Topic: Castlevania: Belmont's Curse!!!

[VEP]

Honestly I think it does look like they are trying to appeal to many audiences which might be a risk but ultimately I am looking forward to it and keeping an open mind.

[Scarlet starlet]

Did any1 play the demo? It will only drop tomorrow morning for me.

[RichterB]

(SEE EDIT below for demo thoughts.) Haven't played it, but I think they've done something smart based on the gameplay I've seen. Visually and mechanically, it satisfies the broad modern Metroidvania audience expectations, even if it might seem a little too far to longtime Castlevania fans. Yet within the mechanics it still is clearly referencing the whole of Castlevania, including some very deep cuts from GB Legends and Circle of the Moon. It also was sure to have a lot of the iconic enemies and bosses. And even within the over-the-top, flashy visuals, it still has some art references/motifs to Castlevania writ large. Those things ensure it doesn't separate it from core Castlevania. And by having action but an emphasis on platforming, and making exploration the format, it hits both Classicvania and Metroidvania wants. Back to the visuals, they bring in the Netflix Castlevania fans who may have avoided most or all of the games. So, it may not 100% satisfy every one of these audiences, but I think it ensures interest and sales from a wide swathe of audiences and makes Castlevania more relevant for newcomers.

My opinion is the art direction is not ideal, but it's not horrible. And the gameplay looks like a very interesting mix that respects the entirety of the series. My hype is about a 6 or 7 out of 10, but I think as a whole game experience, it'll be an 8.5 or 9 out of 10.

EDIT: Completed Demo and did some of the extra content in it. Demo progress save data carries to main game, it says. We're back, people! This is 100% Castlevania for this generation. It's got a little bit of everything and it comes out great. The gameplay with the whip is a dream come true. I'd say what you've got here design-wise is Circle of the Moon meets Silksong meets Blasphemous. That said, it still feels like its own thing--a distinct experience where people can really get into the series. It really honors the Classicvania while also having Metroidvania, too. The art direction is really good, but the art style will be a bit divisive. I wouldn't want this art style for all future Castlevania, but for this one, it works fine and looks good in person. The music is serviceable. Not overwhelming or something you'd want to listen to a ton outside the game so far, but fitting in context. The challenge level is raised right from the start, more along the lines of Blasphemous...maybe a little easier than that, though. But it has more of that Classicvania learning curve, which I love. There are spike traps and such, too. I'm not sure how the Church is being handled so far...there are slight hints of Netflix there. But the "mystery" aspect of it has a Migami flavor from Chronicles of the Wolf and The Lecarde Chronicles 1 and 2. Anyway, demo took care of doubts I have. Feels like a 9 out of 10 right now.

For reference, my favorite Classicvanias are Castlevania III, Lecarde Chronicles 1, Super Castlevania IV, Dracula X SNES, Bloodlines. My favorite Metroidvanias are The Lecarde Chronicles 2, Circle of the Moon, Simon's Quest, and Symphony of the Night. My favorite 3Dvanias are Castlevania 64 and Lament of Innocence.

[BLOOD MONKEY]

Played the demo.

Music and cutscenes can't be redeemed imo. The worst type of bland on both fronts, just a terrible showing there. It's also obvious to me that the visual budget couldn't quite be carried by Evil Empire; I simply don't think they were up to the task when it comes to handling that much visual detail and animation. Encountered several animation errors playing above 60fps too.

That negativity out of the way, it was a rather impressive showing aside. Definitely feels like a Castlevania game in many ways and the gameplay was slick and exciting. I'm looking forward to the mobility and combat upgrades a ton. I'm sure it'll be a quite fun game but not sure if it's the direction I would want things to continue in.

[Scarlet starlet]

My brain recognized it as a Castlevania game in spite of the different, "soulslike" gameplay. It definitely feels fresh and not just Dead Cells or Blasphemous or [generic 2D metroidvania], even though it's a blend of those influences it works. The UI is beautiful. I like that the slide doesn't give i-frames. I also liked the background details and now I'm worried that they won't be able to replicate that level of quality for the entire game.

It's far from perfect of course. Sound effects sometimes are meh. I disabled the screen shake, but there is no way to tone down the flashing effects which can be overwhelming. I also lowered EXP gains and health flasks and I refused to beat the boss by using them.
Enemies drops, as we already knew from the trailers, are incredibly disappointing. Just meat, coffee or potion recharges. There's no reason or incentive to grind enemies and it's sad. And you need to return to the save point to make them respawn.
I don't like any of the portraits used for dialogue (and those shown on the website). This artist's way of drawing faces is just unfitting for a Castlevania game. Rose's menu picture looks much better.
I also didn't like the English VAs, switched to the japanese voices.

I think the story might actually make or break this game for me. Netflixvania traumatized me for life and I don't want to experience anything remotely similar to that. But as a game, it's definitely a step in the right direction compared to Mirror of Fate.

(click to show/hide)

According to some guy who datamined the demo, Brauner is indeed in the game. So it seems like time traveling sheenanigans will happen even though I wonder why Brauner specifically?

[Scarlet starlet]

Well, things got datamined including lots of dialogue. I haven't read all of that because I don't want to spoil myself, but some things arrived to my eyes anyway.

And oh boy I understand making some retcons but this is embarassing for a game that is stated to be the continuation of CVIII and CoD. It's the same thing as Legends except it touches so many things, I really don't think we will consider it canon in the long run. A reboot set in an alternate continuity, perhaps.

[RichterB]

Community, please be careful with story spoilers! I don't really want to know. So far, all I've accidentally gathered is that it might involve

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time travel like Resurrection on the Dreamcast

. If that's the case, it's actually a good thing. I never thought I'd say that. But it will open up the established timeline to

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having Circle of The Moon, the N64 games, and Legends have a form of canon, and give IGA's previous inclusion of Saint Germain and Aeon meaning.

This will allow developers to experiment with the series like in the 80s and 90s versus just giving us remixes of SotN, which Bloodstained has already been trying to do.

Castlevania is way more than that and deserves the Silent Hill treatment where we get to explore more aspects of the series. Lords of Shadow may have been a big misstep, but the idea of being afraid of change, when you had Belmont's Revenge, Super Castlevania IV, Rondo of Blood, Bloodlines, and Symphony of the Night in a handful of years shows that it creatively benefits the brand. As someone who saw the series evolve from the beginning, I always felt that the cons outweighed the pros of IGA being sole steward after 2003. The series tried a few different mechanics, but the overall level design didn't change drastically enough to exploit even that. If you look at what Migami did with The Lecarde Chronicles 1 and 2 (and spiritual successor Chronicles of the Wolf), that is a perfect example of how the format should have been reworked in different ways that were familiar yet fresh.

[mkk hanzo]

My brain recognized it as a Castlevania game in spite of the different, "soulslike" gameplay. It definitely feels fresh and not just Dead Cells or Blasphemous or [generic 2D metroidvania], even though it's a blend of those influences it works. The UI is beautiful. I like that the slide doesn't give i-frames. I also liked the background details and now I'm worried that they won't be able to replicate that level of quality for the entire game.

It's far from perfect of course. Sound effects sometimes are meh. I disabled the screen shake, but there is no way to tone down the flashing effects which can be overwhelming. I also lowered EXP gains and health flasks and I refused to beat the boss by using them.
Enemies drops, as we already knew from the trailers, are incredibly disappointing. Just meat, coffee or potion recharges. There's no reason or incentive to grind enemies and it's sad. And you need to return to the save point to make them respawn.
I don't like any of the portraits used for dialogue (and those shown on the website). This artist's way of drawing faces is just unfitting for a Castlevania game. Rose's menu picture looks much better.
I also didn't like the English VAs, switched to the japanese voices.

I think the story might actually make or break this game for me. Netflixvania traumatized me for life and I don't want to experience anything remotely similar to that. But as a game, it's definitely a step in the right direction compared to Mirror of Fate.

(click to show/hide)

According to some guy who datamined the demo, Brauner is indeed in the game. So it seems like time traveling sheenanigans will happen even though I wonder why Brauner specifically?

 I remember that

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Brauners paintings allowed for time travel? Pocket dimensions

[theplottwist]

I remember that

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Brauners paintings allowed for time travel? Pocket dimensions

Brauner's paintings are "simulated spaces" embodying Brauner's intent, not actual worlds and not time travel.

[EstebanT]

I really hate to be the bearer of bad news all the time.

But the game has a very limited amount of enemy variety.
I have counted and only been able to find about 30 unique enemies. Which is smaller than Rondo of Blood.

Classicvanias were able to get away with small amounts of enemies because they were short and stage based. Plus the level design helped bring about their unique qualities.

Metroidvanias don't have the luxury of being able to get away with an anemic bestiary because the entirety of the game is based around exploration and killing enemies, finding weapons to kill enemies, etc. You should not be  killing archer skeletons in the last stage of the game. Environments have no sauce when they all share from the same pool of 30 enemies. Garden areas should have plant based enemies, etc.

The community will love the game at first, but when the honeymoon period ends they will begin to see it an mid because of the boring music and limited amount of enemy variety.

[Lumi Kløvstad]

It is WILD to see the number of reviews going "THIS IS A TOP TEN CASTLEVANIA SOUNDTRACK FOR SURE!!" and I'm just sitting there going "You can't have played ten Castlevania games then because they would all be higher on the list than this."

[EDIT] NO WAIT FUCK I'M NOT DONE DRAGGING THIS

Like, pick any other Castlevania game. AT RANDOM. The soundtrack will be better. Even the fucking "Castlevania: the Arcade" had a better OST. This soundtrack gives no tracks that are going to join the lexicon of greats. And I've listened to the whole soundtrack now. There's nothing on the catchy level of Vampire Killer, Beginning, Bloody Tears, Bloodlines, Dance of Illusions, Lost Paintings, Battle of the Holy, etc. None of these are tracks people are likely to remember past the end credits, much less formulate distinct opinions about and discuss 20 years later which is their favorite remix, because aside from Rose's Theme, "Bloodbound", there aren't likely to BE any remixes.

Meanwhile, the Belmont's Curse's OST is excellent music to do math homework to if you're in high school.

Yes that's very damning with faint praise but it's also true.

Belmont's Curse is the musical equivalent of beige office carpeting.

It does its job. It fills the space. It doesn't distract you. You can leave it playing for an hour while you work through algebra problems, and it won't interrupt your concentration by demanding that you listen to it.
But this is Castlevania. The music is supposed to interrupt your concentration to some extent. Long enough to go "shit this tune's a banger", at least.
You're supposed to reach a particular room and have the music lodge itself in your brain so firmly that twenty years later, hearing the first few notes instantly transports you back there. You're supposed to hum Bloody Tears when you're doing the dishes. You're supposed to hear Beginning and immediately feel like you're about to charge into battle against the forces of darkness, despite the fact that you're actually sitting in your underwear eating crackers.

It's not necessarily a failure for an ordinary action game. But for Castlevania? It's a little like making a new Metal Gear Solid with excellent stealth mechanics and a soundtrack that sounds like stock music from a corporate espionage documentary.
Nothing is technically wrong, but something important is missing.

And the really frustrating thing is that a soundtrack doesn't need to be wall-to-wall bangers to have a strong identity. It can be atmospheric, restrained, unsettling, even deliberately sparse. But the music needs to make an artistic impression. Castlevania 64's quieter approach, for instance, is a deliberate aesthetic choice; the atmosphere itself is the point. That's different from music that you could swap out for another competent dark-fantasy score without fundamentally changing the game's identity.

But that's not what we have.

It's great music for doing math homework to.

You can solve for x while listening to it.

You probably won't remember what you were listening to when you found x though.

[K.G. Morder]

My thoughts on this games style, I've repeated a few times elsewhere, but it is that this feels likeits inspired by the Netflix show.
Which is awful since while I don't mind the show's designs, the show is definitely taking cues from ayami kojima's legendary work.

Which means it's based on a show which is based on an artist which themselves reinvented the series art style. A series which is originally based on old universal/hammer horror films.

That's like castlevania 3 times removed.

Some of the designs definitely reek of "modern western dev" Rose herself in some shots has some serious western dev man face going on, and it's kind of telling that when the devs try and say "we made some women hot! We've seen porn!!" It seems disingenuous. I mean, hot to who? Because it's telling that most of that conversation almost always is exclusively Carmilla's art.

Do we miss the Lord's of shadow series yet? :^)
It at least had an unashamed unique visual identity. Which imo, still played some homage to its roots.

You know what I've been thinking lately, I kind of miss barbarian belmonts. I kind of miss campyvania.

Also hey folks. Glad to see all the usual suspects rising from their slumber for some discussion

[Scarlet starlet]

Thoughts so far (90% completion). Beware Spoilers.

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Reached late-game and the bad ending, now I'm going for 100%. I liked the early game (Streets-Cemetery-Catacombs) then the game started feeling like torture to me in the midgame (Main Hall-Library-Notre-Dame), now that I approach the end and I have all the movement abilities, it's decent again.
I have no idea why the midgame was so fucking bad, I had to force myself to keep playing it. Enemy placements and platforming puzzles were just obnoxious while the bosses were a joke except Death. Then in the upper half of Clock Tower and the Hall of Mirrors the level design became normal again.

I honestly can't say if I want more games in this style. I think it's a better package than Mirror of Fate overall but just like Mirror of Fate the movement and combat don't feel good, against mobs it feels like button mashing is more rewarding than repositioning. And those damned flashing effects that don't allow you to see shit are just the worst.

I don't even miss the Igavania systems like enemy drops all that much. The problem for me lies entirely in the physics of jumps, combat, movement. The jump not being high enough and feeling "mushy". The attacks feeling floaty and janky and the enemies (including bosses) lightweight and "plastic". Every weapon does combos, even the Vampire Killer, Rose moves forward when attacking, and there are some serious case of "over-animation". There's a beast of a game when it comes to graphics and areas, the game is BIG and looks BEAUTIFUL but I just couldn't enjoy the combat.

Overall the game is fine, but I don't want another product like it. Give a chance to different developers. And next time Konami, please ensure better oversight of the lore because this game touches so many aspects of the lore between LoI and CVIII and is so bold about it that I've noticed many potential pitfalls and I'm not even a lore expert. And Brauner...that's just a mistake, what even was the point of including him in the game if you were going to cut the boss battle.

[Gunlord]

And those damned flashing effects that don't allow you to see shit are just the worst.

THIS!!! I'm not going to refund the game or give it a bad review, but I'm lowering my previous 9/10 score to a 7/10 because of it. Many of the later bosses were just "CAN'T SEE SHIT CAPN" because of that, and because they blended in with the backgrounds so f'in much.

[mkk hanzo]

 I have turned on the visibility outline (on cyan color, like Juste, mind you) and I still cant see shit when chaos ensues. Im the same, forcing myself to contonie. Every room is like a big puzzle, and the game has constantly asking you to be on your toes, and of course failing a lot at first.

 BTW its just me or controls are SUPER laggy? Like half a second input delay. Parries are SUPER hard. And Im playing on Xbox Series X and a 120fps monitor.

 Music is horrid. I like the graphics but feels like an indie title. And that makes sense due to the price tag.

 Give me my 3D Castlevania COllection already Konami