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Offline Dark Nemesis

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3540 on: August 01, 2018, 12:39:24 PM »
0
Considering the amount of work they have to do, i would be surprised to see a 2018 release date. The most logical release date would be early 2019.
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Offline affinity

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3541 on: August 01, 2018, 06:09:58 PM »
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we dont even know how much content they completed.

a 2019 date would only be pushed if they plan to include all the stretch goals modes and content within the base game. 

yea they know the game is not definitive unless it includes all the stretch goals instead of adding them as patches/DLC later.

and its an offline SP game first and foremost and not everyone has internet to get all the content, though I think later they could launch a new definitive edition with all the DLCs and stretch goals included in the game.

a lot of people just wanna play the core campaign already overall. I think they can get that completed and launched in 2018.

this game doesnt require as much work compared to games like Code Vein.  its practically like putting legos together lol j/k.

Offline Gunlord

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3542 on: August 02, 2018, 12:20:14 AM »
+1
I really don't think a release date this year is possible, though there's always the chance they may pull off a miracle. But as others said, considering the sheer amount of work they have to do, first half of 2019 seems likely. It'll be disappointing for a lot of folks, but better than releasing a very buggy game. But like they say, I also wouldn't make a solid bet until the team has actually said something.

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Offline Shiroi Koumori

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3543 on: August 03, 2018, 03:39:04 AM »
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2019 release is ok for me, just don't release it in the same window as KH3 (and maybe the second season stuff of FFXV).
I want a fully playable game and not a buggy release that requires a massive day one patch.

Offline affinity

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3544 on: August 03, 2018, 08:39:13 AM »
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the backer demo looks polished and ready as is.  it has rare glitches, but nothing they can't polish in a month.

look at how much years Diablo III took and its PC launch was still a disaster even at the balancing level.

also they already have years developing this game.   and they are using UE4, progress is more streamlined than other engines.
 and it's not like they are developing an ARK Survival Evolved.

even Fortnite battle royale launched with issues that werent completely ironed out until months later, and its the best selling game this year.

people expecting Bloodstained ROTN pushed to 2019 to be perfect are setting the bar too high. it doesnt matter how much time they develop it,
 there will be nitpickers waiting to chew it up and underrate it.


Offline Long John Silver

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3545 on: August 03, 2018, 11:57:50 AM »
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and to add to that, i doubt there will be a physical release from the start, so pushing the release back dnf style won't do much except screw up with people's expectations.

it'll probably be a digital release at first with bugfixes, patches and dlc as it's completed, and once all that is finished, fixed and ready, then they will release the completed version in physical form, which will probably come in 2019 to 2020. wouldn't make sense to release physical as soon as they're done, and then while digital backers get to play first, physical backers wait for days, even weeks for their copy to arrive just to get day one patches which defeats the purpose of physical copy being independent from internet. sending a second, complete phys copy once it's all finished would make even less sense from financial perspective.

digital to play as it comes out not to be left out, physical for collection and future when/if the console online stores ever go offline as part of planned obsolescence. there's no actual difference between phys and digital gameplay wise except maybe longer loading times for physical.

Offline affinity

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3546 on: August 04, 2018, 07:46:27 PM »
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and to add to that, i doubt there will be a physical release from the start, so pushing the release back dnf style won't do much except screw up with people's expectations.

it'll probably be a digital release at first with bugfixes, patches and dlc as it's completed, and once all that is finished, fixed and ready, then they will release the completed version in physical form, which will probably come in 2019 to 2020. wouldn't make sense to release physical as soon as they're done, and then while digital backers get to play first, physical backers wait for days, even weeks for their copy to arrive just to get day one patches which defeats the purpose of physical copy being independent from internet. sending a second, complete phys copy once it's all finished would make even less sense from financial perspective.

digital to play as it comes out not to be left out, physical for collection and future when/if the console online stores ever go offline as part of planned obsolescence. there's no actual difference between phys and digital gameplay wise except maybe longer loading times for physical.

No Man's Sky is still garbage but its insane how mainstream give it another chance due to the update it got like how long after its intial launch?  and despite its bad reputation and shady business, it now has spiked interest and more buying it, which is ridiculous.

but anyways the point is, they could release the core game of Bloodstained ROTN campaign, then add more to it over time with patches/DLC etc. to rekindle interest long after the game has launched.


so I think from a business standpoint, ROTN devs may resort to staggered content release style, especially considering interest in the game is waning and people just wanna play the story campaign already.   especially in these days, DLC and add ons and patches are common, so people are likely to get more interested in the game and could get a larger fanbase if it gets updated and new modes/content from the stretch goals over time.

and yea, even Friday the 13th the game launched digital, then this year got a physical release.

nothing wrong with Bloodstained ROTN getting milked, a lot of prosperous companies do those things and a lot of people buy into those sort of business models.

PC patching and post launch content culture has spilled onto consoles, so expecting full content definitive version games day 1 is really not that common overall.   

sure a lot would like the full game with all the stretch goals include, but they could release a later edition like MK does with all the DLC addons they add through the months.  people double dip in game editions a lot, especially if its from a favorite IP.

well yea they could push it to later, though that could affect morale.  Im not sure how Code Vein will be received after its been delayed, well it could do better, but I dunno about Bloodstained ROTN.   

 the devs have the backers to think of too.  a lot of them want to play the full game while they are still breathing.

Offline Long John Silver

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3547 on: August 05, 2018, 07:28:24 AM »
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in code vein's case it may be to refine gameplay people complain about being floaty, lacking impact, slow or whatever other things they speak of. that's something bad first impressions would ruin unlike additional content like boss mode or procedurally generated dungeons bloodstained will get. as long as iga's team can get the main campaign completed, the first impressions should be favorable as shantae's were.

in no man's sky case you're probably basing that on video game journalism, which is a corrupt industry designed to shape opinions of those who read it based on how well they're paid by corporations to advertise and give favorable or unfavorable opinions and ratings to things they're ordered to. as far as i remember sony is tied to nms. the game itself may be just as sucky as it was originally, but the journos were paid money to re-sell it to the mass audience, so they will try.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2018, 07:38:38 AM by Long John Silver »

Offline affinity

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3548 on: August 05, 2018, 05:55:53 PM »
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in code vein's case it may be to refine gameplay people complain about being floaty, lacking impact, slow or whatever other things they speak of. that's something bad first impressions would ruin unlike additional content like boss mode or procedurally generated dungeons bloodstained will get. as long as iga's team can get the main campaign completed, the first impressions should be favorable as shantae's were.

in no man's sky case you're probably basing that on video game journalism, which is a corrupt industry designed to shape opinions of those who read it based on how well they're paid by corporations to advertise and give favorable or unfavorable opinions and ratings to things they're ordered to. as far as i remember sony is tied to nms. the game itself may be just as sucky as it was originally, but the journos were paid money to re-sell it to the mass audience, so they will try.

yea that is really corrupt on their part.    its pathetic Sony would shill for those developers, when Siren 2 deserves a promotion and localization in north america and port on PS4.   Sony gave up too fast on that IP.  and Blood Curse is a disgrace white washing most of the cast and twisting it into some western glorification game, it was originally all about japanese people in a japanese place, but they replaced most of the characters with "tourists" or some news crew from outside Japan.   they aren't even asian!   especially with how there's not enough realistic representation of japanese people in japanese games (and games in general), its messed up how these generations both east and west are mostly glorifying european and western people and regions instead of Japanese and other asian places.

the only pure japanese game I can think of thats coming out this year is Disaster Report 4, a natural disaster simulation game, that's it! 
and if they aren't doing some anime thing, they are making realistic games based on american characters.  its so degrading and insulting to the japanese civilization.

but yea anyways thats another subject, but yea, I dunno which side the media is on with the whole Bloodstained ROTN stuff.

I dunno if the publisher will get Game informer and other things on their side.   DBFZ got a front page cover story on GI (I think Bloodborne did too?)
so should Bloodstained.

Offline Long John Silver

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3549 on: August 05, 2018, 09:00:39 PM »
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from what i understand, they usually don't want to do historical or realistic pieces (instead going for animu or fantasy) because (at least according to some chinese people) they want more fantasy based settings. too tired of realism and the daily grind that comes with it, they want their escapism to be an actual escape from their hard lives into the realms of wonder, not another attempt to ground and limit them. as a result, realistic games don't sell that well in asia.

doesn't help that western like realism is expensive and time consuming to do, and their gaming studios don't get hollywood tier money thrown at them unlike usa or europe. games are still seen as toys for kids, and those don't receive a lot of finances, with most money and work going into mobile market these days.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2018, 07:07:01 AM by Long John Silver »

Offline affinity

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3550 on: August 07, 2018, 04:36:30 PM »
-1
from what i understand, they usually don't want to do historical or realistic pieces (instead going for animu or fantasy) because (at least according to some chinese people) they want more fantasy based settings. too tired of realism and the daily grind that comes with it, they want their escapism to be an actual escape from their hard lives into the realms of wonder, not another attempt to ground and limit them. as a result, realistic games don't sell that well in asia.

doesn't help that western like realism is expensive and time consuming to do, and their gaming studios don't get hollywood tier money thrown at them unlike usa or europe. games are still seen as toys for kids, and those don't receive a lot of finances, with most money and work going into mobile market these days.

just because people want escapism doesnt mean all of them wanna play as moeblobs and unrealistic characters.  or expect all important games to go the anime/cartoon/unrealistic route with character/world design. 

there are photorealistic games centered on asian characters, like Siren 1 and 2,  and the upcoming remaster of 428 Shibuya Scramble (a photorealistic visual novel style game. whereas there are hundreds of animeish visual novel games, 428 Shibuya Scramble is an example how photorealistic characters and world can be more appealing and immersive than cartoonish characters).

photorealism is an underutilized art, and it really does not require high production values to achieve, as proven by Siren 1 and Siren 2, which with PS2 tech, they are able to produce characters more realistic and genuine than a lot of AAA games that are made on PS4 and Xbox One.

its really based on art direction and how they put together the overall visuals.

take for example 2D games, like some are 2D rpgs, thats even easier to apply photorealistic characters and worlds, since photos are easier to produce than creating characters from scratch with pixels or line art.

overall there is much potential there.  its just a shame how there are a lot of western games that aim for more realistic and authentic caucasian, hispanic and black characters, while asians in general just go anime with their character designs.

it really is degrading.   now it seems nice that some series like Yakuza someone try to make their characters japanese instead of caucasian looking characters with japanese names to them, but they are still generally not realistic enough, and that's just one genre, not everyone is into Yakuza type games, plus Yakuza itself is bad influence with the shady stuff and crimes they do.

realistic looking characters and realistic looking world would actually provide a form of escapism that cartoonish games can't provide.  the game would be realistic and at the sametime provide freedoms with no real consequences, so that in itself is escapism a lot can appreciate if the overall game turns out good and appealing.
but yea it doesnt have to be anime or uncanny to be appealing.

there's so much beauty of Japanese people and Japanese locations that its shame their industry leaders shy away from all that for the most part.
whereas westerners overall embrace realism and aim for more realistic looking people and world, though sadly, they exclusive asians in almost all their games, and those that go includes asian, dont look realistic asian.

and them shying away from realism is giving room for racism and xenophobic attitudes to spread out, which is bad.  they shouldnt think westerners wouldnt buy games with realistic Japanese characters in them, japanese developers should embrace their ethnic qualities and appearances, especially the best appearances that make their race even more special and beautiful and deserving of representation in games.

so I feel there is a crisis in those aspects with Japanese devs being too invested in anime/unrealistic characters and lacking the pride and self respect towards their own kind in games in general.   looking at the industry history, there is an unhealthy insane amount of glorification towards western ethnicities and not enough pure realistic asian representation in games.

 where is their pride?  where is their self respect for their people, country, race and especially racial ethnic traits/genetics?
those things are not fully reflected upon in their games and character designs.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2018, 04:38:33 PM by affinity »

Offline Long John Silver

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3551 on: August 08, 2018, 04:39:43 AM »
-1
calm down, you're unnecessarily taking offense on behalf of someone who doesn't want your pity while also derailing the thread with your personal politics and beliefs. let them speak for themselves if it bothers them, they don't need anyone from the sidelines to defend them. they're not children.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2018, 05:14:33 AM by Long John Silver »

Offline Gunlord

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3552 on: August 08, 2018, 11:04:56 AM »
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Let's get the subject back to Bloodstained, guys, these other games are unrelated to it. In any case, there are several things they need to include or polish up, on the Bloodstained forums a lot of people have raised questions about the lighting and similar graphical concerns, so it may take IGA and his team a bit of time to address all that. But who knows, maybe if they push super hard they can get it in 2018. But again, I would put much more money on a 2019 release date.

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Offline affinity

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3553 on: August 08, 2018, 03:13:08 PM »
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if people are not fine with the lighting and graphics as is, nothing will satisfy them.

it reminds me of a quote where someone made a  comment on how some evaluations of people, nitpick and seek the worst aspects of people, like say a certain mindset look for the positive/best aspects of people.  while actually pride themselves in their perfectionist stance, though at the sametime, that mindset really underrates and fails to see the good aspects of people they criticize, which unfairly paints them as 'bad', ignoring the good.

in relation to Bloodstained, the hypercritical people are being too nitpicky instead of focusing on the positive aspects.

would say expecting more out of the lighting and graphics really is being too perfectionist attitude, especially from a dev team that just been put together for this first game they develop together. 

yes some criticisms can encourage the devs to improve, however, I think the nitpickers are not going to be satisfied with the graphics/lighting, no matter what is adjusted.  if they dont like how it looks now, they are likely to be sucking teeth after launch.   people are setting the visual bar too high for the ROTN project.  and I think mainstream wise and commercially, if the fans get too negative and nitpicky towards the game's visuals, then that can overall harm its reception (like how Harmony of Despair was underrated primarily because it copies sprites/backgrounds from other games. meanwhile SSBUltimate is copy/pasting character models and assets and fans are ok with it, its still a 10/10 game to them).

so really, yea ROTN can use a little polish, though expecting something noticably a leap better than it looks now, is really being harsh and too demanding to the devs. 
« Last Edit: August 08, 2018, 08:51:20 PM by affinity »

Offline Shiroi Koumori

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Re: The first sign rises with the full moon.
« Reply #3554 on: August 08, 2018, 08:31:24 PM »
+3
I have to do a little derailing since my internal spider sense (and my undergrad major) is tingling.

@Affinity: The Japanese have two faces (search honne and tatemae). They will say good things in front (respect and such that everyone wants to hear and produces a harmonious society) and bad things are hidden inside (no ones knows this unless you are part of the inner circle, or have lived in Japan for quite sometime). They are one of the most nitpicky people, especially to themselves. This also applies on why they do not want their country to be represented in the game world (The Japanese who played FFXV said that the capital was way freaky since it resembled real life so much, but us outside of Japan wanted to see more). They would rather see other worlds/countries because when they see their country, it reminds them of their real life responsibilities (very very competitive from birth) that are too much to bear (look at the suicide rates).

TLDR; It's a cultural thing. You only notice the kind smiley Japanese face, but not see the ugly depressed sad one.

PS Asians love white people. (I'm Asian, I know this unhealthy obsession first hand, urgh... all those damn whitening products and cosmetic surgeries....)

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