Topic: Thoughts on Dracula post SotN

[Las]

Not pertaining to sotn and off topic somewhat, but It's ironic Danial that you're mentioning Dracula seeing individual belmont members of that clan as insignificant as ants and such, and that other fighter who are belmonts would be probably even less signifigant. In actuality if the game were taken from dracula's real life story document in history(at least from what i've read and remember) The Dynasty family had fought his family for power in that area. I believe from what i read they opposed each other and the two sides(or members of each family fought) soemthing like that. Obviously Dracula's side won. But yeah if what history says is true he was dethroned not once but twice only to gain the throne again. He got imprisoned and manage to get out of it. I think he also had 2 sons or something. And it is not know but speculated that one had to do with his overthrowing at least imprisonment. I read various articles from differnt sites but i am not sure on the history,becuase some of them say diffrent things. I think his father and maybe brother were killed by a Dynasty which is why he hunted down some of their clan members. And yes Grant Dynasty is supposed to represent part of that clan(doubtful any of their names were Grant). I just think the last name spelling is not the same. Also from what i read Drac had a disliking of lazy people(condemned them by death as an example of how not to be), and turks, and yes very ruthless.  Also as far as i know the whole van helsing thing or people hunting him down isn't totally accurate. Assasins maybe. But it would more than likely appear he died in battle(beheaded) by turks or a traitor in his own army. Which makes me think that's how they got the idea for Hector. Then again on diffrent sites the stories do vary, but many of the horrific acts do seem to be somewhat similar in nature. I am not exactly sure on the accuracy of what i remember reading,but i do remember making some comparisons to some of konami's storylines realizing some chracters seem to portray or are based off of real life people at that time. Elizabeth bartey was yet another person who's name had been changed somewhat for konami storyline. I believe i read that on wikipedia.

[Nagumo]

Not to be mean or anything, but dividing your posts into paragraphs would make them a lot more pleasant to read.

[Lumi Kløvstad]

Honestly, I always thought that his death in Symphony was the true death of Mathias, where everything good and human in him passed on to Heaven. All the Dracula's we see after that are kind of just a lingering sentiment in a physical body; his physical body is possessed by raw power and all the hatred and rage he'd built up over the centuries.

Kind of like the Lords of Shadow, in hindsight. But that's been my opinion for ages.

Basically, there's enough of his old self present to reasonably say it's Dracula, but Mathias (or whatever was left of him) ain't home anymore, having passed on having fulfilled his unfinished business.

With no human influence to check his actions, Dracula's inner-vampire started to run the show 24/7.

In that sense, Alucard might have actually made Dracula even MORE of a monster, if my theory turns out to be correct.

Way to go kiddo.

[darkwzrd4]

Honestly, I always thought that his death in Symphony was the true death of Mathias, where everything good and human in him passed on to Heaven. All the Dracula's we see after that are kind of just a lingering sentiment in a physical body; his physical body is possessed by raw power and all the hatred and rage he'd built up over the centuries.

Kind of like the Lords of Shadow, in hindsight. But that's been my opinion for ages.

Basically, there's enough of his old self present to reasonably say it's Dracula, but Mathias (or whatever was left of him) ain't home anymore, having passed on having fulfilled his unfinished business.

With no human influence to check his actions, Dracula's inner-vampire started to run the show 24/7.

In that sense, Alucard might have actually made Dracula even MORE of a monster, if my theory turns out to be correct.

Way to go kiddo.

U might be on to something.  I think that it's the vampire curse that prevents him from changing.  There was probably one last vestige of humanity left in him, but when he learned what Lisa's last words were, that last vestige of humanity was finally consumed by the curse.  Without that, he became purely evil.

That, or hearing what she said caused a psychotic break.  Insanity plus the curse (which is evil in itself) could be what controls his personality after SotN.

And while we are on the subject of Lisa's last words, I would like to discuss how she died.  I just can't seem to shake the thought that her dead wasn't so cut an dry.  This thought is that someone manipulated the events that lead to her execution.  We all know that Dracula's underlings are evil.  We also know that Dracula may not have been that evil before her death.  He only hated God.  Nothing that involved humans.  So, could it be possible that someone manipulated the humans to kill Lisa knowing full well the Dracula would thirst from revenge against humanity for her death?

After all, we know from CoD that Issac tricked humans into killing Rosely to provoke Hector to reclaim his powers to pursuit him so that they could have a battle to the death.  So, I'll ask again: is it possible that one of Dracula's underlings manipulated humans to provoke Dracula?

[A-Yty]

Someone like Death, perhaps? Although he doesn't seem the spiteful evil type (hell, he's the only one who bothers to have an intelligent conversation with Golem), making Drac go on a roaring rampage of revenge means lots of souls for him to harvest (that is if he is indeed the divine being he is believed to be).

Then again, he was his loyal servant even when Mathias was just angry at God. It would somehow be too obvious if Death caused Lisa's death. Galamoth or a rival vampire or maybe even a scheming human whom Mathias had pissed off sounds more like it.

[Archangel]

Honestly, I always thought that his death in Symphony was the true death of Mathias, where everything good and human in him passed on to Heaven. All the Dracula's we see after that are kind of just a lingering sentiment in a physical body; his physical body is possessed by raw power and all the hatred and rage he'd built up over the centuries.

Congratulations good sir, that was exactly what I wanted to read. That´s what I was implying in the beginning... or at least wanted to.



To be honest, while it´s an interesting possibility that Lisa´s death was some sort of scheme by his enemies (or even someone like Death to further his own goals) to emotionally hurt Dracula and send him in a direction they wanted, I personally don´t like it. Imo, after his first defeat in CV3, Dracula slowly became more of a sport of fate. "We people are evil! Dracula, come forth and bring us darkness!" And Dracula is resurrected. At least let him preserve some credit with his initial decisions like hating god for the death of his first wife, then hating humans (an enemy he could punish for real this time) for the death of his second. It was a tragic incident, caused by the stupidity of mankind... it happens all the time.

[darkwzrd4]

Someone like Death, perhaps? Although he doesn't seem the spiteful evil type (hell, he's the only one who bothers to have an intelligent conversation with Golem), making Drac go on a roaring rampage of revenge means lots of souls for him to harvest (that is if he is indeed the divine being he is believed to be).

Then again, he was his loyal servant even when Mathias was just angry at God. It would somehow be too obvious if Death caused Lisa's death. Galamoth or a rival vampire or maybe even a scheming human whom Mathias had pissed off sounds more like it.

I doubt Death would have done such a thing.  He's too loyal to Dracula.  I was thinking of someone lower in the hierarchy who hates humanity.  Perhaps even one of Dracula's human followers who resents society.

[X]

I personally don't think any of Dracula's servants were responsible for Lisa's execution. You have to remember at that time, humanity on the whole was very superstitious. The Church had their Papal armies all over the place, scouring the country for any traces of witches and Heretics. Lisa could have been somewhat careless in her methods of being a doctor and some of the townsfolk could have mistakenly interpreted this as witchcraft. Such an incident like this happened in Salom, Massachusetts. All because some child got spooked she cited an entire riot against the innocent women of Salom. Old or young, it didn't matter, and it only escalated from there. And throughout the whole European witch craze, if someone was accused of being a witch, even without evidence they were as good as dead. Either through torture, life in prison, of executed. It didn't take a demon to get Lisa executed. Just a bunch of fearful people who don't know any better and who were being manipulated through the corruption of the book 'Malleus Maleficarum' by the Holy Roman Empire.

[Flame]

Doesn't help she was married to a Vampire. A person with dark magical powers who took in all those who shunned God or were shunned by the light.

He only really married again because Lisa reminded him so much of Elizabetha. She was the only light in his life, and while he shared his dark knowledge with those that came to him, he had no particular contempt towards humans, although they might have had contempt for him. Or at least feared him. Since she was a Healer (Women "doctors"? in the 1400's? I don't think so.), something already shrouded in mysticism, they pretty much came to the only obvious conclusion- that she was a heretic and a witch, married to some dark sorceror king, and burned her at the stake.

Also, interesting note, that the year CV3 takes place is the same supposed year of Vlad Dracula's irl death.

Meaning, Vlad the Impaler's historical assassins were Trevor Belmont and his crew. XD

[Kingshango]

I started to notice that Dracula's power was getting weaker post SOTN, probably due to the premature resurrection's since he didn't get a proper resurrection till 1999.



Or maybe he was weak enough for Julius and friends to finish him off for good.

[Sumac]

Since she was a Healer (Women "doctors"? in the 1400's? I don't think so.), something already shrouded in mysticism, they pretty much came to the only obvious conclusion- that she was a heretic and a witch, married to some dark sorceror king, and burned her at the stake.

I think that they hide they marriage.
Others already said, that during this time people were very suspicious and, if they knew that Lisa is married to some powerfull sorcerer (and given the times, townsfolk would most likely assumed that he was evil), I think it would be a sure death sentence for her.

[Danial]

He only really married again because Lisa reminded him so much of Elizabetha.

I don't think she just reminded him of Elizabetha.  I think that Elizabetha, Lisa, and Mina are all the same soul reincarnated.  They never come right out and say it in the games, but it seems inferred.  Especially by the AoS/DoS story lines.  There's also a similar theme in Bram Stoker's Dracula.

I also don't think that Lisa and Dracula were ever married.  Marriage is a union under God, and I doubt Mathias would be up for that. 

Lisa not being married, yet having a child-spawn of evil and also practicing healing magic is plenty to have her condemned.  Dracula's minions didn't really need to play any part in it.  Although it could be argued that the evil in men's hearts and senseless murder can be ultimately attributed to the force of Chaos, which Dracula eventually ends up serving.

[DraculaCronqvist]

He's the Dark Lord - Castlevania's Satan. Killing humans and being vengeful is what he does.

On a more serious note (though seriously, you do not need another explanation other than he is the Dark Lord), I believe it is a sort of... for a lack of a better word, habit. After almost a thousand years of slaughtering humans, you can't just simply stop. He doesn't feel guilty about it, but he does realize it's against Liza's wishes.

[darkwzrd4]

I don't think she just reminded him of Elizabetha.  I think that Elizabetha, Lisa, and Mina are all the same soul reincarnated.  They never come right out and say it in the games, but it seems inferred.  Especially by the AoS/DoS story lines.  There's also a similar theme in Bram Stoker's Dracula.

I also don't think that Lisa and Dracula were ever married.  Marriage is a union under God, and I doubt Mathias would be up for that. 

Lisa not being married, yet having a child-spawn of evil and also practicing healing magic is plenty to have her condemned.  Dracula's minions didn't really need to play any part in it.  Although it could be argued that the evil in men's hearts and senseless murder can be ultimately attributed to the force of Chaos, which Dracula eventually ends up serving.

Since when did she practice magic?  She simple used herbs to ease the suffering of the sick.  Did she actually cure anyone?  We don't know.  We do know that she was at least doing something other than praying.  From what I understand, what she did was similar to what modern day nurses and doctors do for terminally ill patients (ease their pain and make them as comfortable as possible).

[DraculaCronqvist]

Honestly, I always thought that his death in Symphony was the true death of Mathias, where everything good and human in him passed on to Heaven. All the Dracula's we see after that are kind of just a lingering sentiment in a physical body; his physical body is possessed by raw power and all the hatred and rage he'd built up over the centuries.

Kind of like the Lords of Shadow, in hindsight. But that's been my opinion for ages.

Basically, there's enough of his old self present to reasonably say it's Dracula, but Mathias (or whatever was left of him) ain't home anymore, having passed on having fulfilled his unfinished business.

With no human influence to check his actions, Dracula's inner-vampire started to run the show 24/7.

In that sense, Alucard might have actually made Dracula even MORE of a monster, if my theory turns out to be correct.

Way to go kiddo.

I quite like this theory and it makes sense in hindsight. So basically Dracula shed his soul, what little there was left of and he became the personification of evil (Satan). I like this.