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Offline Hayoam

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Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« on: March 31, 2020, 01:13:19 PM »
-2
Hey I'm back
Haven't been here in a long time and nobody remember me, maybe I should call myself Forgotten One. ;D ;D

Anyway for a series that consider Christianity as a force of good and revolves around it this animation sure put Christianity in a bad light which goes against the core concept of Castlevania good and evil powers.

- Sypha Belnades has turned from a Pure Christian Hunter to an edgy Atheist from Avatar who want to Destroy the Church.
We can't have one of the main characters be Christian because then Christians will be good in which it goes against the anti-Christians propaganda.

- Christians bring misfortune on people again.

- The One Who's Many (Legion) It's based on a Christian story where Jesus Heals a man whom was Prossessed by a large number of demons.
In the animation we see the people prossessed wear Crown of Thorn which a symbol of Jesus so this takes the story and flips it on it's head by implying:
Jesus instead of healing people he unleash demons on them prossessing them, and Jesus is the man on tower and all the other mindless people are Christians.

- The philosopher bug who came and say basically Christianity is Evil to a Muslim.

- The church presumably find the truth about their faith and flip the statue of Jesus to point under to hell is another way of saying Christianity is bad and you're going to hell for it.


Like really really wtf, I'm not religious but this is pathetic to be honest.
Adaptation yeah right more like hate propaganda.



 

Offline crisis

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #1 on: March 31, 2020, 03:11:17 PM »
+3
I mean, I wouldn’t declare the show “anti-Christianity propaganda” at all. If anything, it’s trying to depict the world as more than just “black & white.” In the real world, our world, there were a lot of Popes that were shady & did messed up things, they weren’t the shining examples of good that religion paints them to be.

Sypha had a paper thin personality in the game(s), barely any at all.
You said “in the Jesus story...” emphasis on story. These are all just stories, nothing more. Stories are subject to interpretation, this animation is interpreting the lore differently. We’re not allowed to have different interpretations anymore?

This can trigger a looong debate so... umm yeah the show features a lot of fucked up things, some I’m cool with some I dislike some I’m indifferent towards, but humanity has done a lot of fucked up things in the name of religion, too. So I’m just “whatever” about the whole thing

Offline TatteredSeraph

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #2 on: March 31, 2020, 04:33:32 PM »
0
In the Middle Ages it was also insanely easy to end up being labelled a heretic and be excommunicated from the church.  So in that respect that’s something is actually portraying pretty well if anything.    Things weren’t quite so tolerant of different church factions coexisting as they do today, and the slightest transgression, even belonging to the ‘wrong’ faction du jour could land you in very deep water. 
  As for Sypha having issues with ‘God’, in season three remember she does say that she’s more positive in her views of Jesus as a figure. 
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Offline C Belmont

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #3 on: March 31, 2020, 07:34:22 PM »
0
I love how when it comes to religion everyone defends Warren Ellis by claiming he’s just approaching religion from a less black and white perspective. How exactly is portraying Christians as either stupid or evil not black and white?

If he wanted his interpretation to be less black and white he would have included a significant character who would provide an alternative perspective. But he doesn’t. Despite having plenty of opportunity for it.
 
The writer is a proud atheist and believes anyone religious is insane, the effect of this on how he has interpreted the source material is pretty apparent.

Offline Lumi Kløvstad

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #4 on: March 31, 2020, 08:33:56 PM »
0
The writer is a proud atheist and believes anyone religious is insane

The term you (and Ellis, actually) are looking for is "anti-theist".

An atheist doesn't give a shit about whether you believe or not. They simply don't believe themselves.
An anti-theist though is the type who will declare "a pox on your house if you believe in something so STUuuuuUUuUUuuPiiIiiiIiID as "god"!"

An atheist does not care whether you go to church, and there's a non-zero chance they'll go out of friendly solidarity if invited to go to church by a friend.
An anti-theist will be insulted that you would invite them to something so blatantly horrid and treat such an invitation as an attack in their person of some degree or another.

It's not enough for them to disbelieve; they feel they must tear down anyone who DOES believe because the anti-theist believes that religious belief is wrong and sinful. The irony of this steelclad belief is generally obvious to everyone but them.

And the way Warren Ellis depicts religion definitely fits into the manner anti-theists typically portray the Catholic church: as a diseased and wholly corrupt institution that brings nothing but oppression and misery into the world with no potential for goodness whatsoever.
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Offline Hayoam

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #5 on: March 31, 2020, 10:01:10 PM »
0
I mean, I wouldn’t declare the show “anti-Christianity propaganda” at all. If anything, it’s trying to depict the world as more than just “black & white.” In the real world, our world, there were a lot of Popes that were shady & did messed up things, they weren’t the shining examples of good that religion paints them to be.

Sypha had a paper thin personality in the game(s), barely any at all.
You said “in the Jesus story...” emphasis on story. These are all just stories, nothing more. Stories are subject to interpretation, this animation is interpreting the lore differently. We’re not allowed to have different interpretations anymore?

This can trigger a looong debate so... umm yeah the show features a lot of fucked up things, some I’m cool with some I dislike some I’m indifferent towards, but humanity has done a lot of fucked up things in the name of religion, too. So I’m just “whatever” about the whole thing

Same with everything else in real life painted in games or movies but we are talking about Castlevania where the protagonist always used Crosses, Holy Water, Bibles and Grand Cross crush to vanquish evil.
I would Agree with you if there weren't so many Christianity is bad stuff in there.
LOS is black and White not this.

Sypha barely been in any games so....
What we see here is not interpreting the lore differently? More like flip or reverse. Not sure if you understand the word "interpreting ".


Offline Hayoam

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #6 on: March 31, 2020, 10:03:59 PM »
0
The term you (and Ellis, actually) are looking for is "anti-theist".

An atheist doesn't give a shit about whether you believe or not. They simply don't believe themselves.
An anti-theist though is the type who will declare "a pox on your house if you believe in something so STUuuuuUUuUUuuPiiIiiiIiID as "god"!"

An atheist does not care whether you go to church, and there's a non-zero chance they'll go out of friendly solidarity if invited to go to church by a friend.
An anti-theist will be insulted that you would invite them to something so blatantly horrid and treat such an invitation as an attack in their person of some degree or another.

It's not enough for them to disbelieve; they feel they must tear down anyone who DOES believe because the anti-theist believes that religious belief is wrong and sinful. The irony of this steelclad belief is generally obvious to everyone but them.

And the way Warren Ellis depicts religion definitely fits into the manner anti-theists typically portray the Catholic church: as a diseased and wholly corrupt institution that brings nothing but oppression and misery into the world with no potential for goodness whatsoever.

Yup that seems to be the case.
He really let himself go with this one.

Offline SecretWeapon

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #7 on: April 01, 2020, 12:08:38 AM »
0
Regarding S3: Sypha says Jesus is cool, the bigoted Christians are bigoted against literal demons that would slaughter everyone if Isaac wasn't controlling them and the monks turn the cross upside down when they start following orders from a demon/go mad (nevermind the fact that its a previous castlevania symbol)

S1 was very much anti-catholicism but afterwards it's relatively chill

Offline crisis

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #8 on: April 01, 2020, 02:55:38 AM »
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Quote from: Hayoam
Same with everything else in real life painted in games or movies but we are talking about Castlevania where the protagonist always used Crosses, Holy Water, Bibles and Grand Cross crush to vanquish evil.
I would Agree with you if there weren't so many Christianity is bad stuff in there.
LOS is black and White not this.

Sypha barely been in any games so....
What we see here is not interpreting the lore differently? More like flip or reverse. Not sure if you understand the word "interpreting ".

I guess what he’s doing with the show doesn’t offend me as much as other people. And apparently it doesn’t offend Konami, or Netflix since it got renewed

I’m not going to dig into Warren Ellis’ background because I just don’t care, so the “ugh, how dare he!” criticisms people have against him are funny to me. There are a lot of stuff in the games themselves that mock Christianity, too (and no I’m not going to write a laundry list of examples, it’s been done to death)

Offline DraculaCronqvist

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #9 on: April 01, 2020, 03:21:06 AM »
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While I do believe that every criticism put towards Christianity is well-deserved, my issue with the criticism in the show is that it is oftentimes too ham-fisted and not period-appropriate. If the show was set in modern times, by all means, but back then, in European lands, criticism towards Christianity was met with severe punishments and, more often than not, death. I can see our three protagonists being critical of the church, for reasons canon to the games, but to outright hate it also seems misplaced, as they do help in the battle against Dracula. I'm reminded of Jonathan Morris and how he disapproved of Vincent charging money for his help, but he ultimately went along with it. Ultimately, I think it is fitting to the setting and to the characters, but sometimes it is laid on too thick, for the same reason.
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Offline C Belmont

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #10 on: April 01, 2020, 04:25:00 AM »
0
Quote
There are a lot of stuff in the games themselves that mock Christianity, too (and no I’m not going to write a laundry list of examples, it’s been done to death)

I don't expect a laundry list but I'm honestly having a hard time recalling any instances where the games outright mock Christianity. If you don't want to provide specific examples then at least point me to where I can find some.

Offline Bloo

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #11 on: April 01, 2020, 08:42:35 AM »
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I don't expect a laundry list but I'm honestly having a hard time recalling any instances where the games outright mock Christianity. If you don't want to provide specific examples then at least point me to where I can find some.

yeah... if anything the games use christian symbolic imagery and christ himself to symbolize safety and power against dracula and his horde

hell, even dracula quotes the fucking bible and claims to have learned a "life lesson" from it
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Offline Holy Diver

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #12 on: April 01, 2020, 10:47:00 AM »
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I don't expect a laundry list but I'm honestly having a hard time recalling any instances where the games outright mock Christianity. If you don't want to provide specific examples then at least point me to where I can find some.
I don't remember any either. The only times I recall the Church being bad in games was when they fucked Belmonts over for having supernatural powers of sorts so they excomunicated and when they fucked Leon cuz he wanted to fight monsters instead of heretics.
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Offline GuyStarwind

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2020, 10:16:41 AM »
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Yeah, I really never thought Christianity was portrayed as really bad in any of the games. As mentioned before the church screws over the Belmonts and burn Lisa (I thought they were the ones behind that) but really besides that the games but a lot of pro Christian. I mean the Belmonts (who I would argue are the heroes of the series) throw crosses and holy water. One of their big attacks summon giant crosses with Christ on them. I believe in CoD Trevor yells "holy power" when doing one of his attacks. My point is they're pretty righteous guys. I understand why Dracula would be opposed to it because he's a bad guy.

In terms of the show, I could understand why they made the church bad guys in season 1 because that's how it was kinda told in the games. After that then yeah idk why they took the approach they did. Then again, after reading of certain events in season 3, I stopped watching after a few episodes.

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Re: Season 3 obvious Anti-Christianity propaganda
« Reply #14 on: May 19, 2020, 07:44:15 PM »
+1
What till he finds out Baphomet is in Dragon Ball now... :o

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