Topic: "Tropes vs Women in Video Games" Launches

[Ratty]

Well the much discussed, lauded and maligned feminist web series on video games by Anita Sarkeesian has arrived.

Damsel in Distress: Part 1 - Tropes vs Women in Video Games

I notice that she uses a clip from Legacy of Darkness as an example of the "helpless woman in distress", but fails to mention the female protagonist in that game.
The video is neither offensive or groundbreaking imo, but future episodes could prove to be interesting. Hopefully she will acknowledge the long (if not particularly deep) history of female protagonists in games. Alis Landale/Alisa Landeel from the first Phantasy Star game comes to mind, along with Samus of course.

[Lelygax]

Im waiting for Metroid, Valis, Alisia Dragon and a plenty more, like X-Men, Street Fighter 2, Xena, Resident Evil, etc. I want to see if she will "omit" things, like games or franchises. By what I've seen so far, she seems pretty honest and will not do that type of thing, but lets see.

[Kale]

I hate feminists. They are all retarded. Their solution to a Patriarchal Society is a Matriarchal Society.

They aren't about fairness, just flipping the side of the coin. And many feminists do just that, mention the parts where they are "abused" or "underrated" yet completely ignoring the parts where they aren't because of their agenda. So, fuck em!

[Ratty]

I hate feminists. They are all retarded. Their solution to a Patriarchal Society is a Matriarchal Society.

They aren't about fairness, just flipping the side of the coin. And many feminists do just that, mention the parts where they are "abused" or "underrated" yet completely ignoring the parts where they aren't because of their agenda. So, fuck em!

Well, that's a very broad statement and while it applies to some people who call themselves feminists it ignores the different movements and perspectives within feminism itself. While you can find some truly ignorant and bewilderingly bigoted people under the banner of feminism, not all feminists are men-hating, and many do want to approach gender equality rather than a matriarchy. I try not to prejudge people who call themselves feminists for this reason.

[C Belmont]

I notice that she uses a clip from Legacy of Darkness as an example of the "helpless woman in distress", but fails to mention the female protagonist in that game.

m waiting for Metroid, Valis, Alisia Dragon and a plenty more, like X-Men, Street Fighter 2, Xena, Resident Evil, etc. I want to see if she will "omit" things, like games or franchises

You know if she does bring up any more positive female characters in videogames they will probably be accompanied by a "but..."

[Mooning Freddy]

Happy May 8th women and girls of the Dungeon! 

That is an interesting analysis of the Damsel-in-distress story in many classic games.

As for Samus, oh hell I can really have a good feminist analysis right there. Oh yeah. A big, strong, costumed bounty hunter revealed to be a woman at the very end. That is something feminists would go crazy about. 

[Ratty]

You know if she does bring up any more positive female characters in videogames they will probably be accompanied by a "but..."

Well yeah that's part of competent critical analysis, you acknowledge the good and thoroughly examine the bad. Part of video games becoming more important to mainstream culture is that they're also more important artifacts for examination and discussion. Now just like movies and books, popular games say things about society at large, and those things aren't always pretty. Which leads us to ask where these unfortunate ideas or perceptions came from and why they're popular.

[Laina]

Speaking of femi-nazis & sensible ladies actually out for equality, has anyone ever heard of or seen the work of a certain woman going by girlwriteswhat on youtube?

I'm a sexy woman, so stop objectifying me!


Also Typhon Blue:

Hamster Bites # 1 : Bullshit I Don't Have To Believe To Support Human Rights

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

Quote from: Kale on Yesterday at 06:41:56 AM

I hate feminists. They are all retarded. Their solution to a Patriarchal Society is a Matriarchal Society.

They aren't about fairness, just flipping the side of the coin. And many feminists do just that, mention the parts where they are "abused" or "underrated" yet completely ignoring the parts where they aren't because of their agenda. So, fuck em!

We're not all that way.
In fact, there's a story that very channel is doing on just that: the Straw Feminist... you know, the ones that fall into extremism.
#6 The Straw Feminist (Tropes vs. Women)

[TheouAegis]

That damsels in video game distress video was stupid, ignorant crap until she got to the point about escaping. We really don't get to see the damsels try to escape. But then, she makes it sound like in every game the damsel would be able to escape on her own if the game was true to life. Funny, I don't recall many "missing woman" reports ending on a happy note. And those cases in which the abductee does escape is usually by way of waiting for the abductor to fall asleep, go out for groceries, or go to work. Not very epic.

And the first thing that came to my mind when she mentioned the damsel in distress trope is she's just jealous because she knows no guy would ever risk his life to try to save her from a fire-breathing turtle.

And the Dinosaur Planet issue just demonstrated what everyone already knows: Shigeru is a prick.


In the other vid, she mentions women "generally" don't lie about sexual assault. Subtle, but she just admitted that they do lie about it and there are court records showing women have admitted to faking rape just to get money or something as petty as attention.

And I still like that joke where Sarah Silverman is walking down the street and passes a guy. When he simply walks past her and doesn't try to rape her, she gets pissed off and even more insecure than she was when she saw the guy approaching, wondering what was wrong with her that would make him not want to rape her -- maybe he's gay.

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

Wow, someone is guilty of male prejudice.

Actually, though the original article talks about the core Mario games, in which Peach is indeed the damsel in distress, when one plays the side-story Mario games, one can clearly see Peach's point of view on a lot of things, and she actually manages to get a lot done.

In Paper Mario, she gets ahold of the only star able to grant small wishes, and slowly, aids Mario from afar.  She gets to evade her captors in order to get things done.
In Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door, she has a more prevalent role, though she was still kidnapped at first (that was an army after her).  She is able to outsmart her guards and get stuff done around the base where she's kidnapped (she sneaks around again).

I don't think it paints you in a good light, TheouAegis, to insult the woman in the video.  I also disagree, I don't think she's jealous of videogame characters.  This is why I think you're guilty of too much Male Privilege.

Not sure about Miyamoto being a prick, but I am sure that he's not as progressive as some people think, and is probably still clinging to some japanese old-world 'values' and as such, the trope becomes more apparent.

[Kale]

Well, that's a very broad statement and while it applies to some people who call themselves feminists it ignores the different movements and perspectives within feminism itself. While you can find some truly ignorant and bewilderingly bigoted people under the banner of feminism, not all feminists are men-hating, and many do want to approach gender equality rather than a matriarchy. I try not to prejudge people who call themselves feminists for this reason.

They're not all that way.
In fact, there's a story that very channel is doing on just that: the Straw Feminist... you know, the ones that fall into extremism.
#6 The Straw Feminist (Tropes vs. Women)

Eh..., obviously, I don't think that of all women, like that. But from what I've seen, pretty much all of the ones who claim to be feminists are like that.

And don't get me wrong, any idiot who claims the reverse, is just as bad. But it's more rare, since so many guys are .... painfully aware that women are viewed in a different light. Probably because we came from a purely patriarchal society, where men used to beat women, and nothing was thought of it.

Jokes aside, of course. I don't mind sexist jokes, against either side, if it's intended as one.

EDIT: And wow, did I miss a bunch of posts... seems like my browser loaded up a cached version.

EDIT2: @Laina. That's a better word for it. Femi-nazi! That's probably the word I should've used. And the first vid you post is one I don't mind. She seems like a sensible smart woman.

[X]

In Paper Mario, she gets ahold of the only star able to grant small wishes, and slowly, aids Mario from afar.  She gets to evade her captors in order to get things done.
In Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door, she has a more prevalent role, though she was still kidnapped at first (that was an army after her).  She is able to outsmart her guards and get stuff done around the base where she's kidnapped (she sneaks around again).

Jorge, you left out two other games that gave Princess peach the spotlight. Super Princess Peach for the DS and Super Mario Bros 2 US. And believe it or not guys humanity used to function on a Matriarchal way of life before the pendulum shifted the other way. There is also historical and archeological evidence supporting the facts that prior to the rise of the Patriarchal way of life, things like wars and strife almost never happened. But now they are commonplace, happening an almost daily basis. But I'd be much happier living in a world of equality and it's something everyone needs to work towards.

[TheouAegis]

Miyamoto never was progressive socially. He's too old-fashioned. I think he just has a twisted sense of humor sometimes.

Ok Jorge, ball's in your court. Post as many examples as you can find of women being abducted and escaping on their own. Let's be fair: post examples of men too. I don't mean in video games and movies or TV shows, I mean in real life. An abductee is usually damned lucky to even still be alive. Most of the time, a police officer or military squad saves the person. Yes, video games often make it seem so easy to escape, but no one would play the game if you had to sit there for 32 hours waiting for your abductor let his guard down. I've often played games that start with you trying to escape and have literally blurted out at the TV, "That would never happen in real life!" The damsel-in-distress in video games, except for a few cases, is always the ideal -- the guy shows up to defeat the villain and save the girl. Would girl in video no.1 rather have the game show the girl slap the guy, lock herself in her room shooting heroin, then slice her wrists open? That might pass in a N.A.R.C. sequel, but not in Mario.

And she showed Irene from Ninja Gaiden in that video! Irene's not a damsel in distress capable of saving herself! She only had a gun! Guns don't do shit to demons in Ninja Gaiden, you need a flippin' sword and fire jutsu.

The girl in the last video posted essentially argues that Hollywood created feminism. Feminists created it. Hollywood only shows what the writers see. I see those girls in the vids and they talk exactly like the Hollywood feminists. The Hollywood extreme feminist I never have approved of is the buzz-cut or butch feminist. That's a dyke, not a feminist.  If she said, "Hollywood makes all feminists out to be dykes," I'd agree with that.

And I didn't insult anyone, I criticized her looks. Girl 1 is ugly in a flannel shirt. Who the fuck even wears flannel these days? That's a lumberjack's outfit. Girl or guy, flannel is a fashion faux pas.


@X: You can't count Super Mario Bros. 2/Mario US. The girl in video 1 was spot on with that and I knew she'd bring it up. Peach was an after-thought. They had to fill in the 4th character slot and Peach was their only option. Excluding the 4th character would have been too much work. And technically that wasn't Peach, it was Mario dreaming about her.


If Rush Limbaugh coined Feminazi, I'd believe it. That guy's an idiot. I tried watching his show when he was on TV in my college days and I couldn't stand listening to him. Should change his name to Bullroarer Rush. A feminazi is a girl that thinks women are equal to men and should all work together for the benefit of the whole country by waging war against Jews. For Rush to even throw out the word "Nazi" discredits him completely.

[Mooning Freddy]

As I already said, the video really made me think. The damsel in distress plot in gaming was so overused it makes you think whether those plots actually make the wife / girlfriend appear like stolen property of the hero that he needs to recover, being the knight on white horse and all.

At least Symphony of the Night strays from the path with Maria coming to rescue Richter. Take that, feminists! 

Also, this.

Female Armor Sucks