Topic: Has LoZ gotten Silly?

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

Except Link does look young in the original artwork.
Either that or Hobbit-ish what with the shortness.

I'm willing to say "Young" rather than "Short" since in Zelda II he's nice & teen-sized.

[theANdROId]

They're fun to play though!  And the kidsy, cutesy things are amusing at least...though not much else usually...and excluding Tingle.  LttP is probably my favorite of them all, and I've really enjoyed the retake that game has gotten through A Link Between Worlds.

[Neobelmont]

Is it odd that I miss the Christian shield?

Also Zelda II freaking rocks 

[Aelfwine]

I dont care what an official timeline says that was made in 2011... after all the games had been out and they tried to make it all make sense. I dont believe that at the time zelda came out on the NES that Link was intended to be that young. And the artwork from the game goes along with that. In a few more years what if another metroid game comes out and they release a timeline that says Samus was spose to be 13 in the original game. Who would buy that? Same principle here. The original Zelda on NES was a fantasy adventure game firmly set in the standard medieval swords and sorcery setting. The 2nd game followed that pretty closely and expanded on it. It wasnt until LttP and ESPECIALLY OoT that it took the silly kiddy turns that its stuck to since.

You're right. How could I have been so blind. He wasn't ten in the first Zelda game he was  "about twelve"*. And this information comes from Shigeru Miyamoto no less.

*see Iwata Asks, The legend of Zelda: Ocarina of time 3D, many Characters many Roles where Shigeru Miyamoto states "Link is a boy. In the first game, The Legend of Zelda, he was about 12 years old" http://iwataasks.nintendo.com/interviews/#/3ds/zelda-ocarina-of-time/4/1

[Inccubus]

none of the original zelda artwork was silly or kiddy. It looked like typical anime from that time period but thats cause it was a japanese game. I dont know how of it could be considered anything but serious tho

I beg to differ.

http://legendsoflocalization.com/the-legend-of-zelda/manuals/

http://zs.ffshrine.org/album/link-to-the-past/inst-us/z3manual-45-46.jpg
That snapdragon is frightening!


Look. The various Zelda games have differing levels of seriousness and silliness. I can buy the first two games were more serious, but you're not going to convince anyone that the series was ever intended to be on the same level as other epic high-fantasy works.

[Dracula9]

Well, given that Western RPG settings were typically darker than the "typical anime from that time period," I would imagine that a poofy-haired Hobbit-sized elf kid would definitely look silly to people who were used to D&D, Lone Wolf, and stop-motion skeletons in armor.

Of course I wasn't around in the eighties, so if I'm way off base on this, someone kindly knock me on my ass.

EDIT:

In a few more years what if another metroid game comes out and they release a timeline that says Samus was spose to be 13 in the original game. Who would buy that?

Nobody with any sense, because that wouldn't make any. Even her endgame sprite is clearly fully physically developed. Unless she's suddenly got some Yoko Ritona vibe going on, I doubt Nintendo's going to say she was thirteen.

And you're forgetting one very simple thing. Cartoony styles typically tend to make just about anything look child-sized or child-orientented (TYPICALLY). It doesn't matter that that was the anime style of the period (and even if it did, I would just point out the main characters of even earlier animes of that style, such as Astro Boy or Gigantor), Link looks young in that artwork.

The first two didn't have the visual silliness vibes the future installments did, but perhaps that had more to do with hardware limitations rather than design aesthetics?

[X]

Well, given that Western RPG settings were typically darker than the "typical anime from that time period," I would imagine that a poofy-haired Hobbit-sized elf kid would definitely look silly to people who were used to D&D, Lone Wolf, and stop-motion skeletons in armor.

Of course I wasn't around in the eighties, so if I'm way off base on this, someone kindly knock me on my ass.

No asskicking needed, you're correct 

The first two didn't have the visual silliness vibes the future installments did, but perhaps that had more to do with hardware limitations rather than design aesthetics?

I think so too. They had the chance to do that kind of silliness in Zelda 3, but I'm glad they didn't. And the game is better for the lacking of it.

[PFG9000]

I agree with KaZiZ and several others here.  Zelda has gotten rather silly.  Only I don't mind the continuity issues brought on by forcing an overarching timeline on games that were never originally meant to have it.  It's kinda like the forced continuity Iga brought on the CV series, except that Zelda's continuity is an absolute joke compared to CV's.

Anyway.  The silliness issues I have with Zelda begin with Ocarina of Time.  I love the first four Zeldas, but from OoT forward, the games just got too kiddy for me.  I do think the silliness really started with aLttP, but that game seemed to strike a good balance between goofy interludes and a serious overall tone.  OoT had its serious moments, and certain parts - like the Adult Link version of the Hyrule castle square - are borderline creepy, but the game overall seems to be targeted toward a much younger generation than the first four games.

I wonder if this is just my impression, since I grew up with the series and my age compared to the target audience changed as I grew older.  I was just a kid when the earlier games came out, but when OoT was launched, I was a teenager who was just beginning to fixate on how good games used to be.  But there does seem to be a divide between those gamers who grew up with Zelda's 1-4, and those who were first introduced to the series with OoT.  I know there are those gamers who played the first game when it came out and have stuck with the series ever since, but they seem to be much fewer than those who gave up on the series after the early titles.  You can say the early games were limited in their silliness by the limitations of the hardware, but early Castlevania games certainly didn't come off as games for kids.

In other news, I picked up A Link Between Worlds tonight and am enjoying it so far, though it seems a little too derivative of aLttP.

[Aelfwine]

Personally I don't mind the "silliness". It's like Dragon Quest, it doesn't take itself too seriously and I like that.
I actually picked up Skyrim and found it really difficult to enjoy, I've barely even touched it.
If Zelda became some serious gritty fantasy game I think I wouldn't be interested any more.

I still don't see how people can say the first game was more serious though, I mean, the dungeons were shaped like objects, there are hidden caves  where the old man gets you to pay for the door you just blew open instead of giving you some nice secret, and an old woman who is too  preoccupied with your wealth to give you the info she promised when you pay her. These are all playful maybe even silly gameplay elements, Shigeru Miyamoto himself has said "Until The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time, Link was a playful and childish character." I just don't see where this whole "Zelda became silly with OoT" thing is coming from.

[PFG9000]

That reminds me: this whole thing about Link being 10 or 12 during the original Zelda was added in after the fact.  There was nothing indicating his age at the time (at least as far as I knew).  In fact, the game's story was very simple, just like that of most games of the time, so if the manual didn't state the character's age, and if you couldn't tell from the graphics, then it was up to your own interpretation.  My six-year-old self figured Link was 18 or so when I first saw Zelda.

And by the way, I apologize for bumping this topic.  I didn't realize until after my previous post that it was over a week since the last post.

[X]

Shigeru Miyamoto himself has said "Until The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time, Link was a playful and childish character."

Sounds like Shigeru Miyamoto wasn't paying very close attention to the games he was creating. Maybe it is so in his mind, but in the games themselves it's completely the opposite. In the original four games I see no real evidence that Link is this playful, childish character he is describing. He on a mission to save Hyrule from Ganon at the request of Impa. Maybe that silliness was described in the back story of the characters, but it's not evident in the four games themselves. But OoT on the other hand is when I really started to notice the playful, childish character of Shigeru Miyamoto's Link. And you see it again in Majora's Mask, Wind Waker, Minish Cap, Four Swords, Spirit Tracks, Phantom, Hourglass, Oricle of Ages, Oricle of Seasons, Skyward Sword, and in A Link Between Worlds.

[Aelfwine]

Wait, so the first four games were all serious...

Does that include this one:

[X]

lol! That was the remake of the original Link's Awakening. The DX version had those photograph images but not when the game first came out (which was the one I was referring to  ).

[Aelfwine]

lol! That was the remake of the original Link's Awakening. The DX version had those photograph images but not when the game first came out (which was the one I was referring to  ).

  There is still plenty of silliness in Links awakening.

[Ratty]

The original Zelda on NES was a fantasy adventure game firmly set in the standard medieval swords and sorcery setting. The 2nd game followed that pretty closely and expanded on it. It wasnt until LttP and ESPECIALLY OoT that it took the silly kiddy turns that its stuck to since.

Actually the first game was originally going to have futuristic sci-fi elements with time travel. Miyamoto apparently revealed this relatively recently http://www.zeldadungeon.net/2012/11/the-triforce-was-originally-meant-to-be-chips/

You could see some of the designs for futuristic sci-fi Princess Zelda in the Hyrule Historia
http://www.officialnintendomagazine.co.uk/47332/features/8-incredible-legend-of-zelda-facts/?page=6

I'm with Jorge, "realism" in games is overrated. Silly fun rocks.