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Offline cecil-kain

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #210 on: January 03, 2012, 05:54:00 AM »
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You are basically just demanding games with no justifiable reason.

That is why your goals are forgettable and nobody takes OA seriously.

In your humble opinion, Flame.  I understand that the CVD has a handful of critics, but outside of this echo chamber Castlevania has tens of thousands of fans --most of whom have never even heard of OA.  Do you really presume to speak for all of them?  Or are you comfortable enough in your opinions to let them judge OA for themselves?

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They are not serious goals, but you take them as seriously as a plate of beans.

Those goals are the kind of goals you just make petitions for and hope Konami pays attention and cares. For OA to even be a MOVEMENT, you need to have real goals.

How is Demon Castle War not a serious goal?  You of all people should remember that Megaman Legends 3 was the stuff of fanboy fairytales just a few years ago.

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Operation Rainfall is about getting Nintendo of America to Localize 3 particular high profile games (Xenoblade, The Last Story, Pandora's Tower) that American gamers have been highly expecting since their announcement, and have been snubbed, with Xenoblade being the only of the 3 with a planned American Release, the other 2 so far only having European Loalizations planned.

100,000 strong is about getting Capcom to resume development of Mega Man Legends 3, a game that many Mega Man fans have waited for 10 years to happen, finally got their wish, and then had Capcom pull the plug, breaking their own promises that the prototype would be the test run to gauge interest, and instead basing their estimated unit sales on the Devroom member numbers, when they themselves stated that fans were not required to join the Devroom to follow the game's development, and citing unspecified "criteria" that was not met as the reason for cancellation. And later had Capcom of Europe blame the cancellation on Fans not caring enough.

Those are real, legitimate Goals. The American Localization by NoA of 3 High profile games that have already been stated to have PAL releases, and the revived Development of a cancelled Game that Capcom broke their word on.

None of them are just DEMANDING new games. Operation Rainfall's games are very real and existent, and 100,000 strong's Legends 3 Prototype was practically already finished and awaiting release before it was cancelled. All Capcom needs to do is honor their original promise of gouging interest via the Prototype's sales. AKA Release the prototype that was already finished.

Then by your own logic, Megaman Legends 3 should never have happened --because it was the vocal demands of the fans that got the project started in the first place.  As a matter of fact, if Capcom had never announced Legends 3, it would still be just another pipe dream --much as the Demon Castle War remains today.  With all this talk about what is or isn't a worthy goal, I wonder...  Do you have the honesty to admit the Demon Castle War is at least a more ambitious goal, precisely because it was never in development?  Either way, these operations should be about WHAT THE FANS WANT, not these sleazy, double-crossing business practices, or how far project X was actually in development.  I understand your passion, but why are you going so far out of your way to make this a contest, Flame?

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Ge'choo some real goals, and maybe a better name,(OA just cant stay, sorry. Many people outside the fanbase wouldnt get what it means. Try for "Operation Castlevania" even.) then we can all talk.

With Cox admitting, Lords of Shadow is not an Akumajo Dracula game --he’s given us an even stronger platform.  Why would we throw away the name, when it so clearly illustrates who we are and what we stand for?  As for the Castlevania fans that have never heard of Akumajo Dracula, that’s a shame in itself and worthy challenge to overcome.  I’m looking forward to it.

Offline Flame

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #211 on: January 03, 2012, 10:36:38 AM »
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In your humble opinion, Flame.  I understand that the CVD has a handful of critics, but outside of this echo chamber Castlevania has tens of thousands of fans --most of whom have never even heard of OA.  Do you really presume to speak for all of them?  Or are you comfortable enough in your opinions to let them judge OA for themselves?
Im not speaking for anyone else. Im speaking from my own opinions- You are just demanding games through this movement. For no other reason than because you think they should make those games. What if I dont like CV3, and instead want CV2 remastered in HD? I might start my own facebook group! Ill call it... "Bloody Tears Movement"

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How is Demon Castle War not a serious goal?  You of all people should remember that Megaman Legends 3 was the stuff of fanboy fairytales just a few years ago.
Indeed it was. But Fans did not demand Capcom to make the game like you are. We constantly bombarded Inafune and Capcom with the question of when they would make Legends 3. Even petitions might have circulated. but nothing like what you are doing. This movement you are heading is about demanding Konami make you games. Let's concentrate for the sake of comparisons, on the Demon Castle War. We dont DEMAND from Konami, we just show support, and ask of them and IGA when they will make it. And hope they someday will. It's nice that you want to be proactive about it, but demanding they make it is not going to get you anywhere.

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Then by your own logic, Megaman Legends 3 should never have happened --because it was the vocal demands of the fans that got the project started in the first place.
except that vocal demand was not in the same manner as OA. It was the vocal demand of fans, who simply kept asking for the game for 10 years straight, asking inafune, giving him lottery tickets to use on the game if he won, and showing fan support of the Legends series. petitions, independent fan letters to capcom, etc. And Inafune eventually decided to try to make it, and managed to get the authorization for a prototype which would ultimately decide the Game's greenlight.

what eventually became 100,000 strong, started BEFORE the cancellation- during that period when Universe was cancelled, and there was no news regarding Legends 3 and it's development. It was a fan movement to show support for the game, asking fans to mail letters to Capcom to show them that the fans do care about the game, since we were all worried about it possibly being cancelled. Unfortunately, it cancelled just about when that started.

 
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As a matter of fact, if Capcom had never announced Legends 3, it would still be just another pipe dream --much as the Demon Castle War remains today.
Yes. And Fans would still be wondering when Capcom would make it.

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With all this talk about what is or isn't a worthy goal, I wonder...  Do you have the honesty to admit the Demon Castle War is at least a more ambitious goal, precisely because it was never in development?
Oh ill admit that. Demon Castle War is definitely a far better goal than demanding a remastered CV3, but that doesnt quite make it a good goal itself. At least not the way you are currently handling it.

 
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Either way, these operations should be about WHAT THE FANS WANT, not these sleazy, double-crossing business practices, or how far project X was actually in development.  I understand your passion, but why are you going so far out of your way to make this a contest, Flame?
There's no contest. It IS about what fans want. Simply I do not think you are handling your operation properly, and have unrealistic demanding goals.

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With Cox admitting, Lords of Shadow is not an Akumajo Dracula game --he’s given us an even stronger platform.  Why would we throw away the name, when it so clearly illustrates who we are and what we stand for?  As for the Castlevania fans that have never heard of Akumajo Dracula, that’s a shame in itself and worthy challenge to overcome.  I’m looking forward to it.
I wouldnt put too much stock in Cox's blabbering about Akumajo Dracula and Castlevania. Its the same thing, different name. Only difference is one refers to Dracula specifically, the other doesnt. Rockman/Megaman.    Akumajo Dracula/Castlevania

I suggest Operation Castlevania simply because Operation Akumajo is a more cumbersome name reliant upon people's knowledge about Akumajo Dracula being the Japanese name of the Castlevania franchise. Operation Castlevania rolls off the tongue easier, and simply is more accessible to those outiside the castlevania fanbase.

If I were to give you a suggestion on HOW to do this, I would suggest dropping the CV3 demand, and making it about the Demon Castle war, and instead of making it about DEMANDING it from Konami, make it a fan support thing. try and gather as many supporters as possible, do fan stuff, show support for the idea, and show Konami that fans really want it. Make it so the fans are a bit more vocal.

I hate to keep using it as an example, but make it like 100,000 strong basically. I cant quite explain what i mean, but look at their leadership structure. I cant quite tell who is in charge, because it is more than just one person, and each one does different things. And the fans themselves are very active in participation. To the point that you could be forgiven for not realizing there even is a leadership.

You get what im digging at? make it about fan support, not baseless demands.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2012, 10:42:51 AM by Flame »
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Offline cecil-kain

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #212 on: January 04, 2012, 12:13:29 AM »
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Im not speaking for anyone else. Im speaking from my own opinions- You are just demanding games through this movement. For no other reason than because you think they should make those games. What if I dont like CV3, and instead want CV2 remastered in HD? I might start my own facebook group! Ill call it... "Bloody Tears Movement"

OA never came together to tell Konami what a great job they’re doing.  We came together as hardcore fans to protest and make our desires known.  The Demon Castle War and the CV3 remake have been widely speculated, discussed, and coveted by the fans for many, many years prior to OA’s founding.  Both games polled favorably here at the CVD, and both games were consistently requested on the Official Castlevania Facebook Page’s 25th Anniversary Topic.  So like I said before, this is about what the fans want, so if you don’t believe in the legitimacy of Operation: Akumajo’s goals, then you need not participate.  But you serve no one in this community by belittling a cause nearly 300 of your fellow Castlevania fans believe in.

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Indeed it was. But Fans did not demand Capcom to make the game like you are. We constantly bombarded Inafune and Capcom with the question of when they would make Legends 3. Even petitions might have circulated. but nothing like what you are doing. This movement you are heading is about demanding Konami make you games. Let's concentrate for the sake of comparisons, on the Demon Castle War. We dont DEMAND from Konami, we just show support, and ask of them and IGA when they will make it. And hope they someday will. It's nice that you want to be proactive about it, but demanding they make it is not going to get you anywhere.

Just a couple points here...  First, you’re making an argument of style over substance, in terms of how fans communicate their needs to companies like Capcom or Konami.  Using the social media as a tool for the fans to speak collectively is a new idea --an idea that simply didn’t exist in the long years leading up to Capcom’s announcement of Legends 3.  OA is attempting to capitalize on the precedent that’s been set by these other fan operations, but as you’ve already pointed out, there is one very important difference.  OA seeks the development of Castlevania games that do not currently exist, and without a newsworthy game to help raise awareness of our cause --we’re building our community without the luxury of the mainstream publicity that these other fan operations have enjoyed.

Castlevania also doesn’t seem to have many champions in the media, like those supporting the Rainfall games or Legends 3.  I suppose it made sense to bombard Inafune when was the go-to guy for all things Megaman, but Castlevania is really in a much different situation.  Think about it.  Would it really make sense to harass IGA about the Demon Castle War if Konami’s already handed Castlevania over to someone else?  And what good would it do to pester David Cox when he’s clearly more interested  in pursuing his own agenda?  There’s no sympathetic go-to guy for Castlevania fans to cling to, just a faceless company that seems oblivious...

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except that vocal demand was not in the same manner as OA. It was the vocal demand of fans, who simply kept asking for the game for 10 years straight, asking inafune, giving him lottery tickets to use on the game if he won, and showing fan support of the Legends series. petitions, independent fan letters to capcom, etc. And Inafune eventually decided to try to make it, and managed to get the authorization for a prototype which would ultimately decide the Game's greenlight.

Fans show their support by purchasing the games, but being proactive about telling the company what you actually want takes it to a whole new level.  Operation: Akumajo is a centralized approach where the fans have a collective voice, but what you’re talking about here is a decentralized approach where the fans speak with their own voices through fan letters and such...  It certainly helps when you can direct that fanmail to a willing insider like Kenji Inafune, but now that he’s gone --all Megaman fans can do is vent their anger to yet another faceless company...

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what eventually became 100,000 strong, started BEFORE the cancellation- during that period when Universe was cancelled, and there was no news regarding Legends 3 and it's development. It was a fan movement to show support for the game, asking fans to mail letters to Capcom to show them that the fans do care about the game, since we were all worried about it possibly being cancelled. Unfortunately, it cancelled just about when that started.

The writing was on the wall, the moment Inafune left.  It’s really too bad he couldn’t stay long enough to see it through...

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Yes. And Fans would still be wondering when Capcom would make it.
Oh ill admit that. Demon Castle War is definitely a far better goal than demanding a remastered CV3, but that doesnt quite make it a good goal itself. At least not the way you are currently handling it.

The goals should focus on what the fans want --simple as that.  As for how the group works toward those goals, that’s really a separate discussion.  If you don’t agree with how I’m handling the operation, you’re more than welcome to step up and set a better example.

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There's no contest. It IS about what fans want. Simply I do not think you are handling your operation properly, and have unrealistic demanding goals.
I wouldnt put too much stock in Cox's blabbering about Akumajo Dracula and Castlevania. Its the same thing, different name. Only difference is one refers to Dracula specifically, the other doesnt. Rockman/Megaman.    Akumajo Dracula/Castlevania

Yes. That’s the way we look at it.  But Cox’s recent comments clearly indicate that he views Castlevania as its own brand, with LoS as a “separate universe” from Akumajo Dracula under that brand.  It muddies the water, but it’s certainly more appealing than calling LoS a reboot.  This is part of the reason why the Mission Statement was changed to endorse a multiversal approach to Castlevania.  It’s a live and let live philosophy that really opens the door to fans of both universes.

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I suggest Operation Castlevania simply because Operation Akumajo is a more cumbersome name reliant upon people's knowledge about Akumajo Dracula being the Japanese name of the Castlevania franchise. Operation Castlevania rolls off the tongue easier, and simply is more accessible to those outiside the castlevania fanbase.

I know what you’re saying, and I gave it serious consideration at one point, but the name simply fits.  Operation Rainfall did alright without mentioning each of its 3 games, so I’m sure we’ll be alright.

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If I were to give you a suggestion on HOW to do this, I would suggest dropping the CV3 demand, and making it about the Demon Castle war, and instead of making it about DEMANDING it from Konami, make it a fan support thing. try and gather as many supporters as possible, do fan stuff, show support for the idea, and show Konami that fans really want it. Make it so the fans are a bit more vocal.

We haven’t done any viral campaigning in about 3 months, but there is a Demon Castle War project in the works.  It may take some time, but it will be the centerpiece of the next viral campaign.  As for CV3, it’s still on the Mission Statement, but it’s going to be treated as the secondary priority for now.

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I hate to keep using it as an example, but make it like 100,000 strong basically. I cant quite explain what i mean, but look at their leadership structure. I cant quite tell who is in charge, because it is more than just one person, and each one does different things. And the fans themselves are very active in participation. To the point that you could be forgiven for not realizing there even is a leadership.

You get what im digging at? make it about fan support, not baseless demands.

Capcom has truly galvanized the Megaman Community with their incompetence --it was one terrible decision after another...  I endorsed 100,000 Strong a couple months ago --not only because I believe in the cause, but because I understand that the outcome will impact the whole industry, and help legitimize hardcore gaming fans as a force to be reckoned with.  But I digress...

Leadership is not easy to come by.  People have school, careers, familes, social lives, and of course hardcore gaming...  I’ve had a couple people offering private advice, but nobody can commit the time and energy for full-time leadership.  Hopefully that changes --my door is always open.

Offline Successor The Cruel

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #213 on: January 04, 2012, 12:46:50 AM »
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^ You sent me a message long ago about forming some kind of council, which I just now got the chance to read. I may be able to help so long as it doesn't involve harassing anyone or making a fool of myself.

My thought is that you'd have to take things out of fan forums and try to get acknowledgment from a more general crowd for this type of thing to be worth a damn.

You'd need a clear, well-defined goal.

You'd need to not appear desperate, bizarre, or like a crazy fan, because you'd lose everyone's sympathy and support, even people who may want the same thing you do.

You'd also need some kind of better, more consistent base to clarify your goals and important messages. A forum is for active content, and important things can be buried there. You'd need something for static content. I do have a big ass website that I keep meaning to do something with, but, you know, life. I'm just now getting over a terrible illness, and I've been wrapped up in some other projects of mine, but I am interested in working on some Castlevania stuff again.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2012, 12:49:49 AM by Successor The Red »

Offline Danial

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #214 on: January 04, 2012, 10:22:42 AM »
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Trying to get Konami to make a game that goes against their current plan for the CV franchise will be nearly impossible at the moment.  They are invested in the LoS series, and it's going to take a major financial failure for them to change their minds and directions.

What you should have been focusing on this entire time is their dismissal of the franchises 25th anniversary.  Not every fan wants the games you're trying to push, but I'm pretty sure most of the fans were expecting some sort of celebratory product and acknowledgment of Castlevania's history and its importance as a property.  Hell, even non-CV fans can recognize it as one of the original pillars of the industry, so they would probably support this idea also.

Something like this would have allowed Konami to continue with their current plans while appeasing the fractured fanbase and touting their own horn to the rest of the gaming community that they created one of the more important original franchises.  This would have been a much easier goal to start with and accomplish.  Plus, if it succeeded, it would have given OA a sturdier platform of support to base its next request on.

Unfortunately the 25th is over.  Next best thing is the 30th I guess...

Offline Sumac

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #215 on: January 04, 2012, 03:33:37 PM »
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We intend to make our points forcefully, because that's the nature of activism --but we intend to do so as reasonably and as responsibly as possible.
There is no need for bitching to be taken rather not seriously. Too many  demands AKA "Forceful demands" is enough.

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With that said, MGS also enjoys the rare luxury of a producer who is the sitting Vice President of Konami Digital Entertainment.
He became vice-president in the past year. Before this he was the head of the substudio of Konami. He was very influental I guess, but not in that position anyway.

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Looking at this situation objectively, you can’t possibly deny that these are the ideal conditions for any game to be developed --MGS or otherwise.
It doesn't make Castlevania less niche game. As it was said before it is natural that Konami will cash in on something succesfull. CV is not that successfull at the moment, so it take a sit. And in case of CV there is nothing to rerelease in HD, considering that 3D games by your favorite IGA were not that succesfull.

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You’d think Konami might have some people studying the console market, people who take notice when a 2-D game like Super Mario Bros Wii sells 24 million copies...  Sonic Generations has only been out for a couple months, and it’s already started running circles around Lords of Shadow’s Global sales...
Considering that Mario and Sonic are amongst most popular characters / brands in video game history it shouldn't be that surprising. Practically any other game will lose to them in terms of sales, so it's have nothing to do with LOS being Castlevania. Any other Castlevania or practically any other franchise will lose to them too.

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How is Demon Castle War not a serious goal?  You of all people should remember that Megaman Legends 3 was the stuff of fanboy fairytales just a few years ago.
But there is quite difference - MML3 was being made (at least as prototype), while DCW was never real game to begin with.

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But you serve no one in this community by belittling a cause nearly 300 of your fellow Castlevania fans believe in.
"Nearly 300"? I'm in awe!! That's like the whole lot of people.

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Something like this would have allowed Konami to continue with their current plans while appeasing the fractured fanbase and touting their own horn to the rest of the gaming community that they created one of the more important original franchises.
That's the problem: some guys couldn't accept LOS-style as Castlevania. And it'll boil to the fact that this guys either need to forget about glorious 2D-HD version (that ineviatbly cause more whining) or not demand it at all.

Offline Vrakanox

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #216 on: January 04, 2012, 04:30:24 PM »
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Trying to get Konami to make a game that goes against their current plan for the CV franchise will be nearly impossible at the moment.  They are invested in the LoS series, and it's going to take a major financial failure for them to change their minds and directions.

Can we really be so sure that IGA or someone else isn't developing the demon castle wars or something similar for the 3DS or VITA?

Offline cecil-kain

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #217 on: January 04, 2012, 04:40:39 PM »
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^ You sent me a message long ago about forming some kind of council, which I just now got the chance to read. I may be able to help so long as it doesn't involve harassing anyone or making a fool of myself.

You had suggested a fan council a long time ago and I really liked the idea, but I was a little confused if you were talking about using it to lead OA --or if you had something entirely separate in mind.  I started a topic about the time I sent you that PM but nobody else really seemed committed to the idea.  And I don't think it's because the fans don't care, everyone just seems to be very very busy.  I happen to be at a unique point in my life where I have some extra time that I can really dedicate myself to something like this, but that luxury won't last forever --and that's why I'm willing to compromise some ideals to get some help managing OA.

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My thought is that you'd have to take things out of fan forums and try to get acknowledgment from a more general crowd for this type of thing to be worth a damn.

You're absolutely right.  The viral campaigning has already reached the hardest of the hardcore here and elsewhere.  Regardless of the tweaks that have (and still can) be made to the Mission Statement, most of the hardcore have already made their judgments.  The mystery right now is how to reach thousands of wayward fans that are preoccupied with other games --without the advantage of mainstream media support.

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You'd need a clear, well-defined goal.

I'm planning to sharpen the focus on the Demon Castle War, but there is a problem with the Mission Statement being a bit long-winded.  The very first draft of the mission was just a few sentences that came across way too abrasive without any context or explanation for the demands.  The rewrite focused on explaining the group philosophy, the grievances with Konami, and detailing the goals.  Since then, about half a dozen tweaks have softened the language, embraced the multiverse, and clarified the pro-Akumajo Dracula philosophy.

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You'd need to not appear desperate, bizarre, or like a crazy fan, because you'd lose everyone's sympathy and support, even people who may want the same thing you do.

Passion comes across to different people in different ways.  I know some fans are turned off by the zeal, but the alternative is to let a few condescending critics disparage and smear the group, and I just can't allow that.  There's really nothing wrong with fair and thoughtful criticism --as long as it *is* fair and thoughtful.

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You'd also need some kind of better, more consistent base to clarify your goals and important messages. A forum is for active content, and important things can be buried there. You'd need something for static content. I do have a big ass website that I keep meaning to do something with, but, you know, life. I'm just now getting over a terrible illness, and I've been wrapped up in some other projects of mine, but I am interested in working on some Castlevania stuff again.

YES!  You are absolutely right about this!  I can't tell you how many times I've needed to reexplain something because someone either hasn't read the whole topic, or isn't familiar with past topics!  When I started the operation on Facebook, I really underestimated the value of static page content.  The Mission Statement *really* needs to be more easily accessible --I wish I could make it required reading for anyone interested in the group.

Trying to get Konami to make a game that goes against their current plan for the CV franchise will be nearly impossible at the moment.  They are invested in the LoS series, and it's going to take a major financial failure for them to change their minds and directions.

Konami doesn't need to stop supporting Akumajo Dracula just because LoS2 is in the works.  That's just an illusion we've been living under ever since LoS was first labeled a "reboot".  The fact is Konami *can* do both at the same time --that's why the Mission Statement was changed to endorse a Multiversal approach to Castlevania.

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What you should have been focusing on this entire time is their dismissal of the franchises 25th anniversary.  Not every fan wants the games you're trying to push, but I'm pretty sure most of the fans were expecting some sort of celebratory product and acknowledgment of Castlevania's history and its importance as a property.  Hell, even non-CV fans can recognize it as one of the original pillars of the industry, so they would probably support this idea also.

Something like this would have allowed Konami to continue with their current plans while appeasing the fractured fanbase and touting their own horn to the rest of the gaming community that they created one of the more important original franchises.  This would have been a much easier goal to start with and accomplish.  Plus, if it succeeded, it would have given OA a sturdier platform of support to base its next request on.

Unfortunately the 25th is over.  Next best thing is the 30th I guess...

Our last campaign actually started on the 25th Anniversary --we posted the tribute video, started an email campaign, and publicly encouraged our fellow fans to purchase HD, Rebirth, or VC games to show their support.  That was also when we started engaging the Official Castlevania Facebook Page directly by posting group propaganda and critical commentary regarding Konami's handling of the Anniversary. Unfortunately, OA was only a couple months old at the time --with less than 200 members, there was only so much that we could do.  Its' also important to note, the mainstream gaming media pretty much snubbed Castlevania's 25th as well --if they had raised the awareness a bit more, that would have put some more public pressure on Konami...

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #218 on: January 04, 2012, 05:18:35 PM »
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If you post that CV 1999 trailer with my voice over, I guarantee the game will become reality.

Offline cecil-kain

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #219 on: January 04, 2012, 05:57:56 PM »
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There is no need for bitching to be taken rather not seriously. Too many  demands AKA "Forceful demands" is enough

I'm sorry, this comment isn't quite coherent...  Are you trying to say that it's bitchy for the fans to come together and tell Konami what they really want?

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He became vice-president in the past year. Before this he was the head of the substudio of Konami. He was very influental I guess, but not in that position anyway.

Before he was Vice President of Konami Digital Entertainment, he was Vice President of Konami Computer Entertainment of Japan.  Although I have no sources to confirm the complete chronology of his career, I'll bet he had a nice seat at Konami's corporate table long before either Vice Presidency.

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It doesn't make Castlevania less niche game. As it was said before it is natural that Konami will cash in on something succesfull. CV is not that successfull at the moment, so it take a sit.

I never denied Castlevania's niche status.  I was simply illustrating how a well connected producer gets the top talent and funding he needs to make the high quality games he wants.  The fact is most other producers actually need to sell their ideas and live on limited budgets awarded by the brass that hardly give a damn about their art.

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And in case of CV there is nothing to rerelease in HD, considering that 3D games by your favorite IGA were not that succesfull.

I must admit, I have a soft spot for Lament, but I agree the 3-D games have damaged the Castlevania brand.  Also, I never said IGA was my favorite.  He's needed for the Demon Castle War, because that was his story and his vision.  Beyond that, I'm sure there are other men that can do Akumajo Dracula justice.

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Considering that Mario and Sonic are amongst most popular characters / brands in video game history it shouldn't be that surprising. Practically any other game will lose to them in terms of sales, so it's have nothing to do with LOS being Castlevania. Any other Castlevania or practically any other franchise will lose to them too.

I acknowledge that.  Still, it will be interesting to see how Generations' sales ultimately compares to Sonic's recent 3-D outings...

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But there is quite difference - MML3 was being made (at least as prototype), while DCW was never real game to begin with.

I've already acknowledged that numerous times *see conversation with Flame on this very page!*

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"Nearly 300"? I'm in awe!! That's like the whole lot of people.

The fact is every movement begins with one person's idea, and no matter how many other people join, there will always be trolls saying 500 isn't enough, 1000 isn't enough, 2000 isn't enough, 5000 isn't enough, 10,000 isn't enough... etc, etc, etc...

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That's the problem: some guys couldn't accept LOS-style as Castlevania. And it'll boil to the fact that this guys either need to forget about glorious 2D-HD version (that ineviatbly cause more whining) or not demand it at all.

Did it occur to you that Konami may actually be able to support both forms of Castlevania?

Offline Danial

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #220 on: January 04, 2012, 05:58:28 PM »
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Can we really be so sure that IGA or someone else isn't developing the demon castle wars or something similar for the 3DS or VITA?

Never absolutely sure, because Konami's not going to divulge that level of information.  But they've stated they want to take the franchise in a different direction.  That leads me to believe they don't want to continue down Iga's path.

Konami doesn't need to stop supporting Akumajo Dracula just because LoS2 is in the works.  That's just an illusion we've been living under ever since LoS was first labeled a "reboot".  The fact is Konami *can* do both at the same time --that's why the Mission Statement was changed to endorse a Multiversal approach to Castlevania.

They don't have to, but they probably will.  Konami's looking for a fresh take on CV, hoping to make it relevant to the majority of the gaming community again.  They want people to pay attention to this new project, which is why they don't want to distract from it by making another new game that doesn't tie in somehow.  It's not about a multiverse for them, it's about focusing on one specific brand image.

Our last campaign actually started on the 25th Anniversary --we posted the tribute video, started an email campaign, and publicly encouraged our fellow fans to purchase HD, Rebirth, or VC games to show their support.  That was also when we started engaging the Official Castlevania Facebook Page directly by posting group propaganda and critical commentary regarding Konami's handling of the Anniversary. Unfortunately, OA was only a couple months old at the time --with less than 200 members, there was only so much that we could do.  Its' also important to note, the mainstream gaming media pretty much snubbed Castlevania's 25th as well --if they had raised the awareness a bit more, that would have put some more public pressure on Konami...

The biggest problem for all of the fans is that we learned there wasn't any plans for the 25th Anniversary until after it was too late to really do anything about it.  That's Konami's bad, and it's one of the things that we should hold them to task for.

Another easier goal would have also been to push for more content and levels for Harmony of Despair.  I bought that game when it finally came to the Playstation and I was surprised to discover it was actually fun, especially when you're playing with a group.  It's biggest problem is that it gets repetitive quickly with only so many areas and characters, which is something that shouldn't happen since CV has an enormous catalog of protagonists, bosses, and locations to choose from.

Small things like this, which can be done with limited financial requirements and that don't take away from their larger goals, are what Konami is likely to meet you half way on.   


Offline beingthehero

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #221 on: January 04, 2012, 06:34:40 PM »
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If Konami wanted the series to be relevant, they'd tried to be ahead of the curve with their 3D games, rather than rip-off various existing franchises from the PS2 generation. Castlevania still appears to be a niche series even now. Even though they were released long before Lords, God of War III and/or Bayonetta seem to be the focus of attention on other gaming forums when there is discussion of the best 3D action games. Lords is hardly ever mentioned, if at all.

Frankly, Konami is right that their focus shouldn't be 2D games. Those are great for handhelds, and I hope IGA does one for the 3DS. But 3D is where the money is, but Konami really ought to go back to the roots, and I don't mean vague bullshit like 'it's linear! so that means it's like the old games!" which is as much justification as saying God of War is a classic castlevania game because it's also linear or any other linear game in the world. Castlevania needs to do something to set itself apart, and having a game with god of war controls/weapon, shadow of the colossus boss fights, metal gear solid twist-ending, Internet Meme Jokes, and Lord of the Rings aesthetics isn't the way to go. You can't appeal to a mass Western audience by saying "look at our game, it's exactly like the things you all liked 6 years ago, back in 2006!" It's no better than KCET shoe-horning anime plots/designs/grinding to appeal to the Japanese market. Such as then, they're still playing catch-up to an audience that already moved on. I'm surprised they didn't add Nazis Zombies, because Call of Duty has Nazi Zombies and those sell and please buy our game we have everything cool that you kids like just please like us we'll even give you our lunch money please please please. Even this site's founder, Kurt Kalata-kun, pointed out the severe deficit of originality in Lords and how it made him want to play Lament of Innocence instead. And Kurt is not much of a Lament fan.

(Of course, Lords also did several things right. The graphics and the sheer detail in the stages were slick, very slick, and the Castle was beautifully done.)

They ought to ditch high fantasy and go back to vampires (and not Warcraft Eradar labeled as vampires.) Cox-kun and the like need to watch Nosferatu and the 1992 Dracula. No games today opt for a classic vampiric feel, but too many have already emulated the high-fantasy, lord of the rings shtick. Have the other games try to emulate you, rather than vice-versa.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2012, 07:52:19 PM by beingthehero »

Offline Neobelmont

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #222 on: January 04, 2012, 10:58:15 PM »
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Did it occur to you that Konami may actually be able to support both forms of Castlevania?

True if nintendo can do it for mario and heck if my memory serves me correct Namco Bandai had team symphonia AND team destiny work on the tales series both 2D and 3D. symphonia with games like well symphonia,abyss and vesperia I believe and team destiny with destiny, destiny 2 , and tales of rebirth,  now anyone can correct me if I am wrong but having two talents is better than one and if both had a budget than all would be good.
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Come on now this was going to happen eventually  :P

Offline Charlotte-nyo:3

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #223 on: January 05, 2012, 04:42:15 AM »
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Castlevania needs to do something to set itself apart, and having a game with god of war controls/weapon, shadow of the colossus boss fights, metal gear solid twist-ending, Internet Meme Jokes, and Lord of the Rings aesthetics isn't the way to go. You can't appeal to a mass Western audience by saying "look at our game, it's exactly like the things you all liked 6 years ago, back in 2006!" It's no better than KCET shoe-horning anime plots/designs/grinding to appeal to the Japanese market. Such as then, they're still playing catch-up to an audience that already moved on.

It may be too late for that, at least in the 3D third-person action genre. It seems like most truly original avenues in that genre have been explored. The SotC boss fights scattered here and there were actually one of the less all-pervasive mechanics they could've used, but it didn't really help set the game apart since it's just one small aspect of the game anyway rather than something that had an effect on the majority of the game. I get the feeling that in order to not be thought of as "another God of War clone" by the gaming public at large, a 3D Castlevania would have to go with a different genre, yet a genre that still works for its themes and atmosphere.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2012, 04:44:37 AM by Charlotte-nyo:3 »

Offline Nagumo

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Re: Konami Facebook team responding to Operation: Akumajo
« Reply #224 on: January 05, 2012, 04:58:14 AM »
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random question: if you post on the wall of the offical castlevania fanpage, can anyone see it or only the person who maintains it?

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