Topic: SOTN's Fatal Flaw

[zangetsu468]

Eh, kinda disagree.
The inverted castle isn't too bad. I think it's flaw was making that god awful noob of a weapon; Crissagrim.

Crissaegrim you still have to grind in order to obtain, and that's one of the more difficult areas of the game (despite the game being relatively easy). There are more common noob weapons like the heaven sword which have a much farther range.

Either of these is no different to finding the Claim Solais in AOS. Overly poweful weapons (aside from the canon VK in POR) basically don't exist in any Metroidvania games outside of a handful of weapons which one has the option to equip any weapon or de-quip

[X]

I feel that finding the Claim Solais in AoS is relatively easy compared to the grinding I have to do in the inverted castles' forbidden library just to get the Crissagrim. Those damned Shmoos just don't drop 'em fast enough for my liking. Then again neither do the giant skeletons easily give up those rings of Varda.

[zangetsu468]

I feel that finding the Claim Solais in AoS is relatively easy compared to the grinding I have to do in the inverted castles' forbidden library just to get the Crissagrim. Those damned Shmoos just don't drop 'em fast enough for my liking. Then again neither do the giant skeletons easily give up those rings of Varda.

Or the golden knights guarding the centre of the inverted castle who drop God's garb.
You need elements of luck to some extent in exploration based games.

[X]

Or the golden knights guarding the centre of the inverted castle who drop God's garb.
You need elements of luck to some extent in exploration based games.

Right, forgot about those guys too.

[GuyStarwind]

The problem I have with SotN is that common enemies are sometimes harder than the boss fights.

[zangetsu468]

The problem I have with SotN is that common enemies are sometimes harder than the boss fights.

It's also quite ironic that you can destroy the final boss but you can't destroy those rotating skulls

[GuyStarwind]

Yeah that's a really good point haha

[Shinobi]

It's also quite ironic that you can destroy the final boss but you can't destroy those rotating skulls

For the record, this is not the only case were a certain enemy is indestructible while the final boss was, like those fire breathing alien-like heads in Kujaku Ou 2 AKA Mystic Defender for Sega Genesis.

My guess is that when a final boss dies, indestructible enemies will die as well offscreen so in short the final boss are their main weakness:P

[zangetsu468]

For the record, this is not the only case were a certain enemy is indestructible while the final boss was, like those fire breathing alien-like heads in Kujaku Ou 2 AKA Mystic Defender for Sega Genesis.

My guess is that when a final boss dies, indestructible enemies will die as well offscreen so in short the final boss are their main weakness:P

Absolutely not the only time, I remember Mario 3 had those translucent energy balls which followed the perimeter of platforms on the (boom boom) castle stages. Even with a star you can't kill them. Rather perplexing.

As you say, you assume whatever powers the final boss is powering them.
But now I've found out Miyamoto has confirmed SMB3 was indeed a play, I don't know what the hell to believe!!! (Mindblown btw)

[ProjectDread]

I completely agree with the OP here. To me, the inverted castle just seems like a cheap way to extend the time you have to put in to complete the game. Sure the enemy placement is different and they added more gear to find, but I can't get over the fact that I'm just exploring the same exact map I'd already explored prior but now rotated vertically. On top of that, the fact that they repeat the same 2 or 3 songs throughout the entirety of it really started to test my patience.

Honestly, I kind of feel the same about the "extended maps" in the other IGAvania games. You know, the palette swapped stages using tilesets from other parts of the game? Never particularly liked those. In my opinion, it's also a glaring issue with Order of Ecclesia as half of the stages you explore recycle not only enemies but tilesets as well. I understand the developers have a finite amount of time and resources to complete the game and so they cut corners when they have to, I do. It doesn't kill the experience by any means at all but I do see it as a flaw, myself.

[zangetsu468]

@Dread POR Was much more guilty of reusing stages than OOE. They literally reused the same 4 portrait areas twice over. That feels cheap to me. At least OOE's stages were oriented differently, had different enemies and on the hardest mode (L1/ hard) actually involved platforming.

[theANdROId]

...Mario 3 had those translucent energy balls which followed the perimeter of platforms on the (boom boom) castle stages. Even with a star you can't kill them...

If I recall, everything can be killed in Mario 3 with the Tanooki Suit.  If you use its statue power and hit them just right, any enemy will die.  Sometimes you go through...I guess you miss the hit box of something.

[zangetsu468]

If I recall, everything can be killed in Mario 3 with the Tanooki Suit.  If you use its statue power and hit them just right, any enemy will die.  Sometimes you go through...I guess you miss the hit box of something.

The statue move is used to avoid enemies not hit them, how do you hit an indestructible enemy?

[theplottwist]

The statue move is used to avoid enemies not hit them, how do you hit an indestructible enemy?

You can attack enemies with the statue move if you use it midair.

Here is a list of what it can destroy:
http://www.mariowiki.com/Statue_Mario#Super_Mario_Bros._3

[Nagumo]

I was planning on making a separate thread but since we already have a thread about SotN's flaws I might as well bring it up here. Does anyone also think the Alchemy Laboratory is the worst area in the game? It has a lot of boring box-shaped rooms and lots of copy paste backgrounds which are pretty dull looking, especially the ones in the long vertical rooms with those floating flatform jumps. Also, they didn't really place any enemies there with an alchemy theme in mind which makes the area come more across as artificial. I think all the other areas are more varied in their design and less bloated.