Topic: Lament of Innocence should've been 2D

[crisis]

ever since this sprite was teased in Poultry of Ruin, I've been craving a 'sequel' to LoI that utilized the sprite style of the metroidvanias. Unfortunately this never came to be.. Does anyone think that LoI would've been a better "start for the series" had it been a 2D classicvania in the vein of the NES/SNES games, instead of an okay-average 3D brawler? Benefits include:

- more emphasis on platforming
- higher difficulty
- a lot more varied enemies
- more replay value

however I don't know how the combo system would've faired.. maybe Leon could've handled in a way similar to how The Dishwasher: Dead Samurai did it. Or perhaps did away with the combo system & just use straight-up classic controls.

[DarkPrinceAlucard]

If it was in 2.5D than yes.

[Inccubus]

That might have been good. I personally feel that setting it so far in the past was unnecessary. They could have done fine creating a story that tied directly to a Dracula based on the historical figure. Also, it is possible to have a good combo system and a 2D/2.5D CV without it having to turn into a rediculous situation of a super-powered vampire-hunting bad-ass that cant break a barrel without a combo.

[Mystic Myotis]

I like Lament of Innocence; I feel that the main area it is lacking in is level design, but I don't think that would be too hard to rectify, or require a completely different perspective to do... Oh, I'd also add a first-person thing.  I wanted to look around at the areas but the fixed camera wouldn't let you.

However, a 2.5D or 2D prequel/sequel/whatever is something I most certainly would not object to.  I liked Leon and his giant ham-ness.

[GuyStarwind]

I went with no but since they made the sprite I would have enjoyed a 2D sequel.

[Flame]

I liked LoI the way it was, but it was definitely somewhat underwhelming, despite being fun. i don't know if making it a 2D game would have made it better or worse. At least the way it came out it has a very unique feel to it. It is essentially a dungeon crawler, not a metroidvania. as a 2D game, it would have undoubtedly been a handheld game. Also, It would have no doubt resulted in a mindless grindfest with a giant map.

That said, it would likely have been a GBA game, and the GBA Vanias were actually pretty good, HoD's flaws aside. It's the DS where Metroidvanias went down the toilet.

Who knows. It could have been great. It also would have allowed for some great throwbacks to CV1. (Not like every other castlevania doesn't already do that, but still)

But In the end I still like the final product.  It allowed for more quality and imagination. It allowed for it to be unique and have it's own style to it.

Also, come on. You wouldn't have "I'LL KILL YOU AND THE NIGHT!" on a GBA! Or Crispin Freeman and Jamieson Price hamming it up as Mathias and Walter respectively!

[Mystic Myotis]

Also, come on. You wouldn't have "I'LL KILL YOU AND THE NIGHT!" on a GBA! Or Crispin Freeman and Jamieson Price hamming it up as Mathias and Walter respectively!

Don't forget Liam O'Brien.

Leon: Why is a vampire locked away here? 
Joachim: SHUT UP! 
Leon:   

[Abnormal Freak]

Oh, I'd also add a first-person thing.  I wanted to look around at the areas but the fixed camera wouldn't let you.

UUUUGGGHHHH, YEEEESSSSSS. So many times my first playthrough did I want to just gaze at all the textures. The game is PRETTY and I always lamented (hence the title?) that there was no first-person view mode.

Apart from making the level design more interesting and also adding more platforming sections (ones that actually worked, 'cos the platforming is even worse than in CV64), there's not a terrible lot I'd change about LOI. I enjoyed it a lot when it first came out despite its shortcomings, and it gave us one kickin' soundtrack at least.

However, I'd love for there to be a 2D console game. Dot art is pretty much impossible with the higher resolutions (even pre-HD) but a hand-drawn approach would have been cool, granted the animations were actually good and didn't explicitly look like Flash. Castlevania was always made to be a console series with lavish graphics and music, and the GBA/DS didn't do the series justice, in my opinion. (For that matter, Dracula X Chronicles should've been a PS2 title.)

[Ratty]

I'd love a de-make in 2D but the game is fine as is. I'll third the wish for a camera control function though, because so much of LoI's gorgeous visuals are wasted up in areas you hardly ever glimpse. I know I've spent a while in the game just jumping around in empty rooms to try and get a better look.

Castlevania was always made to be a console series with lavish graphics and music, and the GBA/DS didn't do the series justice, in my opinion. (For that matter, Dracula X Chronicles should've been a PS2 title.)

Eh I think CotM and AoS look good blown up on a TV. I might actually rebuy (something I hardly ever do) the DS titles if they put them up for download on the WiiU. (If I had/get one.) Come to think of it a "Castlevania Collection(s)" of the type someone proposed a while back would be perfect for the WiiU.

[Abnormal Freak]

I suppose having the tablet could work as the bottom screen on DS titles. Hadn't thought of that; I've always wanted to emulate DS games on a console (although games that actually utilize both screens as gameplay fields like Sonic Rush probably wouldn't work so well).

But it's not a matter of how good a game looks blown up. The limited hardware makes for limited visuals and sounds. None of the post-SOTN Metroidvanias are as lavish as that one, and that's always upset me. Dawn of Sorrow kind of came close in ways in the graphical department with the various effects used and craft put into the pixel art (that was wasted on often-lousy level design, sadly), but it just wasn't the same, especially not on a small screen.

Ah well. Classic dot art games are practically dead; we're seeing a lot of "8-bit retro" throwbacks but nobody thinks it's cool to emulate the pixel 16- and 32-bit eras, apparently—or it's just impossible considering these are indie games with small development staff.

[GuyStarwind]

Not to go off the original topic a bit but I think LoI would have been better if they played vampire killer as the background music while the vampire killer is being made. It would start off slow and then build up he says "I will not let any more suffer your fate" or whatever he says. I also think developing more character development between Leon and Mathias would have really helped... especially in the end of the game. Still I really enjoy it though.

[Ratty]

I suppose having the tablet could work as the bottom screen on DS titles. Hadn't thought of that; I've always wanted to emulate DS games on a console (although games that actually utilize both screens as gameplay fields like Sonic Rush probably wouldn't work so well).

But it's not a matter of how good a game looks blown up. The limited hardware makes for limited visuals and sounds. None of the post-SOTN Metroidvanias are as lavish as that one, and that's always upset me. Dawn of Sorrow kind of came close in ways in the graphical department with the various effects used and craft put into the pixel art (that was wasted on often-lousy level design, sadly), but it just wasn't the same, especially not on a small screen.

Ah well. Classic dot art games are practically dead; we're seeing a lot of "8-bit retro" throwbacks but nobody thinks it's cool to emulate the pixel 16- and 32-bit eras, apparently—or it's just impossible considering these are indie games with small development staff.

Ehh I think the art on the games was good. Sure it wasn't as detailed but it worked. I think of SOTN in Highlander terms anyway so I'm not bothered the others don't match it note for note, would actually be kind boring if they did. But I was thinking of using the WiiU pad as more of the top screen for the CV games, with the main game on your TV most of the time. And only switching to the bottom when you have to do one of the very few tasks that require the stylus in those games.

And yeah it's a shame that you don't really see a lot of Indie games paying homage to the 32bit era, it's just a budgetary and time thing I'm sure.

[Mystic Myotis]

I'd love a de-make in 2D but the game is fine as is. I'll third the wish for a camera control function though, because so much of LoI's gorgeous visuals are wasted up in areas you hardly ever glimpse. I know I've spent a while in the game just jumping around in empty rooms to try and get a better look.

The last time I played LoI, I stopped and took a good long look at every single painting, all the details in the doors and walls and floors... was awesome, but the only reason I was able to make out any good amount of detail was because I played it using my PC.

Eh I think CotM and AoS look good blown up on a TV. I might actually rebuy (something I hardly ever do) the DS titles if they put them up for download on the WiiU. (If I had/get one.) Come to think of it a "Castlevania Collection(s)" of the type someone proposed a while back would be perfect for the WiiU.

I agree.  I think they look fine... but then again I've never been very picky about graphics so long as they get the point across.

Not to go off the original topic a bit but I think LoI would have been better if they played vampire killer as the background music while the vampire killer is being made. It would start off slow and then build up he says "I will not let any more suffer your fate" or whatever he says. I also think developing more character development between Leon and Mathias would have really helped... especially in the end of the game. Still I really enjoy it though.

I agree that Vampire Killer should have been in the game.  I also think that since this was supposed to be THE origin story, they should have had more characterization/development with regards to both Mathias and Sarah, and their dynamics with Leon. It was a mistake to put all the prologue in that narration at the very start of the game before the start screen.  I don't have a problem with the overall story but it should have been more detailed/fleshed out... that's one of the reasons I wanna get my greedy paws on that cell phone manga thing.  Does ANYONE have that?

[Shiroi Koumori]

It could have been good if we had a 2d vania for the ps2... But it is ok as it was.

I agree that Vampire Killer should have been in the game.  I also think that since this was supposed to be THE origin story, they should have had more characterization/development with regards to both Mathias and Sarah, and their dynamics with Leon. It was a mistake to put all the prologue in that narration at the very start of the game before the start screen.  I don't have a problem with the overall story but it should have been more detailed/fleshed out... that's one of the reasons I wanna get my greedy paws on that cell phone manga thing.  Does ANYONE have that?

Yeah they should have included it.
I am guessing Konami hurried them in production that the stories of Matthias and Sarah were never told. I am sure IGA has their backstories in his mind.

Wait, what cellphone manga?

[Mystic Myotis]

Wait, what cellphone manga?

http://castlevania.wikia.com/wiki/Akumaj%C5%8D_Dracula:_Lament_of_Innocence_%28comic%29

I WANT IT.