Topic: SOTN's Fatal Flaw

[Crying Freeman]

SOTN is one of the only games I'd say is almost completely perfect! There a huge map to explore, tons of items, abilities, endings, satisfyingly addicting combat, and probably the best control of any 2D platformer ever made. It even has a really good story, as simple as it may be, simplicity is one of it's strong points (like we can feel Alucard's struggle through events we witness and some of his lines, instea dof him badgering on about "life sucks" and looking very brooding like other heroes). With everything it has to offer, there is only ONe major problem myself and I'm sure everyone else has with the game: The Inverted Castle.

It breaks the pacing of the game and takes it to a sloppy halt. Progressing through the inverted castle is irritating and can feel more like a chore than anything exciting. The word to describe the enemies here are CHEAP. Gremlins placed in front of entrances to rooms can mean knock back to the previous room if you're not prepared, the skeleton's projectiles bounce too far and for too long, and the beam skeletons... 1 or 2 hits can kill you, which really isn't fair! Sure, the boss fights are excellent, but you could've just placed them in the normal castle or in a newly designed map to complete after the original castle; their strength doesn't lie in the inverted castle itself.

It's sloppy, lazy, and for such a brilliant team, I can't believe they just inverted the map and made repetitive segments, overly annoying enemies, and annoying or confusing to get through areas. What should have been done is something similar to Aria; a new map with many ideas and parts of the original map but still a new map. Or if I remember correctly, Harmony of Dissonance had an entirely new castle to explore (been years since I beat that game).

[Gunlord]

I think most people liked the Inverted Castle, actually. Yeah, some enemy placements were annoying, but IMO it was a nifty way of getting the player to reflect on the level design, navigating things differently when everything was upside down. The only other problem I had with it was too much reused music. x-x

[theANdROId]

I think most people liked the Inverted Castle, actually. Yeah, some enemy placements were annoying, but IMO it was a nifty way of getting the player to reflect on the level design, navigating things differently when everything was upside down. The only other problem I had with it was too much reused music. x-x

Agreed.

[Crying Freeman]

Fair enough, I see what you guys mean. I have to admit, I did reflect a bit on my previous encounters in the regular castle. I know I might be alone on this, but the inverted castle is just very frustrating personally.

[X]

I personally did feel the inverted castle was a bit repetitive. They could have kept everything it offered, but it should have been done in a completely new castle to traverse through.

[Claimh Solais]

Or if I remember correctly, Harmony of Dissonance had an entirely new castle to explore (been years since I beat that game).

Wasn't the second castle in Harmony of Dissonance just largely the same castle, just recolored?

Anyway, the Inverted Castle is largely the worst part of the game for me. I did like that it was open-ended, in that you can tackle the castle in whatever order you want to, but the level design felt extremely wonky upside down and just overall made exploring it more than annoying, ESPECIALLY when using Richter.

[Inccubus]

I had no problem with the inverted castle other than what Gunlord said about the repetitive music.
I feel like the more difficult enemies that are "cheap" and their placement hearkens back to the early games where you have to be more cautious about how you played.
This lends itself to the idea that the inverted castle is more dangerous as you get closer to Dracula.

[Mystic Myotis]

I did think that the inverted castle was poorly-paced.  The complete absence of any story beyond what you get at the very end coupled with the repetitive music and (imo) kind of lazy design once the novelty of the flipped castle wears off was a let-down for me.  I don't actively dislike it but I do think it could have been done much better than it was.

[Shiroi Koumori]

When I first played SotN, I was shocked with the inverted castle cuz everything was inverted and the enemies were hard. I did not dislike it though.

In hindsight upon knowing some behind the scenes stuff from IGA, I got to appreciate their effort in delivering a game that was behind schedule with only about 11 people working on it at maximum. At the start of the project there were only 4-5 people.

[Nagumo]

I believe they ran out of time, therefore they couldn't add new content to the game and they had to figure something out to extend the playtime. This was around early 1997, so about 2 years of development time went into the regular castle. Taking that into account, could you really blame the game for this? 

[TatteredSeraph]

I like the inverted castle personally, and likewise share the same opinons on it re: development issues.

[zangetsu468]

Annoying enemy placement is good enemy placement imo. Particularly in a game where in comparison from its predecessors the platforming was severely watered down.

I like the fact that the first castle had stairs and such on the ceiling and suspected there were areas which these would be useful. Although 'inversion' seems a cheap and easy fix, it still felt awesome especially the first time. Even the best things in this world have a budget.

[Belmontoya]

After the novelty of it wears off, it feels like what it is. A cheap way to extend the game. This is one of my problems with Iga. SOTN already borrows graphics from other games to begin with.

I understand having a small crew of 10. But there are game developers (even fan ones) who put out games with daunting amounts of quality artwork in the same time alone.

People are always so quick to give Iga excuses for his shortcomings. Why can't we at least entertain the idea that maybe they weren't as effiecent with their time as they could have been? Or maybe they just ran out of ideas. It's just as possible that it is the fault of the dev team as it is the fault of Konami's budget and deadline. It's the same story every time when someone points out a flaw in an Iga game. "Oh he had a small budget, oh he had an impractical deadline." It's bullshit IMO.
 
I would much rather have shorter game of higher quality. If I were Iga, I would have started the game off with a couple more linear levels in the mountains outside of Castlevania. Perhaps passing through a village where the townspeople fear Alucard.

Everything from entering the castle to it flipping over is a masterpiece in my opinion. But running through the woods for 2 seconds and instantly gaining access to the castle is ridiculous. Dracula has always had defensive forces in the countryside guarding his castle. Why are they suddenly absent in SOTN?

That would have been a been much better way to expand the game and give it a better sense of freedom and openness.

[Maedhros]

After the novelty of it wears off, it feels like what it is. A cheap way to extend the game. This is one of my problems with Iga. SOTN already borrows graphics from other games to begin with.

I understand having a small crew of 10. But there are game developers (even fan ones) who put out games with daunting amounts of quality artwork in the same time alone.

I REALLY think that you don't know shit about what you're talking about. But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

Please, feel free to show us all these game developers/fan developers that make more polished games and with the same scope as SOTN in 2 FUCKING years.

I'll answer for you: You won't find it.

Then, you need to consider how TOXIC Konami working conditions are, considering the latest news about this problem, and you'll see they work REALLY hard. And even with those two years, they couldn't finish the entire game properly and decided to leave Debug menus and to lenghten the game like this.

Not even talking about the evolution of the frameworks and how much better for productivity they are today.

[Crying Freeman]

It does! And it could be very true that the team ran out of $$ or time, but a problem is still a problem, and having a good excuse doesnt change bad to good, its just a good excuse. I still commend the team obviously for making one of the best games ever made, but it just goes to show that even the best things aren't perfect.

About the few linear levels idea, it would've been fantastic for adding to the narrative. I do like how the game just springs you in, but it does feel a little simple too. It works but more would've been more, and SOTN with even more content would be a dream! (One reason I prefer the Saturn version). But after the Richter Dracula fight, it can be argued that the player just wants to start the main gameand I guess the castle isn't guarded outside because Dracula isn't really back yet, who knows. Great idea I'd say though!