Topic: The biggest 3D FAIL.

[Vampire Killer]

oh don't even

Seriously, though. You can't handle that some fans don't think the same way about Lords as you do.

*NOTE* I've decided to remove my little rant. Basically because I honestly don't care, and would rather keep the peace. Life is too short. If you wanna go bust out a full-on keg of Hatoraide on LoS, be my guest. I feel saying the game is utter crap is a tad much, but that's just me.

[KaZudra]

Dracula Apocalypse (64\LoD, the original name is too boss)
Good games, 64 has a few critical issues to it that were fixed with LoD, overall not bad as there is a sense of danger and thrills along the journey.
The story is self contained and there are enough characters to rub off of each other, in LoD you could feel the urgency Cornell felt to save Ada.

Lament of Innocence
as a Game, not bad. As a story it is a huge fail, Establishing the Belmonts is okay but establishing an already established Dracula with a stupid ass Conflict per-determined plot IGA loves to do just ruined the game Story-wise, Game-wise Its pretty Flat, Useless Relics (other than wolf's foot), and minimum platforming, Its just enough not to bore you.

Curse of Darkness
The game is overall flat, boring, and the only reason you're not doing anything else but play this game is the gimmicky Weapon Forging and the Innocent Devils.
Story is uneeded and the Premises is non-logical since Dracula has summoned all his own minions in every game except this one.
Only redeeming Factor is the Appearance of Trevor and the ability to play as Trevor.
Action Replay Run clocked this game at 15 mins, Without the weapon making its BORING.

Judgement
Unlike Curse of Darkness, this game has an interesting Premises, but is slaughtered by characters not acting nor resembling the characters they are supposed to be.
As a Game the mechanics are broken and is very quick to frustrate as the AI takes advantage of the Flawed mechanics and turn the battle one-sided.
As a fighting game its pretty balanced but , yet agian, the mechanics are broken so balance is not an issue.

Lords of Shadow
Not the Reboot most fans wanted, but its suffer from Shadow of the Collosis copy/pasting and some lame Platforming.
Story-wise the game is pretty good, but the story-telling could be way better.
It is Niether Frustrating nor Boring, nor does it conflict with its own Mythos.

Dark Priests
They are Evil, they prey on they weak with a smile, fooling you that they are good.
They Violate your mind and poof, you'll never go to church again, why?
He is there when he is not, watching you with his glazed eyes.....
At least that is what the crazies tell me.

[Nagumo]

While I admit that I'm the type that doesn't think that all opinions are equally valid (that's just my opinion), I ultimately don't care if someone doesn't care for LoS.  What I do find a tad annoying is what I like to call EPIC-HATE.

Seems to me you're just blowing this out of proportions just to make your point stand.

[The Silverlord]

Seems to me you're just blowing

just blowing

blowing

I see what you did there.

Edit for some OT: Puwexil was very eloquent and gave reason/justification, even if it did raise an eyebrow.  But, got to respect opinions.

[Sumac]

While I admit that I'm the type that doesn't think that all opinions are equally valid (that's just my opinion), I ultimately don't care if someone doesn't care for LoS.  What I do find a tad annoying is what I like to call EPIC-HATE.

Agree with you.
I am OK with people that dislike LOS, but like you, I am not OK with constant (and sometimes overblown) hatred that this game (or any other) receive. Reeks of fanboish and dillusioned approach, that I've seen so much in regards to the other franchises.

And it seems after Chapel's demise some people from there decided to go here. I hope this place will not turn into Chapel 2.0.

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

If people misbehave, I will have them banned, simple as that.

[Successor The Cruel]

And it seems after Chapel's demise some people from there decided to go here. I hope this place will not turn into Chapel 2.0.

That's been my secret plan this entire time. A clandestine upheaval.

[KaZudra]

If people misbehave, I will have them Spanked, simple as that.

XD, I can't resist these humorous urges sometimes.

(click to show/hide)

On a serious note, He's not joking. You WILL get Spanked aka Banned

[thernz]

I think there are two main misconceptions on how a 3D vania should be like: shimmying and combos.
Shimmying itself is really just a dull mechanic most of the time. If it's in something, it should be short. It damages pacing, especially in regards to LoS's "fast" combat. It's not a really good substitute for cool down periods. Castlevania has never been an adherent of "naturalistic" platforming either. Probably too much hassle than good for it, especially when creating level design that intermingles both platforming and combat.
Then with combos, its style of combat encourages flat arenas and with combos, come more health in enemies, so the player stays in the same general area. I think that dampens the flow aspect of Castlevania as you move your Belmont, leaping and whipping shit while still going forward. Even in an exploration title like SoTN, most of the time you were moving and grooving.

[darkwzrd4]

Curse of Darkness was the worse given the flat level design and poor story concept.

Level Design:

• Repeating rooms
• No platforming whatsoever
• No puzzles to solve

Story Concept:

• Doesn't contribute to overall storyline
• Boring revenge centered plot
• Script is just bad

CV64 and LoD had great level design.  The only problem were the graphics, but those were the best at the time.  They had the traditional simple storyline (make your way to the castle keep and kill Dracula), but that's what was good about the old games.  LoS had great level design, but was CV enough and I don't really like the concept of a Belmont becoming Dracula.  Plus, the battle system was arena based (does suit CV). 

[Flame]

Then with combos, its style of combat encourages flat arenas and with combos, come more health in enemies, so the player stays in the same general area. I think that dampens the flow aspect of Castlevania as you move your Belmont, leaping and whipping shit while still going forward. Even in an exploration title like SoTN, most of the time you were moving and grooving.

but combos are more fun. compare LoS whipping with CV64's.  LoS is far more satisfying. LoI had combos too, but they were minimal. nothing as dynamic as LoS. Though they were still somewhat satisfying.

[Neobelmont]

but combos are more fun. compare LoS whipping with CV64's.  LoS is far more satisfying. LoI had combos too, but they were minimal. nothing as dynamic as LoS. Though they were still somewhat satisfying.

Castlevania Lords of Shadow Combo Video "Workshed"

[thernz]

Well, CV64's combat system was dull in general. You don't necessarily need combos for good combat. It's just one way to do it. Imagine how unfitting combos would be in a game like Demon's Souls.

[RichterB]

Castlevania Lords of Shadow Combo Video "Workshed"
but combos are more fun. compare LoS whipping with CV64's.  LoS is far more satisfying. LoI had combos too, but they were minimal. nothing as dynamic as LoS. Though they were still somewhat satisfying.

[Shakes head back and forth]

Great, turn enemies into punching bags while you pretend to be Superman. Combos are "cool" but also highly overrated and dangerous to game design. In this context, they're "satisfying" in the same way that junk food is. Combos of this extent are a "genre piece" tailor made for things like Devil May Cry, and do little to help "Castlevania's" game design. The simple combat of CV64 provides for natural combos: With Reinhardt, if you want/are able, you whip a skeleton, go into a slide tackle, and come up with a short-ranged blade swipe. (Or, jump in, whip, and then hit with the holy water or sub-weapon of choice). It's not pre-programmed "juggling." Most importantly, it means most enemies take less hits, which in turn makes for scenarios like Level 2 of CV64 where you have to platform-jump while dealing with medusa heads, bats, bone pillars (and their projectiles), as well as crumbling/flipping platforms and falling guillotines.

Meanwhile, heavy combo-centric combat doesn't naturally engender the gameplay rhythm necessary to dodge structural obstacles AND fight the enemies. In fact, combos emphasize the "fight action," resulting in more arena-type, beat'em-up scenarios, and less strategic enemy placement (bone-throwers on broken bridges) and free-form pursuing enemies (like the Forest of Silence's running skeletons). The former scenario is also where sub-weapons come most in handy, yet if the scenario is lacking, the sub-weapons again dip in their strategic importance. As a result, the sections of action and platforming become utterly stratified and separated in LoS, which isn't the Castlevania norm. (This can't be fixed without changing the gameplay for starters, because Gabriel's jump is atrocious to control, and his whipping more or less immediately moves the character toward a pre-set combo in its animation).

Going on, the way Gabriel "slices" with his "whip" doesn't always feel like you're making solid contact with the enemies, as there is no resistance or recoil. (Nevermind the fact that he "jumps" about as well as Nathan Drake). There's just not the sense of differentiation and atmospheric terror/tension when you're "grinding" on enemies with superpowers in flat arenas. LoS' combat, for all its "coolness," cripples Castlevania's game design and forces it toward the modern cliches of DMC and GoW (and doesn't even mix it up as solidly as the latter, not that I think it should be GoW to begin with). And it ruins the pick-up-and-replay value of LoS, too, as you have to recall the pre-programmed combo button presses when you go back to try out a level months after you've beaten it.  (And unfortunately, I've found that there isn't much worth replaying, as a lot of it feels on rails--many invisible walls in the wrong places and lots of enemy grinding padding levels. Despite having more variety than CoD or LoI, it's not all that much different from those entries in design theory when you strip it down). I agree with Thernz on this combo business, and also the "shimmying." In CV64 you could do that and it meant something--surviving by the skin of your teeth. Here it's just pre-programmed Uncharted or SotC shtick. And for Pete's sake, can we get a 3D camera for use in real 3D levels, not  100% forced camera for levels that, while pretty, come off as pre-rendered set pieces. I give LoS an "A" for effort, but its gameplay, by looking at GoW and SotC as models, is fundamentally flawed in terms of Castlevania's action-platforming. CV64 is a far better building block/starting point for CV in 3D.

[A-Yty]

I believe I wholeheartedly agree with the post above

A combat system taken from other series to which it better suits, feels very redundant and distracting when slapped to CV. Combos didn't ring well in LoI (though somehow I sometimes enjoyed it. I don't know why - maybe it was the feeling of using a whip instead of chain), so I didn't much enjoy it in LoS either.