Topic: The Konami Bashing Thread

[Lumi Kløvstad]

Let's all bash, roast, and generally make fun of gaming's current most EEEEEVIL and mustache twirly supervillains.

I mean seriously, Konami is more evil than Lex Luthor.
And he once stole forty cakes. FORTY CAKES PEOPLE.
And that's terrible.

I'll bet Konami stole FIFTY.

[X]

It might get us a head start on this thread by taking all that was bashed about Konami in other threads, then merging them here. I'm not sure we can say anymore then what has already been stated. But I've been wrong before. Everything from not caring about their game designs, money grubbing, and human rights violations? How long do they intend to let this farce go on..?

[zangetsu468]

I have nothing else to say aside from I hope they've killed Castlevania so it can be resurrected in 2035 along with Dracula.

[shelverton.]

They're not so much "evil" as they are completely out of touch with absolutely everything. They're unwilling to take risks anymore and seem to be 100% in it for maximum profit (except they are making all the wrong decisions to get there). It also seems like they're actively looking for a completely new audience. We, the old fans, aren't interesting to them anymore.

I bet there must be a lot of frustration within the company too. No room for creativity left. This will obviously have an effect on what kind of people they'll be able to hire in the future too. The more konami distance themselves from the traditional video game industry, the less attractive they become as employers for new talent. And without talent their path will go more and more towards something really ugly.

Japanese kids studying to become video game designers, producera and programmers will probably not wanna work at Konami in the future. The Hideo Kojimas and Koji Igarashis of tomorrow will be working for From Soft (or something) instead.

[Belmontoya]

Without Konami there would be no CV.

I understand being frustrated with them today.

But I'm not comfortable with mocking and bashing the company that revolutionized action gaming. We have so much from Konami to be thankful for.

It's short sighted to only see the negativity of current times. Look at the whole picture.

Without Konami, this forum wouldn't exist for you to bash them on.

[Dracula9]

A bountiful past filled with glory days does not erase the transgressions of the present.

That they once were industry pioneers is likely one of the reasons the animosity towards them is so vehement; they weren't always profit-driven asshats out of tune with the industry, and we've watched them as they've fallen from their former glory.

[Crying Freeman]

Everything's already been said atm, but I feel like we'll have more to say soon. Pachinko production is making them tons of mula, and the AAA games market is so hard to make money in nowadays that they just left it. They look at the people who spend like $6000 on mobile games(literally happened recently, forgot the games name) and other successful mobile titles and are gonna go for those.

They could make a cheap game and slap Metal Gear on the cover and make a decent profit. They could even make a new 2D Castlevania or Contra for little money and assuming they're functional and good they'd make profits based on the brand recognition. I mean, I don't run a company or anything, but when you have brands that successful and well known, you should use their popularity to your benefit. When you look past gaming though, they're despicable people cus of the way they treat their staff.

Btw, still waiting for Belmonts Revenge and Legends on 3DS, Konami!!

[JR]

One thing I've always thought (and I'm sure a lot of people will disagree) is that Konami had shit beat-em-ups. I bought the Simpsons on XBL simply for nostalgia's sake and after 5 minutes of playing, I instantly regretted my purchase (add to the fact that Konami charges twice what they probably should on their digital games, but that's another story). Same with Turtles in Time: I remember the TMNT arcade games fondly, but last time I was in an arcade bar and sank money in this game, I died so fast that I didn't bother continuing.

Konami always got the good licenses for beat-em-ups (X-Men, Simpsons, TMNT), and that made people flock to these games, but it's like they're a chore to play. Trade blows with enemies, put in more quarters, repeat. I know these are beat-em-ups I'm talking about here, but Konami's games always seemed to milk this concept the most (Crime Fighters was the epitome of this, just boring, frustrating, and expensive to finish.)

Compare that to something like Final Fight where there was at least a fluidity to the combat system, and someone could conceivably git gud at the game and beat it on one credit (unlikely as that is, but I digress). You weren't just left to stand there and stupidly trade hits with an enemy until you had to pump more quarters in the machine.

[Belmontoya]

A bountiful past filled with glory days does not erase the transgressions of the present.

That they once were industry pioneers is likely one of the reasons the animosity towards them is so vehement; they weren't always profit-driven asshats out of tune with the industry, and we've watched them as they've fallen from their former glory.

I'm not saying that their past erases their present. I'm saying that their present does not erase their past.

I'm not a fan of that sort of attitude. So my two cents is to look at the whole picture. If you really look at the big picture, you find one of the longest running IP's in gaming history with an abundance of great games. A few years of being fuckwads doesn't erase what we've already been given. All good things have to end. That's life. Konami isn't completely dead yet, but maybe they are when it comes to games. If so, that's ok. Great entertainers can fall from grace, be greedy and become dicks. But that doesn't erase the great legacies they leave behind. Killing people or doing horrible things like Bill Cosby can erase a great legacy. Konami has been greedy and foolish. They're more like an Axle Rose or a Prince. I look at the current state of Konami's game division that way. I'm obviously using analogies here but I hope that makes sense.

I don't hate Konami because their games have permanently enriched my life. I will remain hopeful that they can still put out a good Castlevania game in the future. If they don't, then I will be sad and disappointed, but still be grateful for what's already been given. Because in my opinion there is no game that's ever been made that is as enjoyable as Castlevania.

Either way I choose to use my time to help create another great CV game for people to enjoy. A game that, by the way, also could never exist if not for the legacy that Konami has made. I think that's a better usage of time than spreading negativity by bitching about what Konami is doing now.

[Lumi Kløvstad]

I'm not saying that their past erases their present. I'm saying that their present does not erase their past.

It... actually kind of does. People don't want to buy Konami games as much, even games from a much better period, because it puts money towards the company as it currently exists, not as it used to be. People don't want to support that, and nor should they.

I get what you're trying to say, but Konami of NOW is coloring our hindsight about Konami of then, however unjustifiably that might be.

[Belmontoya]

It... actually kind of does. People don't want to buy Konami games as much, even games from a much better period, because it puts money towards the company as it currently exists, not as it used to be. People don't want to support that, and nor should they.

I get what you're trying to say, but Konami of NOW is coloring our hindsight about Konami of then, however unjustifiably that might be.

 It's ironic then that you make such posts on a forum designed to promote konamis IP.

[Lumi Kløvstad]

Not ironic at all.

That's where one would EXPECT to find critique of Konami. If your friends aren't calling you out for your blunders, you have terrible friends.

We are hard on Konami because we know they can be better. We are holding Konami to a higher standard than they currently hold themselves.

Because, as you said, they were better once.

However, if I applied a Ship of Theseus argument to Konami, I would despair that they ever stood a chance at regaining what they used to be. The parts just aren't there anymore. Anyone who is in a position to reverse course at Konami has either left, been effectively neutralized by reassignment to the boonies of the company, or has not yet been hired into a position where they could make a difference.

Things are bleaker than they've ever been for our favorite company, and that's why we're doing our best to kick their ass until they get it back into high gear.

As it stands, Konami will proudly refuse to reverse course in any way. They will continue to bleed talent and garner bad press and reputation, and left unchecked, that could destroy them.

They may be making tons of money off their mobile and casino ventures, but that too will stop if they acquire too much negative rep, and that is the course they are currently set on.

[Dracula9]

It's ironic then that you make such posts on a forum designed to promote konamis IP.

This comic is intended as hyperbole and is not meant as anything derogatory, but I do feel the need to point out the trouble with that train of thought.



If I sell someone my old kitchen table, and that person talks the table up to his friends, he's not talking ME up or benefiting ME directly simply because I owned the table originally. He's talking up the table because it's a nice table, not because he wants to make me look good because the table was originally mine.

As it's been mentioned, the sort of viewpoint you're trying to get across isn't necessarily being lost on us, but at least in the case of myself and Scholar, the way it's being conveyed feels a bit like it's trying to downplay the severity of the screw-ups Konami has made the last few years.

Will they continue to exist, create, and profit despite our grievances? Most likely.
Will they continue to have the same level of support from the fanbase it's spent almost thirty years building after everything they've done recently? Probably not, and a crack in the reputation like that isn't something that can just be swept under the rug because they have a longer track record of not being assholes.

Quality trumps quantity, and the kinds of mindsets and motives displayed in their recent years (despite a decent chunk of them being able to be chalked up to "it's just business," which is another thing in itself) speaks volumes of where the company is currently at.

"You're arguing about a company on a board that is themed after one of that company's products, so your argument is ironic" has the potential to feel like a bit of a blasé dismissal, even if that's not the intent. This potential for disregarded-interpretation is why I posted the above comic, because said comic is the extreme end of the sort of tone generally found in that kind of argument or statement.

Don't take it as anything terribly negative, I simply went with the comic as a means to illustrate a point which might otherwise take a text wall for me to get across clearly.

EDIT: I feel like I should mention that it doesn't seem like every single person here outright hates Konami forevermore and wants to watch their headquarters burn down or anything like that; that's never the impression I've gotten from this place. I've always felt more...disappointment, rather than hatred. If we all hated the company we wouldn't be here rationally discussing our grievances and why we feel those grievances to be based on harmful things Konami has been doing that have the potential to come back to bite them later.

We're not standing around screaming "YEAH FUCK KONAMI I HOPE THEY ALL DIE PAINFULLY THEY'RE THE MOST EVIL FORCE EVER CONCEIVED BECAUSE REASONS," despite the title and opening post of this thread (which are clearly satirical and slightly humored). We're standing around explaining why we believe Konami's recent decisions have been based on poor ethical foundations that have seemed to alienate more of their long-time fans than attracted new ones, inherently flawed business strategies founded on ideas and views which have come to illustrate a disconnect within the company and the traditional industry at large, and blatant misunderstanding of what their own fans even liked about their glory-day titles. We could be acting far less civilized than what we are, but we're not because we understand that that gets nobody anywhere.

[Belmontoya]

That's fine. Say what you guys want.

My opinion is that it's a short sighted, negative attitude and a waste of virtual breath.

I'm stepping out of this thread because it's a waste of energy.

[zangetsu468]

All I will say is that if you're with a partner, you've had an awesome past together since you were in highschool and you're now a grown adult and that partner is treating you badly, it doesn't negate the niceness and harmony that was the past. However, any semblance of a relationship you used to have in "the now" will go out the window very quickly.

This is one of the few situations I will be that guy and say everyone's pov's are valid.
Scholar has a point with the critique thing
D9's logic about the table actually made me crack a smirk, and is insightful
Belmontoya has a valid point about not expending negative energy.

I'm more interested in where to from here.
What do we expect from Konami?
What can we do as hardcore fans?

I'm finding the cruelest twist of irony is that Iga is basically giving us Castlevania's 30th anniversary celebration with Bloodstained.

What I would really like to see from Konami is "Castlevania Anniversary Collection v.1"
This could be all of the NES SNES, arcade, genesis/ megadrive and TG16/PCE titles bundled as one with extras.(if applicable)

I would also really like a Goemon collection, call me old fashioned but I preferred Goemon 64 over Mario 64 and played that game to death. (No castlevania pun intended)