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Offline KaZudra

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Games that deserve a 2nd take
« on: December 19, 2016, 12:25:23 PM »
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The Concept isn't a remake in a sense, but a redesign of a flawed game, adding changes and polish to refine the rough edges or even outright change the core gameplay to suit a better experience.

Rules:
Most assets must remain the same.
Story elements can be changed, voice actors can recast or reprise.
Cut-scenes can be redone in both FMV or in-engine.
All technical aspects are open for change.
Games can be redesigned with another platform in mind.

And GO!

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Offline Dracula9

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #1 on: December 19, 2016, 01:50:10 PM »
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Atari E.T.


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Offline Ratty

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #2 on: December 19, 2016, 02:34:18 PM »
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This for Castlevania games only or all games in general? If the latter we'll wanna move the thread to a different sub-forum. Feels kinda like a "classic discussions" thread anyway.

But for the question itself assuming this is for Castlevania games only, I'd have to go with the classic response of Castlevania Legends. I'd say Castlevania Adventure to but of course that's already been remade.

And of course I would absolutely love to see the N64 games released in a compilation for the PC. Along with all the other games in the series to varying degrees.

Offline BMC_War Machine

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BMC_War Machine
« Reply #3 on: December 19, 2016, 02:52:53 PM »
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Lords of Shadow 2






















Lol

But enough talk, HAVE AT YOU!!!!!!!!

Offline aensland

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #4 on: December 19, 2016, 06:34:16 PM »
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Harmony of Dissonance.

Came too early.

Offline zangetsu468

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #5 on: December 19, 2016, 06:43:58 PM »
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Castlevania 64/ LOD.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<[Judgement]>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

                              
                **<<<<<SuperCVIV>COTM<<<<<<<<+
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v                 ^
                                 ^      l   v  ^    +<<<<<<<BE
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v                 ^  
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v     BE>>> VK<**   
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v     ^          ^   
            +<<<<<Legends>HC>OOS>LOD>64        ^
            v                           l              ^                ^
            v                           l     BE>> * <<<BE     RE
            v                           l      ^               ^       ^
LOI>CVIII>COD>AR>BR>CVC>CVII>HOD>ROB>SOTN>OOE>BL>POR>AOS>DOS
                                                                          v
                                                                          BE>*
BE=Bad Ending
RE=Richter Ending

Offline theplottwist

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2016, 07:24:50 PM »
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Order of Shadows.

I know for a fact that the developers could and would do much better if they had the chance.
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Offline SecretWeapon

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2016, 09:37:15 PM »
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LoS 2 is a given. To begin explain properly the Castle/Kid Trevor/Marie thing right. Second give Drac and Alucard rest

MoF should have been the story of the Founders.

PoR problems are mostly gp wise. Both it and Judgement could have used a different artstyle too

Artstyle its truly what made judgement stillborn because its a decent game on its own. Better cutscenes would have been good too (as in, more than just standing moving their mouths)

Offline Aceearly1993

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #8 on: December 19, 2016, 11:24:48 PM »
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Castlevania Dracula X SNES (Dracula XX/Vampire's Kiss). They could've done it way better if not for a stripped-down-replacement thing of Rondo of Blood. Refined control engine, balanced stage/boss setting, multiple game rounds with increased difficulty on the second round and afterwards, a more cinematic ending with another continuation to the main timeline...Oh and Maria's playable appearance

Haunted Castle...Balance all things under classic CV rules
« Last Edit: December 20, 2016, 04:19:46 AM by Aceearly1993 »
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Offline zangetsu468

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #9 on: December 20, 2016, 07:28:47 AM »
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Castlevania Dracula X SNES (Dracula XX/Vampire's Kiss). They could've done it way better if not for a stripped-down-replacement thing of Rondo of Blood. Refined control engine, balanced stage/boss setting

Are you kidding? If we're talking about balance, Rondo is severely unbalanced compared to XX/ VK. I'm no anti-purist, but every stage in Rondo bar 5' 2 was cake compared to XX, and that was the only stage with no actual boss. At least XX built upon the difficulty stage by stage and included an alternate route with an increased difficulty in defeating Death. (arguably one of the tougher CV bosses around).
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<[Judgement]>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

                              
                **<<<<<SuperCVIV>COTM<<<<<<<<+
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v                 ^
                                 ^      l   v  ^    +<<<<<<<BE
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v                 ^  
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v     BE>>> VK<**   
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v     ^          ^   
            +<<<<<Legends>HC>OOS>LOD>64        ^
            v                           l              ^                ^
            v                           l     BE>> * <<<BE     RE
            v                           l      ^               ^       ^
LOI>CVIII>COD>AR>BR>CVC>CVII>HOD>ROB>SOTN>OOE>BL>POR>AOS>DOS
                                                                          v
                                                                          BE>*
BE=Bad Ending
RE=Richter Ending

Offline uzo

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2016, 01:35:28 PM »
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Not Lords of Shadow.

Offline Claimh Solais

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2016, 02:38:25 PM »
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Are you kidding? If we're talking about balance, Rondo is severely unbalanced compared to XX/ VK. I'm no anti-purist, but every stage in Rondo bar 5' 2 was cake compared to XX, and that was the only stage with no actual boss. At least XX built upon the difficulty stage by stage and included an alternate route with an increased difficulty in defeating Death. (arguably one of the tougher CV bosses around).

A game being easy doesn't make it imbalanced, though. There's a fair and consistent rise in difficulty as the game goes on. Simply being easier isn't imbalanced.

Dracula X on SNES is flat-out poorly designed, though. Game controls stiffly, hit detection is whack, lack of invincibility frames leads to repeated and unfair damage, the final boss fight is poorly designed and is the epitome of artificial difficulty, the whole key side-quest is an absolute chore, etc.

Dracula X's first stage starts off easy enough, but the difficulty immediately ramps up to 11 right afterward. That game is in total need of a balancing overhaul.
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Offline zangetsu468

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2016, 02:58:12 PM »
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A game being easy doesn't make it imbalanced, though. There's a fair and consistent rise in difficulty as the game goes on. Simply being easier isn't imbalanced.

Dracula X on SNES is flat-out poorly designed, though. Game controls stiffly, hit detection is whack, lack of invincibility frames leads to repeated and unfair damage, the final boss fight is poorly designed and is the epitome of artificial difficulty, the whole key side-quest is an absolute chore, etc.

Dracula X's first stage starts off easy enough, but the difficulty immediately ramps up to 11 right afterward. That game is in total need of a balancing overhaul.

But Rondo is just flat out easy, there's little to no challenge throughout the entirety of the game. Even finding the women is of little to no challenge, and Maria basically breaks the game. The key quest is the more difficult version of the game. You work your butt off and you're rewarded with a better boss fight and a better ending, simple. This is good design if anything, there's a harder difficulty which is designed into the game, for those who care little to nothing about the ending they can skip it, if you want the real ending, get the key, bet the white knight and save Maria.

Saying something is unfair, particularly in a 16 bit game is a matter of personal bias, unless you're playing The Wizard of Oz for Snes where you're literally falling through platforms which are supposed to be there - then complain. If anything XX's whip mechanic actually covers Richter's back at close range more so than Rondo's does. By your logic of 'fair' the first Legend of Zelda is not a fair game, how is anyone supposed to know to burn a bush on a specific screen with a candle? I played XX many times and never noticed an issue with hit detection. Link me to a video showing XX's unfair hit detection and I will view it.

I think gamers these days are far too precious, and it shows in your comments. #gitgud
« Last Edit: December 20, 2016, 03:07:35 PM by zangetsu468 »
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<[Judgement]>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

                              
                **<<<<<SuperCVIV>COTM<<<<<<<<+
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v                 ^
                                 ^      l   v  ^    +<<<<<<<BE
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v                 ^  
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v     BE>>> VK<**   
                                 ^      l   v  ^    v     ^          ^   
            +<<<<<Legends>HC>OOS>LOD>64        ^
            v                           l              ^                ^
            v                           l     BE>> * <<<BE     RE
            v                           l      ^               ^       ^
LOI>CVIII>COD>AR>BR>CVC>CVII>HOD>ROB>SOTN>OOE>BL>POR>AOS>DOS
                                                                          v
                                                                          BE>*
BE=Bad Ending
RE=Richter Ending

Offline Jazz Paladin Productions

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #13 on: December 20, 2016, 03:14:42 PM »
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Dracula X's first stage starts off easy enough, but the difficulty immediately ramps up to 11 right afterward. That game is in total need of a balancing overhaul.

I seem to remember thinking at first it was tough...it's been a while, but I seem to remember the second form being easy once you find the right strategy, I think it just revolves around using the axe and being on a specific pillar outside of dracs range of attack, but the axe can still hit.


However, I will echo the sentiment that the level design  was indeed horrible. I couldn't stand the way you'd leave an area and end up someplace looking entirely different and facing the opposite direction to boot! Totally felt like a lack of congruity , and yeah, the aforementioned issues with hit detection and invincible frames...eww...'nuff said.

Still, I do find that I like the visuals and aesthetics on the SNES are overall better than rondo. Too bad the gameplay had to suffer.

« Last Edit: December 20, 2016, 03:22:48 PM by Jazz Paladin Productions »
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Offline JR

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Re: Games that deserve a 2nd take
« Reply #14 on: December 21, 2016, 03:35:39 AM »
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At the risk of beating a dead horse...Simon's Quest. I loved the game, but it would be cool to see a version that addressed gripes that a lot of people had.

They could change some of the means of progression to be less obtuse (like kneeling at the right place with the right crystal), but still keep them as a decent challenge to solve.

They could definitely rework a lot of the messages the townspeople give you so that they make more sense (although I still like the idea of some of them being liars). Maybe give one or two of the houses some secret monster/cult-like lairs that could work as combat areas, just to add to the sinister feel of the game, and the creepiness of some of the people you interact with, with them being followers of Dracula or something. I dunno, I'm really just spitballing with this one.

Keep the dilapidated look of the mansions, but make the bosses engaging and worthwhile. Every mansion should have its own boss. Maybe scrap Carmilla's Mask entirely and just put a more interesting boss in its place.

Keep Dracula's castle ruins, but make the fight with Dracula more memorable. Revamp his appearance, but his wraith in black look was kind of cool, so still go off of that.
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