Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: DraimanBelieve on January 29, 2009, 09:17:48 AM
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So I finally finished off Castlevania: Order of Ecclesia which I actually bought when it was first released (I pre-ordered it). After getting my DS broke not long after I bought the game and then getting my DS back from Nintendo not even 2 or 3 weeks ago I have started playing it again. I just beat the game at 100% with all 14 boss medals and most of the items and every glyph in the game there is very little else for me to do except to play through the different Modes that you unlock. This game has gotten a lot of unfair criticism from some people and I feel its somewhat underrated. This is the best Castlevania game since Symphony of the Night hit the PS1 and in a lot of ways it might just be better.
Its definitely next to Symphony but its real close on which game is better? Its basically a lot like Simon's Quest from the old NES but with a lot of Symphony of the Night's elements and features thrown in. Everything from the storyline to even the way the graphics look is really neat. I loved the new environments and I feel that the bosses were just epic and hard for once. Some people griped that the "stages" were too short and felt disjointed compared to the castle I felt that it was really cool.
Of course some of the stages just felt like one huge corridor to another area but even then they served their purpose. Basically you can't please everyone all people did was complain about how Castlevania's 2D series was starting to run out of steam because they kept using the same formula since Symphony over and over and over again and releasing new games based off that game. This game is just epic and it was really new and fresh. It felt familiar but in a other ways it felt fresh and new. The glyph system I felt worked better than the Soul System in the previous games because of how you could combine different glyphs and do different "Glyph Union" attacks and combos. I also liked how they put a female as the lead character instead of Alucard or a Belmont for once in the game.
The music was amazing from start to finish from the beginning to the end. I think that its got some of the strongest music in the series since Symphony. Its just a great game kills Portrait of Ruin and I think its a little bit better than Dawn and Aria of Sorrow. Symphony of the Night is one of those games thats really hard to top but this game actually gets closer to toppling it but I can't say if it actually does. Symphony of the Night is up on this pedestal as the one of the greatest CV games ever but if this game isn't better than SotN then its at least very close or on par with it. I would personally give it a 10/10 there really isn't anything I can find wrong with the game.
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personally I feel OoE is better. but SOTN has the advantage cause it's on console and much greater impact playing it on a good TV and good controller.
SOTN's castle(s) are much bigger but OoE feels like a more complete adventure because there are so many locations and the castle itself wasn't tiny like in CV2 where the last part was just a brief trek to fight Dracula.
the only thing I thought woulda been better is if OoE used
classic tracks after the plot twist and final location appeared on the map, the previous locations should of been given classic music, like the village should of
been given the CV2 town theme. and one of the forest levels should of been given bloody tears, and stuff.
That woulda made the last hours feel more like Castlevania.
but both are great.
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I personally think that they are equal.
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Interesting perspectives. I personally still enjoy SOTN a little more than OOE, although OOE is definitely a close second, followed by DOS. In my mind there's still no trumping SOTN though.
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well SOTN is great in some ways, but it's sooo tearfully TOO EASY! even The Bouncer is harder than SOTN.
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Interesting perspectives. I personally still enjoy SOTN a little more than OOE, although OOE is definitely a close second, followed by DOS. In my mind there's still no trumping SOTN though.
You're joking, right? DoS wasn't that good of a CV. Hell, Portrait was a better game that DoS, for the most part (DoS had a better scriptwriter, but that's it). If anything, DoS was possibly one of the worst Metroidvanias, since it was basically just a repeat of Aria of Sorrow. It didn't really give us anything new at all, except for the seals which IMO, sucked.
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yeah DoS is vastly overrated. it's just popular because of the who the main character is, which is actually kinda lame, they might as well just make a Castlevania where the original CV Dracula is playable and he just goes on a rampage destroying a rival vampire's castle. :p
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Weird. I don't even see OoE as really a great game or anything. I mean it's the best CV in about 10 years (basically post SotN), but that isn't really saying much. I mean it's the only one of the hand held CVs that I actually enjoyed playing somewhat. I will say that I think the gripe about the stages is pretty legitimate. I like the idea of the stages, but I wouldn't mind more exploration to them. I mean most of the stages really felt like a long corridor to me.
Basically though, my thoughts on OoE are that it's a step in the right direction. The idea of having some pretty distinctly different new areas, while still having a decent sized castle is nice. I also liked the strategy needed with the glyphs. You couldn't just strap on the strongest one you have at the time and tear through the castle. You have to use certain ones for certain enemies. I liked that. I think it just really still didn't feel fresh enough for me. When it comes down to it, it's still just another platformer with RPG elements.
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yeah DoS is vastly overrated.
I say the same about SotN. As far as I'm concerned, CoD kicks the crap out of it.
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I always felt that Aria was better than DoS but DoS did things that Aria didn't.
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nope
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In Reply To #12
...Nope to what?
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In Reply To #12
...Nope to what?
to the initial question. OOE while a good solid game doesn't compare to SOTN.
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I like them both equally. I've been waiting for a Castlevania game that did what OoE did. Have plenty of different types of areas to explore as well as a massive Castlevania map. Plus, its harder difficulty was needed.
But I still do love SotN. The atmosphere of the castle, the music, the castles layout and levels is just so well put together that it'll always remain high on my list
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In Reply To #15
I feel the exact same way. All this time I have wanted a Castlevania that did what CVII did but mix it with a huge castle. I had more in idea of like CVII meets CVIV? Like how you travel different locations then you get to the castle and have a so many stages that you go to hit up in order to get to Dracula but with the CVII system in there too. We got what we wanted I don't think anyone would've necessarily hated it if IGA and his team made another pure Metroidvania title but at the same time people in here and all over the net and in reviews would be griping that we just played that kind of game 7x now. Whereas this is really only half of a Metroidvania.
It took the idea PoR had (which was poorly executed)and took it to an entire new level. The level design is more varied, sure there is a little bit "copy and paste" here and there but the artwork is so good in this game that when they do copy paste stuff its somewhat forgivable. Plus the Castlevania series has always been guilty of that kind of thing since Symphony but its much more varied here. Plus every location pretty much has its own feel. I really loved the glyph system and the storyline is probably the best out of all the 2D games.
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OOE while a good solid game doesn't compare to SOTN.
This.
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This.
Because OoE is that much better than SotN? :P
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I personally have a hard time choosing between the two, they both have very attracting parts.
In the gameplay part of things, they excelled in very different ways. SotN did have better level design, there's no question there, and the wholesome castle really had a good progression going on. The Inverted Castle is also something I actually liked, unlike most people. It had a good feel to it, and the level design actually made a lot of sense. While some places seemed a bit less solid than in the normal castle, some places were designed very well, providing even more interesting places than in the normal castle.
On the other hand, OoE excelled at every other gameplay aspect: It was smoother, with a better battle system, improved back-dash and the ground-slide (although the latter two were fixed before OoE, but...); it had better enemy placement, as well as overall better enemies, making for much more of an actual challenge, as well as making it much more fast-paced; and then it had much better bosses, some of the best I've seen in the whole series. And with DoS in the series, that's saying a lot!
So I guess that in this sense OoE is better.
But then there's the aesthetics. SotN is better in this regard, with both better graphics and better music. Even though OoE has very good visuals and music, it just doesn't deliver the same amazing experience that SotN does.
So, I've only played OoE once and I haven't played SotN for a while, but while OoE may deliver much, much, MUCH better combat and more fast-paced gameplay, SotN somehow manages to give a more fulfilling experience. And the levels are also designed better.
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I personally have a hard time choosing between the two, they both have very attracting parts.
In the gameplay part of things, they excelled in very different ways. SotN did have better level design, there's no question there, and the wholesome castle really had a good progression going on. The Inverted Castle is also something I actually liked, unlike most people. It had a good feel to it, and the level design actually made a lot of sense. While some places seemed a bit less solid than in the normal castle, some places were designed very well, providing even more interesting places than in the normal castle.
On the other hand, OoE excelled at every other gameplay aspect: It was smoother, with a better battle system, improved back-dash and the ground-slide (although the latter two were fixed before OoE, but...); it had better enemy placement, as well as overall better enemies, making for much more of an actual challenge, as well as making it much more fast-paced; and then it had much better bosses, some of the best I've seen in the whole series. And with DoS in the series, that's saying a lot!
So I guess that in this sense OoE is better.
But then there's the aesthetics. SotN is better in this regard, with both better graphics and better music. Even though OoE has very good visuals and music, it just doesn't deliver the same amazing experience that SotN does.
So, I've only played OoE once and I haven't played SotN for a while, but while OoE may deliver much, much, MUCH better combat and more fast-paced gameplay, SotN somehow manages to give a more fulfilling experience. And the levels are also designed better.
I believe this post just summarized the entire topic.
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Don't know because it's not out in Australia until February sometime ::)
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Wait, you're actually saying OoE's story beats SoTN? They're both meh and just there imo.
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Well, yeah it introduced a lot of story innovation for Castlevania, but it was still meh. I mean, it was good for Castlevania stories. But, yeah, meh.
...Besides the beginning.
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introduced us to an "evil Belmont"
Castlevania Adventure II: Belmont's Revenge
brought back characters from previous games, etc. Come on, it was very well done.
Castlevania II: Simon's Quest
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Castlevania Adventure II: Belmont's Revenge
Castlevania II: Simon's Quest
So true! LOL
I mean, if someone wants to get very technical on what was the first game to introduce many of the same characters, it would be vampire killer. True, it was basically CV1, but it had a lot of changes. It wouldn't be a Castlevania game
if Dracula is not mentioned of fought in the game.
Regardless, SOTN isn't the first game to have the same characters.
SOTN, however, introduced the metrovania concept.
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Well, OoE isn't exactly a full MetroidVania itself. The way it splits up the maps makes it feel like something different, especially since I can't remember any Metroid game that splits the map the way OoE does.
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I dont know, Symphony of the Night will always and WILL be my most favorite Castlevania game next to Castlevania and Rondo of Blood (The Dracula X Chronicles now), Order of Ecclesia was a great game and all but... i was dissappointed possibly because 1. I didnt like the music for some odd damn reason, it just didnt seem "Castlevania" to me 2. Castlevania is losing its dark setting that I have always adored 3. IGA IS RUNNING OUT OF IDEAS!!! 4. Castlevania died once they made Dawn of Sorrow, all of the Castlevania games are great in alot of ways but just, when I mean, im not meaning literally DEAD but just, not Castlevania, they've added well, to me, a bunch of bullshit and killed it for me, the games have Castlevania on the covers but is not CASTLEVANIA. Im not trying to be a critic and all, its just how I feel about it, I miss the old chilling feel that I once had for the series, especially the dark settings with Symphony of the Night and Lament of Innocence... yall should notice what I feel from it... right????
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1. I didnt like the music for some odd damn reason, it just didnt seem "Castlevania" to me
Eh, I didn't mind the music, but it definitely isn't the classic Castlevania sound. But hey, that's why the records were included.
2. Castlevania is losing its dark setting that I have always adored
The originals wern't really that dark to begin with, and OoE's easily as dark as or moreso than most of the IGA Castlevanias, anyways. Shanoa and Albus are a couple of tragic characters when you really think about it.
3. IGA IS RUNNING OUT OF IDEAS!!!
What the hell was the Glyph system, then?
4. Castlevania died once they made Dawn of Sorrow, all of the Castlevania games are great in alot of ways but just, when I mean, im not meaning literally DEAD but just, not Castlevania, they've added well, to me, a bunch of bullshit and killed it for me, the games have Castlevania on the covers but is not CASTLEVANIA.
DoS was extaeneous, I'll give you that. However, OoE and PoR actually had some bearing on the storyline, however limited it was (OoE explained why Dracula was revived despite the seal Alucard placed on him at the end of SotN failed, and PoR... well, PoR expanded upon how the VK works. Kinda.)
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Well... First of all, hello, I'm new lolz...
Next...
Order of Ecclesia is one of my favorite Castlevania's now, haven't played most of the old ones, before Super Castlevania IV...
Even though it is "level-designed" it is awesome,and it feels so big.
SotN is awesome, but Order is better, imo.
Plus, it has Shanoa, that Hot brunette:D
On a side note... Just finished DoS and i didn't like it.
While AoS was awesome, DoS feels like a bad copy of it
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OoE and PoR actually had some bearing on the storyline, however limited it was (OoE explained why Dracula was revived despite the seal Alucard placed on him at the end of SotN failed, and PoR... well, PoR expanded upon how the VK works. Kinda.)
What seal? I don't remember Alucard or anyone placing a seal on Dracula's remains in SotN.
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What seal? I don't remember Alucard or anyone placing a seal on Dracula's remains in SotN.
I could swear I remember Alucard sealing off Drac's power at some point... Maybe it was my imagination. :/
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I disagree with the premise of this topic. Why?
Well, for one, OoE is piggybacking on what SoTN started. Yes, it does some things better, but on the whole, it just doesn't have that "je ne sais quois" that SoTN has.
The story is bad. The characters are not compelling in the least because we get very little back story on them. Shanoa just shows up, does her thing, then leaves, and we know little more than we did when the game started about her. Not that I'm really one to play for the stories, but they could have at least made an attempt. SoTN's story isn't great, but it's certainly better.
The battle system is quite underwhelming. If you're going to massively scale back the inventory list, at least give us something in its stead that's worth a damn. Instead, we have a few different kinds of glyphs whose upgraded versions are basically the same thing, only stronger. It would have been nice if we'd gotten some more glyph unions or could have had a few interesting ones pop up with the right combination of glyphs, but instead we got about as many unions as there were glyph types.
The level design was still bad. Better than it has been, but still bad. I liked the idea of many shorter stages because that cut down on the copypasta but it was still there in full force. Dracula's Castle has probalby some of the best material in ANY castle post Symphony, but they copypasta'd it all and wore it out pretty quick.
The game's mood and soundtrack are among the high points. We finally got back to that dreary vibe after the Sorrow games and PoR which was nice. The music was a lot less on the happy poppy side and I think the theme that comes up at the title screen is the best thing Yamane's composed since LoI.
[personal complaint]There's also no whip user. Sure the story doesn't NEED one, but I think the game would have been more fun to play through with an extra mode whip user. Note that this is the first CV game to not include a whip in any way.[/personal complaint]
That said, the game has the same problems that every post Symphony game has had. There are a handful of good ideas that are bogged down by poor design in other parts. To me, that's the REAL Castlevania formula as of late. Why can we never get it right all at the same time? Certain games do a couple things right and leave the rest to rot as if it's of no consequence, and OoE, while it is good, is no exception.
SoTN is far from a perfect game, and is quite overrated, but it blows OoE out of the water because you can tell that it was made with love. Konami as a company has changed quite a bit in the last 10+ years and it seems like they care more about the bottom line than ever, which is why I'm not sure that even if they had the time and resources, that a game as good as SoTN could even be made these days.
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Of course OoE is crappy game, and worst game in the series. People who think that OoE better than SotN, must be crazy or something.
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In Reply To #35
You have just destroyed whatever credibility you ever had in one post. Good job.
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In Reply To #35
Care to explain why the fuck you feel that way?
Just, y'know, kinda infuriated curius...
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In Reply To #35
Kupo is back under a new name?
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ORDER OF ECCLESIA IS SHIT. :picture of a toilet with SHIT in it with CASTLEVANIA: ORDER OF ECCLESIA written on:
Kupomogli.
Certainly the epitome of humor, he has reached a pinaccle of cleverness and wit that I'm afraid none of us shall ever attain. Lament, fellow man, for Kupo will always be better then us.
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I'm sorry but.. I just.. I can't...
MY NAME IS KUPO LOL
*runs away giggling like school girl*
Anyway, I haven't played OoE yet, but I'm sure it isn't crap. X(
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Of course OoE is crappy game, and worst game in the series. People who think that OoE better than SotN, must be crazy or something.
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In Reply To #41
Christ! Is there something wrong with you guys?!
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Hahahaha.
There is no way that games like PoR and DoS and CotM are better then HoD and OoE.
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In Reply To #41
...You've been smoking marijuana, haven't you?
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There's some things I prefer in SotN, and some things I prefer in OoE. I generally like SotN's areas better, but I had more fun in terms of combat in OoE, which also had the best bosses in the series.
So I guess OoE edges SotN out a little bit.
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In Reply To #42 #43 and #44
Sorry Guys, DoctaMario is right on the money with his criticism.
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In Reply To #46
Docta also sid the actual combat system was better in OoE than SotN. That puts it a bit higher than just "Cheap knockoff".
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In Reply To #46
Docta also sid the actual combat system was better in OoE than SotN. That puts it a bit higher than just "Cheap knockoff".
Of course, the game has its merits --I didn't see the point in regurgitating his entire post. And to be fair, all of the post-SotN castleroids are a knock-off to some degree or another. But the operative term here is "cheap" which can be chalked up to such things as the copypasta asthetics, cookie-cutter combat glyphs, linear gameplay, weak bonus modes, etc...
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In Reply To #48
Weak bonus modes? Albus Mode blew the socks off every bnus full-game mode since, well, SotN. Hell, Albus Mode is arguably better than SotN's Richter mode. Never mind that the Practice Course 3 was a pretty ingenious bonus course to begin with...
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And to be fair, all of the post-SotN castleroids are a knock-off to some degree or another. But the operative term here is "cheap" which can be chalked up to such things as the copypasta asthetics, cookie-cutter combat glyphs, linear gameplay, weak bonus modes, etc...
Err, post-sotn castleroids? Even SOTN itself is a knockoff of Super Metroid, with RPG elements thrown in.
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In Reply To #48
Weak bonus modes? Albus Mode blew the socks off every bnus full-game mode since, well, SotN. Hell, Albus Mode is arguably better than SotN's Richter mode. Never mind that the Practice Course 3 was a pretty ingenious bonus course to begin with...
Nothing tops DoS' Julius mode IMO --Albus wasn't broken but he certainly was --akward. Hell, I think I enjoyed the PoR's Axe Armor more than Albus. Speaking of Richter Mode --it's just doesn't feel right to make a Castlevania without a whip wielder.
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Err, post-sotn castleroids? Even SOTN itself is a knockoff of Super Metroid, with RPG elements thrown in.
SotN and Super Metroid? Apples and oranges. We might go a step further and call 2-d platforming a knock-off of Donkey Kong. The point here is only that SotN broke a very rigid mold set earlier classics within the series; OoE was forged in the SotN mold --and hardly reinvents the series.
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In Reply To #51
*Spews soda all over laptop screen*
Wait, Julius Mode better than Albus Mode? What? Julius mode sucked, IMO-Julius was pathertic for a Belmont, Alucard was ridiculously weak, and Yoko was an MP whore because her magic was all she was useful for. Albus, on the other hand, had plenty of tricks to use throughout the game, AND was actually fun to use. I personally get a kick out of Albus's Teleport ability and Optical Shot.
I never really unlocked Old Axe Armor mode though, so I don't know how it plays.
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In Reply To #51
*Spews soda all over laptop screen*
Wait, Julius Mode better than Albus Mode? What? Julius mode sucked, IMO-Julius was pathertic for a Belmont, Alucard was ridiculously weak, and Yoko was an MP whore because her magic was all she was useful for. Albus, on the other hand, had plenty of tricks to use throughout the game, AND was actually fun to use. I personally get a kick out of Albus's Teleport ability and Optical Shot.
I never really unlocked Old Axe Armor mode though, so I don't know how it plays.
Here's the deal with Julius mode. All the characters individually were somewhat mediocre --which is why the team element is so important. As a team there's a great deal more gameplay variety than most of the other alt modes out there --including Albus. Then you figure that Julius mode actually has a plausible -canon- storyline behind it, and suddenly it becomes something more than simple fanservice.
BTW Albus's teleport ability was alot of fun, but again --akward to use with one thumb over the d-pad and another thumb over the jump/attack buttons. If I had a third hand to make the most of the teleport during combat, I'd probably be singing the praises. Come to think of it --I wonder how Albus might have handled on the Wii instead...
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In Reply To #54
The teleport really works best as a quick tap of the thumb near the edge of whatever side of the screen you're trying to teleport to. You don't really need a third hand to use it.
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In Reply To #55
Julius mode is awesome. I never liked Yoko though, so I never picked her up.
I liked the way Alucard said "Julius!" When you'd swap characters, same for Julius. He'd say it right fast and I don't even think he pronounced the D in Alucard. "Alucar!"
Yeah, the extra mode in DOS is the best. Richter's mode in SOTN is fun, just because of how fast you could be dashes and Street Fighter moves. Those moves seemed strange in POR, I don't even think they added all of his move set in that game.
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In Reply To #56
Eh, I guess... Though I still find it odd that Yoko still calls Alucard "Arikado" after he reveals himself...
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In Reply To #53
I own Contra 4 so Albus mode didn't do much for me. I'm not even that keen on J mode in DoS, but I think it's better than Albus mode by a long shot.
In Reply To #46
Docta also sid the actual combat system was better in OoE than SotN. That puts it a bit higher than just "Cheap knockoff".
I never said that.
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In Reply To #58
What? Really? Then... Right, it was Azmodan. Whoops, sorry Docta.
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Worst of the Castleroids, I can agree with.
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No way in hell that POR and DOS are above HOD, COTM and OOE.
More realistic would be this:
Sotn = Aos > CotM > OoE = HoD >> Metroid Fusion >> PoR > DoS
only reason Sotn and Aos are at the top is because they both had good level designs with decent gameplay. Aos more gameplay than level design though. CotM is above the others because of it's awesome difficulty. It was brilliant, it still had the dark atmosphere there with a decent combat system despite being a metroidvania. OoE and HoD are equal in my opinion, HoD is underrated because of it's bad audio output and...Unique graphic taste. But the gameplay still kicks ass(forward and backward dashing for example) PoR and DoS are real black sheep in the series. Main reason for this is the anime look, I hate it when applied to castlevania. PoR gets points for being original though, DoS sucked ass for being a recycle and hardly original except maybe for the Soma boss. (intro sucked, 3 random dudes spawning in a city
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So, uhhh, you complain about HoD's low music quality and CotM's unoriginal music, but ignore the fact that DoS and PoR have all-around bad OSTs? Personally I feel that HoD has amazing music, some of the best compositions in the series! Although CotM does have slightly lacking music, sure, but compared to DoS and PoR...? :|
Also DoS's and PoR's graphics were often pretty, uhhh, bad. Especially some of the sprites (Julius and Alucard, anyone?)
But eh, I guess it's all opinions...
Mine would probably be like this:
SotN = OoE > HoD > AoS > CotM > Dos > PoR
Or, with dramaticisation:
SotN = OoE > HoD > AoS > CotM > Dos >>>>>>>>>>> PoR
Although there's a very small difference between DoS and CotM. Both are really good, but CotM wins by a small ammount. The only really bad one is PoR :P
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In Reply To #62
Okay, I don't know what the bashing about PoR's soundtrack is about- I thought it was pretty good for the most part, even if it's 90% reused tracks. There's far worse music in the series.
As for the sprites, I hope you realize that DoS's Alucard is the EXACT SAME Alucard that was used in SotN. Julius... was average. It was better than Maxim's.
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OoE is definitely superior over SOTN.
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I loved OOE- by far FAR range better than PoRuin
I just downloaded SOTN on my PS# via PSN (is it the enchanced version or is that only XBLive) But have been through it many many times- I have no idea where my CD is lol.
As for what one is better I put them all in my top 3- SOTN/OOE/XXXXofSorrows (I put them both as one game)
I rate them all a 10/10 for a 'modern' castlevania
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This thread has brought laughter and enjoyment to me. IMHO, in no way is PoR better than OoE. Or too much of anything if you want me to be frank and honest. But I digress.
SOTN and OoE are about what and what with me at this point. They both have their faults and strengths and I enjoy playing both after beating them. I don't really care for either games extra play modes (I'll admit, the only one I ever bothered with was DoS's because Julius mode did, for some reason, rock.) and I loved the music for both. The storyline (to me) were decent in both so no real complaints there. Pretty much what and what.
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In Reply To #62
Okay, I don't know what the bashing about PoR's soundtrack is about- I thought it was pretty good for the most part, even if it's 90% reused tracks. There's far worse music in the series.
As for the sprites, I hope you realize that DoS's Alucard is the EXACT SAME Alucard that was used in SotN. Julius... was average. It was better than Maxim's.
About PoR's OST:
It was bland, predictalbe, every melody was extremely forgettable, it was too up-beat (JAEL OF JOOULZ WAS FUCKING HORRID) and the never-ending drums were almost the same throughout the whole OST, so bland and so booooriiiing. I'd like to hear what OST you thought was worse than PoR's.
About the sprites: Alucard had an awful black outline. While this worked ok with the other sprites, with him it made him look fantastically horrible. Especially on that tiny screen ._.
Also Julius looked like he had hemorrhoids.
But aside from the colourful outlines, I never really had much against HoD's sprites. Hell, considering the whole feel of the game, the outlines were actually pretty welcome. Added to the weird, creepy vibe of it all.
This thread has brought laughter and enjoyment to me. IMHO, in no way is PoR better than OoE. Or too much of anything if you want me to be frank and honest.
THANK YOU. That paragraph just made my day :)
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HoD suffers for its sound quality.
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While on the topic of HoD and I will add CoTM, I must say they both did to me, feel very castlevania- more so than parts of DoS and much...if not all of PoR.
CoTM draws you into the darkness right from the start- in most games the entrance is just that an intrance- in OOE, LoI and some others you can leave and go to your 'safe place' like the village or rinaldos house- but in CoTM your thrown into the dark depths of the castle with no way out- and no where to go but a bloody fight ahead of you- to me that added to the dark sence and some fear.
HoD really was a great advancement and took what we liked about SoTN and attempted to make it viable on a portable- AoS imo while as I said on my top 3 of whats-what for 'current' castlevanias- really hit it right with the plot and character interaction- the 3 person mode in DoS was done better than PoR's 2 person mode for the whole game.
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I just thought of something else that is present in OoE that bothers the hell out of me: Forced Grinding.
In order to be able to even have the option to buy potions, armor, etc., you have to grind to get the items to complete the quests to make these things even available in the shops.
The quest system in PoR is much better because it doesn't force you to complete it. If you don't want to do the quests, you don't have to, the game goes on. But if you want to do them it's a diversion from the main game. In OoE however, you have to complete the quests in order to finish the game unless you're a masochist who enjoys playing without potions or armor. Bad design if you ask me.
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Except for the fact that it's perfectly doable to just run through the game, get whatever potions you can get with whatever money you happen to find and beat the game normally. No 'grinding' required. Not to mention most of the 'beggining' items such as High potions require no grinding. Unless you're retarded and missed every chest in the game, you'll have the necessary ingredients.
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In Reply To #71
High potions require no grinding? You mean, except for having to get the Mandrake Root? Uh, I had to grind for quite awhile to get that. Plus, with the other items you have to play "Common-Chest Roulette" and hope you get the items you need, which is a sort of grinding in and of itself because it involves a lot of pointless backtracking if you don't get the item you need. The quests almost non-optional and the chest contents random. Again, poor design if you ask me.
There's quite a bit of grinding involved in getting the metals for the armor.
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In Reply To #72
The only real grinding in OoE's quests is with the Horse Hair and Mandrake Root. except for those two, enemies drop the other items often enough that it's not as much of a problem. (Second playthrough aside, I got all 3 gold ores and all 5 cashmere threads fairly quick.)
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In Reply To #73
But that's the thing: Sometimes you get the stuff quickly and easily with little effort, and other times you have to hunt high and low for it without much luck. It's still grinding, and the game still forces you to do it in a certain sense because who in their right mind is going to say no to being able to buy items?
I had to do a bunch of grinding to get some of these quests out of the way.
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Err, my mistake. I meant Potion, not High Potion. The items you do need however, for example Sage and Rue.. both of which are so incredibly common that not having one by the time you rescue Jacob is incredibly unlikely. The likelihood of having to play 'Chest-roulette' to get everything you need is incredibly unlikely; I only had to do so once, and that was to get an item or two I needed to get 100%.
You're making the game sound harder then it is, like it's some kind of doomsday machine if you don't grind as much as possible and get thousands of gold and do every single quest in the game... ):
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In Reply To #75
I'm pretty sure I didn't have a sage by the time I rescued Jacob because I remember having to retrace my steps in the hopes of finding one. Sure, Sage and Rue are common, but the other half of what you need to complete those quests isn't terribly common, or if it is, you have to figure out which enemy drops said item.
And I had to do the chest-roulette thing more times than I cared to. OoE was a fairly tough game on the first go-through, so I made sure to get potions when I could, but I was bugged by the system they used to meter out what you could buy. I liked it better in PoR where you could get better weapons or moves, but it wasn't a necessary thing to do the quests.
You act like this game is a snap and that items obtained from said grinding aren't useful. No, you don't need to do every quest in the game, but some of the more useful ones require a bit of grinding, which is what I have a problem with. Would it be good design to require someone to grind in order to not have to fight with their fists?
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In Reply To #34
"Well, for one, OoE is piggybacking on what SoTN started. Yes, it does some things better, but on the whole, it just doesn't have that "je ne sais quois" that SoTN has."
Hey everyone, I'm new here and gald to be. It seems like a lot of people just can't get why othere people like certain castlevanias more than others. Or the fact we can't enjoy all of them instead of putting so much negativity towards our favorite series. Oh well....
As that Dr. Maro guy said about OoE piggybacking SotN is not fair. Everyone loves to praise RoB or CV3 which in your view "piggybacks" from castlevania 1.
I have been playing this series since the very first and love each of them and happy to have them since the series could have died years ago. IMO OoE is far superior to SotN which I feel is over rated. I even enjoy PoR more.
Now a lot of you are going to blow a stack from hearing this but I enjoy these games more because they are more fun. SotN just kinda bores me now. It was a great game for its time and is truly a classic, but it's action and gameplay is just not as interesting as OoE or even PoR which I pick up to play quite often.
I don't think the topic should be Castlevania: OoE possibly better than Symphony? it should be: Can anyone admit they like other castlevanias more than SotN?
I can!
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I have been playing this series since the very first and love each of them and happy to have them since the series could have died years ago. IMO OoE is far superior to SotN which I feel is over rated. I even enjoy PoR more.
*Waits for the PoR haters to start raging*
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In Reply To #78
Let them rage. It's my opinion. They don't have to agree with me. Their hate for a obviously great game does not affect my fun. As a hardcore castlevania fan, I couldn't bring myself to hate any of the games (except legends lol).
Sorry guys but SotN is what I play now when my tyenol PMs don't work!
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In Reply To #34
I don't think the topic should be Castlevania: OoE possibly better than Symphony? it should be: Can anyone admit they like other castlevanias more than SotN?
Nailed it.
Most have hailed SotN the Lord and Master of the other Castleroids with an air of nostalgia --myself included.
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In Reply To #80
"There's NOTHING so pleasing to a hardcore gamer as fresh material --and none of the recent gimmicks have come close to refreshing the Castlevania experience, like SotN did back in the day"
I do see where your coming from but I disagree a tad. SotN did start this for all these other games. But Castlevania 1 started it ALL. That game hardly gets kudos. Why? I actually think the original castlevania is more fun and more groundbreaking than SotN. Over 20 years later and I still play the game a lot.
SotN may of started it's new formula but I think later games had already surprassed the experience. PoR and OoE FINALLY take that map system and expand on it (more OoE).
To dwell on that SotN started this or it hasn't been as good since SotN is like playing CV4 or RoB and dismiss it because Castlevania 1 and 3 already did that if not better.
They are just games for our enjoyment, we can all perfer one game over the other...but to hold onto SotN like some holy grail is kinda......weird.
See you and others feel the series are going downward since SotN whil I view it as IGA is taking the series in a direction we can ever only hope for. If we didn't have IGA we would have more sequels like CV64 or Legends or not even a series at all and then all we would have to talk about is SotN.
I can be a victim to nostolgia as well but I know a damn fun game when I play one. And I find a lot of the newer castlevanias to be more fun. My opinion, that's all.
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In Reply To #81
You struck a resonant chord here.. Not so much the apples/oranges comparing a classic game to a castleroid but... How is it that SotN originated the castleroids and ends up worshipped, and yet CV1 originated the classics and ends up eclipsed by other classics. Now that's topic-worthy.
I think games like CV3 and RoB built upon original's foundation more successfully than games like OoE and PoR build upon SotN's. Again I could go on, but this is easily a discussion unto itself... Perhaps I'll create such a topic later...
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Ya know, theoretically, one could even say that SotN wasn't even the original Castleroid; That honor belongs to Simon's Quest, which was set up in a very Metroid-style way.
Simon's Quest wasn't executed as well, but...
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Actually, I don't really hold SotN on such a high pedestal because it was the first, but because it's actually so good. The aesthetics make for such an amazing experience, the levels feel so well constructed, the overall pacing is so good...Despite having some of the weaker action in the series, it rises above them with all its other qualities. Nothing to do with the fact that it was the first one.
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In Reply To #84
"I think games like CV3 and RoB built upon original's foundation more successfully than games like OoE and PoR build upon SotN's."
I agree with CV3 and I would add CV4. But no Rondo. RoB is a great classic castlevania and a benchmark of all the casltevanias that followed in terms of look. But the game is dealry overrated. The first 2 stages are pure gold. My favorite part of the game, mostly likely because it is homage to CV 2 and 1. But after that it is kinda blahish, no more inspiring than it's Drac X counterpart.
I thought the Drac X Chronicles was something to boast about though.
But back on subject (I refuse to say "disgress" the newest, trendy word to use on message boards) I felt SotN's following games suffered from not expanding on the map idea. Too much of the battle system and not enough thought of were the game took place...until PoR. The portiats were such a nice vacation from the single castle game.
OoE even expanded on that more.
Yeah, SotN is a incredible game that can easily be said on of the finest Castlevanias ever. BUT.... I find PoR and OoE more fun. I find a lot of the newer castleroids more fun. SotN is great but kinda a slow paced, sleepy feel game IMO. And When I play it now I kinda get, ehhhhhh.
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SOTN is great but OoE really surpasses it in so many ways.
it's just a shame that OoE is isolated on the DS, it really should be released on Live Arcade and other online marketplaces. it's really one of the best CVs ever and it totally overshadows CV2, except that CV2 still has the cool populated towns, town theme, and other stuff. but ya, I feel OoE is really one of the top 2 CV games.
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In Reply To #77
Okay, but WHY do you think OoE is better than SoTN? It's cool that you feel that way, but explain your reasoning. Because in my mind, it doesn't do much of anything better, especially where abilities and level design are concerned. And don't just use the "it's my opinion" cop out. Discuss with us.
And before we go any further, you should know that SoTN isn't my favorite CV game. It's my favorite Castleroid, but it isn't that close to the top of my favorites list. My favorites are more along the lines of Rondo (which I very much disagree with your assessment of), the 64 games, CV3&4, and Simon's Quest.
I think you should go back and read some of the other posts against OoE again. I can accept that you like it better, but for you to chalk it up to nostalgia when some of us disagree with the premise of the topic and have given concrete reasons as to why we disagree doesn't make for a healthy debate.
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In Reply To #87
"Okay, but WHY do you think OoE is better than SoTN? It's cool that you feel that way, but explain your reasoning. Because in my mind, it doesn't do much of anything better, especially where abilities and level design are concerned. And don't just use the "it's my opinion" cop out. Discuss with us. "
You really need to know why I like the game better do you? Well if it helps you sleep at night.... I like OoE because it has more challenge. The boards are more interesting with dynamic boss fights. The Glyph system is much more interesting than the weapon system of SotN (Which half of it is useless). And I do enjoy the level design in OoE better. Yes, SotN castle is great but the Invereted Castle is such a bore after you play it for the first time. Shanoa has much more intersting abilites compared to Alacard's I can turn into a usleless wolf, a bat and a fart cloud. I say this is my opinion because a lot time I choose not to waste my breath. When SotN lovers/PoR and OoE haters ask why I think one is better than the other it falls on deaf ears.
"And before we go any further, you should know that SoTN isn't my favorite CV game. It's my favorite Castleroid, but it isn't that close to the top of my favorites list. My favorites are more along the lines of Rondo (which I very much disagree with your assessment of), the 64 games, CV3&4, and Simon's Quest."
Good for you. My favorite is Casltevania 1. Hey you disagree with me about RoB I disagree with you with SoTN. Great to have that freedom of choice, ain't it? Your prefrence isn't on debate here.
"I think you should go back and read some of the other posts against OoE again. I can accept that you like it better, but for you to chalk it up to nostalgia when some of us disagree with the premise of the topic and have given concrete reasons as to why we disagree doesn't make for a healthy debate. "
I think you just can't accept my reasons no matter which I give. SotN is not perfereed over PoR or OoE for me because I don't like the item system, half the bosses are really poor, the challenge is childish, the inverted castle is horrid, the pace and music (even the music is GREAT) puts me to sleep. I find OoE to much more exciting, solid with much more fun bosses to fight, a Dracula and Death battle worth mentioning, lots more to do and a lot of new type of levels besides the "castle". That's how I feel and I don;t care if people disagree with me. When I am playing these games I think how I like it not you.
Now, I hope I explained it to you since you MUST understand one's reasoning to liking one game over another. I read all these posts and all I see are opinions. Like mine and like yours. So an opinion is not cop out, it's how one feels about a game.
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In Reply To #88
Um, dude, you need to relax. We're having a discussion here. Simply saying, "OoE's better just because it is" adds nothing to the discussion. Maybe you'd bring up a point I hadn't though of that would cause me to change my opinion slightly. That's how a message board works.
My preference apparently IS on debate when you quote my posts and debate them. If you don't want to get into that type of discussion, then don't start quoting posts. If you're going to quote my posts, expect me to respond.
I can accept the reasons you give for liking one game more than the other, but you didn't GIVE any until I asked you to. All you said was stuff to the effect of "SoTN is boring, people only like it because of nostalgia, etc etc" but never gave any reasons why you liked OoE better.
And you're right, this is all about personal preference. I never tried to pass off any of my opinions as facts, YOU tried to pass my opinions as facts. Ease up, we're talking about games here. It's not that serious. ;)
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In Reply To #89
Dr. Mario, I am quite relaxed. I was never angered or offended. You are the one who came off quite passionate on your post. Please don
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In Reply To #90
Your reply to me asking you why you liked OoE was defensive, like I was attacking you simply for wanting more information.
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In Reply To #45
I will agree with the last statement here- OoE had some fantastic bossfights and I always looked forward to them. Possibly the best aspect of the game.
Anyway, I think they were both good for their own merits.
Those of you who think OoE sucked... I'd like to see you try and explain why, since that seems absolutely ridiculious to me. It was a great game.
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In Reply To #92
OoE isn't a bad game, but it's not a great game either. It's more of the same of what we've been getting for years, and that's why I dislike it as much as I do.
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In Reply To #91
"And if anything, you were the one to call ME to task for my opinions first. You came in here rattling off your assumptions about those of us not drinking the OoE kool aid, that our opinions are based on nostalgia, that we can't admit to liking another game better, blah blah woof woof. Check yourself."
What are you talking about? I suggest you don't get drunk before writing posts. Please have the make sense and somewhat understandable.
"My man, you JUST got here. You don't know SQUAT about "the type of person" I am. You're some guy who got butthurt because I asked you to qualify your position, which is the point of a message board."
So you must feel your more deserving here than I. Well if that's the case, why don't you show your fellow members some respect to this board by responding like an intelligent human being, not some drama queen.
You did come at me aggressively, deny it or not. Your accusations are false. I even said my self I am a victim of nostalgia and I really didn't even get into it all that much so you need a new argument. I think your just mad because I gave it back to you.
This was the kind of of response I was expecting unfortunately. I'm sure your next responses will fulfill my expectations as well. Let's see.
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In Reply To #94
I also liked how post 92 says:
"Those of you who think OoE sucked... I'd like to see you try and explain why, since that seems absolutely ridiculious to me. It was a great game."
Hmm sounds like he wants reasons too.
This is your response:
"OoE isn't a bad game, but it's not a great game either. It's more of the same of what we've been getting for years, and that's why I dislike it as much as I do."
Now you go off on me for not explaining "things" but then you go off and do exactly what accuse me of. Damn man....I think you need to be Patient Mario.
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In Reply to # 94 & 95
I'll show you respect when you do me the same courtesy. But you don't do that when you boil all the opinions contrary to yours down to "Oh, you're just blinded by nostalgia playing boring games" and getting defensive when someone asks you to share your opinions about the topic.
I show people respect here. I rarely ever even post here, and when I do I try to post intelligently. But when folks like you come up in here and think they know it all and don't have to add anything, and then drag ME into stuff like this, I get annoyed. I don't like getting into arguments like this. I know you want to paint me as some flamer, but looking at the rest of my posts here, I don't think you'll find many if any instances of that. Because that's not what I do. But this is probably the response you expected, because you know me so well, with your post count of...wait, oh yeah, TEN!
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In Reply To #96
Well I am proud of you for finally writing with some intelligence so I can't fault you on your last post. I did not come here to start fights but just let you know because I'm new here I won't be pushed around. In the future I can start from scratch and show you respect as long it's a 2 way road. Just remember when you get a snappy in your posts, someone might bite back. You may not like what comes from it but use this experience to avoid making a situation thats sort of heated into an explosion (by manipulaing conversation) and I will do the same. I have no hurt feelings, the message board doesn't really affect my life all that much so it's not a big deal lol.
I do know how a message board works, but I will stand up for myself. But when friendly to me I can be good conversation to add about our favorite series.
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Well, OoE is Castlevania, so it makes sense that it would be a Castlevania-like experience. But personally I had a rather unique experience playing the game, mostly due to difficulty. It was incredibly hard, and I appreciated the challenge. It didn't feel like PoR at all, more like Contra 4. (well, maybe easier)
I always appreciate some improvements to. The art style is awesome. Some of the best, in fact. It's funny how these great character designs clash so vividly with the absolutely godawful designs in Judgement.
Otherwise though, you're right, it's not too different, but that's not really a reason to hate a game. That's rather like going to Burger King and getting annoyed that you're getting fast food. If you want a different game, play a different series.
Developers too often try to innovate to create a different experience anyway.
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In Reply To #98
I agree completly. And yes, a lot of post SotN games so have that SotN influence. But I think that's because LoI and CoD didn't get such rave reviews so they stuck with what the fans wanted. They are changing the series but I think if they changed it too much (the 2d games) the fans may not be too pleased. If they do make another DS game I like to see them expand on OoE just as OoE expanded on PoR.
I have a lot of high hopes for the DS games. They showed us that each game they are trying to expand and perfect the formula rather than the GBA which seemed to be more interested in recreating SotN.
What would be really cool, next game they remake Chris Belmont's adventure. Not the games but the concept. Have the game start off as Chris going to Castlevania to fight Drac, run around a Sotn castle doing the Castleroid thing - Kill drac and then lead 15 years later into the story of Belmont's revenge where it's similar to OoE going around Translyvania looking for clues to your son's disapearing until you reveal a new castlevania where you have to fight your son and Drac. Add some interesting characters and plot devices, a refined but farmilar battle system for Chris. If done right it would be a good retelling of Chris's adventures since him being on old gameboy has forced him backstage. Plus we need a main belmont charcter again.
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In Reply To #97
O_o Anyway, moving on....I'm done.
I definitely agree that the DS games tried to expand the Castleroid thing more than the GBA games did. The only thing is, the fanbase has been bitching about things like level design for YEARS! Why is it that IGA can make the game more challenging, put in a female lead character, and pair down the arsenal but he can't make a game with convincing level design?
I like OoE's take on making some of the levels more straightforward and some more castleroid like, but the fact remains that the overall design of these levels was pretty crummy. Still too much copypasta.
And LoI and CoD would have been fine games had it not been for the poor level design. I hate to harp on this, but it's a fact that the design of the later games has not been very good.
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What would be really cool, next game they remake Chris Belmont's adventure. Not the games but the concept. Have the game start off as Chris going to Castlevania to fight Drac, run around a Sotn castle doing the Castleroid thing - Kill drac and then lead 15 years later into the story of Belmont's revenge where it's similar to OoE going around Translyvania looking for clues to your son's disapearing until you reveal a new castlevania where you have to fight your son and Drac. Add some interesting characters and plot devices, a refined but farmilar battle system for Chris. If done right it would be a good retelling of Chris's adventures since him being on old gameboy has forced him backstage. Plus we need a main belmont charcter again.
Yes, dammit! Dracula Densetsu Chronicles for the DS! It would be awesome! I'd like it to still be an old-school CV; alas, who knows how likely that is. Dracula X Chronicles sold enough to warrant a Greatest Hits version, though, so maybe it's possible we'll see an old-style one sometime soon.
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In Reply To #100
I feel if there is any true bad level design it's the PS2 games. Those games really felt like you were just walking down the same hallway over and over again. I never felt that with the 2D games. The copy and paste issue is something most 2D games suffer from. Even SotN with it's IC and very much Castlevania 2 which not only is the level copy and pasted but the music as well. OoE did some copy and pasting but the action was pretty fast and crazy so you really don't think about it unless you plan on staring at the backround all day, lol. It's very normal I feel for a 2D game to reuse certain backrounds as long as they at least attempt to make it a tad different. Castlevania 3 even reused many pillar and graphics from one board to another, sometimes only recoloring it but it worked.
I feel PoR and OoE actually improved level design by finally doing what should been done a long time ago. Get out of the Castle for a bit. After Castlevania 1 every castlevania tried thinking of new ways for Castlevania to be not just in the castle. After SotN all the games were always JUST the castle until PoR. And thank GOD, cause even though I love DoS I was like god, cause the new ideas for inside castle levels were getting old. A lot of people would like to see a unique background every screen but I think that's something you should expect from a 3D game not a 2D one. I think IGA and his team are in the right direction and for the level design to feel fresher it needs new locations.
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In Reply To #101
"Yes, dammit! Dracula Densetsu Chronicles for the DS! It would be awesome! I'd like it to still be an old-school CV; alas, who knows how likely that is. Dracula X Chronicles sold enough to warrant a Greatest Hits version, though, so maybe it's possible we'll see an old-style one sometime soon."
Yeah I love to see an old style castlevania again too...But I dunno, doesn't seem like it would happen. We know now that IGA isn't afraid to give a hard game so doing a old style game with some RPG elements wouldn't be hard. But then peeps would complain that the hero is too slow and clumsy. But I do enjoy the Castleroids very much and that style of gameplay I feel is as much Castlevania now as the old style. What the Castleroids do need now is for them to stop being side stories and Make a MAIN belmont adventure like Chris's tale into a Castleroid.
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In Reply To #102
Symphony's castle (the first one) was very well designed. There were very few instances of copypasta and even if there were, you barely noticed them (or I barely noticed them) because they were so rare.
Fast forward to the DS games, there is LOADS of copypasta. And it's really noticeable. It's a shame too because some of the material for the castle in OoE is some of the best we've seen, but they copied the hell out of it and wore it out. I appreciate that PoR and OoE got us out of the castle, and I thnk that was a step that definitely needed to be taken, but they still copied too many level pieces. And sure, CV3 may have copied pieces of a background, but never the whole room. There's a big difference there.
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In Reply To #104
Well the copy paste issue has never bothered me. We just have different taste. I was always more interested in the game play and locations which in the DS games I thought were done very well. It was never to the degree of the PS2 games or CV2 plus all the backgrounds that were reused looked great anyway so I never saw the big deal.
I agree, SotN's castle was the best designed. Well it was the first in this formula so it had a lot of freedom to do what it wanted. Too bad the inverted castle fucked the pace of the game. They should of just added a few more areas to the first castle and just have the game in ONE castle. And to me, I rather have a few rooms that look the same in a game than the whole game repeated and upside down (not to mention horribly repetitive music and some goofy ass bosses like the Creature, Mummy and Death...who was as strong as a zombie. At least we had the CV3 trio fight.)
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Bosses were far more entertaining this time around
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In Reply To #105
Wait, so the copypaste bothers you in the PS2 games but not in the 2d games? We got remixed portraits in PoR, entire levels that were pretty much copy pasted in OoE and that isn't as bad as some rooms in the PS2 games?
I read somewhere that originally they wanted to do more in SoTN but ran out of time (story of pretty much EVER CV game since) The Inverted Castle wasn't part of the original plan, it was just tacked on becasue they didn't have time to do anything else. :P
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In all honestly, the reused repainted background sprites doesn't bother me that much. It's Ecclesia's collection of worlds that are literally a straight line with one or two levels of elevation that kills me.
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In Reply To #108
Those always struck me as an attempt to throw fans of the classicvanias a bone. But I'd rather have that than more repainted copy-pasta bullshittery.
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Those always struck me as an attempt to throw fans of the classicvanias a bone.
If they were aiming for that, they would have noticed that Castlevania has always had stairs, hidden passages, and separate areas per screen to prevent that kind of mind-numbing linearity.
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The only gripe I have with the game is its level design. Graphics are fantastic (animation, sprite-work and backgrounds better than what SotN has to offer in my estimation), BGM adds to the culture and mood of the game (much as did Aria
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In Reply To #107
"Wait, so the copypaste bothers you in the PS2 games but not in the 2d games? We got remixed portraits in PoR, entire levels that were pretty much copy pasted in OoE and that isn't as bad as some rooms in the PS2 games?"
Well the copy paste thing is different between the 3d and 2D. With 2D the complaint is more the backgrounds, not the platforming. I was just playing the game and I think the level design is REALLY under rated. I think compared to a lot of post-SotN like games it's level desing is quite clever. With the 3D games, the copy past corridors and rooms are annoying because there is NO platforming. So it's just a floor you can run around on.
PoR's second set of portraits unlike the IC was more fun than the first set. OoE reusing entire levels is a big exaggeration. It comes down to, Yes, SotN is the more ground breaking game, it's prettier and has lots of fresh new ideas. But on a fun factor I perfer PoR and OoE.
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In Reply To #112
Just because you have to jump doesn't mean the level design is good. There were a couple platforming parts in LoI as well, but again, that doesn't make the design good. People complained about the level design in PoR as being too boxy and OoE's is pretty much the same way.
Unlike most, I didn't mind PoR's remixed portraits that much (except Burnt Paradise, god that and Nation of Fools, god, those have to be the worst CV levels ever :P :P :P) And I didn't excuse SoTN for copying the entire castle over. If anything, I have to give them credit in PoR for at least kinda remixing rather than just recoloring and making minor changes like they did in OoE or just flat out copying like they did in SoTN.
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In Reply To #113
"Unlike most, I didn't mind PoR's remixed portraits that much (except Burnt Paradise, god that and Nation of Fools, god, those have to be the worst CV levels ever ) And I didn't excuse SoTN for copying the entire castle over. If anything, I have to give them credit in PoR for at least kinda remixing rather than just recoloring and making minor changes like they did in OoE or just flat out copying like they did in SoTN."
Yeah, seriously, between SotN, HoD and PoR doing the second set of levels, PoR pulled it off the best. Yeah I don't get the reused rooms in OoE either. It's still fun as hell but it seems they can't make a large game without reusing areas. AoS and DoS are the only ones that don't really do that (but they do feel smaller than the others). Maybe it's a space issue, a time issue...or they are just lazy. Who knows? IGA does seem to take the fans comments in, even though it takes some time. He gave the fans the art and challenge they wanted so maybe next game he'll produce unique rooms in every area.
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In Reply To #114
Actually, I feel like HoD did it the best, because the B castle actually had something to do with the story, and it was really creepy and cool. There was a truly evil vibe in the second castle and it gave the game kind of a Silent Hill type of vibe. In the other games, it seemed like the copy-pasta was there simply to make the game longer. :P
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In Reply To #115
Story wise, I agree...HOD pulled it off best. The pallette change was pretty damn good. Too bad they didn't give them new tunes and changed the platforming a little bit more than they did to make it just more interesting. Otherwise I agree, Castle B was really cool and it was pretty clever with things changing in one caste after doing things in another castle. And it was actually a main plot in the story instead of "oh he ran to that castle or you gotta do 4 more paintings before he even notices you!"
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nice lol finally some HoD love. why couldn't the glyphs have been a secret and/or learned art? It would have fit the story line much better and would have explained where albus got his powers. I just find it strange that we get this character who has no reason for having these powers she just does.:(
(Imo the other games have good stories they just suffer from underdevelopment and poor dialogue)
Final thought: OoE has some great qualities like most of Iga's games(This game having difficulty, a change of pace in the story, and the musak) but then in other areas falls flat with half baked ideas like the glyph system. Not saying of course the other games didn't have their fair share.
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In Reply To #117
I like the way you are thinking and i agree with you in a way. Also the only castlevania game that got me exciting after symphony is aria of sorrow.