Topic: Castlevania Chronicles - Dracula's Curse

[Belmontoya]

Sypha looks great Kaonstantine. You are one of the most talented artists I've seen around here. If you think changes need to be made, then make them. Just remember that if you listen to every little critique that people come up with, you'll end up spinning your tires working on the same sprite over and over again. That is how an artist can get stuck in development hell.

I'm going through the same thing. My motto is to make everything look as good as I can, and then move on. This is actually something I've learned from working with Mig. Find your balance and keep pushing forward. No matter how much work you put into something, someone will find something they think could be better about it.

Most of the time you'll find that the people that pick your work apart to hell are the ones who have nothing finished of their own to showcase. What really counts is that you are a passionate artist that puts real work into your art. I can see that is what you are!

You're work is great and you seem like a nice and humble person. I love what I have seen from you thus far, and look forward to seeing the work you put forward in the future.

Keep fighting my friend. 

[BMC_War Machine]

Sypha looks great Kaonstantine. You are one of the most talented artists I've seen around here. If you think changes need to be made, then make them. Just remember that if you listen to every little critique that people come up with, you'll end up spinning your tires working on the same sprite over and over again. That is how an artist can get stuck in development hell.

I'm going through the same thing. My motto is to make everything look as good as I can, and then move on. This is actually something I've learned from working with Mig. Find your balance and keep pushing forward. No matter how much work you put into something, someone will find something they think could be better about it.

Most of the time you'll find that the people that pick your work apart to hell are the ones who have nothing finished of their own to showcase. What really counts is that you are a passionate artist that puts real work into your art. I can see that is what you are!

You're work is great and you seem like a nice and humble person. I love what I have seen from you thus far, and look forward to seeing the work you put forward in the future.

Keep fighting my friend. 

Thank you Jeffery, Kaonstantine is a beast of a sprite artist and im more than thankful to have him on board!  If not for him, i wouldn't be able to complete this.  He has completely done Sypha and Grant from the ground up, and i love every bit of his work.  There's nothing i haven't liked, i just wish i could sprite at least close to his level lol.  And with that said, speaking of his future work, check this out 

Grant Test room beta:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzX_Um3_ABw

[KaZudra]

Grant and Sypha are so fluid, its almost mesmerizing.

[the_truth]

Wasn't going to reply, but since the sprite artist is being MUCH more open and humble than some other people, and I opened my mouth and critiqued his work, I am willing to explain myself here:

Can you point me to any Sypha sprites (of similar size) in DA that may be used as a guide/reference?

Look at the one from SOTN found here: http://www.spriters-resource.com/fullview/3682/

I mentioned DA because you could always go on there to seek further assistance/advice/critiques from people who can give a more technical explanation as to how the sprite can be improved to look better than some spriting scrub like me (I have ZERO spriting skills, lol). Animation wise it is VERY fluid (I personally like that, but that in itself makes it seem out of place since the other sprites these guy are using do NOT animate this way), but that staff swinging seems too slow (easily fixed from within MMF) and awkward. Maybe, the programmer can add an effect to the sprite's staff to fix that, but honestly I can't tell if she is swinging the staff from upward to downward, or in a roundhouse style from left to right. Which is understandable since these sprites have to be so small, AND the video is low quality, but based on what I saw here is also why I disliked it.

Ducking wise I'm not sure what they were thinking telling you to make it a poking forward attack; that greatly cuts down the effectiveness of her original attacked where it covered a much better vertical sprectrum. But then again, I don't know what other balancing changes were made to compensate for that. 

The sprite itself has edges that just look rough and jagged compared to the other ripped ones these guys used. Kind of like something was rotated in photoshop, or some edge smoothing was used. If you compare it to the one I linked to above you can see what I mean. Also something about the contrast/brightness on it makes it look more out of place, and it might need more shading here and there (same with grant).

Still I do acknowledge that it does take a LOT of work, and skill to make just this. And yes, I am NOT a spriter, and making something like this is waaaaaaaaaaaay beyond my ability. But like I said before: when compared to the one above (which Las edited to use in his game), though your sprite is coming along VERY nicely, as is now it just looks like it needs more work.

If you put both sypha sprites up on DA and ask for feedback comparing them, I'm sure someone can give you more useful feedback than this.

P.S. As for particles, they actually can save the programmers a lot of otherwise wasted ram and cpu power if properly utilized, not to mention the aesthetic uses. And there are ways to use them in a retro fashion that will fit into the game fine.

[Belmontoya]

I agree that kaonstantine's sprites stand out when compared to the ripped graphics. They do animate way smoother and have a slightly different style to them.

I am not a fan of ripped and recycled artwork.

But I think what you guys are doing is cool, since it is a remake of cv anyways. As far as getting his sprites to blend with the ripped graphics...

Ideally I think the best way would be to only use ripped level graphics and have all original character and enemy sprites.

If not that, then I would suggest having kaonstantine make you guys a new Trevor and Alucard so there is consistency between the playable characters.

But you could still do it the way you are and it will be awesome. That's just my suggestion!

[BMC_War Machine]

I agree that kaonstantine's sprites stand out when compared to the ripped graphics. They do animate way smoother and have a slightly different style to them.

I am not a fan of ripped and recycled artwork.

But I think what you guys are doing is cool, since it is a remake of cv anyways. As far as getting his sprites to blend with the ripped graphics...

Ideally I think the best way would be to only use ripped level graphics and have all original character and enemy sprites.

If not that, then I would suggest having kaonstantine make you guys a new Trevor and Alucard so there is consistency between the playable characters.

But you could still do it the way you are and it will be awesome. That's just my suggestion!

Thanks man  idealy that would be amazing to see a Curse of Darkness version of Trevor and a remastered Alucard as well but I cant ask Kaonstantine to do that, as much as id love to lol.  Im grateful to have his time and skills as it is with Sypha and Grant, he is busy doing his own thing too, so time is really conatrained on his end....but I wouldnt argue a bit if he tried  lol

[KaZudra]

Thanks man  idealy that would be amazing to see a Curse of Darkness version of Trevor and a remastered Alucard as well but I cant ask Kaonstantine to do that, as much as id love to lol.  Im grateful to have his time and skills as it is with Sypha and Grant, he is busy doing his own thing too, so time is really conatrained on his end....but I wouldnt argue a bit if he tried  lol

I guess we'll just have to try to imitate that style and try to add more frames for Trevor and Alucard (worth a shot)

[Belmontoya]

I guess we'll just have to try to imitate that style and try to add more frames for Trevor and Alucard (worth a shot)

That's true! You could try just adding frames and maybe editing some of the colors a little. That's probably a better route to take than my suggestions anyways. Of course you could also go the other route and try removing some of the frames for grant and sypha to make their movement match the ripped graphics. But that would seem a little deductive.

Whatever you guys decide to do, it's really not an issue. My vote would actual go to just rolling with it as is. It looks sweet.

Anyways! Cool project. I'll be keeping an eye on this.

[kaonstantine]

Look at the one from SOTN found here: http://www.spriters-resource.com/fullview/3682/

I was expecting some new custom sprites. Her legs and arms doesn't move. Being thousands and thousands of Castlevania fanart in DA, seems like it's not easy to find "original" (not re-edited) sprites for Sypha. As Jeffrey Montoya, i prefer not to recycle artwork, specially animated characters.

The sprite itself has edges that just look rough and jagged compared to the other ripped ones these guys used. Kind of like something was rotated in photoshop, or some edge smoothing was used. If you compare it to the one I linked to above you can see what I mean. Also something about the contrast/brightness on it makes it look more out of place, and it might need more shading here and there (same with grant).

I agree with the the shading is flat in some areas. Shading can be improved? Yes. Why i didn't finish the shading? Fluid animations require a lot of work, that means a lot of time, wich i wish i had more. I don't see the rough and jagged edges. I'm simply using a dark border around the figure, like sprites in order of ecclesia, simply because i liked that.  I never use rotation. The spin in the jump sprite (Grant) is made manually. I rotated the last sprite to show how it looks

(click to show/hide)

Before starting to Sprite shypha, I asked for opinions here, and most of the people choose the current set of colors.

P.S. As for particles, they actually can save the programmers a lot of otherwise wasted ram and cpu power if properly utilized, not to mention the aesthetic uses. And there are ways to use them in a retro fashion that will fit into the game fine.

But their use is not mandatory and not required for every game. I don't see classic CV games relying on particles to achieve pleasing graphics.

Thank you to all supporters, specially BMC and Jeffrey, we will keep fighting.

Thanks man  idealy that would be amazing to see a Curse of Darkness version of Trevor and a remastered Alucard as well but I cant ask Kaonstantine to do that, as much as id love to lol.  Im grateful to have his time and skills as it is with Sypha and Grant, he is busy doing his own thing too, so time is really conatrained on his end....but I wouldnt argue a bit if he tried  lol

LOL. I'd like to sprite a new Alucar version, but now it's not possible. My project is accumulating dust and needs to be revived. Plus, the former musician have silently quit  , but I found another one, and i don't want to anticipate events, but expect original music with a fresh and new touch. 

[darkmanx_429]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWsgSyhBBKU

What's wrong with particles? lol

Well....I did hand draw those and used the engine to animate them which saved in the long run...

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

@Kaostantine:

Now I understand.  I figured that was what you were intending when drawing the cloak.  It's interesting, but that style of clothing is unusual for Sypha.  Now that I understand it, I can see what you're trying to do.  Conveying this idea in a tiny 24x48 sprite is going to be a challenge, however.

On your point about not having access to the game engine, you still have creative control in terms of telling the programmers the duration of a frame of animation.  I've worked with people with access to Game Maker, MMF, etc. while I myself don't have access (or, at the time, did not have access) to the development environments.  When that would happen, I'd usually receive a video from the developers and would say "No, that frame is not right.  That frame should take less time than other frames", etc.  This allows the developers to tweak the animation duration for any particular frame, improving the work.  Usually you can be generic, saying stuff like "See that frame?  It takes half as much time as these other frames".  Stuff like that.

I'm going to share with you the animation I was going to use in my game for Sypha.  I went with a "Keep It Simple" design.
Normally I don't share until I'm somewhat complete with a set of sprites... but my game isn't going anywhere for a while, so I suppose I can share a little.  Maybe it'll help you?  I don't know.  At least, it'll give you ideas.

I'll also put it up on the sprite request & showcase thread.

As you can see, in my sprite (based on the CV3 sprite and the SotN sprite), Sypha's cloak is separate from her robe.  However, when casting a spell, she holds her cloak with her fingers a little, not unlike how Dracula holds it when he's doing his dark spells, or how Alucard does his Hellfire in his first frames in SotN.

The wind-up is quick, but the follow-through stays on for about twice as long as the other frames she uses.
She doesn't need a big follow-through animation either, since it's the magic in her staff that's doing the damage, not how hard she thwacks something with it.
Pepper her staff attack with a few key particle effects (magic sparklies, lolz) and she's good to go.

[BMC_War Machine]

Thank you for the input, tips and animations Jorge!  Its good to see more help kaonstantine my brother, if you would like samples of the engine just let me know and ill hook you up! Anything that would help your fantastic works man

[Jorge D. Fuentes]

I think, BMC, that you should probably set up something like TeamViewer, or record videos with the specific purpose of having Kaostantine look at the animation.
That way, Kaostantine can let you know whether one frame is being too slow, or too fast, or whether you should add a particle to a certain animation, and where.

Keep the dialog going.  Use Skype.  Maybe use Twitch and use a private stream to share in the process.

[the_truth]

@Kaostantine:

Now THIS sprite is awesome, and looks like it would go perfectly into the game. It even has a little effect when the staff is swung. Gorgeous.

[Kale]

That Sypha sprite so damn nice. The attack looks like it has real force in it.