Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: Claimh Solais on June 11, 2011, 12:08:38 PM
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How is Richter over-used? I've heard tons of people on forums like GameFAQs and stuff say this constantly, but I don't feel the need to ask there because I may be endlessly trolled in return. So I ask here.
How is he overused? (this doesn't count homebrews, GameFAQs really only talks about the official games... and bewbs.) Especially when you compare him to Alucard.
Richter appeared in:
Rondo of Blood/DXC
Symphony of the Night/Nocturne In the Moonlight
Portrait of Ruin
Harmony of Despair
Alucard appeared in:
Kid Dracula (sort of...)
Dracula's Curse
Symphony of the Night/Nocturne In the Moonlight
Aria of Sorrow
Dawn of Sorrow
Judgment
Harmony of Despair
As well as got his own trailer for a cancelled game, hurr durr.
Or I could be a d-bag and compare Richter to Dracula. >.>
But yeah, how is Richter overused? Can someone explain that to me?
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Well, you're comparing him to pretty much the most prevalent protagonist character in the series, at this point. Ol' Rich is still plenty prolific himself, probably around the same level as Simon.
Anyhow, it's more about the context of his appearances. I know his Portrait showing and especially being made a playable bonus character in it rubbed some people the wrong way because it was seen as a quick and cheap way to add more content, Richter having the most modern sprite out of all the Belmonts, so it was no big deal to just slap him in. They went for convenience instead of doing something actually relevant to the subject matter, like a John/Eric mode or whatever.
The rest of the distaste probably stems from being featured prominently in two of the (totally justifiedly) most popular games in the series, both of which have seen their share of ports and rereleases along the years. A victim of hype, perhaps.
He's just around a lot despite only two 'real' starring roles.
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Hmm... Yeah, I see what you mean. Alright, that pretty much answers my question. ^.^
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Trevor is more used than Richter too. Alucard is over-used.
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Yeah, but on forums like GameFAQs, Richter is the only one being talked about as "overused". If you even mention Alucard as overused you will be butt-raped sideways by the trolls there, as they're all diehard Al fans.
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Yeah, but on forums like GameFAQs, Richter is the only one being talked about as "overused". If you even mention Alucard as overused you will be butt-raped sideways by the trolls there, as they're all diehard Al fans.
These guys may think SotN is the only existing CV game, with RoB or DXC. XD
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Well, it's on the Harmony of Despair board there. They're probably fanboys who started with SotN and refused to believe anything existed prior to that. ^.^
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Simon is the only Belmont ever needed.
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Anyhow, it's more about the context of his appearances. I know his Portrait showing and especially being made a playable bonus character in it rubbed some people the wrong way because it was seen as a quick and cheap way to add more content, Richter having the most modern sprite out of all the Belmonts, so it was no big deal to just slap him in. They went for convenience instead of doing something actually relevant to the subject matter, like a John/Eric mode or whatever.
I really enjoyed the Richter mode. Why do people bitch about having more and completely optional gameplay? I don't see anyone bitching about being able to play as the friggin Ye Olde Axe Armor. Damn those game devs and their habits of giving extra content. DAMN THEM ALL!!!!!
Simon is the only Belmont ever needed.
Simon as a 96yr old man: Can someone else please go destroy Dracula this time? Please!? My son, or grandson, or great-grandson perhaps? I'm old and very very tired. And old.
Townsfolk: NO! You go kill vampires now! You're the only Belmont ever needed.
Simon as a 96yr old man: *strangles self with whip*
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They're less than ideal because they're pointlessly shoehorned in just because the assets were there. You know why you really fight Richter in Portrait? It's because he's easy to include since he has a great sprite, not because of whatever humbug they feed you about WHIP'S MEMORY or whatever within the story. It's all so see-through, so of course it's going to bother someone, and just one example of Portrait drawing more elements from Rondo -- like almost every Castlevania since Symphony -- instead of the game it's supposedly a sequel to, Bloodlines.
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I really enjoyed the Richter mode. Why do people bitch about having more and completely optional gameplay? I don't see anyone bitching about being able to play as the friggin Ye Olde Axe Armor. Damn those game devs and their habits of giving extra content. DAMN THEM ALL!!!!!
Simon as a 96yr old man: Can someone else please go destroy Dracula this time? Please!? My son, or grandson, or great-grandson perhaps? I'm old and very very tired. And old.
Townsfolk: NO! You go kill vampires now! You're the only Belmont ever needed.
Simon as a 96yr old man: *strangles self with whip*
See its a perfect Hideo Kojima game already!
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Not overused. Over popular. He is insanely popular for his Symphony role, and role as "strongest Belmont" before Julius came along and topped him as "Strongest Vampire Hunter"
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They're less than ideal because they're pointlessly shoehorned in just because the assets were there. You know why you really fight Richter in Portrait? It's because he's easy to include since he has a great sprite, not because of whatever humbug they feed you about WHIP'S MEMORY or whatever within the story. It's all so see-through, so of course it's going to bother someone, and just one example of Portrait drawing more elements from Rondo -- like almost every Castlevania since Symphony -- instead of the game it's supposedly a sequel to, Bloodlines.
By that logic, they could have just as easily made him Jonathan Lecarde instead and you have to fight the Spear's Memory of Alucard. :P
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They did not want to draw new sprites of the Bloodlines heroes. And they give you some weird plot device like "Whip's Memory" to throw you off the scent that you're being ripped off.
And yeah it's a ripoff that we get Richter/Maria mode, and not John/Eric mode, for the same reason.
Lastly, he's got a ridiculous following who continuously clings on to one line in the USA SotN booklet, some crap about being the strongest because 'Belmonts get stronger down the line' or some crap (which, by logic, would make Julius the most badass strongest, best Belmont, even though genetics doesn't work that way).
Also, Simon & Trevor are cooler, imo. :P :P :P
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For those who say Alucard appears too much, you seem to miss the point. Unlike Richter, Alucard usually has some role to play in the story. In CV3, he was one of Trevor's allies. In SotN, he was the main character. In AoS and DoS, he was around to make sure no one would take Dracula's place as master of the castle.
They did not want to draw new sprites of the Bloodlines heroes. And they give you some weird plot device like "Whip's Memory" to throw you off the scent that you're being ripped off.
And yeah it's a ripoff that we get Richter/Maria mode, and not John/Eric mode, for the same reason.
Lastly, he's got a ridiculous following who continuously clings on to one line in the USA SotN booklet, some crap about being the strongest because 'Belmonts get stronger down the line' or some crap (which, by logic, would make Julius the most badass strongest, best Belmont, even though genetics doesn't work that way).
Also, Simon & Trevor are cooler, imo. :P :P :P
I also agree with Jorge.
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But again, the real reason Alucard appears often is that he's popular. It's not farfetched to be tired of him for that reason alone.
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I'll Third the Simon/Trevor love.
I do think Ritcher is cool though. He's got the most moves in a 2D-vania (I mean physical moves like his power-slide and whirlwind strike move).
Also, Richter can run.
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Well, Alucard is also immortal. At least in AoS he wasn't really him and had a smaller role. One can argue that his DoS mode as an 'extra' mode is also subdued (and even in these modes, at least he's got lines, not just right-off-the-bat-start). He's not just thrown in, though again, in some instances, he should be. For example, in Bloodlines and Portrait, there should have been a blurb about him when mentioning the Alucard Spear (Alcarde Spear), and the relationship between Alucard and the Lecardes.
Richter has no real reason of being in PoR, even as an extra mode. And, as I've mentioned before, the whole "Whip's Memory" thing is rather superfluous.
I always wonder if the Lecardes are the long lost bloodline of Sonia and Alucard. :P But that's fan-speculation on my behalf. :P It would make the sisters becoming Vampires quite more interesting, from a historic standpoint. But that's another thread. Ignore this last line.
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Richter is the only character whose arm actually moves while brandishing the whip -- aside from Simon and the technique's original appearance in CV4 -- so I can't hate him. Details!
One can argue that his DoS mode as an 'extra' mode is also subdued (and even in these modes, at least he's got lines, not just right-off-the-bat-start)
I HAD TO TRANSFORM TO DRAW OUT MY FULL POWER
Read: we couldn't be arsed to draw an appropriate sprite, so here, have the old one with missing frames.
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Trevor is more used than Richter too. Alucard is over-used.
Yep, who doesn't remember Trevor Mode on Curse of Darkness. It was cool, but not absolutely necessary.
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Well, that was actually a sequel to Dracula's Curse. If anything, he got the short hand of the stick in the storyline. Not sure how Trevor is overused though, beyond an appearance in Dracula's Curse, CoD, and Judgment and if you want stretch it, a fake Trevor boss in SoTN and PoR, which at least makes sense in context to Alucard.
There's Pachislot but that hardly counts lol.
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Well, that was actually a sequel to Dracula's Curse. If anything, he got the short hand of the stick in the storyline. Not sure how Trevor is overused though, beyond an appearance in Dracula's Curse, CoD, and Judgment and if you want stretch it, a fake Trevor boss in SoTN and PoR, which at least makes sense in context to Alucard.
There's Pachislot but that hardly counts lol.
Oh, Pachislot, what I think Curse of Darkness should of been, but without the money-eating and more platforming.
But back on topic:
In the context of overused CV characters, I would say Simon fits the bill more than Richter, since Simon (and Trevor?) made a cameo appearance on some of Konami's other games, such a Pop'n'Music.
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I HAD TO TRANSFORM TO DRAW OUT MY FULL POWER
Read: we couldn't be arsed to draw an appropriate sprite, so here, have the old one with missing frames.
Someone needs to make the appropriate DoS sprites with the Arikado guise....
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I would say that's more because Simon is the unofficial Castlevania mascot, so in any Konami Wai Wai whatever titles (crossovers), he would usually step up as the representative of that series, much like how Solid Snake represents Metal Gear and Twinbee represents Twinbee (as opposed to Raiden or Winbee)...
...though it is weird that for Konami Krazy Racers (Karts?) they chose Dracula instead of Simon. I guess they needed a heavyweight-class character.
I HAD TO TRANSFORM TO DRAW OUT MY FULL POWER
Read: we couldn't be arsed to draw an appropriate sprite, so here, have the old one with missing frames.
I'm not sure if you're arguing against me or arguing on my side, but yes, DoS Alucard is another example of Konami ripping the player off and not doing new spritework, and instead giving us altered, inferior versions of his Symphony of the Night sprites.
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I'm not sure if you're arguing against me or arguing on my side, but yes, DoS Alucard is another example of Konami ripping the player off and not doing new spritework, and instead giving us altered, inferior versions of his Symphony of the Night sprites.
Maybe the spriters are like me. If they have good sprites that they can still use, why make new ones. :P
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Because it's a new game, that's why.
The difference is, they're getting paid to work on sprites. You're not.
However, I don't think it's them. It's most likely the project director or lead designer, etc. who makes the decision of whether to cut time & costs by using already available material, or to spend time & resources to work on new stuff.
The clear difference in the end product, however, is that taking one route makes the product seem like a more quality work, while the other route makes it look cheap.
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My thought is that they're doing all these other things first. Developing the gameplay system, mapping out the areas, figuring out puzzles, writing another mediocre story (well, in the case of DoS and PoR), etc. etc. And then, towards the deadline, they're all like "OH CRAP. Did anybody draw any new sprites?!" "Son of a..!" Yeah, that. Quite a stretch but it is possible.
Another question is, why draw out all these new versions of Dracula and such, who's a much bigger character, and not even bother to at least give someone like Richter a new outfit at the most. I know it's possible. A lot of people on here are doing it, and if they actually worked on it, they could finish it in a couple days. They have a team of spriters, after all.
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You know I found a spritesheet of Alucard from SoTN with black hair? thought that was interesting.
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I think the only hints to them running about of time was with SoTN. It had Richter's new outfit, a handful of unused moves (though I'm glad they didn't use them in actuality), and there's how Richter was supposed to have a different color palette. And despite SoTN only having at most 15 people in the development team, it still had more new graphics than any of the DS titles which had larger teams.
So it's all very uh. They're probably cutting corners with the budget most likely.
You know I found a spritesheet of Alucard from SoTN with black hair? thought that was interesting.
There was actually a preliminary design for Alucard with black hair in the Ayami Kojima artbook released last year. But it was a totally different outfit too, so I guess you probably saw a re-color. I'm betting that Jorge probably even made it lol.
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It was an edit
http://cvimages.meeka.net/take2.php/character%20related/alucard/SotN_Alucard_black_hair_edit.png?action=big&size=original&fromthumbnail=true (http://cvimages.meeka.net/take2.php/character%20related/alucard/SotN_Alucard_black_hair_edit.png?action=big&size=original&fromthumbnail=true)
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You know I found a spritesheet of Alucard from SoTN with black hair? thought that was interesting.
Serio made that. ^.^ I have it. Rather well done.
I think the only hints to them running about of time was with SoTN. It had Richter's new outfit, a handful of unused moves (though I'm glad they didn't use them in actuality), and there's how Richter was supposed to have a different color palette. And despite SoTN only having at most 15 people in the development team, it still had more new graphics than any of the DS titles which had larger teams.
So it's all very uh. They're probably cutting corners with the budget most likely.
There was actually a preliminary design for Alucard with black hair in the Ayami Kojima artbook released last year. But it was a totally different outfit too, so I guess you probably saw a re-color. I'm betting that Jorge probably even made it lol.
I wasn't exactly serious about the time comment, but you got a point. The game was extremely rushed out by Konami, and we got IGA to vouch for that. Richter was supposed to have a sprite sheet for his SotN outfit. It was supposed to be like the Saturn version, where you could choose outfits once you unlock him. But they took the easy route (that many of us take) and drew the new moves on his Rondo outfit first, which makes sense. But again, time constraints. IGA even said that he didn't even know the game was being localized, so rushing is also what caused the voice acting problem in the original version (but honestly, I liked them). And by the way, the only missing move that was worthwhile was the spin kick, which they later added into PoR.
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How is Richter over-used? I've heard tons of people on forums like GameFAQs and stuff say this constantly, but I don't feel the need to ask there because I may be endlessly trolled in return. So I ask here.
How is he overused? (this doesn't count homebrews, GameFAQs really only talks about the official games... and bewbs.) Especially when you compare him to Alucard.
Richter appeared in:
Rondo of Blood/DXC
Symphony of the Night/Nocturne In the Moonlight
Portrait of Ruin
Harmony of Despair
Alucard appeared in:
Kid Dracula (sort of...)
Dracula's Curse
Symphony of the Night/Nocturne In the Moonlight
Aria of Sorrow
Dawn of Sorrow
Judgment
Harmony of Despair
As well as got his own trailer for a cancelled game, hurr durr.
Or I could be a d-bag and compare Richter to Dracula. >.>
But yeah, how is Richter overused? Can someone explain that to me?
They're just giving the incomplete sentence, that's all.
Richter is overused by the fans
but not all the fans, just the ones that say he's overused, because they did it lol. Alucard is far more used than this guy, he's one game away from being a prostitute.
Richter's only appearance as a main character is in RoB, in the other games he is whether a bonus, remaked or just an enemy. I would hardly call that overuse :P
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They're just giving the incomplete sentence, that's all.
Richter is overused by the fans
but not all the fans, just the ones that say he's overused, because they did it lol. Alucard is far more used than this guy, he's one game away from being a prostitute.
Richter's only appearance as a main character is in RoB, in the other games he is whether a bonus, remaked or just an enemy. I would hardly call that overuse :P
It is true that Alucard is used more than Richter, but unlike Richter, Alucard always contributes to the story and is only playable in three games.
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It is true that Alucard is used more than Richter, but unlike Richter, Alucard always contributes to the story and is only playable in three games.
CV3, SotN, DoS, Judgment, HD.
Five by my count. :P
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CV3, SotN, DoS, Judgment, HD.
Five by my count. :P
If you haven't forgot Judgment and "HD", please do it now :P
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If you haven't forgot Judgment and "HD", please do it now :P
Unfortunately for you, I enjoy the hell out of those two games. ^.^
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Simon is the only Belmont ever needed.
[shaft voice] Damn straight, baby!! [/shaft voice]
They did not want to draw new sprites of the Bloodlines heroes. And they give you some weird plot device like "Whip's Memory" to throw you off the scent that you're being ripped off.
And yeah it's a ripoff that we get Richter/Maria mode, and not John/Eric mode, for the same reason.
Lastly, he's got a ridiculous following who continuously clings on to one line in the USA SotN booklet, some crap about being the strongest because 'Belmonts get stronger down the line' or some crap (which, by logic, would make Julius the most badass strongest, best Belmont, even though genetics doesn't work that way).
Also, Simon & Trevor are cooler, imo. :P :P :P
100% agreed.
Someone needs to make the appropriate DoS sprites with the Arikado guise....
I second that!! That would be a great hack for DoS!
It was an edit
http://cvimages.meeka.net/take2.php/character%20related/alucard/SotN_Alucard_black_hair_edit.png?action=big&size=original&fromthumbnail=true (http://cvimages.meeka.net/take2.php/character%20related/alucard/SotN_Alucard_black_hair_edit.png?action=big&size=original&fromthumbnail=true)
That actually looks way more bad-ass than the usual color. =P
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Yeah that's definitely one of Serio's sprite projects. I don't think I helped at all with it aside from some suggestions done on IRC (if even that).
Also, you cannot count multi-player games or fighting games like CVHD or Judgment as 'Alucard' titles. Sorry, but that's just silly, as you can play as anyone in those games. You've got 15 characters in Judgment and you've got a slew of 'em in Harmony of Despair.
Really, the true "Alucard" games are CV3, SotN, and DoS. In every one of those games, Alucard's role in the game is explained and makes sense.
As for Richter:
-Rondo/DXX is his game. His remake in DXC also counts as his game.
-There was NO NEED for a Richter mode story-wise, in SotN. He's got no plot, so this is an extra mode. This is somewhat forgivable in this one game though, given that he's in the game and is a boss.
-There was NO NEED for him to be in Portrait of Ruin. That Whip's Memory crap, as I explained earlier, was totally superfluous.
So you've got a number of instances in which he's just tacked on at the end, because he has an easily 'portable' set of sprites. The only other character whom they shoehorn into games is Simon (in 8-bit 3-color NES mode, no less), but that one is always excusable because he's, as I mentioned before, the Castlevania Mascot character just like Snake is Metal Gear's and the Easter Island Statue is the Gradius mascot.
However, you've got this huge Richter fanbase for a character whom they always claim he's the strongest, most powerful Vampire Hunter, blah blah blah, where in reality he's a weak individual who allowed his mind to get violated by a dark priest. He's just popular. I guess that's what grinds my gears about him. Thankfully, characters like Julius are brightly stealing Richter's status.
Julius is awesome, even as a middleaged man. ;)
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For the record, Judgment has 14 playable characters and HD has 11 (why 11? That's a stupid number to stop at)
I counted the multiplayer games for the fact I was counting all their playable instances as well as times they just appeared. I never said they were "Alucard Titles", rather titles Alucard appeared in.
I think Alucard being a Japanese government agent was pretty stupid. >.>
Them getting stronger as the bloodline goes on (Belmont Warlord Chromosomes :P) makes some sort of sense. Julius in his game isn't counted as stronger than Richter because, well... He's like 55. I mean, even look at the whip wielders' base attack in CVHD.
Jonny - 67
Simon - 68
Julius - 68
Richter - 69
Imagine Julius in his prime (19 during the 1999 incident). It'd be well in the 80's. ^.^
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If they were to release Trevor, Sypha & Grant as exclusive bonuses for the ps3 version, I'd be pissed.
and youthful Julius would have a power level of over 9000, no doubt. kinda reminds me of the character Kliff (http://www.fightersgeneration.com/characters2/kliff.html) from the Guilty Gear X games how he's already a powerful old man, but he can transform into his younger self & display even more power lol!
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Seriously, if we got to see a young Julius, he'd probably be pretty badass.
My knowledge of genetics prevents me from believing that they get stronger as the bloodline goes through the years. If anything, I would believe that new skills learned throughout centuries of training, forged from practice and perfected with experience, would make someone more SKILLFUL, but not outright stronger.
However, most of Julius's skills are still from Simon and from Juste. Item Crushes were usable even by sister families like the Morrises, Graveses, and Baldwins.
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Well remember even as far back as Trevor, the Belmonts had supernatural powers.
Then Trevor had a kid with Sypha- a witch, and those genes are present in Juste. I assume those powers strengthen further down the line with training. I mean, you dont make giant holy energy based crosses without some kind of magic powers.
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Sonia had 'em too. Innate powers, too.
So do you think the Belmonts get stronger because they pick up traits from other strong families, as well? That would imply that every Male Belmont got hitched with a Female from an appropriate strong family. That's... let's see... Lecarde, Fernandez/Belnades, Renard, Morris, Baldwin, Schneider, and Graves... and perhaps Aulin.
There do seem to be quite a few.
But one can argue that this isn't strengthening the Belmont bloodline, but rather changing it by adding bloodlines from other families, thus actually weakening the Bloodline... They are stronger Belmonts as time goes down because they are stronger 'other familes involved' Belmonts.
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HD has 11 (why 11? That's a stupid number to stop at)
I don't believe you were around back when it was release, but I went and cracked open the files to discover Hammer was a planned DLC (among evidence for all the other DLC characters to date, besides Fuma, unless I didn't recognize what it was being a different series and all). Hammer never came out, but that would have made an even 12.
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I don't believe you were around back when it was release, but I went and cracked open the files to discover Hammer was a planned DLC (among evidence for all the other DLC characters to date, besides Fuma, unless I didn't recognize what it was being a different series and all). Hammer never came out, but that would have made an even 12.
Oh, I knew about the Hammer and Simon and all that other jazz being in the files. Romulus from GameFAQs basically knows everything there is to know about Castlevania and figured out Fuma would be released months before he actually was from going through the files. Hammer would have made an even 12, but I don't think they even had plans to release him. Maybe Konami was being a team of d-bags and put that there to throw us off. :P
But whatever the case, 11 is still a weird number to choose.
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iga is being held hostage by artists and level designers so they don't have to do as much work.