Topic: About Vlad III's Existence on Castlevania

[theplottwist]

Really, twist-kun? I don't remember that being apperent anywhere. Was it in the radio drama?

I think the idea of Tepes being a surname is a very silly idea for obvious reasons. I actually thought about why Alucard would be called "Tepes" and it worked perfectly in my mind. Since "Tepes" is basic calling someone "[insert name here] the Butcher" (I know it actually means "The Impaler"), and Alucard being Dracula's son, it's possible that he was given this nickname as well just because of his association with his father. That would after Lisa's death, but before meeting Trevor and friends, so 1475 - 1476.

As Zangetsu mentioned, the only source we have for his true name is the manual for SotN. Naming someone "Tepes" is kind of a weird thing to do, and we find it weird because we know "Tepes" is a nickname that was given to the real Vlad III. Thing is, does Castlevania work under the same logic?

I'm not really sure if it makes sense for Alucard to receive the "Tepes" name after Lisa's death. Perhaps it does, but this requires more variables and assumptions. I'm aware Alucard could've adopted the surname after his father's nickname, as Vlad III did with "Dracula" after his father's title of "Dracul". However, I'm *personally* not very keen about it because Alucard has also the "Fahrenheit" in his name. This name is presumably from his mother's side.

So, before Lisa's death, Adrian would go around carrying only his mother's real name, but not his father's? He was called "Adrian Fahrenheit" only? Only Lisa would get to name the child and Dracula would've no say in the matter? Now, If "Tepes" in this universe is really Dracula's name, then it makes sense for Adrian to inherit both his father AND mother surnames.

So bottom line: I don't think "Tepes" is merely a nickname in this universe because then, Alucard would have only his mother's surname. If I were to be more strict, I don't think "Tepes" is merely a nickname in this universe because the manuals specifically use it for Alucard and Dracula untranslated - that is, the word is not properly translated either in japanese or english as "The Impaler" which would be the correct thing to do.

I'll try looking for more evidence on Alucard's surname and see if we can make something more concrete out of this.

[Nagumo]

I'm a bit skeptical about Lisa's surname being Fahrenheit. If that was the case, why doesn't the manual refer to her as Lisa Fahrenheit rather than just Lisa? I have no idea why  out of all names they decided on Fahrenheit, but I always assumed it was Alucard's second name. No idea what his surname would be, but I personally don't think that much thought was ever put into the matter.

[Dracula9]

The Church needs to be REALLY FRIKKIN POWERFUL to manipulate history in such a grand way

ThisactuallyhappenedIRLthough


Anyway, couple the aforementioned bits about Mathias chilling for 400 years and CoD stating he protected the land, and you have a pretty easy connection to Vlad III. That being said, there are some glaring inconsistencies.

For one Vlad fought for the Church, as the Order of the Dragon was a Christian sect. Mathias is pretty anti-God, so this wouldn't line up. One COULD theoretically argue him as pretending to fight for the Church's cause against the Ottomans, but given how vehement his hatred of God is in LoI, I don't see much feasibility there.

Secondly, there's the whole "head chopped off and displayed on a stake in Constantinople to prove he was dead" thing, but this can be easily fixed with the next bit.

Let's say Mathias did adopt the moniker of Wladislaus Dragwlya (which is how Vlad signed his name historically), and usurped the throne from Vladislav II as it's historically writ. He basically uses that period to grow his powers and knowledge of the black arts, and uses the neighboring countries' people as guinea pigs. At some point the Turks do something to piss him off (or perhaps they had something he wanted and they denied him) and he goes after them as we know Vlad III to have done. However, he still relied on the easier-access Wallachian people for his experiments and magical tests.

Eventually, he surmises that the area is no longer useful to him, so he creates a doppleganger through his magic and lets that thing take his place on the executioner's block. He then goes underground and the series canon continues as normal.

The Church later alters records and makes it so that Mathias was the son of Vlad II rather than a random usurper, fought on behalf of the Church and God (to rationalize the decimation and brutality towards the Turks, as well as demonize the Turks and shift blame to them as the cause of the violence against the Wallachian people), and was killed by his enemies after running out of money to pay his mercenaries.

Basically, the Church keeps most of the truth intact, but alters certain key details which rewrite Mathias into a warrior of the Church, so that his actions could be justified as acts in the name of God; in addition, rewriting things so that there wasn't an immensely powerful sorcerer and vampire running an entire country, but a member of a well-known Christian order who was the tragic victim of political kidnapping and murdering of his family, who rose up in righteous vengeance against his enemies and died fighting them.

[zangetsu468]

http://www.castlevaniacrypt.com/img/sotn/manual/ps/7.jpg
http://www.castlevaniacrypt.com/img/sotn/manual/ps/6.jpg

Dracula goes by the name Dracula Vlad Tepes
Alucard is Adrian Farenheights Tepes

Plottwist is right imo in that:
This says a couple of things to me. Whether by throne or otherwise Dracula adopted the surname of "Tepes"; which is not a nickname in the Castlevania universe. If it was why would he take "Vlad Tepes" which means Vlad The Impaler? Granted Sotn was made earlier than LOI but it still stands in context to 1797.
The fact Dracula took the name "Vlad Tepes" which is second to his name Dracula (who Mathias became and the name he adopted between 1094-CVIII) is telling me he took the throne at some stage. More than likely this was how he amassed all of his power by the time of CVIII.

Otherwise if Tepes was a title/ nickname or only name he adopted from association he would be Dracula Tepes. Nope, in CV Tepes IS their last name.

Farenheights is not in inverted commas, therefore I assume it to be Alucard's middle name, just as Adrian is his first and Tepes his last name. Nagumo is correct and it's not Lisa's last name imo. Otherwise the manual would have stated so.

Has anyone read the Japanese manual? I have SSOTN but I can't read Japanese.

[Lumi Kløvstad]

I always assumed "Tepes" was a name "earned" by the same reasons as Dracula's real life counterpart -- he got really zealous about defending the people. Even if Lisa was otherwise a paragon or virtue and morality, if you consider the times and culture she lived in, she likely would have had zero problem with her husband massacring Muslim Turks. Unless of course she's Female Jesus, which considering Iga's writing style is also a possibility.

[zangetsu468]

Personally I'm in belief that Dracula had the throne of Vlad by the time he met Lisa. He took the place of the then "Vlad Tepes" and adopted his name after the title of Dracula. Whether Lisa was a Countess or not is unclear.

If Alucard's Sword and Shield were handed from Lisa's family then it would scream bloodline of knights to me. But the shield just isn't really doing it for me being a hand me down, it's too indicative of his Vampiric abilities. I mean Lisa could have come from a bloodline of Blacksmiths or Mercenaries for all we know.

[TatteredSeraph]

I've always read it that it was only his sword handed down from Lisa, while his shield was from Dracula.

[zangetsu468]

Okay, so the Holy Bloodline of Lisa explains why Alucard can use holy weapons if I'm reading this correctly.

Does Holy Bloodline equate to descendant of a knight?

How is Lisa's attire, more like that of a peasant or a Countess?
She could have also been the descendant of a line of priests if her bloodline is considered holy.

[Lumi Kløvstad]

Okay, so the Holy Bloodline of Lisa explains why Alucard can use holy weapons if I'm reading this correctly.

Does Holy Bloodline equate to descendant of a knight?

How is Lisa's attire, more like that of a peasant or a Countess?
She could have also been the descendant of a line of priests if her bloodline is considered holy.

It is very Countess-like for the period, but actually, in keeping with Kojima's usual [lack of] standards, not actually accurate to 15th century Hungarian (of which Wallachia was a constituent province of the time) dress -- closer to 18th century Austrian, and much more drably colored.

The thing is that most nobles of the 15th century dressed very plainly unless they were at Court. Clothes were expensive, and opulent clothes even more so, and even a noble family would penny pinch when it came to wardrobe. None of Dracula's outfits, for comparison, would have EVER been in fashion among nobles in Hungary, or indeed elsewhere -- it's too dark, opulent, and expensive, and fit more for the Holy Roman Emperor than a Wallachian count; and even then he'd only wear something that dark at a funeral.

Alucard's Symphony of the Night garb is more in line with English fashions of the mid to late 1600's among nobility along with a dash of French influence, so it's a bit more accurate to the times, but still way off.

Richter's DXC outfit is more realistic (probably one of the most realistic in the series imo), looking like he adapted it from a military uniform of the period (likely Belgian or French, given the look and color).

[zangetsu468]

It is very Countess-like for the period, but actually, in keeping with Kojima's usual [lack of] standards, not actually accurate to 15th century Hungarian (of which Wallachia was a constituent province of the time) dress -- closer to 18th century Austrian, and much more drably colored.

The thing is that most nobles of the 15th century dressed very plainly unless they were at Court. Clothes were expensive, and opulent clothes even more so, and even a noble family would penny pinch when it came to wardrobe. None of Dracula's outfits, for comparison, would have EVER been in fashion among nobles in Hungary, or indeed elsewhere -- it's too dark, opulent, and expensive, and fit more for the Holy Roman Emperor than a Wallachian count; and even then he'd only wear something that dark at a funeral.

Alucard's Symphony of the Night garb is more in line with English fashions of the mid to late 1600's among nobility along with a dash of French influence, so it's a bit more accurate to the times, but still way off.

Richter's DXC outfit is more realistic (probably one of the most realistic in the series imo), looking like he adapted it from a military uniform of the period (likely Belgian or French, given the look and color).

Thanks for that detailed reply Blood Rayne.

I was googling some clothing from that era which probably doesn't help as most photo's were black and white.
Though it did occur to me that the 'puffy shoulders' and the low neck as well as the hair veil/ accessory seems more like a countess than a peasant to me. I'm not well versed in this era of clothing or any prior to this century, but it seems like a fair enough assumption.

Then again when you look at the sprite her outfit is not coloured the same which I'm assuming was done to break the fifty shades of grey that is "Nightmare". Honestly, Lisa also doesn't seem like she's dressed that differently to the woman on her left (by the man/ guard with the spear).
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/I5fGavPsQa8/hqdefault.jpg
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/NPoCNrnorIE/hqdefault.jpg

Also in context of artist and CV universe and not the era (or reality of any kind) Maria's outfit for example seems much more ornate and Lisa does look more like a peasant in comparison. I would say that from an artist's intention this reductive and less ornate appearance has more to do with appearing pious due to being likened to the Virgin Mary who remained "pure".

It's a tough one.

[Lumi Kløvstad]

Thanks for that detailed reply Blood Rayne.

I'm something of a self-educated semi-expert on the 1400's-1700's Germanic and Slavic culture and fashion. I used to research them heavily for a Soul Calibur-esque project back in high school, so I learned a lot about the Holy Roman Empire and the Ottoman Empire and how the two interacted.

History being history however, there is always something more to learn.

[zangetsu468]

History being history however, there is always something more to learn.

Surely history is such a fabric that it is woven from the actions of humanity, and cut from an even more ornate and splendiferous cloth.

[TatteredSeraph]

It is very Countess-like for the period, but actually, in keeping with Kojima's usual [lack of] standards, not actually accurate to 15th century Hungarian (of which Wallachia was a constituent province of the time) dress -- closer to 18th century Austrian, and much more drably colored.

The thing is that most nobles of the 15th century dressed very plainly unless they were at Court. Clothes were expensive, and opulent clothes even more so, and even a noble family would penny pinch when it came to wardrobe. None of Dracula's outfits, for comparison, would have EVER been in fashion among nobles in Hungary, or indeed elsewhere -- it's too dark, opulent, and expensive, and fit more for the Holy Roman Emperor than a Wallachian count; and even then he'd only wear something that dark at a funeral.

Alucard's Symphony of the Night garb is more in line with English fashions of the mid to late 1600's among nobility along with a dash of French influence, so it's a bit more accurate to the times, but still way off.

Richter's DXC outfit is more realistic (probably one of the most realistic in the series imo), looking like he adapted it from a military uniform of the period (likely Belgian or French, given the look and color).

I'd agree on Alucard's clothing.  it's definitely more late 17th century/18th century than anything else.  His over the knee boots and vest are feasibly earlier, but the frock coat is the big give-away.

All of the material I've read over the years seems contradictory on Lisa's background.  Some places seemed to equate her with Ilona Szilagyi, the second wife of the real Vlad Tepes, which would have made her from noble stock.  However, Lisa herself seems quite modest and willing to help all with her medicines.  Even were of humble stock, Dracula would no doubt be of a mind to give her finer attire, so it's hard to base any conclusions on her background based purely on her dress.  Her clothing would have more likely had a basis of a cotehardie/kirtle dress over a chemise.

[Shiroi Koumori]

I have the Japanese SOTN manual and the names are the same with the English version.
Maybe the Japanese assumed that Tepes is an actual surname for Vlad and not a moniker. I thought that was the case as well when I first got the game and it still messes up my mind. Alright, maybe IGA's vania world is an AU of ours, similarly with what he is planning with Bloodstained. That would settle a lot of things. hahaha.

[zangetsu468]

What about the Alucard Sword. The official artwork:
1) http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/castlevania/images/2/27/Alucard_002.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20150129003339
2) http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/castlevania/images/4/4d/Alucardgrey.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20080227202634

This conflicts with the in game sprite:
3) https://sotnhacked.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/alucard-wolf-compare5.png
4) http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/castlevania/images/c/c2/Alucard-Sword.gif/revision/latest?cb=20140410034400

Image 1 looks more like a rapier with a normal hilt (?)
Image 2 looks more like a stereotypical sword but it clearly not the same as image 1, the hilt is different.

Image 3 looks like a basket hilted sword.
Image 4's hilt looks like a rapier or a walloon sword. (which according to wiki was used by military and civilians.)

Do we trust the art or the sprite? Of course the artwork is of the official artist but it isn't consistent, the swords don't even appear the same.
It doesn't seem the artist necessarily had this in mind while crafting the images.
The sprites on the other hand are consistent.

Ahh whatever, no sense stressing over it.

Thanks Shiroi for that tidbit.