Topic: Salvaging Sonia? Plus, reflections on IGA....

[VoDkA]

That thing was american made just like the entire preorder package, including watered down artbook made from low quality images. It wasn't official. Iga's official timeline still keeps these games out and has no mentions of them.

It holds no weight because it's American made...?  Jeez, we Castlevania fans are snobs, aren't we?

But I think the point that was being made REGARDLESS of whether or not we're Japanophiles is that people don't bitch about Reinhardt or Nathan anymore because they're on some sort of KONAMI-MADE timeline somewhere.  When they weren't, people bitched about them, too.

[The Last Belmont]

In Reply To #28

I forget where, but it does say hes the first to kill dracula. Its one reason why when LoI was made, Walter was the Vampire boss, not Mathias.

Yeah but having mathias in place of the walter fight would have made no sense the story was set up so that when walter died mathias would take his soul and become a vampire. Unless this part was thought up later and originally you were supposed to kill mathias after he had already killed walter in that spot. :?

Also since he comes back 20 years later it can be inferred that sonia didn't really kill him, but it was all part of his plan to get her out of the way. We can assume that he remembered leon and his power and once he witnessed sonya's awesome power he faked defeat.(since we don't see her in 3 it can be assumed she's dead) Then he gathered his power and got ready to wage war on all of Europe.

[VoDkA]

Yeah but having mathias in place of the walter fight would have made no sense the story was set up so that when walter died mathias would take his soul and become a vampire. Unless this part was thought up later and originally you were supposed to kill mathias after he had already killed walter in that spot. :?

It's little plot(hole) points like these that prove what an awesome storyteller IGA really is.  "Let the artist perform his craft" or somesuch...right...

I guess this is where I put an end to this thread by saying that this point (and others) have been discussed to death time and again around here.  Sonia, Mathias, IGA's mishandling of the series at large (despite some good games that have come under his reign)...all covered time and again.

[The Last Belmont]

It's little plot(hole) points like these that prove what an awesome storyteller IGA really is.  "Let the artist perform his craft" or somesuch...right...

Well yeah I agree but personally I found that part of the story to be quite lame, dracula the apitome of evil was just a man who got pissed cuz his girl died and stole his power from another vampire. I don't know that's just always been hard for me to accept. Loi also does a really bad job of explaining how Mathias became best buds with death, when he was an ordinary mortal man 3 seconds before. Death's just there at the end like he was thrown in at the last minute cuz they needed a main boss fight. Iga also could have told his story without totally retconning the other games, make them like alternate reality games or remake them, or change the date they occur or something in order to make them fit in with what he is trying to tell there was no reason to totally retconn them that's like a slap in the face to all the fans of those games.

[Kale]

Well, its why I start to write fanfics for it... too bad I'm lazy lol. I shold start a mega man x one too, god knows Sigma shows up too many times for it to be a decent story.

[Kensuke]

Actually, I think TLB is correct on this one. It was never explicitly stated in any of the games that Trevor was the first Belmont to kill Dracula. In some of the written material before 1998 it might have been but that's really easy to change. It's an easier retcon than killing an entire game.

Also, Alucard doesn't say anything to Trevor simply because Sonia didn't exist until 1998. So that doesn't prove that Alucard being Trevor's father wasn't what KCEN was going for, only that it's BS that wouldn't really work too well given CV3's undisputed canonicity. Personally, I think KCEN was being a bit too cute for their own good, which is why that whole thing needs to be explained. Perhaps having Alucard saying in some future game "I once loved a human woman" would be a nice bone to toss to the Sonia fans. Wouldn't hurt anything. 

Also, VoDkA hit the nail right on the head. This whole crap about women not being able to do anything in 1450 is exactly that. IGA needs to get a new line. They tried to connect Bram Stoker (along with another Romania legend: Elizabeth Bartley) to the series starting with Bloodlines. And parts of Carmilla starting with CV2. All of this quickly disintegrated. Konami has always borrowed a lot of stuff, but there's no way you'll be able to integrate all vampire material in total.

- John

[The Last Belmont]

Well, its why I start to write fanfics for it...

Yeah I should do that. The story we got could have been much better, like Mathias delving into the black arts for years until he becomes strong enough to cross over to the gates of hell and makes a deal with satan who grants him his powers and he takes death as his servant after making his pact with the devil. Leon completes his whip and kills Walter who was only a front and was given the ebony stone by Drac/mathias so drac could test it's power. However Leon is stronger than he anticipated and he sends death after him and then he fights him until he realizes even he can't win at this stage and he'll need to gather more power before he can stand up to a belmont, so he retreats and hides while he increases his own powers and recruits more minions like frankenstein, the mummies, other vampires, the mother medusa who produces the little flying medusas, among other evil vile creatures, and begins the contstruction of the first castlevania which he would bind himself spiritually to and be able to constantly ressurrect it over time if it was ever destroyed. When he is confident in his powers he wages his first war against europe.

Also, Alucard doesn't say anything to Trevor simply because Sonia didn't exist until 1998.

- John

well if Alucard didn't know he had a son, regardless of if he was or wasn't the father he probably wouldn't have said anything about sonia, he's a really private guy and seems to hate himself alot. And if he did even suspect Trevor might be his boy (remember the manual for Legends and the game are very vague on the stage of their relationship and he may have not even slept with her, plus she was 17 giving her plenty of time to find someone else and have a kid) I don't think he would have said anything either cuz Alucard wouldn't want Trevor to know he's a quarter vampire even if sonia told him cuz he hates his own bloodline.

[crisis]

Well yeah I agree but personally I found that part of the story to be quite lame, dracula the apitome of evil was just a man who got pissed cuz his girl died and stole his power from another vampire.

So I guess you don't like SotN's story either? Y'know, the whole Dracula x Lisa fling... iga was just elaborating on what SotN established. It's not really that hard to swallow.

Loi also does a really bad job of explaining how Mathias became best buds with death, when he was an ordinary mortal man 3 seconds before.

I'm sure they had a couple hundred years to get to know eachother, though 

Death's just there at the end like he was thrown in at the last minute cuz they needed a main boss fight. Iga also could have told his story without totally retconning the other games, make them like alternate reality games or remake them, or change the date they occur or something in order to make them fit in with what he is trying to tell there was no reason to totally retconn them that's like a slap in the face to all the fans of those games.

The games still exist, you can still plug them into the game console & play them. The timeline shouldn't matter to you or anyone else!






Some fans are just way too emotional  :

[The Last Belmont]

So I guess you don't like SotN's story either? Y'know, the whole Dracula x Lisa fling... iga was just elaborating on what SotN established. It's not really that hard to swallow.
I'm sure they had a couple hundred years to get to know eachother, though 

The sotn thing is completely diff. there's no comparison. Dracula realizes when lisa dies that humans are barbaric and looks at them like animals and lesser beings, that was actually a really cool twist in SOTN. The Mathias thing was him turning cuz one woman died and he couldn't handle it and was weak so he thought up this whole scheme to kill Walter just so he could absorb his soul and was his revenge against god so to speak, Now if he was some minor villian this would have been alright but I think it is beneath dracula. He should have been granted the power by a diety, satan, finding a powerful artifact etc., not stolen it from some lesser being, that cheapens his character.

The timeline shouldn't matter to you or anyone else!

True but by removing those games he's made it impossible for them to ever be released/updated again, cuz they don't exist to him. We're stuck with the N64 and gameboy graphics with no special features or anything and no chance at getting any.

[Long John Silver]

It holds no weight because it's American made...?

Yep. It's an equivalent of a fan work. The american division of konami never had complete control over the series and never will, seeing as their best and only effort to create a cv game was that poor resurrection with its retarded character designs (speaking mainly of villains. Dracula looks gay, the vampire woman is totally retarded, sonia looks like a horse etc) that eventually got killed when they got in trouble with the japanese division. Shows just how much influence on the series they have. :
Also back on legends topic, too bad Alucard shouldn't even be born or be a little kid during legends. Lisa died young in 1470, so alucard, being her son couldn't have been more than 16-25 during that. Legends happens 20 years earlier. Lisa was just a human not a vampire.

Actually, I think TLB is correct on this one. It was never explicitly stated in any of the games that Trevor was the first Belmont to kill Dracula. In some of the written material before 1998 it might have been but that's really easy to change. It's an easier retcon than killing an entire game.

Yes it was stated. In original cv3's prologue, not the shitty translation with poltergeist king fanfic character.

"More than 100 years before Simon Belmont, Dracula and mankind's battle begins..."

That more less shows, that this is the mark where the battle of Belmonts and others against Dracula started. Not some sonia who kills him for unknown reasons and whose feat was never documented, unlike for example Christopher's game which was referred to in cv1's manual.

[Stigma Black]

Though it's already two pages later, I would like to mention that the Vampire Killer was made by bonding Sara's soul with Leon's hatred and Rinaldo's magic powers. Even if she was a large factor in the creation of the whip, she wasn't the sole factor.

[VampireHunterM]

In response to John/Kensuke
This is a pointless topic. You are obviously not a true fan. If not for Iga, who knows where the series would be. If your playing Castlevania games to play as a "hot" girl, your in it for the wrong reason. Maybe Castlevania isn't for you. Maybe Tomb Raider would be a series for you to look into... the end 

[Stigma Black]

...You are obviously not a true fan.

You did not just seriously say this.

As for the rest of your post, he had other reasons for why Sonia should be salvaged from the timeline retcon.

[VampireHunterM]

In Reply To #43

yes. I did. If people just want to bitch, find something else to play. It's really that simple. Again, Iga knows what he's doing. And that's the bottom line.

[Stigma Black]

In Reply To #44

The reason the forum exists is for everyone to discuss what they like/dislike about the Castlevania series. Just because it's a fan forum doesn't mean there's an obligation for everyone to go, "Oh, IGA~" *fapfapfapfap* in every single post. If that were the case, a lot of people would've left already.