Topic: Hopes and dreams for 2013?

[Zuljaras]

I hope for more 2D Castlevania games and I hope that Mirror of Fate is good!!!

PS: I know that this is impossible but I want 3 more GBA Castlevanias and 3 more for the DS

[Sumac]

I wish developers would give even less attention for some unreasonable demands by fans. So far MS does a great job by creating their own vision of the series. I like it and hope future CV developers will follow this trend, not being afraid to experiment, but keeping the essence of the series intact. LOS did a good job at this department.

[Phoenix7786]

Hey there Zuljaras! I left a comment on your video for you Also, youtube links should embed automatically. Try putting an extra space between the picture and the youtube link.
EDIT: Oh wait that's part of your signature. In that case I don't know if you can (or should) embed it.
Also, welcome to the Dungeon!!!!

[crisis]

I wish developers would give even less attention for some unreasonable demands by fans.

I'll never understand your constant beratement of us fans as "unreasonable" or "insignificant." Since you've joined this forum it's almost as if you look down upon us for viewing Castlevania a certain way. We're the ones that have kept the series alive for so long and the term "fan-service" is exactly what the industry (especially Castlevania) thrives upon. It's fan response that get certain games made, why else in so many countless developer interviews the producer(s) always say "if you want [game], then tell us, the fans need to speak!" and WayForward even admitting "You want us to create a Castlevania? Send letters/tweets/campaigns to Konami and it just might happen!" Cox even said in interviews that "we've been listening to fan complaints of LoS1, what they did & didn't like, and are taking that into consideration with LoS2/MoF"

It was constant fan demand that got MM Legends 3 started (but not canceled, don't believe Capcom for a second it's "the fan's fault," more like industry politics & Inafune quitting "cut the head off the snake, and the body falls apart"). It was fan demand that got Marvel vs. Capcom 3 made. It was fan demand that got Rondo of Blood ported outside Japan (via DXC). Countless other examples of fans getting games ported/created.

They work for us, not the other way around, and we're the ones that decide whether a game ultimately succeeds or bombs. We have more power than we think. But of course you're retort will be something like "logically we don't matter cuz general consumers buy it blah blah, it's logic that they should adhere to, not whiny fans." I'm confident Castlevania will be in good hands again, by a team that doesn't completely ignore the source material like MS seemingly(intentionally?) did, but build upon it with a fresh take that leaves everyone happy with no intention on "alienating" anybody. That's the mark of a good development team. Prior to LoS' release Cox came off rather cocky (no pun intended) with quotes such as "this is our time now, you can hop aboard or be left behind," which is why many don't seem to like him very much (granted he's been back-peddling with MoF as he says it's designed to cater to "metroivania fans"). He's been borderline disrespectful (especially with his Twitter rants), although to his credit he has gotten a lot better and "friendlier" over time. The next producer needs to be the opposite of that. That's why I like IGA; his games aside, he's always humble & comes off as a genuine fan first, producer second. He recognizes he's not the best & sees his faults (there's a youtube video of him saying how he essentially "failed with LoI & CoD" and that "pisses the hell out of him," and he "strives to make a better experience" FOR THE FANS.) Cox comes off as "you don't like what we're doing? oh well, you don't matter," which is true, but also tarnishes his image. Not trying to turn this into a "cox/iga discussion" but just trying to make a point.

I know you're a "logical" dude, Sumac. But consider this; Einstein once said, "Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere." You [and the next CV developers] should remember that.

[Claimh Solais]

Give Castlevania to Fromsoft or Platinum Games.

Boy, I'd be all over that like white on rice.

insert speech here

Crisis, out of the many I've read, I believe you're the only one who's ever delivered the "company works for us, not the other way around" speech well, and not sounded like an asshat. So, kudos to you.

I do, however, agree with Sumac. To an extent. And by that, I mean I wish companies were more willing to take risks with their games (which is very hard these days considering the funds necessary to make a full retail game).

[VladCT]

I just hope that the next take on CV would be good enough to shut up both sides of the IGA vs. COX pissing contest.

I hope we'll stop the eternal stupid debate of traditional/metroidvania vs. LoS.

God, I'm sick of this shit.

I was half-joking before, but truly, this "war" has grown to be tiresome. Were this a real war and I a soldier fighting for either side, I would drop my weapon and let myself be slain. And I am normally against suicide.

[JoshuaKadmon]

If I were in charge of the Castlevania series' direction post-MS, there are a few objectives I would shoot for immediately:

1) Consolidate the classic timeline for old fans to enjoy and new fans to catch up by putting a collection of all major titles on a single platform, probably 3DS or Vita.

2) Release a few fan favorites as cheap App Store downloads on iOS. It still baffles me that the only CV on iPad/iPhone is the EotN puzzler.

3) Commission a Castlevania edition of Bram Stoker's Dracula (a la Pride and Prejudice and Zombies), either as a paperback Limited Edition for preordering a future CV or as a hardcover collector's item for CV enthusiasts. I know, this is silly, but it would be a cool way to represent that part of the timeline officially and explain how the novel fits into CV's lore more specifically.

4) Since the previous items would satiate fans for a while, it would buy some time to start working on a massive new CV surrounding the Demon Castle Wars.

[Munchy]

I just want another IGA game dammit. OoE was pretty cool. Although judging from much of his later interviews, he seemed pretty burned out working on it nonstop. (I'd be extra happy if he made a 3D game with competent level designers.)

Alternatively, if Metal Gear Revengeance sells bucketloads I'd love for Platinum Games to take a shot at it.

I could also get behind any home console port of The Arcade. Really want to try that one.

[Sumac]

I promised myself not to do "multiple answers for a long post", but this time, I think, I can make an exception.

I'll never understand your constant beratement of us fans as "unreasonable" or "insignificant." Since you've joined this forum it's almost as if you look down upon us for viewing Castlevania a certain way.

I view some people here (and in any fandom) as curiosity denying common sense and business practices.

We're the ones that have kept the series alive for so long and the term "fan-service" is exactly what the industry (especially Castlevania) thrives upon. It's fan response that get certain games made, why else in so many countless developer interviews the producer(s) always say "if you want [game], then tell us, the fans need to speak!" and WayForward even admitting "You want us to create a Castlevania? Send letters/tweets/campaigns to Konami and it just might happen!" Cox even said in interviews that "we've been listening to fan complaints of LoS1, what they did & didn't like, and are taking that into consideration with LoS2/MoF"

It is more or less true for some bigger series as Mario, Sonic or Final Fantasy, where amount of fans is enough to sell new games in the series, even if they quality is questionable at best (I think it's called sybdrome of "battered wife"). In case of Castlevania, and in case with most other series, companies keep producing new games for as long as they are profitable. No matter how much importance you put on yourself, companies will not keep making games for people, that not even sure what exactly do they want. After-LOS quarrels proved more than enough, that  "Castlevania fandom" is rather disjointed community, that is very hard to please. The last events also have proved, that Konami care, first and foremost about profit, hence move from "metroidvania" to the new genre. Arcade and Pachislots are just for quick money. Konami already burned themselves, when they were listening to the fans and produced more and more "metroidvanias" that eventually nearly finished the series off for good. Obviously, they don't want to repeat the same mistake and went into another direction.
The bottome line: listening to the fans almost killed the series + community doesn't know what it want + Castlevania is succesful in a new form = there is no neccessity to listen to the oldschool fans. Face it - your time has gone.

It was constant fan demand that got MM Legends 3 started (but not canceled, don't believe Capcom for a second it's "the fan's fault," more like industry politics & Inafune quitting "cut the head off the snake, and the body falls apart"). It was fan demand that got Marvel vs. Capcom 3 made. It was fan demand that got Rondo of Blood ported outside Japan (via DXC). Countless other examples of fans getting games ported/created.

I am not sure why you believe that fans had so much influence on those developments. MML3 was shut down despite whatever fans wanted. MvC3 was made to capitalize on fighting genre revival. ROB was included because it was rather simple to do so and it was thematically tied with DXC. If Konami listened to the fans, than ROB would have been ported much earlier and not as an afterthought for the bigger game package. Those examples convince me much more than anything, that companies behind them cared about profit, not fans. Or at least, didn't put fans before profit.

They work for us, not the other way around, and we're the ones that decide whether a game ultimately succeeds or bombs. We have more power than we think. But of course you're retort will be something like "logically we don't matter cuz general consumers buy it blah blah, it's logic that they should adhere to, not whiny fans."

No matter what fans think, they're not the ones making profit nowadays. Since that's the case all this talk about "how we have more power than we think" is meaningless. Companies were working for the fans in the past, when the games were smaller  business. There weren't teams of hundred people working with multimillion budgets. Nowadays, things have changed. It is strange that somebody who consider himself so smart as you are, can't see the reality.

As for this talk about Cox...it looks like you trying to pass your personal displeasure with him as something bigger than life. For me it's a sign of immaturity and nothing else. He doesn't own anything to you personally and for the fandom in general. He was hired to create a good game. He did it. Questions?
Everything else could be marked as "he created the game - I don't like it - I will hate him for this". Now this is understandable. Not credible or constructive, but understandable. And rather logical. For the people like you, of course.

I know you're a "logical" dude, Sumac. But consider this; Einstein once said, "Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere." You [and the next CV developers] should remember that.

That is exactly why I don't want to see another "metroidvania" or "IGAvania" and why I support LOS-verse. It's much more creative comparing to what series was in the last decade. Latest "metroidvanias" were creative bankrupts in terms of gameplay and storylines. LOS maybe not the most original thing, when it comes to video games, but at least it doesn't needlesly abide to the old and tired formula and have more imaginative approach to the matter, rather then another "anime"-themed Castleroid with generic storyline about someone trying to ressurect Dracula and two best friends involved. But it seems some, less open-minded people confused it with "bertraying roots of the series". It is funny how IGA didn't received so much hate for doing exactly the same with AOS, DOS, POR and OOE, which mostly were Castlevanias in name only. It seems SOTN made a good job in blinding people, I must say.

Also, I must say I surprised that some people want to see Castlevania from Platinum Games. Do they really think that their Castlevania will be more "true to the roots" rather than LOS? All I see them creating is another mindless and stylish action as they always do. Not to say that it will not be good to the series (and that what ultimately matters), but does this approach screams more Castlevania for some people? Or it is just warped sense of hatred like "anything, but LOS will be better for the series"...Questions, questions...

[crisis]

*sigh* You just don't get it, Sumac, so I'm not even gonna respond to you. Good day.

I could also get behind any home console port of The Arcade. Really want to try that one.

I wonder what the reasoning for creating it in the first place was? Did a couple guys at Konami say "lets make a arcade game, but with Castlevania." I think IGA was involved to some extent, I remember reading on his Japanese blog him mentioning it's release. I think it was even brought stateside but at only a few venues cuz I remember reading some reviews from people who played it. It would've been reason enough for me to buy the PSMove. alkjfnw4

[Sumac]

*sigh* You just don't get it, Sumac, so I'm not even gonna respond to you. Good day.

Believe what you want, Crisis, even that companies own you something. But don't be dissappointed, when reality kicks in. End of line.

[crisis]

The moral of the story, folks, is that debating with people like Sumac usually goes like this, so don't waste your time:

No no no Donkey - Family Guy


Coincidently, it's ironic you were temporarily banned from this forum at one point for acting like a donkey. But I digress..

1) Consolidate the classic timeline for old fans to enjoy and new fans to catch up by putting a collection of all major titles on a single platform, probably 3DS or Vita.

3DS is more likely since the Vita has been slagging in sales (dare I say bombed? I still would like to purchase one tho, the hardware is amazing). And it's more feasable to release the classic NES games on the e-Shop. Why haven't they done this yet is anyone's guess, considering CV1-3D has been showcased damn near a year ago.

2) Release a few fan favorites as cheap App Store downloads on iOS. It still baffles me that the only CV on iPad/iPhone is the EotN puzzler.

Order of Shadows perhaps? Still haven't played it.

3) Commission a Castlevania edition of Bram Stoker's Dracula (a la Pride and Prejudice and Zombies), either as a paperback Limited Edition for preordering a future CV or as a hardcover collector's item for CV enthusiasts. I know, this is silly, but it would be a cool way to represent that part of the timeline officially and explain how the novel fits into CV's lore more specifically.

This is a great idea actually. I always envisioned the events of 1897 to be in game form, but a visual novel or manga depicting these events in the CV-world might turn out better, while paying tribute to Bram Stoker's version. I'd love to see this happen!

[Sumac]

The moral of the story, folks, is that debating with people like Sumac usually goes like this, so don't waste your time:

Because being realistic is stupid. 
OK, so be it. Maybe lying to yourself make you feel better, I am not sure. How they say: better sweet lie, than sad truth. I haven't seen any convincing argument from you, only: "I believe we have power!!" Yeah, great. For the propaganda or self-persuasion, not so much for the real world we happened to live in. 
Also, for somebody who considers himself so smart, you insults are childish.   
Have fun.

[Chernabogue]

Hopes and dreams for 2013? We all stop arguing.


We said "dreams". 

[crisis]

In Reply To #72,

Perhaps you should stick to reviewing games before Jorge gets involved in your incessant condescending ramblings (again).


In Reply To #73,

I like civily debating with my fellow Dungeonites, been doing so for years & I respect everybody here, but sometimes when someone comes along & tries to subtly insult the fanbase [multiple times], I see through that BS & I'll call them out on it. I earned my Trollmeister award for a reason