Topic: Harmony of Despair (The next Castlevania game?)

[Deko21]

on a related note, I heard from one site that new DLC were being planned for the PS3 version of this (though probably dependent on the sales). Course only heard of this from one source, so its questionable. Also, anybody have thoughts on how they plan to execute the offline multiplayer? By that I mean since it is probably going with a split screen, how do you guys think the character equips and such be done? Would be kinda cheap if a person can just leave the other 3 of their characters just standing there as one character goes around and picks up equipment, but then again that might take away from some of the fun since CVHDs strength/weakness is the grinding and searching for new and stronger items with friends.

Another thing Im curious about is what kind of intervals we can expect the DLC to come in (kind of hoping at least Richter and Maria's DLC will be on sale along with the actual game <- Richter being the character I want to play as).

I'm thinking the screen will stretch out a bit when the players get farther and farther apart. But that might be a little difficult for the players since the characters they're controlling will get smaller and smaller as the screen zooms out, but who knows. Also what source said that the PS3 is getting an exclusive DLC? Unless said exclusive DLC is just mistaken as the offline multiplayer and the first DLC sets being in the game without having to purchase them. As for the existing DLCs that you'd have to buy, maybe they'll be released the same day the game comes out.

Maria in rondo of blood maybe? possibly? though the general difficulty of that game and her lack of HP (if we want to call it that) sort of balances it out 

Balancing can be rather hard to do in game designing, but for as long as the game is still fun to play, doubt we'll worry about the balancing too much 

She could be an example, but she's more of a glass cannon or something similar rather than a game breaker. Sure she has a double jump, but Richter can access higher places too if his backflip is timed right. If you're curious, you can search for the trope "game breaker" to see a number of examples in video games that just outright break the game.

It is hard for game companies to balance things out, especially when some issues that are fixed wont please everyone or a new problem will just arise. And it'd be too late for them to revise something if they've already released it. But then that's what patches are for. Then again, most companies are too lazy to patch up games or rerelease the game with bug fixes as reprints, but it seems companies are lazier these days as what i said about patching up games in reprints rarely even happens at this day and age. They used to do that more often back then though. But you're right. As long was we have fun with the game, the glitches and game breaking elements and bugs we won't have to worry too much about them.

... unless you're an elitist.

[KaZudra]

I miss super Charolette....
Too bad Soma IS the game breaker....

[Sumac]

but really, how many of the games you've played aren't broken?

It doesn't mean that creators shouldn't worry about and at least try to make the game as balanced as possible.
That's especially important in multiplayer games.

[Kusanagi]

I'm thinking the screen will stretch out a bit when the players get farther and farther apart. But that might be a little difficult for the players since the characters they're controlling will get smaller and smaller as the screen zooms out, but who knows. Also what source said that the PS3 is getting an exclusive DLC? Unless said exclusive DLC is just mistaken as the offline multiplayer and the first DLC sets being in the game without having to purchase them. As for the existing DLCs that you'd have to buy, maybe they'll be released the same day the game comes out.

Now its just dependent if I can find that source again, I've been reading on multiple sites about peoples reaction to the news then I stumbled onto it somewhere inbetween. If I ever run into it again, I'll be sure to put it up here. Im hoping they do sell all the DLC all at once like you said. I want to play as richter from beginning to end, as I became a fan after playing Rondo of blood and Dracula X chronicles (both essentially the same game, but still).

Edit: Here we go, found it
http://www.joystickdivision.com/2011/08/castlevania_harmony_of_despair_4.php

Being the only source to mention that last little detail, leaves questions if that is true or not

As a final tid-bit, Konami made mention of "plans in place for downloadable content for additional characters and levels" as well. We're guessing that sentence used to include the words "if the game sells well," but we can't know for sure.

From reading this last sentence, it could be interpreted as:
1)PS3 version might not get all of the DLC (<- probably won't be the case)
2)PS3 version might get more DLC ontop of the original DLC

Though Im a PS3 only user, if the second does happen Im hoping the 360 does get them as well (would be unfair otherwise). That and some sort of patch for the offline multiplayer for the 360.

She could be an example, but she's more of a glass cannon or something similar rather than a game breaker. Sure she has a double jump, but Richter can access higher places too if his backflip is timed right. If you're curious, you can search for the trope "game breaker" to see a number of examples in video games that just outright break the game.

It is hard for game companies to balance things out, especially when some issues that are fixed wont please everyone or a new problem will just arise. And it'd be too late for them to revise something if they've already released it. But then that's what patches are for. Then again, most companies are too lazy to patch up games or rerelease the game with bug fixes as reprints, but it seems companies are lazier these days as what i said about patching up games in reprints rarely even happens at this day and age. They used to do that more often back then though. But you're right. As long was we have fun with the game, the glitches and game breaking elements and bugs we won't have to worry too much about them.

... unless you're an elitist.

Yeah the glass cannon is the best way to put her, haha. Maybe I will look it up, though the only other example I can think of off the top of my head is Mario and his cape, but thats just another game series altogether xD

Can't call myself an elitist for sure if Im looking forward to Harmony of Despair. Least from what I had heard, a good number of people hated this game because it involves level grinding and barely has a storyline. Plus Soma kinda got favorited with all of the souls he can get and that weapon players always use (don't know the name though, just watched too many gameplay videos to hype myself up xD). But just to go back a bit on companies being lazy to patch the game, Marvel vs Capcom 3 sounds like it fits that bill rather well. Companies will try to balance out their games, but in human nature we all do make mistakes and some imbalnaces here and there do happen. Course some more obvious than others.

[Deko21]

It doesn't mean that creators shouldn't worry about and at least try to make the game as balanced as possible.
That's especially important in multiplayer games.

True. They should balance the game as best as they can.
Though its kinda hard for them to try to balance the games they make since they don't find bugs as fast as normal players do when they stumble upon them usually by accident.

Now its just dependent if I can find that source again, I've been reading on multiple sites about peoples reaction to the news then I stumbled onto it somewhere inbetween. If I ever run into it again, I'll be sure to put it up here. Im hoping they do sell all the DLC all at once like you said. I want to play as richter from beginning to end, as I became a fan after playing Rondo of blood and Dracula X chronicles (both essentially the same game, but still).

Edit: Here we go, found it
http://www.joystickdivision.com/2011/08/castlevania_harmony_of_despair_4.php

Being the only source to mention that last little detail, leaves questions if that is true or not
From reading this last sentence, it could be interpreted as:
1)PS3 version might not get all of the DLC (<- probably won't be the case)
2)PS3 version might get more DLC ontop of the original DLC

Though Im a PS3 only user, if the second does happen Im hoping the 360 does get them as well (would be unfair otherwise). That and some sort of patch for the offline multiplayer for the 360.

After reading it, it kinda sounds like it might be refering to the original DLCs that were released for the 360 that will be released either later or right when the game is released. Still, it'd be nice to get a few new DLCs, and hopefully the 360 players also get it if that's the case.

Can't call myself an elitist for sure if Im looking forward to Harmony of Despair. Least from what I had heard, a good number of people hated this game because it involves level grinding and barely has a storyline. Plus Soma kinda got favorited with all of the souls he can get and that weapon players always use (don't know the name though, just watched too many gameplay videos to hype myself up xD). But just to go back a bit on companies being lazy to patch the game, Marvel vs Capcom 3 sounds like it fits that bill rather well. Companies will try to balance out their games, but in human nature we all do make mistakes and some imbalnaces here and there do happen. Course some more obvious than others.

Most of the time in multiplayer games, story barely even matters since people just want to get straight to the game. Heck, story is still not important to some players. And if they do hate level grinding, then they must hate rpgs in general. Then again you might mean that they hate the fact that you need to level up your sub weapons to get stronger. Yea its a dumb idea, and its different from the norm, but its probably so there's no one walking around with 9999 HP and 999 MP at lv99 if it were to have normal level up where every stat including HP and MP goes up.

Yea, people make mistakes, including game developers, so nothing from them would be perfect. But if they released patches to fix or balance (or both) the game are made then a balanced game wouldn't be a rare thing in today's world. But thinking about it, it'll probably cost alot of money just to patch one game (for the game companies i mean)

[KaZudra]

LOL the article says "If the Game sells Well it might get more DLC"
Since Converting something so simple from its source format is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Hard.
Iga, you lazy piece of shit, you.

[Sumac]

Though its kinda hard for them to try to balance the games they make since they don't find bugs as fast as normal players do when they stumble upon them usually by accident.

For that they have DLC. And besides they supposed to have testers for exactly that purpose - test game as much as possible. If they testers can't do they job properly - it's a probelm of the company. If comapne doesn't want to patch disbalance and bugs, even if they can, it's once again comapny's probelm.
There is no need to protect them, when they halfass they job and product.

LOL the article says "If the Game sells Well it might get more DLC"
Since Converting something so simple from its source format is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Hard.
Iga, you lazy piece of shit, you.

It's more like "if gamers will buy our "slapped together in 2 minutes work" we may slap together more of the same and sell it as a cool addition to the game". So it's not lazyness, more like greediness.

[Deko21]

I still think its just existing DLC and probably nothing new.

For that they have DLC. And besides they supposed to have testers for exactly that purpose - test game as much as possible. If they testers can't do they job properly - it's a probelm of the company. If comapne doesn't want to patch disbalance and bugs, even if they can, it's once again comapny's probelm.
There is no need to protect them, when they halfass they job and product.

You're right, i was just saying cause sometimes bugs or broken gameplay is sometimes overlooked by the testers. And sure they can just give out DLC patches to fix things up, but whenever companies do that another problem always arises.
Though who knows. I could be wrong about all this and the companies could easily fix it but are too lazy to go over it. That or they'd rather invest their funds on making a new game to make more money rather than fixing an old game that was released a year ago.

[Sumac]

Though who knows. I could be wrong about all this and the companies could easily fix it but are too lazy to go over it. That or they'd rather invest their funds on making a new game to make more money rather than fixing an old game that was released a year ago.

Never mind the fact, that in this particular case, they rerelease this game as a new product for the new console. It's naturally to expect that if they had time and desire to code this game for the new platform, they could as well patch all bad stuff that was in the previous version.

[Kusanagi]

Most of the time in multiplayer games, story barely even matters since people just want to get straight to the game. Heck, story is still not important to some players. And if they do hate level grinding, then they must hate rpgs in general. Then again you might mean that they hate the fact that you need to level up your sub weapons to get stronger. Yea its a dumb idea, and its different from the norm, but its probably so there's no one walking around with 9999 HP and 999 MP at lv99 if it were to have normal level up where every stat including HP and MP goes up.

True that, though in some rpgs they do keep players from going that high with some sort of level cap. Either way I don't mind how the game carries itself, I'll just be happy with a multiplayer castlevania game (though barely anyone I know would probably want to play it because of the general castlevania difficulty ^^").

Yea, people make mistakes, including game developers, so nothing from them would be perfect. But if they released patches to fix or balance (or both) the game are made then a balanced game wouldn't be a rare thing in today's world. But thinking about it, it'll probably cost alot of money just to patch one game (for the game companies i mean)

Much agreed there. What money they use with patching they could use developing an even better game. That could be their logic. The time they take to patch up a year old game could be spent working on a better sequel to follow (or another game altogether). But on the other hand as you said, balanced games wouldn't be a rare thing if they do release patches to rebalance things.

Guess its just down to time constraints.

LOL the article says "If the Game sells Well it might get more DLC"
Since Converting something so simple from its source format is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Hard.
Iga, you lazy piece of shit, you.

We do still have Iga to thank for the game pushing through in the first place ^^" But if we reinterpret that last statement from the article, the time it took to get the game to the PSN could mean that extra coding could have been put in to allow more characters/stage DLC to be added to the game. Course that would be ontop of adding the offline multiplayer coding in first. Doesn't hurt to hope for new stuff to be added, though Im already pretty satisfied that the game is coming to PSN with offline multiplayer (now I just need the Richter/Maria DLC and I'll be very happy  )

[Deko21]

True that, though in some rpgs they do keep players from going that high with some sort of level cap. Either way I don't mind how the game carries itself, I'll just be happy with a multiplayer castlevania game (though barely anyone I know would probably want to play it because of the general castlevania difficulty ^^").

True. Though in some RPGs today, the level cap is sometimes higher than the usual 99 or at the maximum of 9999, i really dont know who'd waste their time getting a character that high x_x. But maybe that's what keeps players from stopping. Though in a multiplayer game that has levels involved, its a little more difficult since sometimes the players you're paired with might be higher and end up doing all of the work while you're a sitting duck. castle crashers is one example on how that works.

Much agreed there. What money they use with patching they could use developing an even better game. That could be their logic. The time they take to patch up a year old game could be spent working on a better sequel to follow (or another game altogether). But on the other hand as you said, balanced games wouldn't be a rare thing if they do release patches to rebalance things.

Guess its just down to time constraints.

Yep. Patching a game takes up time and money from the company and who knows how many bugs and broken gameplay they'd remove if they just spent time just correcting the wrong. But as said, it takes up time and money, and with that money they could just make a brand new game or sequel, like you said. But releasing reprints can give them a chance to fix whatever's wrong with the first game.

[Kusanagi]

True. Though in some RPGs today, the level cap is sometimes higher than the usual 99 or at the maximum of 9999, i really dont know who'd waste their time getting a character that high x_x. But maybe that's what keeps players from stopping. Though in a multiplayer game that has levels involved, its a little more difficult since sometimes the players you're paired with might be higher and end up doing all of the work while you're a sitting duck. castle crashers is one example on how that works.

Depending on the game, I might be one of those people ^^" but then again I sometimes just rush through to see the ending of the story (or that I just don't have much time to put into going that far). In regards to levels, that would be the up and the down part of this game as one player could do all the work and gather all of the items for the other players (the other players just need to stand there while someone else gets all the equipment). People may see that as good or bad, though personally I find the people who just watch are losing the experience of enjoying the game for what it is. But in the case of working with someone much stronger, that presents an issue as the stronger character can leave the others behind as you mentioned. Out of my friends, I tend to be that at times and then they lose interest in playing altogether ^^" Would be nice to find a way to remedy it, like some sort of pre set characters to match up with the strongest character (should the player choose to use them), so they can keep up level wise without doing the actual work.

Im still wondering if in offline mode will leveling up and equipment gathering still work... if so will it be saved on the profile of the owner of the PS3 or will it be only temporary for that gaming session... Im thinking it will be the first, but then again it will make equipment farming for multiple characters easier for people (which can be seen as both a good and bad thing).

[Deko21]

Im still wondering if in offline mode will leveling up and equipment gathering still work... if so will it be saved on the profile of the owner of the PS3 or will it be only temporary for that gaming session... Im thinking it will be the first, but then again it will make equipment farming for multiple characters easier for people (which can be seen as both a good and bad thing).

I'm pretty sure everything is still the same in offline co-op mode. Only thing that's probably different is the two players sharing tvs.

Depending on the game, I might be one of those people ^^" but then again I sometimes just rush through to see the ending of the story (or that I just don't have much time to put into going that far). In regards to levels, that would be the up and the down part of this game as one player could do all the work and gather all of the items for the other players (the other players just need to stand there while someone else gets all the equipment). People may see that as good or bad, though personally I find the people who just watch are losing the experience of enjoying the game for what it is. But in the case of working with someone much stronger, that presents an issue as the stronger character can leave the others behind as you mentioned. Out of my friends, I tend to be that at times and then they lose interest in playing altogether ^^" Would be nice to find a way to remedy it, like some sort of pre set characters to match up with the strongest character (should the player choose to use them), so they can keep up level wise without doing the actual work.

I think the best way to remedy it is if said player uses a character they didn't really spend time leveling up or have the character they use the most (which is usually their strongest) use weaker equipment so that the other players actually have a purpose. A good example of doing that in CVHD is having an alucard or soma player replacing their valamnways or yasutsunas with a sword or any other weapon that's still strong but doesn't allow them to do all the work.

But chances of that happening when PS3 users actually do get valamnways and yasutsunas are very small.

[Kusanagi]

I'm pretty sure everything is still the same in offline co-op mode. Only thing that's probably different is the two players sharing tvs.

Pretty much a double edged sword; some will find it an easy way to train and farm for equipment (which not always is a bad thing), others will appreciate that friends can help the leveling up process. Still, offline mode has made the wait well worth it for me, now the only question is finding players who would enjoy it...

I think the best way to remedy it is if said player uses a character they didn't really spend time leveling up or have the character they use the most (which is usually their strongest) use weaker equipment so that the other players actually have a purpose. A good example of doing that in CVHD is having an alucard or soma player replacing their valamnways or yasutsunas with a sword or any other weapon that's still strong but doesn't allow them to do all the work.

But chances of that happening when PS3 users actually do get valamnways and yasutsunas are very small.

I'd do that for sure so at least I can keep my friends interested. If I ever read or hear that a particular weapon is broken, my tendency is never to use it even if I find the weapon.  valamnways was the weapon I heard of as being one of the said broken weapons. Though with me using Richter, I probably will be leveling up all of his stats, but I'll just ease up and let my friends take the lead and I'll just provide support. Its up to the PS3 owners how they want to enjoy the game for the most part. Imma just steer clear of the broken weapons for the game (unless its in single player and Im farming for something in particular).

[Deko21]

I'd do that for sure so at least I can keep my friends interested. If I ever read or hear that a particular weapon is broken, my tendency is never to use it even if I find the weapon.  valamnways was the weapon I heard of as being one of the said broken weapons. Though with me using Richter, I probably will be leveling up all of his stats, but I'll just ease up and let my friends take the lead and I'll just provide support. Its up to the PS3 owners how they want to enjoy the game for the most part. Imma just steer clear of the broken weapons for the game (unless its in single player and Im farming for something in particular).

Same over here. And said weapons should only be used on single runs since they allow you to kill enemies with ease. Though its kinda hard for other people to keep the valamnways to a minimum when a majority of the players love using cheap tactics. Though maybe it'd be best to play with a party of friends so things wont get too out of hand.