Castlevania Dungeon Forums
The Castlevania Dungeon Forums => General Castlevania Discussion => Topic started by: CapComMDb on December 29, 2010, 03:40:07 AM
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Anyone else notice that Hector's head is very tiny relative to his body size?
This makes him a pinhead.
:P
Come to think of it, Ayami Kojima tends to draw the hands of her characters a little large, too...
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I've never really noticed, maybe the big hair just makes his head look small? I also noticed she tends to draw a lot of males with big long emo hair, and for some reason she likes to draw Maria in shorts instead of a dress. :P
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yes, and.. I never liked that piece anyway..
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Nah, GreySun, he actually has a proportionally minuscule head. Also, SoTN Maria does indeed wear a green skirt over a black skirt. No shorts there.
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His got some big hips.
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Really? I could have swore she was wearing a pair of black short shorts. There was even a cut in the center between her thighs.
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ftu-fui-ego-eris.webs.com%2Fphotos%2FMaria-Renard%2FMariaAdult.jpg&hash=abd883d4b5eabf3ce795e8395b51fc5b778362b0)
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I never really cared about this when it came to artwork. Unless you are drawing a real person or your intention is to portray someone realistically, I don't see a problem with tweaking the scale of certain parts. If you can draw hands really well, make them babies huge! Hands are one of the hardest things to draw! I don't know, I deal with professors that always comment on the size of hands, head, legs in my artwork and I always have to explain that I wasn't going for absolute realism like I would for say, my life oil painting class (painting the nude figure). People are so nitpicky about that! Sorry I don't want my prints to look like a photograph! If I wanted to do that I would have taken a photo!
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"Goomba Hector" has been brought up a couple of times. Also..
http://castlevania.neoseeker.com/w/i/castlevania/thumb/d/d4/Hector5.jpg/350px-Hector5.jpg (http://castlevania.neoseeker.com/w/i/castlevania/thumb/d/d4/Hector5.jpg/350px-Hector5.jpg)
Check out his right hand. Does that look natural?
http://castlevania.armster.org/dracxchron/artbook07.jpg (http://castlevania.armster.org/dracxchron/artbook07.jpg)
Look at that neck. Just look at it. It's like Homer strangled her for years.
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Really? I could have swore she was wearing a pair of black short shorts. There was even a cut in the center between her thighs.
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ftu-fui-ego-eris.webs.com%2Fphotos%2FMaria-Renard%2FMariaAdult.jpg&hash=abd883d4b5eabf3ce795e8395b51fc5b778362b0)
The black part is actually supposed to be a reeeally formfitting underskirt. The Akumajo Dracula Prize Collection figure of SotN Maria clarified this a while ago.
http://msz006yama.sakura.ne.jp/yama2/vamp2.htm (http://msz006yama.sakura.ne.jp/yama2/vamp2.htm)
All of the fanartists and cosplayers who thought she was wearing black biking shorts have been wrong this entire time.
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This is actually one of the most annoying covers in Castlevania history. Someone should've noticed that the proportions were completely off. It bothers me to this day (maybe I should get a life :D) Make his head TWICE the size and then we can talk..
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.animecharactersdatabase.com%3A81%2Fuploads%2F2359-561398306.jpg&hash=afe2a2d97eee961d8ac7cfafdd145321dcaa6911)
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(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.inverteddungeon.com%2Fjorgefuentes%2Fimages3%2FHector-fixed2.png&hash=959c2b3f65a71ca243c911083c1d28f56a419ad8)
Here, I fixed it. :)
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Also, it must be noted that she is self-taught. She had no formal training in art. I love that about her, the imperfections. Plus, it shows how much she's improved over the years.
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I agree, for someone who's self-taught she's an amazing artist. I think that's one of the things that makes her work so unique, because she doesn't copy off of other people like most artists do.
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I agree, for someone who's self-taught she's an amazing artist. I think that's one of the things that makes her work so unique, because she doesn't copy off of other people like most artists do.
It's true! I could write a huge essay comparing her to some folk artists in America and how her work is more valuable based on the self-taught aspect but I don't have the time! I'm not going to say she is completely UNinfluenced by other artists, we all are, and her work has a heavy European vibe coming from it but I dare you to show me someone that has work that is like hers. Not having formal training is a huge plus in her corner. It's dark, beautiful and romantic. I really want that artbook of her non-game related art.
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Yeah yeah she is talented for someone with no formal training.
But that is still a small head ???
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Thanks Jorge, that looks ten million times better already. I don't suppose you could give him a smaller hip while you're at it? ;D
Hehe, just kidding. This is not the Extreme Makeover show!
..or is it? dun dun DUN!
Anyway, I LOVE Ayami Kojima. Her work is awesome. It's just those proportions... but yeah, little imperfections here and there doesn't bother me. A blatant pinhead does, however :(
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IIRC, during production she drew the original with an even smaller head and was asked to go back and fix it by her production team. The final version still isn't quite right, but it's markedly improved over the first draft. This is a common problem, and doesn't really have anything to do with "formal training". Although her work is quite small in comparison, this happens often in larger works where the artist doesn't take adequate time to step away to make sure the proportions are all correct in correlation to each other. "Formal training" is a bunch of nonsense. All you need to do to become a better artist is draw from life, and do a hell of a lot of it. Looking at Kojima's work, it's obvious she's done a lot of drawing.
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right on Sonic.. hey, nice to see you again here.. what did you think of LoS? I guess post your thoughts in the proper topic, if you feel up to it.
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Thanks Jorge, that looks ten million times better already. I don't suppose you could give him a smaller hip while you're at it? ;D
I'm not a miracle worker! :P :P :P :P :P
He's also got a long-ass torso. I guess it's to show of that sash/sarong thing he's wearing, but still... too tall of a trunk! :P
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Yeah, Hector's body is way out of proportion compaired to the rest of his body. I'm also a self-taught artist, but even then my fist pic was nowhere nearly that out-of-proportion. I only had trouble with hands...too small.
-X
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Well Hector looks like he was pretty difficult to draw, I mean he has a lot more detail on him then most of the male characters in Castlevania. Or maybe Miss Kojima was having a bad week when she was doing the art for the game and messed him up without really paying attention. The world may never know for sure.
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Or maybe it was Kojima's way of saying: "You think there's a problem with Hectors proportions? LOL! Wait 'til you actually play the game. My art is flawless in comparison"
:D
Well, it's not that bad really. It's just a bit boring.
Music's fab though.
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This is a very common problem in Kojima's art. She tends to have this pyramid theme going on where the head is very small but the bottom part is wide
I never noticed it in the Hector pic but I have in her trevor pic
from some random person's photobucket album:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi294.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fmm83%2FPunisher013%2FCastlevania%2F350px-TrevorBelmont.jpg&hash=3e8910202da6204092fadcb3279551d084d6284e)
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Oh man! Trevor's lower legs are way, way, waaaaay out of proper form! :o Way too dainty for a man who swings around a chain-link whip, hoping from gear to gear and climbing who-knows who many stairs in one lifetime.
-X
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Kojima is the japanese Rob Liefeld
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IIRC, during production she drew the original with an even smaller head and was asked to go back and fix it by her production team. The final version still isn't quite right, but it's markedly improved over the first draft. This is a common problem, and doesn't really have anything to do with "formal training". Although her work is quite small in comparison, this happens often in larger works where the artist doesn't take adequate time to step away to make sure the proportions are all correct in correlation to each other. "Formal training" is a bunch of nonsense. All you need to do to become a better artist is draw from life, and do a hell of a lot of it. Looking at Kojima's work, it's obvious she's done a lot of drawing.
Rob Liefeld is also self taught and has proportion problems as well
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(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi294.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fmm83%2FPunisher013%2FCastlevania%2F350px-TrevorBelmont.jpg&hash=3e8910202da6204092fadcb3279551d084d6284e)
That's actually quite insane. Never thought about it.
His thighs are SUPER FAT, and then further down the legs are superskinny. And looong. Creeps me out, this.
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good thing she started taking drawing classes
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I see this sort of thing alot in japanese art. Always thought it was done on purpose.
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That's actually quite insane. Never thought about it.
His thighs are SUPER FAT, and then further down the legs are superskinny. And looong. Creeps me out, this.
That art bothered me for years. I am also bothered by a lot of her Dawn of Sorrow
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/Images/Scans/Aria/art-yoko.jpg)
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/Images/Scans/Aria/art-genya.jpg)
From Drac X chronicles:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/Images/Scans/DXC/chara_main04.jpg)
I doubt it is just a perceptive problem.
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I realized that not every art she draws has this this problem since some are actually quite good like the majority of the Dracula X chronicles art, as well as SOTN. Maybe she was on a tight schedule when doing Aria and Curse of Darkness or can't do protraits as well as full figure bodies.
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I see this sort of thing alot in japanese art. Always thought it was done on purpose.
It depends. It can be a style where you can see the consistency. However, Kojima draws her characters semi-realistically with proportions not consistent. all the time.
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At the risk of possibly starting a flame war, I really don't understand all the sudden bashing of Kojima's art. Sure she doesn't always draw heads or legs 100% accurate, but for the most part those little things are hardly noticable. She still does amazing work for the series and not many game artists draw with the amount of detail and colors she does.
If you all are going to be nitpicky about her art you might as well be nitpicky about the even crappier art of the older games. My 12 year old sister could probably draw a better Dracula in the original Rondo of Blood.
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At the risk of possibly starting a flame war, I really don't understand all the sudden bashing of Kojima's art. Sure she doesn't always draw heads or legs 100% accurate, but for the most part those little things are hardly noticable. She still does amazing work for the series and not many game artists draw with the amount of detail and colors she does.
If you all are going to be nitpicky about her art you might as well be nitpicky about the even crappier art of the older games. My 12 year old sister could probably draw a better Dracula in the original Rondo of Blood.
We are not really bashing her, but just stating the obvious. The small heads and elongated torsos are noticeable since a few of us are bothered by it. The Dracula art in the original Rondo game isn't bad either, just done in an anime style. If you have no problems with her art style, then it is all good. I like her art too, but I am bothered how a few of her art looks weird. Each their own.
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But the anime style in the original Rondo of Blood wasn't all that great. There's plenty of anime with better artstyle, but I guess you could argue that since it was just an old 2D video game the anime style didn't have to be good quality.
Anyways I respect that people are simply pointing out problems in her art, but to me it just felt like people weren't giving her enough credit for the other really awesome works she has done. Maybe my inner-fanboy just snapped for a minute. I didn't mean to get all hot and aggressive. :P
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Anyways I respect that people are simply pointing out problems in her art, but to me it just felt like people weren't giving her enough credit for the other really awesome works she has done. Maybe my inner-fanboy just snapped for a minute. I didn't mean to get all hot and aggressive. :P
Don't worry, I love Ayami Kojima. But looking at some of her art I'm just wondering "WHY?". She's so talented and yet she gives Hector a tiny head and hips that could very well be wider than his shoulders (if you take away the armour thingie).
And oh, that picture of Yoko.... not only are her breasts very large- they're literally where her stomach should be. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with low hanging breasts though. I doubt that's what Kojima was aiming for though.
But yes, when Ayami Kojima is at her best (Symphony of the Night, Harmony of Dissonance) she's brilliant. Even at her "worst" she's still in my top 3 of favourite artist for any video game series. But I like to nitpick :)
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Maybe Yoko doesn't wear a bra? I'm not an expert on boobs since I'm not a woman, but I think when women don't wear bras their boobs tend to kind of hang low. Some guys find the idea of a braless woman a turn-on, so maybe that's what Kojima was going for?
Ah who am I kidding, it was probably just another mistake. :-\
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From Drac X chronicles:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/Images/Scans/DXC/chara_main04.jpg)
Japanese yōkai Rokurokubi
LOL
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rokurokubi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rokurokubi)
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LOL @ Koutei.
That neck could be quite frightening. :o
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i like how her neck gets fixed when she turns into a vampire
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LOL @ Koutei.
That neck could be quite frightening. :o
I think the Yoko and Maria art needs the Jorge Fuentes' touch if you know what I mean.
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(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.inverteddungeon.com%2Fjorgefuentes%2Fimages3%2Flolanettefixed1.png&hash=ac3d7a40fb1227adfa3da2a09de2016ca5faba61)
I did this in like five minutes. Sloppily. :P
Seriously, no one in Japan has an editing department? They're professionals, c'mon.
Then again, maybe that's just 'her CV style' or something... I don't buy it though.
I couldn't do the background head as well as the foreground head, so I guess you can see the difference.
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Actually Jorge, having her forground pic fixed and leaving the background pic as is, shows us just what you're taking about in terms of fitting the proper ratio for neck length.
-X
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At the risk of possibly starting a flame war, I really don't understand all the sudden bashing of Kojima's art. Sure she doesn't always draw heads or legs 100% accurate, but for the most part those little things are hardly noticable. She still does amazing work for the series and not many game artists draw with the amount of detail and colors she does.
If you all are going to be nitpicky about her art you might as well be nitpicky about the even crappier art of the older games. My 12 year old sister could probably draw a better Dracula in the original Rondo of Blood.
GtFO my Cv Dungeon. O_o
Nah I kid. I dig Kojima's style but I think if she were drawing non-human characters, the proportions wouldn't be such a big deal. Humans tend to notice oddities in portrayals of human characters.
On the topic of Rondo's anime, that game came out before anime had really developed as far as I know. I don't know that they had as many styles to choose from.
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(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.inverteddungeon.com%2Fjorgefuentes%2Fimages3%2Flolanettefixed1.png&hash=ac3d7a40fb1227adfa3da2a09de2016ca5faba61)
I did this in like five minutes. Sloppily. :P
Seriously, no one in Japan has an editing department? They're professionals, c'mon.
Then again, maybe that's just 'her CV style' or something... I don't buy it though.
I couldn't do the background head as well as the foreground head, so I guess you can see the difference.
That looks so much better
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I may have made the head too large, but I didn't felt like messin' with the body since that the boobs are way out of scale as well.
I inititally had the head not as huge but it didn't look right
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi4.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy149%2Fle94501%2Fart-yoko4.jpg&hash=45fb8b44cfc57c2aef95fcd202d3853fc945f3fc)
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Actually you got her dead-on there le052383! The pic works well. ;)
-X
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(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fthumb-culture.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2010%2F10%2Flords-of-shadow-screenshot-big.jpg&hash=3213507b1a12f49b2ef1084d4712ad33b132baa8)
can anyone make his nose bigger?
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Yeah, I wasn't trying to Kojima-bash. I've just noticed a lot of things like that and wondered why someone who can draw that well can't get proportions right. You'd think she'd have noticed. I mean, a head should be half as wide as the torso...
Also, it must be noted that she is self-taught. She had no formal training in art.
Well, that could be it... But I'd think if she was that good she'd get a little bit of training or at least read something on it.
You want to chock it up to style?
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Ones I always noticed were Hammer's mutant hand, Maxim's total lack of a neck, Lisa's breasts being bigger than her head and, well, this.
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv453%2FGMCMA%2FOther%2520stuff%2FCod_offart47.jpg&hash=4eeb0230c6df32219770b652bc4f18d6c5591ead)
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv453%2FGMCMA%2FOther%2520stuff%2FHeads.jpg&hash=2fbd03e368028554e8a5a079eabbdac5fe7fbcc7)
She might be self-taught, but she could really use some classes in anatomy and proportion.
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Wow, and I thought Bayonetta had the proportions off with the legs, but Trevor here truly takes the Taco. Three of his heads fit in his thigh, and his lower legs can stack five heads in a row. Jeez.
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Wow, and I thought Bayonetta had the proportions off with the legs, but Trevor here truly takes the Taco. Three of his heads fit in his thigh, and his lower legs can stack five heads in a row. Jeez.
also Bayonetta ridiculous proportions are the result of Kamiya wanting to make the game all fashion
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trevor's legs are obviously meant as sex appeal
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Yeah, I wasn't trying to Kojima-bash. I've just noticed a lot of things like that and wondered why someone who can draw that well can't get proportions right. You'd think she'd have noticed. I mean, a head should be half as wide as the torso...
Well, that could be it... But I'd think if she was that good she'd get a little bit of training or at least read something on it.
You want to chock it up to style?
Yes! That's what I should have said from the beginning. It's her style, and it funny that people here find it bothersome. No one would look at a Klimt painting (who I think she is somewhat inspired by) and pick it apart like this. Or a Picasso for that matter. She's one of the best artists working in games today! I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion when it comes to art, but she isn't here to defend her design choices. For all we know, everything is EXACTLY the way she wanted it.
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i dont know. even if it is intentional, the proportion flaws still look out of place and are subject to criticism. i mean, intentional flaws are only justifiable if they fit or give interest to the piece, but here they just seem like mistakes a lot of the time. plus, i guess they would just be badly implemented intentional flaws then. uguu.
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Lisa's breasts being bigger than her head and
It happens. My ex's breasts were bigger than her head.
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Yes! That's what I should have said from the beginning. It's her style, and it funny that people here find it bothersome. No one would look at a Klimt painting (who I think she is somewhat inspired by) and pick it apart like this. Or a Picasso for that matter. She's one of the best artists working in games today! I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion when it comes to art, but she isn't here to defend her design choices. For all we know, everything is EXACTLY the way she wanted it.
As said before, I don't think it is her style since if it were, all her characters would have that type of proportion in a consistent matter. A good example is Anette. She has a long neck in human mode, but a normal one in vampire mode. In some of the Hector artwork, his head is proportional whereas in others it is very small.
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages4.wikia.nocookie.net%2F__cb20090412204639%2Fcastlevania%2Fimages%2F3%2F30%2FCoD_OST_Hector.JPG&hash=2a45273a952f9214823f5bf754f231c7f0ffc284)
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages1.wikia.nocookie.net%2F__cb20090308074617%2Fcastlevania%2Fimages%2F7%2F7a%2FPrelude_to_Revenge_Hector.JPG&hash=118f29a1ff20ead008352845aecf392c4e6f8f79)
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages1.wikia.nocookie.net%2F__cb20080227232440%2Fcastlevania%2Fimages%2Ff%2Fff%2FHector2.jpg&hash=08e20ff6c919b145c817206ad7597d9cfaf4c32f)
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Here is another one of Trevor. His head is still small, but he doesn't have the thunder thighs or the bigass shoulders like the other image:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages2.wikia.nocookie.net%2F__cb20090412204738%2Fcastlevania%2Fimages%2F6%2F67%2FCoD_OST_Trevor.JPG&hash=c5b5db922cec5dde9affd5a4fbf81993d0f0f4ca)
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages3.wikia.nocookie.net%2F__cb20091220022554%2Fcastlevania%2Fimages%2F9%2F9a%2FIsaac_and_Trevor.jpg&hash=5dd38278f4851888b4ee3cb1d6760a26cd3d6c83)
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.wikia.com%2Fcastlevania%2Fimages%2F2%2F2a%2FTrevor45342.PNG&hash=5c4d7465a594aa73e6f4cd36238d7596e046041f)
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Yes! That's what I should have said from the beginning. It's her style, and it funny that people here find it bothersome. No one would look at a Klimt painting (who I think she is somewhat inspired by) and pick it apart like this. Or a Picasso for that matter. She's one of the best artists working in games today! I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion when it comes to art, but she isn't here to defend her design choices. For all we know, everything is EXACTLY the way she wanted it.
The same was said about Rob Liefeld during his heyday
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.petercashwell.com%2Fjournal%2FLiefeld%2520Cap.jpg&hash=42c1d5d66e4f9b71263a979b6b4065743a763fac)
This artist is similar to Komija whereas he also didn't have any formal training and was popular at one point in his career.
Like Komija, he has problems with proportions and parts of the body like hands and feet. I am certain that he has read a lot of artbooks, but I don't think he practiced drawing life models .
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I have problems with that pic (C.America), but at least from what I know of that artist, he was consistent with that kind of work and you could write it off as 'style' (it's still wrong but at least it's 'stylized' to a degree, and most of the characters are consistent)
Kojima's (LOL you said Komija, teehee... **ahem** sorry) proportions vary by the day, it seems. Sometimes stuff is 'ok', other times it comes off as wildly out of proportion, by a large margin, even when it's the same character, only at a different shot/angle. I love the way she draws faces, but when having to do a full-body shot for illustrations, seems she doesn't believe in touching up her works in post-production. It's like **scribble** **scribble** **shade** **shade** **color** **color** "OK it's done" and nobody tells her "That's nice but the proportions are done. Please do it again or hand it to our post-production team, who will inflate the head, shrink the body vertically, and align everything correction, then return it to you to finish up".
Picasso was doing stuff just for the sake of art... she's not. She's doing a character illustration, like a commercial artist would, only it's a person (as opposed to a can of soup or a box of cereal). Style is up to Konami, so either they don't care that it's offfffffffff, or they cannot afford/don't have the gall to tell her to fix it.
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trevor's legs are obviously meant as sex appeal
I'm trying to picture who finds those sexy.
..I'm going to stop picturing it immediately.
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I have problems with that pic (C.America), but at least from what I know of that artist, he was consistent with that kind of work and you could write it off as 'style' (it's still wrong but at least it's 'stylized' to a degree, and most of the characters are consistent)
Kojima's (LOL you said Komija, teehee... **ahem** sorry) proportions vary by the day, it seems. Sometimes stuff is 'ok', other times it comes off as wildly out of proportion, by a large margin, even when it's the same character, only at a different shot/angle. I love the way she draws faces, but when having to do a full-body shot for illustrations, seems she doesn't believe in touching up her works in post-production. It's like **scribble** **scribble** **shade** **shade** **color** **color** "OK it's done" and nobody tells her "That's nice but the proportions are done. Please do it again or hand it to our post-production team, who will inflate the head, shrink the body vertically, and align everything correction, then return it to you to finish up".
Picasso was doing stuff just for the sake of art... she's not. She's doing a character illustration, like a commercial artist would, only it's a person (as opposed to a can of soup or a box of cereal). Style is up to Konami, so either they don't care that it's offfffffffff, or they cannot afford/don't have the gall to tell her to fix it.
It is strange that no one in production has correct Kojima's art since it is blatant. I am sure the 3d graphic artist have noticed the inconsistency in her art as well.
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I'm trying to picture who finds those sexy.
..I'm going to stop picturing it immediately.
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwhooties.homestead.com%2Ffiles%2Fmario.jpg&hash=c91366db27084a2db802f022af02e8addb6498f6)
I wanna know what this "game" is like.
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It is strange that no one in production has correct Kojima's art since it is blatant. I am sure the 3d graphic artist have noticed the inconsistency in her art as well.
Maybe it has something to do with Japanese work culture.
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Yes! That's what I should have said from the beginning. It's her style, and it funny that people here find it bothersome.
True, it is her style and she's entitled to it. No questions there. However since she's scetching our favoret CV heros, we have certain expectations of 'proper proportions' for the characters in question. If it is her own creations; characters, etc. then I will not judge, but she's done images of trevor, simon, etc. and they just look 'off'. I personally don't think it's good for CV characters to be shown in that light.
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Yes! That's what I should have said from the beginning. It's her style, and it funny that people here find it bothersome. No one would look at a Klimt painting (who I think she is somewhat inspired by) and pick it apart like this. Or a Picasso for that matter.
"It's my style" is commonly an excuse you see thrown around on Deviantart to excuse abject laziness. If you've studied and chosen the ways in which you intend to deviate from reality, you have a style. Otherwise, you just have "the errors you usually make because you don't know any better." Picasso, by the way, was into crazy realism before he ever started doing abstracts.
Kojima's good at scenes and costumes, but she doesn't have much grasp of the basics of how a figure goes together; the result is that her figures often look wrong rather than stylised. For example, I don't think she intended for Hammer to have a giant first finger, a withered thumb and a stump where his other hand should be:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv453%2FGMCMA%2FOther%2520stuff%2Fart-48.jpg&hash=ecc5256c09d002639f5e3a9eb2315f812c889990)
I don't think she intended for Maxim's neck to not exist on the left and be thicker than his skull on the right:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv453%2FGMCMA%2FOther%2520stuff%2Fmac.gif&hash=eba0df87c52569c011d83a36c3d83e1f166d8968)
I think the issue is she draws the clothing seperately to the rest of the figure, actually. Look at Graham here, for example:
(https://castlevaniadungeon.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv453%2FGMCMA%2FOther%2520stuff%2FKojima%2Fart-47.jpg&hash=98d08266582067482b2d3b6677d0c81425e6c6f8)
He looks like his head is behind his clothes, like he's standing behind a cardboard cutout of them. Maxim up there has the same thing going on on the left.
I have problems with that pic (C.America), but at least from what I know of that artist, he was consistent with that kind of work and you could write it off as 'style' (it's still wrong but at least it's 'stylized' to a degree, and most of the characters are consistent)
Welllll...More often not, really. And Liefeld's got the extra strike of being lazy, especially when he's coming up with ridiculous excuses to not draw feet.
http://progressiveboink.com/archive/robliefeld.html (http://progressiveboink.com/archive/robliefeld.html)
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Ok, fine, she's horribly lazy and should be never allowed to work again. What is with this board? One month we praise something about Castlevania and the next we all pick it apart till there is nothing left. I almost feel like this is some attempt to turn me into another fanatic that everyone disagrees with, like affinity and his/her love of Harmony of Despair. I'm done, I should have just stated I was ok with the proportions being off and been done with it. Yeesh.
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Don't be so melodramatic. I don't think she's so much lazy as that she doesn't know any better; the way she draws certainly doesn't imply that she's thrashing these out in seconds (unlike Liefeld, where he's got someone else to ink and colour for him and he just pencils any old shit), she's obviously got a lot of technical skill and imagination. She needs to improve in places (specifically, study human anatomy and proportion more closely than she has), not just stop because she's useless.
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Obviously tone doesn't come through over the internet, I was being sarcastic. I guess I need to make sure I put "/sarcasm" at the end of certain posts. The only thing I was partially serious about is the "praise turning into criticism" (or vice-versa) aspect of message boards in general. Just give it time, and soon Castlevania Judgement will become a "misunderstood classic".
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Hey, nothing wrong with constructive criticism of an artist, especially since, y'know she's never going to read any of this anyway.
She does a lot of really cool stuff, but by now we generally see where she needs improvement (and we're not even experts on art stuff).
And make no mistake: it's constructive. No one here has flamed her work (what would be the point? She's not here to take such flamebait anyway). No one's like "Her work is shit and thus, she's shit, and should never draw again". No one's saying that. In fact, most of us like her work, at least the parts she excels at (she's a fantastic costume designer and her faces are generally very well done... especially effeminate males... yeah), but it doesn't take a master of fine arts to look at those pics of Scissor-Legs Trevor to go "Ooof, someone needs to take a Body Proportions course, or draw a nude model".
Chill out, pal.
PS- I don't think you were sarcastic. But I look into finding a "Sarcasm Mode" tag just for instances such as this. BTW, Sarcasm is more difficult in text than in verbal form.
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I'm trying to picture who finds those sexy.
..I'm going to stop picturing it immediately.
I find Trevor's child rearing hips hawt...
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LOL
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Incidentally, this (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v453/GMCMA/Other%20stuff/liefeld-anatomy-captain-america.jpg) (warning: not for the faint of heart) is what happens when you redraw that Liefeld Captain America without the outfit and shield. It does outline exactly what's wrong with it, and it's not the only time he's done something like that.
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Incidentally, this (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v453/GMCMA/Other%20stuff/liefeld-anatomy-captain-america.jpg) (warning: not for the faint of heart) is what happens when you redraw that Liefeld Captain America without the outfit and shield. It does outline exactly what's wrong with it, and it's not the only time he's done something like that.
True. I wouldn't call Captain America's chest as an art style because it is drawn in the wrong perceptive.
I don't get why Kojima's SOTN is so top notch without any errors. Did Kojima drew the figures smaller, hence less error or did someone at Konami critique her art? SOTN is the first time she did professional art for a VG if I am not mistaken.
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Ok, fine, she's horribly lazy and should be never allowed to work again. What is with this board? One month we praise something about Castlevania and the next we all pick it apart till there is nothing left. I almost feel like this is some attempt to turn me into another fanatic that everyone disagrees with, like affinity and his/her love of Harmony of Despair. I'm done, I should have just stated I was ok with the proportions being off and been done with it. Yeesh.
Way to blow things out of proportions.
Heh, pun not intented.
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I don't know if you can call style getting the proportions wrong, especially when she's using an illustrative technique. We sort of expect the characters to be in proportion when they are drawn like that. Usually when characters are not in proportion, it's a specific type of drawing (i.e. SD manga) rather than something that looks realistic or illustrative. What it seems to me is the quality here is 'good enough' for Konami in that most people won't look at it in detail.
I think you might have to read an interview or ask her why she draws like that and why she hasn't studied proportion. I would also like to see how she came to work for Konami (especially since those stories are interesting in an of themselves :)) I think if it's style, then drawing in this manner just 'feels right' even if it doesn't 'look right'. I don't think Konami is going to tell her to go get some formal art training (though I'm sure a single class on figure drawing would do wonders) because she already has a job and she's getting paid to do it. But I do think it's important to know why she hasn't studied proportions.
And yes, I'm going to try and find a way to get that Kojima art book from Japan... It's too awesome not to!
@Santa Count: Awwww ;D BTW, nice sig.