own a NES , but i knew of it and Simon, my pals knew of it. Your making your self less, and less credible with every word. and yes again the whip was A Big part from the start.
A young man named Simon, the descendant of the Belmont clan, has come forth to help out in this crisis. Armed with a whip possesed with
mysterious powers, passed down to him from his father, he sets out to Dracula's castle on his own..."
So The whip is and Was Big Part.
And I'm glad you talked about red haired Simon, as that is one of the biggest sticking points for fans, many and I have seen bitch, fight over bitch fight about him. and 10000s of fan always say this.
"I want the classic Simon, back, when are we getting the real Simon back"
And we all saw LoS1 trailer and thought YES he's back, the holy knight (little did we know)
After every thing you've said I really don't think your qualified to Be having this debate, As you seem to know nothing about the classic games or just games general
I'm going to leave you Now with this advice
learn your CV.
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And the combat cross, is just a chain whip, yes it has some it has holy water on it. But like it says it has NO outstanding supernatural powers.
The games (especially LoS2) establish that the original Combat Cross that Gabriel used was the most powerful weapon created by Rinaldo Gandolfi. Again you're confusing gameplay with story. It is supernatural in its own right. That's the reason why Zobek rebuilt it, because it was the only weapon that can "destroy" Satan & end Dracula's immortality. Just a piece of it (the stake part) that Gabriel used to kill Carmila, was melted down into the Crissaegrim & was powerful enough to put Dracula in a near-death state.
It's pretty obvious that the developers intended it to be their rendition of the Vampire Killer, whether you agree or not is irrelevant. Your argument of "b-but it doesn't contain the soul of Gabriel's wife like the original contains Leon's wifes soul therefore it's not supernatural & is inferior" is kinda funny. It doesn't shoot fireballs, it doesn't transform into leather, but it doesn't have to.
As for Simon, yes, yes!!! he is I don't know what rock you've been living under but, he was one of big names of the 8 bit world, when you think of CV you think him every bit as big a mega man.
Again, I'm not saying he's not iconic, he's just lesser known. There are many music artists from the 70's that are truly iconic, but if you show a picture of them to today's generation, they would have no idea who they are. Similar case with not just Simon, but many other old gaming protagonists as well. That's just the reality of the situation. You are thinking from a diehard fans perspective, not a general, casual fan perspective. Therefore you are biased and it def shows :o
It would be different if Simon was the star of every single Castlevania game, but he wasn't. Therefore he's not as popular as other protagonists that have always been the star of their series. He's been in the most games, but you're buggin if you think gamers of today will recognize Simon alongside Master Chief or Solid Snake. That's what I was trying to convey with the Crash Bandicoot reference. Do you understand?
After every thing you've said I really don't think your qualified to Be having this debate, As you seem to know nothing about the classic games or just games general
I'm going to leave you Now with this advice
learn your CV
lol seems that I've struck a nerve. I am a "trollmeister," after all ;D
You can't offend me with your words, so you shouldn't get offended by mine. This isn't a dick measuring contest dude. Like I said in my original post, this is all in good fun
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The games (especially LoS2) establish that the original Combat Cross that Gabriel used was the most powerful weapon created by Rinaldo Gandolfi. Again you're confusing gameplay with story. It is supernatural in its own right. That's the reason why Zobek rebuilt it, because it was the only weapon that can "destroy" Satan & end Dracula's immortality. Just a piece of it (the stake part) that Gabriel used to kill Carmila, was melted down into the Crissaegrim & was powerful enough to put Dracula in a near-death state.
It's pretty obvious that the developers intended it to be their rendition of the Vampire Killer, whether you agree or not is irrelevant. Your argument of "b-but it doesn't contain the soul of Gabriel's wife like the original contains Leon's wifes soul therefore it's not supernatural & is inferior" is kinda funny. It doesn't shoot fireballs, it doesn't transform into leather, but it doesn't have to.
Again, I'm not saying he's not iconic, he's just lesser known. There are many music artists from the 70's that are truly iconic, but if you show a picture of them to today's generation, they would have no idea who they are. Similar case with not just Simon, but many other old gaming protagonists as well. That's just the reality of the situation. You are thinking from a diehard fans perspective, not a general, casual fan perspective. Therefore you are biased and it def shows :o
It would be different if Simon was the star of every single Castlevania game, but he wasn't. Therefore he's not as popular as other protagonists that have always been the star of their series. He's been in the most games, but you're buggin if you think gamers of today will recognize Simon alongside Master Chief or Solid Snake. That's what I was trying to convey with the Crash Bandicoot reference. Do you understand?
lol seems that I've struck a nerve. I am a "trollmeister," after all ;D
You can't offend me with your words, so you shouldn't get offended by mine. This isn't a dick measuring contest dude. Like I said in my original post, this is all in good fun
But your missing this
it was Gabriel's FATE, not the weapon. He could have used anything like he did with Cornell. again Not The weapon itself, the monsters were never weak to it cos of its holy power, again that's why they needed the holy water, again how are you missing this?. zobek would have known if it would have been enough, But its was not, as the Vampire Killer is known as
"the Legendary Whip and the bane of all vampires"
And the that's not the combat cross full stop, no wiggle room like "Oh bu... its has this and that" again the combat cross itself
has no real power over vampires and monsters, YES the cross had the stake part, but again IT was Gabriel's Fate that Killed
Carmilla, plus stakes can kill a vampires, again another great point you brought up ;)
The real vampire Killer Can just kill a vampires and other Monster On contact, cos of its holy magic, that's why the stake part got left put after rondo of blood, cos it was unneeded. unlike the combat cross. I'm not saying its not got magic powers it has, but its not the same as the REAL vampire Killer.
And the Vampire Killer had this Power well before Lament of Innocence. as its been known as the Magic whip. And it was known to kill vampires and Monster due to its holy power.
So no that is not my argument, my point is that it has no real Holy power that monsters are weak against.
Again its just blunt damage. it is not the same thing. again the holy water proves that point, as the affect that relic has on vampires is far stronger then the combat cross, that's why it was important to Find it.
As Zobek needed Gabriel to complete His plan. So he would not have put Gabriel's life in danger Unless they really needed it. and that's from the story not game play :D.
And if he had the REAL Vampire Killer then they would not need the holy water.
again I seem to think your a bit of LoS Fan boy, as you can't stand the idea of the combat cross not being as powerful a the REAL Vampire Killer
And yes it was used to forge the Crissaegrim cos of its was powerful connection To Fate, that's why it has the power it has (and the other stuff that went in to it)
And in the occult when we used something like he did the combat cross, We put her own life force in it, Giving powers. It becomes a part of us,
there for being the only thing that can kill him, And the fact it killed satan was fate,
It was always Gabriel's fate to kill him, like Zobek too, they were all linked by fate. that's the only reason it worked. Not cos of the cross itself. It was Gabriel's weapon of choice, if it had been a sword, and or something else it would have still been the same.
And again with simon again he is still soo well know, he is CV, you ask any gamer (Non cv fan) and they say this
"Oh yeah that simon, i saw Him on the AVGN, or oh yeah i know him, he uses that kinky whip, why does he not just use a sword" ( hate it when they call the whip kinky)
again he is timeless that's just the facts.
Again everyone knows the phase "what a horrible night to have a curse" and they know its from Simon's quest. So yes he still is one of the faces of CV. and he has been the star of many games, everyone knows him. so he is still big today.
And no one is getting offend here ;D I get very passionate on the subject of the whip and Belmont's
And i only want to help, as i hate the idea of you saying something like this in public and looking like you don't understand CV lore. ;)