Topic: Games are dieing as i knew them, CV games, as well as others.

[Mikepjr]

Okay, this is a rant... i want my voice heard by others.. i want people to know how i feel, and i don't want people jumping my case, if you agree, great, if you don't? Leave the insults at the door if you don't agree.

This rant has to do with the crap i keep dealing with, when it comes to morons on youtube and in general anywhere, who never touched a CV game before LoS, and how they think LoS is epic, yet for me it's not epic cause it threw everything i loved about CV games out the window, little things actually.

Okay so.. i am sick of how the word "epic" is thrown around now days, it's so damn subjective, and if you tell someone it's not "epic" to you, they argue you to death cause they think they're stating fact, and the FACT of the matter is, what might be epic to these wannabe CV fans is not epic to me, and i been playing the CV games for years, since the NES, i seen it evolve all the way up to the SOTN games, and then de-evolve into what LoS is.. yes.. that's right, to be LoS is not an evolution of the series... it's something else... and for good reason.

LoS is just that.. LoS.. the only thing making it a CV game is the title, because as we all know.. CV games place you as a belmont fighting DRACULA! Not Satan!

I think the biggest thing though that bothers me is the fact that they took little things that make a CV game a CV game, and threw it all out!

Let's start with Music.... what the hell happen there?!
LoS does not have epic music, i keep arguing with people, it's not epic to me... .
All the actual CV games before LoS were actual CV games, they had this music that mixed things up, it took symphony and more and just... made it all awesome!

That is the BIGGEST argument i have though with people.... to me the music was horrid!
It was like .. a hollywood movie!
I don't want to play a hollywood movie!
I want to play a GAME! Not a MOVIE!
I don't think i would complain if a CV movie DID come out and had music like that, cause that would be a MOVIE... but i don't like that kind of thing in a GAME!

Let's look at other games from other companies... Nintendo for instance, you STILL go through Zelda games almost always hearing some sort of awesome constant music!
It rarely brakes up and goes silent! And the music never sounds hollywood!
Same with mario games, and ever with the music and how it sounded in Super Mario Gallaxy, you still knew it was mario's music, you could just tell.. and it still sounded good! It still had it's identity and was enjoyable.

CV games though, not so much...LoS's music for me.. lost it's identity!
Sure their were a few little.... subtle hollywood version of old CV tunes.... but... ugh...

I am almost done with japanese companies, cause they lost their way!
Capcom... What happane to Megaman? Ta hell?! Since i no longer get my fix of megaman games, i'm done buying anything else that comes from Capcom!

I'm just about done with all those companies.... just... i'm sick of it!
I'm going to end up playing old games.. over and over.. and never spend another dime on newer games.. and i don't think these companies would like that too much.

I'm fairly sure i'm not the only CV fan who feels this way... sure they brought in other fans to the series, but people like me got alienated!
LoS is not a CV game for a long time fan... not for a fan like me, it's a CV game for everyone else the company could not reach!
It needed to be a game for all of us! And for me it was not.

And Megaman and CV games are not the only thing pushing me away, i used to LOVE Final Fantasy games, it's gone that way as well! What the HELL happen to that series? The last good FF game is one i will never get to play cause it's on iPad and iPhone! I am ofcourse talking about Final Fantasy Dimensions!

Those are examples of things going wrong....

What happen to Japanese games? And why are no nothing westerners being put in charge?

I know most of you won't read this.. in fact... i am likely to hear crap about how this is too long... wahh lol.

But COME ON!
I can't be the only one noticing this all happening, can i?
I love newer graphics.. i love what computers and technology brings us.. but that does not mean we should let go of what was great!

there is a rap song of all things on Youtube that say EXACTLY how i feel... a rap song of all things, says how i feel!
Epic Video Game Rap - Real Hardcore OGs (Original Gamers)!

lol...

What happen?

I'm a Real OG it seems >_<

oh and if this is the wrong section for this, it can be moved.

[Claimh Solais]

Quite a read. I actually separated your post into fragments to make my response easier to write.

This rant has to do with the crap i keep dealing with, when it comes to morons on youtube and in general anywhere, who never touched a CV game before LoS, and how they think LoS is epic, yet for me it's not epic cause it threw everything i loved about CV games out the window, little things actually.

Okay so.. i am sick of how the word "epic" is thrown around now days, it's so damn subjective, and if you tell someone it's not "epic" to you, they argue you to death cause they think they're stating fact, and the FACT of the matter is, what might be epic to these wannabe CV fans is not epic to me, and i been playing the CV games for years, since the NES, i seen it evolve all the way up to the SOTN games, and then de-evolve into what LoS is.. yes.. that's right, to be LoS is not an evolution of the series... it's something else... and for good reason.

Does it make me not a real CV fan if I've played all of them and put almost 100 hours into each (with the exception of Encore of the Night) and think that LoS is the best Castlevania?

LoS is just that.. LoS.. the only thing making it a CV game is the title, because as we all know.. CV games place you as a belmont fighting DRACULA! Not Satan!

Aria of Sorrow = Magical School Boy vs. the Embodiment of Chaos
Dawn of Sorrow = Magical School Boy vs. the Embodiment of all Dark Powers

Let's start with Music.... what the hell happen there?!
LoS does not have epic music, i keep arguing with people, it's not epic to me... .
All the actual CV games before LoS were actual CV games, they had this music that mixed things up, it took symphony and more and just... made it all awesome!

To each their own. I personally find LoS's soundtrack quite enjoyable.

I am almost done with japanese companies, cause they lost their way!
Capcom... What happane to Megaman? Ta hell?! Since i no longer get my fix of megaman games, i'm done buying anything else that comes from Capcom!

The loss of Megaman games is due to Inafune leaving Capcom. I heard something about them making more MM games, but I might be wrong.

I'm just about done with all those companies.... just... i'm sick of it!
I'm going to end up playing old games.. over and over.. and never spend another dime on newer games.. and i don't think these companies would like that too much.

I think one customer not buying their games isn't that big a deal to them.

Besides, not all new games are crap. PlayStation All-Stars Battle Royale is kickass, and Assassin's Creed III is pretty awesome.

LoS is not a CV game for a long time fan... not for a fan like me, it's a CV game for everyone else the company could not reach!
It needed to be a game for all of us! And for me it was not.

T'was the best CV for me, runner-up being Dracula X Chronicles. Again, though, to each their own.

And Megaman and CV games are not the only thing pushing me away, i used to LOVE Final Fantasy games, it's gone that way as well! What the HELL happen to that series? The last good FF game is one i will never get to play cause it's on iPad and iPhone! I am ofcourse talking about Final Fantasy Dimensions!

Not saying that you shouldn't get it, but Final Fantasy Dimensions was pretty lame. Yeah, it's classic FF again, but the game was shoddy beyond hell.





Anyway, my response put simply--and like I said twice--to each their own. I enjoyed the hell outta LoS, and I'm sure as hell looking forward to Mirror of Fate. This is coming from a longtime CV fan.

[Kingshango]

The answer is simple:

3DS
DS
PC

The three kings that will lead you to gaming bliss.

And maybe in a year, the Wii U will become the fourth if Nintendo shapes up.

As for LOS, what's more to say than what has already been said for four years. I for one am looking forward to LOS2 and Mirror of Fate.

[Mikepjr]

I realize the whole "to each their own statement" but.. i'm not the only one who felt alienated...
As for me not spending a dime.. i meant more than me.. anyone like me, and trust me their are a LOT.

Also, i realize that the GBA and DS CV games having to do with a reincarnated Dracula kinda fall into the same category.... but not really, i mean they connected with an established story continuity, he was not a good guy one day and then fought satin and became Dracula, he was Dracula reborn as this kid who would become Dracula again... but the Belmonts are always the Belmonts... end of story.

The idea of a Belmont fighting Satin and becoming Dracula bugs the hell out of me.
And i'm sorry but it's the little things that bugged me the most honestly.... The music is just not .. Castlevania to me... period.
The entire experience is ruined to me.. it just is..

I don't even want to buy LoS 2 or Mirror of fate because from what i hear, they're STILL going with that hollywood sounding music crap... or nothing at all....

So again, games are dieing as i knew and loved them... and i'm not alone...

[Ratty]

Change is inevitable, and with mainstreaming comes simplification. Games are becoming more akin to books and movies as something more people do less often. And in order to appeal to the lowest common denominator the AAA games are getting bigger, louder and dumber, and idiot proof when it comes to gameplay.

Sure there will always be the hardcore fans of any medium but they're in the minority. Most people who watch movies probably wouldn't consider themselves "movie buffs", but they, the casual Friday night film watcher, are the largest market and the ones big budget films are made for.
In the same way as games get more mainstream the traditional "gamer" hobbiest market becomes less and less significant to the big studios. So don't look to the big budget studios, American or Japanese, to produce good games any more than you look to hollywood to produce good movies.

You can't just all blame it on the "casuals" though. Part of it is the natural evolution/maturation of the medium. Just like movies started as silent short films that had to rely on pantomime and broad physical comedy or melodrama. The games we grew up with had to make do with very limited hardware and had to rely on (largely text-based) storytelling and gameplay to generate value. The games couldn't be very big data-wise back then so they were difficult both as a way to increase playtime and add a sense of accomplishment to completion. Let's not forget that development teams were much much smaller back in the day, so the games of yore were more likely to reflect a sense of personal vision which today's big budget titles simply do not.
Take a look at this great video about "Doom" for an example of what I'm talking about.
Errant Signal - DOOM

Ultimately I think that as games get more mainstream they become "games" in the traditional sense of something you try to win less and less, and more just another way to experience a story as an alternative to books/movies/music. Thank God that we have Indie games though! Look to the Indie developers for the real artistry and innovation in the medium.

[Successor The Cruel]

When I think of Castlevania I get a bittersweet feeling. It will always be a series filled with some of my favorite video games, but I can't help but feel melancholy about what has happened with it. To be fair, Lords of Shadow wasn't the beginning of its downward spiral to me. The beginning of that was probably Dawn of Sorrow, or possibly Lament of Innocence, though I have a heck of a lot more respect for Lament than I do Dawn. The series just began a string of consistently powerfully bad games, with a few bright spots to break up the chain (Dracula X Chronicles and Order of Ecclesia). Admittedly, yes, there were many unimpressive games, the series had gotten stale*, and changes needed to be made, but not to the point where they're so radical that many fans of the series could no longer relate well to it and thus felt alienated. I think that's just about the worst thing that can happen. One of the main things that drew many of us to the series was its powerful and unmistakable identity... its unique style and personality, that, while portrayed different from game to game, was never totally pushed aside and buried. The acidic lemon juice into the already gaping wound is that Castlevania's totally awesome personality was pushed aside in favor of something banal and uninspired (in my opinion, of course). As such, while I love Castlevania, I have no interest in the Mercury Steam games. I'm just waiting for this run to be over with and hoping that whatever comes next is something incredible, and worthy of being called Castlevania.

*Though I said the series was stale, I, by no means, think the Metroidvania format is/was stale. I think there are many fresh things that can be done with that gameplay set up that haven't been done in Castlevania, or any other game, for that matter. The execution of it was pretty stale, however, or just bad (lame ass level topography/too much emphases on SHEER SIZE with no substance or grinding ), and there wasn't enough progressive thinking being applied. It also didn't help that the graphics were so rehashed on the DS games, which further led to a "been here done that" type of feeling.

[Profbeanburrito]

You'repost was long so I just skimmed it, and I can understand your points

But for me, as a long time CV fan for 22 years, I really enjoyed everything about LoS, but the first time I played it I wasn't exactly happy with it as a CV game, but the more I played it the more I appreciated it. I love the music, the combat, the level design, but I think the best thing about it is it's story. While the other games have stories, they're not very well fleshed out and have minimal amounts of dialogue. And I like games with nice deep stories but also love action games, so in that regard I really learned to love it.

As for no classic elements, the way I look at it is that the classic games all involve Dracula as the main plot point, and so I believe that all the music, enemies etc, come from Dracula as the main point. Now that Dracula is in LoS, and cox confirmed classic enemies/ music I like to look at no enemies/ music in LoS as "pre-Dracula". If that makes sense.

I guess like it for what it is, not for what it isn't.

[K.G. Morder]

LoS is just that.. LoS.. the only thing making it a CV game is the title,

heeeere we go again...

[Ahasverus]

Seriously, I respect your opinion but.. perhaps modern gaming is just not for you.

[Kingshango]

Seriously, I respect your opinion but.. perhaps modern gaming is just not for you.

I hate to be that guy but this OP. Your better off abandoning mainstream games altogether, especially with the likelihood of next gen being the safest gen we'll ever see with dev costs increasing further. Therefore we'll be seeing way less risks and alot developers play it safe fearing studio closure.

Im tellin you OP, get a 3DS, get a PC hell even get a Vita and if Nintendo straightens up, get a Wii U. There are still great fun unique games coming out for them, check out more indie games like Hotel Miami (highly recommend ) and La Mulana. And the Wii U is gettin Platinum games love with The Wonderful 101 and Bayonetta 2 as well as some indie games on e shop.
 
Gaming is alive, just gotta look harder.

[DragonSlayr81]

I hate to be that guy but this OP. Your better off abandoning mainstream games altogether, especially with the likelihood of next gen being the safest gen we'll ever see with dev costs increasing further. Therefore we'll be seeing way less risks and alot developers play it safe fearing studio closure.

I think that's the sucky thing about progression, the better hardware and graphics, the more money it takes to fund development, meaning less risks. In my opinion, it's almost like false progression, as it doesn't really seem(to me, at least) like the outcome of the sacrifice to get to this point is worth it. It's like taking 5 steps forward and 10 back. It's not the glorious dream of what most people think it should be(taking everything good and expanding on it, while adding new things to freshen it up), but it's about sacrificing a lot of the good aspects for "new ideas" that could either good or bad depeneding on how they go with the gamers.

If the games keep on getting mainstream, I can definitely see many game series die out in the mainstream eye until it's just a selected few(only the MOST profitable titles of them all). Not exactly my taste for "natural selection". And who knows, maybe gamers will get a backbone and decide to rebel against those companies after the selection dwindles considerably low. Mainstream game crash. I'd welcome it, at least. But, as far as next gen goes(PS4/X720), I'm probably jumping off the console wagon before that. As it is, I'm not looking forward to yet another expensive console with expensive games(that rumor has it, princes might go up do to game development costs rising).

Of course, that doesn't account for downloadable games, app games or social games. A lot of the indie stuff you find on PSN, XBOX Live or online are actually pretty good, and have the spirit of classic games. Hell, if HD console gaming(partcularly Sony and Microsoft gaming) dies, if indie gaming becomes the new standard, so be it. I'd actually welcome that with open arms. Get Wayforward to crank out some more awesome games! Have a blast!!! Hell, this is actually what big companies SHOULD be doing with beloved titles that they know there's a market for, but are too reluctant to dedicate an HD budget to. While FF Dimensions was pretty bad, that shouldn't mean Square should stop this type of thing. They SHOULD release a steam of downloadable FF games(that play like the classic games, but are all original new games) for not only Android, IPad and such, but also on PSN, XBOXLIVE and Wii U Shopping Channel. Capcom should do that with new Mega Man games. Konami, yes, where ever the future lies beyond LoS trilogy, this avenue should not be overlooked either. New 2D dowloadable CVs... sign me up! Get WayForward involved.... sign me up, times TWO!!! Who knows, after LoS's time, Konami might just want to dedicate all their power to making MGS related games in HD. If they don't want to spend that type of money on the CV series anymore, this is the next best thing.

But yeah, handhelds are pretty good with selection, and like I said, indie games tend to capture the spirit of older gaming experiences while being of lower budget than most large scale mainstream console games. Wii U, I'll have to wait on. Right now, the thought of an HD system that can both cater to mainstream core gamers with the style of games you see on X360 and PS3, while also cater to the general Nintendo demographic intrigues me. It's almost like a Utopia situation(a console where many different gamers can actually find what they want because a widely diverse selection) in theory, but can they pull it off? We'll have to see. But, if they do, it might actually make a great role model of how future gaming should follow. Ebony and Ivory, living in perfect harmony....

[Neobelmont]

there is a rap song of all things on Youtube that say EXACTLY how i feel... a rap song of all things, says how i feel!
Epic Video Game Rap - Real Hardcore OGs (Original Gamers)!

lol...

What happen?

I'm a Real OG it seems >_<

oh and if this is the wrong section for this, it can be moved.

That is the first time I have gotten into rap that left an impression on me 

Also long rant I have to read it again.

[Neobelmont]

Okay, this is a rant... i want my voice heard by others.. i want people to know how i feel, and i don't want people jumping my case, if you agree, great, if you don't? Leave the insults at the door if you don't agree.

Too late for that 

First I would want to say that I somewhat understand where you are coming from yet I do not agree with you for the most part, ok time to break this into pieces

 

Okay so.. i am sick of how the word "epic" is thrown around now days, it's so damn subjective, and if you tell someone it's not "epic" to you, they argue you to death cause they think they're stating fact, and the FACT of the matter is, what might be epic to these wannabe CV fans is not epic to me, and i been playing the CV games for years, since the NES, i seen it evolve all the way up to the SOTN games, and then de-evolve into what LoS is.. yes.. that's right, to be LoS is not an evolution of the series... it's something else... and for good reason.

1.Epic is just a simple way to say good but more awesome there and one thing I think Los is a very good game and I think MoF and Los2 will be very epic  , next what is a castlevania fan? You do not like los all right and since other people do or the ones that are introduced to the series for the first time their labled as wanna be's ? Come on that's like me saying that since I grew up on dracula's curse all people that played castlevania symphony of the night as their first are wanna be fans since it was a depature from what was known, and yes I have played cv since the nes as well and to tell the truth I'am glad I was not introduced to the series from SOTN(way too bloody overrated , yet people still want this style of gameplay I do not understand why I got very, very tried of them still fun but not as fun as the classics). Devolution huh if anything Los can be seen as progress maybe not full on evolution like mario 64 was,zelda oot, heck even tales of symphonia/abyss, but it took most of what was done in the past 3d games except CoD and put them into a blender and it came out good.

LoS is just that.. LoS.. the only thing making it a CV game is the title, because as we all know.. CV games place you as a belmont fighting DRACULA! Not Satan!

    Ok so by this logic link's awakening, minish cap, majoras mask, and zelda II are not zelda games because we do not fight Gannon or aria/dawn of sorrow since we do not fight dracula at the end. What if I were to say what makes a cv game is having a dang Belmont as main character in it something the MV's lacked. Iheck OOE did had nothing but a mention of the belmont in it take them out and is it still a cv game?

I think the biggest thing though that bothers me is the fact that they took little things that make a CV game a CV game, and threw it all out!

MV's did this way before los did mostly taking the belmonts out, los at least put a belmont as a main character after how many years (8-9) harmony of dissonance was released in 2002(juste) and leon(LoI) in 2004 right?

Let's start with Music.... what the hell happen there?!
LoS does not have epic music, i keep arguing with people, it's not epic to me... .
All the actual CV games before LoS were actual CV games, they had this music that mixed things up, it took symphony and more and just... made it all awesome! That is the BIGGEST argument i have though with people.... to me the music was horrid!
It was like .. a hollywood movie!
I don't want to play a hollywood movie!
I want to play a GAME! Not a MOVIE!
I don't think i would complain if a CV movie DID come out and had music like that, cause that would be a MOVIE... but i don't like that kind of thing in a GAME!

Let's look at other games from other companies... Nintendo for instance, you STILL go through Zelda games almost always hearing some sort of awesome constant music!
It rarely brakes up and goes silent! And the music never sounds hollywood!
Same with mario games, and ever with the music and how it sounded in Super Mario Gallaxy, you still knew it was mario's music, you could just tell.. and it still sounded good! It still had it's identity and was enjoyable.

CV games though, not so much...LoS's music for me.. lost it's identity!
Sure their were a few little.... subtle hollywood version of old CV tunes.... but... ugh...

There has to be at least one song in los that you like how about this 

Castlevania: Lords of Shadow - Super Castlevania IV Soundset (SNESology)

also I think one thing cv has in advantage over other series in terms of music is that it's very diverse

like does this song really remind you of cv?

10th Anniversary Konami Label Theme Song Collection - 08 I AM THE WIND (Castlevania Symphony of the Night)

no but it's pretty darn good very gospel like  much better than the mainstream stuff . cv music is in my opinion a very diverse soul Los including.

I am almost done with japanese companies, cause they lost their way!
Capcom... What happane to Megaman? Ta hell?! Since i no longer get my fix of megaman games, i'm done buying anything else that comes from Capcom!

I'm just about done with all those companies.... just... i'm sick of it!
I'm going to end up playing old games.. over and over.. and never spend another dime on newer games.. and i don't think these companies would like that too much.
And Megaman and CV games are not the only thing pushing me away, i used to LOVE Final Fantasy games, it's gone that way as well! What the HELL happen to that series? The last good FF game is one i will never get to play cause it's on iPad and iPhone! I am ofcourse talking about Final Fantasy Dimensions!

Those are examples of things going wrong....

What happen to Japanese games? And why are no nothing westerners being put in charge?

There are japanese game designers that do get it like from software with dark souls, and while Japan has lost it's hold on the mainstream that does not mean that their down and out.  Japan still makes the best fighting games, I find them to still try interesting stuff just not as wide out there as the mainstream stuff, And in the case like dark souls if they were to adopt some western DNA again like they did with Dragon Warrior then they can be on top. I would love to play a samurai themed game this gen with music and a dark serious, yet passionate tone like this

Rurouni Kenshin OVA Ending special DVD edition.flv

think like this west oh we have red dead an open world sandbox game with awesome graphic and stuff vs japan we have an awesome samurai themed game that not only has awesome graphics, but powerful music, and it's sandbox as well
there should be an even level but there is not japan is not trying hard enough look what the west is doing but do not try to become them infuse your self with just a little bit of western infulence dark souls did it and it's one of the best games ever this gen from japan.

As for orchestrated music
if japan were to try harder they could produce more stuff like this
YGO - Fang of Critias (15 minute loop)

Passionate Duelist Extended would be awesome to fight the mummy boss in CV)

God's anger extended [Link in description]

I'm fairly sure i'm not the only CV fan who feels this way... sure they brought in other fans to the series, but people like me got alienated!
LoS is not a CV game for a long time fan... not for a fan like me, it's a CV game for everyone else the company could not reach!

No your not most likely. LoS is a cv game for a some long time fans... At least I was able to play a belmont this time around not to mention like the old game it was just not inside the castle which I think some fan did not know.

I know most of you won't read this.. in fact... i am likely to hear crap about how this is too long... wahh lol

 

[Green Stranger]

Aria of Sorrow = Magical School Boy vs. the Embodiment of Chaos
Dawn of Sorrow = Magical School Boy vs. the Embodiment of all Dark Powers

Well put. It's good to hear someone actually make an honest opinion about those two awful games. I'm not suggesting that you personally dislike them but I do appreciate your spot on choice of wording to describe them.

I only wish most of the hatred for LoS would be channeled onto AoS/DoS which are real festering sores of the franchise and the time period when Castlevania took an undefined slope to hell. I really can't see how those games are so untouchable to most of the fanbase and receive such unreal praise.

[crisis]