Topic: Castlevania: Symphony of the night HACKED! I bet you thought I had quit? ;)

[uzo]

Very well done. I am impressed. All the abilities and moves are nicely scaled and balanced. Everything looks authentic, while being updated at the same time.

I don't feel like making a word press account, so here;

Notes:
Some dual shock controller adapters assign the dpad to 'buttons' as opposed to an axis when Analog mode is on. The custom controls do not accept 'button' inputs for directionals. When not in Analog mode, L3 and R3 do not function. I cannot run dual shock mode and use the dpad at the same time.

Thought about renaming the project since it is no longer a hack? (Symphony of the Night Plus/Extended/Enhanced/Upgraded?)

Oh and a bug report;

Cross Sub-Weapon Stopped Being Usable
Type: Gameplay
Version: A10 R1
Reproduction: Failed (several attempts)
OS: Windows 7 64bit Professional

During the first form fight, I had the cross sub weapon. I had used the cross sub weapon, and an item crash during the fight. Eventually I had 11 hearts noted by the HUD, but realized I was unable to use the cross sub weapon anymore. Nothing appeared to be out of place, or unusual prior to the bug's appearance. All other attacks and abilities seemed to work. I am not sure if the item crash was the last sub weapon based attack I had used or not. I could not try to switch to the holy water, as it had already been gotten, replaced again by the cross, and disappeared. I did not use L1 sub weapon switching for the duration of play, and had not remembered to try to use it after the bug presented itself to see if it would bring it back to proper functionality. I was in normal status, not being helped my Maria's powers. Inciting Maria's powers did not fix the issue either. The bug had appeared after clearing the demo stage once (not the first clearance of the demo stage), returning to the menu, reloading an existing file, and continuing to play the demo again without having exited the program.

[Esco]

One question: was the cross STILL displayed in the upper left corner, or was it blank?

[uzo]

It was still displayed.

[VladCT]

@uzo:
Not to burst your bubble, but Esco did say to post all bug reports on his blog, did he not? Yeah, Esco did respond to you, but it's usually a one-time response.

On another note, anyone wanna talk strategy? :X

[Esco]

If it happens again Uzo, please let me know and add any more details that you can. I have heard that GM may have issues on 64 bit versions of windows 7 (see here: http://wiki.yoyogames.com/index.php/Making_games_work_under_Windows_Vista)

It could also be something I missed, but I have no idea what. I used the cross literally over 500 times with no issues in the past few months. But I'm not perfect, so you never know.

Also Vlad is correct, in the future please follow the rules like everybody else so this thread doesn't turn into a mess. Going forward any further bug reports here will be ignored from EVERYONE. Thanks for the VERY detailed report though, and for the props. Glad you liked it.

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

Alright, I will explain Z-depth.
Z-depth is a definition of the horizon line in a 3D model.  It gives objects depth by providing some much-needed perspective.

Here is the difference between an object with Z-depth applied, and one without it applied.

On the left is the clocktower, with no Z-depth.  This is the way you have it in the game.  It does a good job at looking 3D, but it's doesn't really have much depth, so it looks flat.  On the right is the same clocktower, with all the variables the same, except with the Z-depth attribute applied.  Even if it's facing the player in the same angles, the perspective clearly shows.  This is how SotN in the PSX is done, and is apparent when Alucard flies in the area high above the clocktower, where you can (barely) see the rooftops of it.  On your stage, it's never gonna do that, no matter how high you fly.  It will look flat without a horizon to make it pop.

No Z-Depth-------------------------------------------Z-Depth

[uzo]

On another note, anyone wanna talk strategy? :X

Use super jumps and whip dashes to phase through some attacks. Super jump through fatal ray, whip dash out of fire pillars. Etc.

Not to burst your bubble, but Esco did say to post all bug reports on his blog, did he not? Yeah, Esco did respond to you, but it's usually a one-time response.

Also Vlad is correct, in the future please follow the rules like everybody else so this thread doesn't turn into a mess. Going forward any further bug reports here will be ignored from EVERYONE.

Sorry,

I don't feel like making a word press account

[Esco]

Alright, I will explain Z-depth.
Z-depth is a definition of the horizon line in a 3D model.  It gives objects depth by providing some much-needed perspective.

Here is the difference between an object with Z-depth applied, and one without it applied.

On the left is the clocktower, with no Z-depth.  This is the way you have it in the game.  It does a good job at looking 3D, but it's doesn't really have much depth, so it looks flat.  On the right is the same clocktower, with all the variables the same, except with the Z-depth attribute applied.  Even if it's facing the player in the same angles, the perspective clearly shows.  This is how SotN in the PSX is done, and is apparent when Alucard flies in the area high above the clocktower, where you can (barely) see the rooftops of it.  On your stage, it's never gonna do that, no matter how high you fly.  It will look flat without a horizon to make it pop.

No Z-Depth-------------------------------------------Z-Depth

I'm sorry Jorge, but other than the angle they are turned, and the fact that they are colored different, I see no difference between the two (although in my engine based on where you are the clock tower DOES angle different like in the pic and like in SOTN).

My experience with z-buffering (I assume that is what you mean by Z-depth, or am I mixed up?) is basically to make stuff look like it is coming at the screen, right? But in this case, I would have no reason to make the tower appear to come closer to the screen?. I did use z-culling on the object to make the faces appear correct, but I never tried any z-depth stuff with with the tower.

Maybe it's just that you have so much more EXP. with 3d than I do, but looking at SOTN and my game, I don't see any issue depth wise at all. I am actually amazed at how great your tower looks in game; it makes the original one look choppy and trashy.  But if I can find a way to make it look even better (which you are making helpful suggestions for) I am all for it.

[Inccubus]

Just tried it out. Fan-fucking-tastic, bro! Mostly only minor issues, otherwise, this shit is sick!!

[Flame]

It runs real good. Though a few things Id like to point out, and I am not making a wordpress account to do so. If you want to keep this thread from "becoming a mess", then make a new topic to discuss the releases, while this topic stays for the development.

(click to show/hide)

The mugshots- You have a new Mug for Richter in his convo with Dracula, but Dracula has his pixelated original one. Why dont you just take the artwork it's based on and re-do his mug as well? it clashes otherwise.

The clocktower- i agree with Jorge on this, it just feels odd the way it is.

And now some issues that arise when running on integrated graphics-

* slowdowns. there are occasional random slowdowns, particularly when Dracula transforms.
*When the "Dracula transforms" scene takes over, the background of the keep gains a grid pattern before it falls away.
Like so:
http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/6233/95625939q.png

*The cutscene after the battle, that little narration, i extremely slowmo. the voice and music are distorted and reaaaally sloooow.
*after the game ends and it sends me back to the title screen, the music just goes crazy and starts warping and distorting.

[uzo]

So I was playing it on my TV, messing around, and then suddenly;

(click to show/hide)

[Esco]

On another note, anyone wanna talk strategy? :X

Believe it or not, there is actually a lot of strategy behind the boss battle, and in getting a high rank in general. Beating Dracula is easy (mostly because you can't die, lol); heck getting good starting stats is relatively simple; but getting a good rank however is NOT!

I will be putting out a guide about 2 weeks from now; after I see someone get the highest rank possible in the stage.

I will say this: EVERYTHING is dodge-able without crashing, frenzy whipping, or high jumping thru. Use all of your abilities; you do not just have a cross, and a whip; you can slide, backflip (air & ground), dash, and use the aforementioned 3 moves too. And Richter is much more mobile now, and has looser controls especially with his flip.

As I said when I started this hack: you WILL have to use all of your options in game and become good with them to do well in it. 

[Flame]

So I was playing it on my TV, messing around, and then suddenly;

(click to show/hide)

That's amusing.

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

I'm sorry Jorge, but other than the angle they are turned, and the fact that they are colored different, I see no difference between the two (although in my engine based on where you are the clock tower DOES angle different like in the pic and like in SOTN).

My experience with z-buffering (I assume that is what you mean by Z-depth, or am I mixed up?) is basically to make stuff look like it is coming at the screen, right? But in this case, I would have no reason to make the tower appear to come closer to the screen?. I did use z-culling on the object to make the faces appear correct, but I never tried any z-depth stuff with with the tower.

Maybe it's just that you have so much more EXP. with 3d than I do, but looking at SOTN and my game, I don't see any issue depth wise at all. I am actually amazed at how great your tower looks in game; it makes the original one look choppy and trashy.  But if I can find a way to make it look even better (which you are making helpful suggestions for) I am all for it.

Oh yeah, the tower looks so awesome.  However, there's a basic concept of perspective that it's quite difficult to express without going into a big lesson.  But I will try anyways.

Say you have an object like a box.  The box is about the size of your fist.  You hold it about one foot away from your face such that the front face is facing you, almost like a square.  Then you move it to the right side of your face.  You will notice that the box will show its side face, at an angle.

Now, say you have a huge box.  Huuuuuuge, like the size of a giant square building.  However, it's quite far away from you; far enough that if you look at it, it looks the same size as the box you held in front of your face earlier.  The difference?  Well, the difference shows as you move the building to the same 'relative' location as the box, so that it looks like it's in the same position.  The perspective angle will be different, and it's what tells our brains the relative spatial location and size of an object.

The way you have the clocktower right now, as you move Richter to the left, the clocktower slowly scrolls to the right.  However, there is no perspective angle at all.  This would lead people to believe that it's an incredibly huge object that's very very far, while in fact it should look like a reasonably large object that's somewhat close to the player.  Only by having a perspective angle (achieved either with a horizon like, or  by scaling the object so that it's smaller and then moving it forward, toward the camera, so that its perspective changes) will it look like the SotN version.

It's a simple but very important concept.

Since I don't know how you're programming the scrolling, I'm guessing:
1. you don't have any, or you do not have properly implemented, vertical scroll variables for the 3D objects.  Something like 'orthogonal scroll ON' or something, that cancels any depth of angle... again, just a guess.
2. you have positioned the object very far and have scaled it very large (unlikely)
3. have never set up a horizon line for relative perspective (I doubt GM does that).

I'm leaning towards 1.

[Maedhros]

I don't like how Richter's moves are now L2 + Square or Up + Triangle... other than that, I haven't had a problem with the game.

Playing on Windows 7 64 bits.